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Posted: 5/4/2024 9:47:09 AM EDT
[#1]
Hah, try being “The Computer Guy”! You owe it to the world to fix everyone’s shit for free.
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Posted: 5/4/2024 9:47:17 AM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By smashedminer: 5000.00 for a set of head gaskets seems a bit high I think. 99 Ford 5.4 Well assuming it is an F-150 it calls for 16.5 hours labor, and that is if everything is pristine, then you will have to replace the intake manifold if it has never been replaced, they are notorious for crossover pipe coolant leaks. THen if there are any blown out spark plug holes, and machining the surface of the heads, gaskets, fluids. Not sure what the labor rate is where you are, but without running all the numbers I would probably be between $4-5K for the whole job. Lots of stuff can break coming apart on that year 5.4 and would have to be replaced, and you don't want aftermarket on it if you are planning on keeping it. |
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Posted: 5/4/2024 9:48:50 AM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Dagger41: Not me. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/279984/20211113_101807_jpg-3205110.JPG And as a diy guy that is fine. Open a business and try to do ac work that way. Many places require a certified recovery machine by law to perform ac work. |
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Posted: 5/4/2024 9:49:04 AM EDT
[#4]
Try being a homebuilder
 EVERYTHING is questioned. Why did you do this? Why does that cost so much? Why isn’t this done yet? What about that? Can you include a wetbar? Why do I have to pay for it? I’m paying $X already, can’t you just include it? I also give everyone a few nice freebies on every build, hoping they’ll be pleasantly surprised, happy with it and appreciative. That almost always backfires and they expect more. Everyone thinks they’re Bob Villa after watching some YouTube’s, and of course their great uncle Joe was a “contractor” and he says it should be done another way. If I build your master bath out of solid Platinum, Uncle Joe said I should’ve used 24K gold. I’ve said to a few people, “if you know better than me, why aren’t you building your own house?”. I’ve also fired customers. Sometimes just telling them I’m refunding their deposit, and they can find another builder does the trick and they settle down. That said, the ones that have the genuine smile when I hand them the keys to their new home make it all worth it. |
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Posted: 5/4/2024 9:55:07 AM EDT
[#5]
I don't hate on shops for charging 500 bucks for a break job. That's like half dealer rate around here
I hate on shops that pull your air filter to show it to you, and offer to replace it and charge a half hour of labor to do it. It's a 2 minute job, and you already did half the work to show me a filter that's still good  |
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Posted: 5/4/2024 9:55:15 AM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By SkyFive: A brake job on a GM vehicle payed 2 hours labor, front or rear. That was the labor rate even on rear wheel drive cars when the front wheel bearings were *suppose to* get repacked. I can tell you mechanics love brake jobs, especially on front wheel drive GM vehicles. They could probably turn 20 flat rate hours a day doing brake jobs and never break a sweat. FWIW I have been turning wrenches for over 30 years and was ASE Master certified at one point. I quit general under hood and full service about 15 years ago and have been doing nothing but brake,chassis,suspension and alignment work since. Here's the labor time for a 2020 Equinox from the Napa labor guide. It gives one hour to R&R pads and rotors on one axle. Guys here will say it only takes the mechanic 15 minutes and they are correct IF I have the parts sitting on the bench when the vehicle pulls in. What the labor guide doesn't account for is the test drive before and after,inspection and estimate time and then waiting for parts delivery. All of that eats up clock time so I better be fast and proficient or I will be bleeding money from myself and the company.  Attached File |
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Posted: 5/4/2024 9:55:37 AM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Quintin: Not sure if you're being sarcastic or not, but if the compressor failed internally then yes, the system does need to be flushed and the accumulator and orifice tube need to be replaced as well. R134a is also the most expensive its ever been, it's about $9/lbs cost on average now. Three or four years ago it was like $2.50/lbs. And you're supposed to have a 609 card to buy 30 lbs cylinders of it, but just about any retail auto parts store will sell it to people who want to buy it. Compressor, accumulator, orifice, flush, ~3 lbs of refrigerant, evacuate and recharge, labor, $1500 doesn't sound too unruly to me. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Quintin: Originally Posted By pale_pony: Now...when that old compressor went bad it probably grenaded into the eeentire system so ima gonna hafta vacuum out that WHOLE system, then that thar freon cost almost a thousand dollars a pound you know. And yo BUY it you first gotta pass a test that's harder than the bar exam, AND THEN you gotta go buy a recovery machine that costs about FOURT-TEEN THOUSAND DOLLARS, THEN you can buy yer own freon" R134a is also the most expensive its ever been, it's about $9/lbs cost on average now. Three or four years ago it was like $2.50/lbs. And you're supposed to have a 609 card to buy 30 lbs cylinders of it, but just about any retail auto parts store will sell it to people who want to buy it. Compressor, accumulator, orifice, flush, ~3 lbs of refrigerant, evacuate and recharge, labor, $1500 doesn't sound too unruly to me. one of those quotes was from an acquaintance of mine that sounds like he wants to do some gun bartering for part of it, plus the fact that i can trade the rest of that freon to him as well so i'm sure i'll go that route |
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Posted: 5/4/2024 9:57:31 AM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Liaztraht: I don't hate on shops for charging 500 bucks for a break job. That's like half dealer rate around here I hate on shops that pull your air filter to show it to you, and offer to replace it and charge a half hour of labor to do it. It's a 2 minute job, and you already did half the work to show me a filter that's still good The flat rate pay system is not good imo and should be done away with, but it's what they/we/us have to work with. |
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FL, USA
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Posted: 5/4/2024 10:03:45 AM EDT
[#9]
The shop I use is so cheap I don’t know how they stay in business. Being quick and reliable probably helps.
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Posted: 5/4/2024 10:09:54 AM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Dano523: Don't expect the mechanics, or shops to work for free, but when you have to finance the simple repairs anymore, then something is off. Hence needed to change the water pump on my truck few years back, was short on time, so got a quote to see how much local shop was going to charge to do so, which was going to be $1200 for them to do. When asked about the labor charge to do such since wanted 5 hours (which took me less than a hour and $78 in parts to do it myself, with specialty tools to remove the fan from pump and such part of the auto parts loaner program for free), they had added 3 hours of shop time of 2 hours to just install, so they could allow the truck to sit and run once put back together, to makes sure the pump they would install, would not leak. So the $78 that I spent on everything including new fluid and T stat, they wanted over $300 , and 5 hours labor charge to do an hour of work. This is an important part of that job,it also purges the air from the system and confirms heater operation. You don't think they should get paid for that time? I do agree it seems a bit excessive but time is spent doing that. |
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Posted: 5/4/2024 10:11:28 AM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Quintin: The flat rate pay system is not good imo and should be done away with, but it's what they/we/us have to work with.  No one has come up with a better system in decades of trying. The system is not only fine, but should be applied to every industry. |
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Posted: 5/4/2024 10:15:41 AM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Ecarl4100: The obvious upselling on the part of the service writer, often with the collaboration of the “technician” is why nobody trusts dealerships. This is one reason why I left my last job. |
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ND, USA
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Posted: 5/4/2024 10:16:09 AM EDT
[#13]
A licensed plumber just replaced a coworkers leaking outdoor faucet for $900. Took the plumber 45 minutes. You pay for that license and insurance and the skill to sweat on a faucet and bury the hole.
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Posted: 5/4/2024 10:16:39 AM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By DayandNight1701: Oh, you're doing rear pads? That requires at least some kind of scan tool that can retract the calipers. What's that cost? Say Autel? The cheapest of the cheap. $1500, min. Oh, we can get it done for you in a few hours because we have a $14,000 hoist so we don't have to drag a harbor freight floor jack across the shop. And there it is! You don't need an expensive "scan tool" to change rear pads. |
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PA, USA
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Posted: 5/4/2024 10:17:34 AM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 3one5: Hah, try being “The Computer Guy”! You owe it to the world to fix everyone’s shit for free. Yeah, I did that as a side gig for a time. I got really tired of unfucking people's computers because they couldn't stay away from porn sites, and clicking on every damn email link that came their way. It was often cheaper to just wipe and reinstall the O/S rather than spend hours and hours running malware scans/fooling with the registry to undo the damage. Then they'd bitch it was too expensive and why did it cost so much - and I wasn't even charging much of an hourly rate either, compared to a proper computer shop. |
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Posted: 5/4/2024 10:19:42 AM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Foxtrot08: Try selling fuel - gasoline / diesel fuel. Then get back to me. Got a discount code for forum members?
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Posted: 5/4/2024 10:20:14 AM EDT
[#17]
I am a mobile mechanic, I charge $120 an hour based on the labor guide in AllData for the most part.
I also have a 30% markup on parts, fluids, etc.... and to cover warranty labor if a part fails. I am very particular on the parts I install, most of the time I try to use OEM or at least OE manfacturer parts. I normally do not install customer supplied parts, and if I do there is no warranty on the labor/they have to deal with the part warranty if it fails. I do not do unneccesary work, but I do try and give an honest opinion of what might be needed in the future. A lot of places with use the service interval guide to recommend services, this is what the mfg suggests, and can be completely wrong for certain items (lifetime fluid) But as to honesty, it is as almost as hard to find honest customers as it is to find honest shops. I am an honest mechanic, I treat people better than I would want to be treated, and I appreciate honest customers. I am upfront, if someone is just looking for the best deal, I am not their mechanic, I do great work at fair prices and can usually get to their car much sooner than a shop can. I do not get offended if someone thinks my price is too high, but my price is my price. |
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Posted: 5/4/2024 10:20:26 AM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AgeOne: No one has come up with a better system in decades of trying. The system is not only fine, but should be applied to every industry. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AgeOne: Originally Posted By Quintin: The flat rate pay system is not good imo and should be done away with, but it's what they/we/us have to work with. No one has come up with a better system in decades of trying. The system is not only fine, but should be applied to every industry. All my guys are salary or hourly. They’re very happy with it. |
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Posted: 5/4/2024 10:20:38 AM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Quintin: Devil's Advocate. Let's take out the idea that they were trying to rip you off and sell you something you didn't need. I wasn't there so I dunno. "Mr. BirdDog, while we had your car on the lift, we did a general inspection and noticed your rear brakes are a little low as well, and saw that the shocks and struts were original, they look about 6-7-8-whatever years old. Also we noted that the exhaust crossover pipe was rusted/cracked/leaking/broken/stolen/missing/gone, we went ahead and quoted you a new O2 sensor with it just in case the old sensor seizes up in that pipe and we can't get it out and moved over to the new pipe. Your total for all this is 'x,' and we should be able to get this all done by Tuesday afternoon." "zomgwtfbbq you're raping me don't fix shit you fucking crook fuck you how do you sleep at night?!?!?!!?!!!1111!" So they do what's requested. What if...some of that stuff did need to be done? Maybe not right away, but maybe it is stuff that does eventually need to be taken care of? Inspecting a car and quoting repairs is like a damned if you do, damned if you don't situation for most shops. Do an inspection along with whatever was originally requested, write up and quote some repairs, you're a crook and liar and should be ashamed of yourself, you need Jesus in your life! Do exactly what the customer asks and don't check shit. Change the oil, weld up the bracket. Car goes 152 miles down the road a week later a ball joint comes out of a socket. The shop either missed it completely and they're incompetent and by god they're going to fix this for free, or they must have sabotaged the joint because they're crooks, amirite? Damned if you do, damned if you don't. Bingo< I have even told people they needed to fix something and have them come back later telling me I should have fixed it when it was in there two weeks earlier. And then there is always the "YOU were the last one to work on it" after something breaks that is totally unrelated to what you worked on. |
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Posted: 5/4/2024 10:21:14 AM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By aod886: And there it is! You don't need an expensive "scan tool" to change rear pads. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By aod886: Originally Posted By DayandNight1701: Oh, you're doing rear pads? That requires at least some kind of scan tool that can retract the calipers. What's that cost? Say Autel? The cheapest of the cheap. $1500, min. Oh, we can get it done for you in a few hours because we have a $14,000 hoist so we don't have to drag a harbor freight floor jack across the shop. And there it is! You don't need an expensive "scan tool" to change rear pads. Depends on the vehicle. But sometimes you do. Newer vehicles I know you do to retract the piston. |
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Posted: 5/4/2024 10:21:27 AM EDT
[#21]
I have hired/payed 3 people to do work on my house. Driveway, roof, tree removal. We agreed on the work to be done and the cost prior to singing a contract.
It was eye opening to get quotes for the driveway and trees and see how very far apart some of the companies were for doing the same work. Tree quotes ranged from $1800 to $10K????? Plumbers do charge insane amounts, so I do it myself. I learned a couple years ago about the horrific mark ups in HVAC work. I learned it from a guy that is in the industry…. I had had several mechanics lie to me and rip me off or try to rip me off. Now I am not saying they are all bad, but I have had too many bad dealings with them, to trust anyone I don’t personally know. So I have learned to do most repairs myself. |
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Posted: 5/4/2024 10:23:42 AM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By aod886: Got a discount code for forum members? Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By aod886: Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: Try selling fuel - gasoline / diesel fuel. Then get back to me. Got a discount code for forum members? I lost ~$10,000 selling product to someone who DM’d me here. So right now, no. |
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Posted: 5/4/2024 10:24:40 AM EDT
[#23]
The "general public" is a bunch of idiots who have been indoctrinated rather than educated. The real world is incomprehensible to them.
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TN, USA
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Posted: 5/4/2024 10:26:01 AM EDT
[#24]
Originally Posted By DayandNight1701: Plumbers get a pass for charging $4000 to replace a $900 water heater. General contractors get a pass for charging $87,000 for a simple bathroom remodel. Why do mechanics get shit on when they charge $500 for brake jobs? That shop bill isn't cheap. The shop equipment is insanely expensive. It costs a shop many $1000's per month, just in subscription fees for spotty "OE support" with multiple scan tools to enable programming, etc. The parts mark-up isn't anything close to the HVAC guy's 900% mark-up on a compressor capacitor. 500 is a deal, shop around here charged me 900 for new pads and rotors all around on a old Rav4. Had a trip coming up and had no time to do myself due to other obligations. Never again. I do my own breaks, except that one time. I can do all new rotors and pads for like 200 bucks in parts. Honestly, the best option for people to can't fix stuff is to shop around, not many people do that with mechanics. Find a GOOD one that let's you supply your own parts and get them from rock auto. Most shops charge a huge margin on parts. But they have costs and overhead. Price of doing business is expensive, etc. |
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PA, USA
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Posted: 5/4/2024 10:26:33 AM EDT
[#25]
I do all of my own work...I was a builder for 30 plus years. Do my own car work too. Just finished building a dry stack stone wall...finished on both sides and 2.5" caps.
People who don't do anything will spend a lot more than those of us who do...Simple truth. |
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Posted: 5/4/2024 10:27:26 AM EDT
[Last Edit: CouncilOfDave]
[#26]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By m1awolf: FWIW I have been turning wrenches for over 30 years and was ASE Master certified at one point. I quit general under hood and full service about 15 years ago and have been doing nothing but brake,chassis,suspension and alignment work since. Here's the labor time for a 2020 Equinox from the Napa labor guide. It gives one hour to R&R pads and rotors on one axle. Guys here will say it only takes the mechanic 15 minutes and they are correct IF I have the parts sitting on the bench when the vehicle pulls in. What the labor guide doesn't account for is the test drive before and after,inspection and estimate time and then waiting for parts delivery. All of that eats up clock time so I better be fast and proficient or I will be bleeding money from myself and the company. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/50785/Screenshot_2024-05-04_at_07-41-10_NAPA_P-3205120.JPG Welcome to six hour brake jobs, fellas. |
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Posted: 5/4/2024 10:28:19 AM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By BillofRights: Numerous threads. What would you say the average and maximum pay is, for an experienced motivated mechanic at a busy high end shop? Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By BillofRights: Originally Posted By 69rrdriver: Originally Posted By BillofRights: Originally Posted By Staggunner: Everybody in the trades think they should get paid like doctors. And they do. You can't blame them. Idiots and the hapless abound. We’ve had a number of threads on this. Pretty common for Mechanics to make $250,000 and more. Where? Pay has certainly gone up but I don't think I know any mechanic making that kind of money. Maybe the shop owner but that's with a ton of investment in the business before reaching that level. Numerous threads. What would you say the average and maximum pay is, for an experienced motivated mechanic at a busy high end shop? By high end you mean Mercedes,Lambo,Ferrari or do you mean Cadillac,Lexus it makes a big difference. I can see the Lambo guy making 250K, the Cadillac guy not so much. Average pay around here is about $25.00hr up to about 35.00hr at the dealerships. Labor rates are $120.00hr independent shop and Dealer $150.00hr. |
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Posted: 5/4/2024 10:28:29 AM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By aod886: And there it is! You don't need an expensive "scan tool" to change rear pads. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By aod886: Originally Posted By DayandNight1701: Oh, you're doing rear pads? That requires at least some kind of scan tool that can retract the calipers. What's that cost? Say Autel? The cheapest of the cheap. $1500, min. Oh, we can get it done for you in a few hours because we have a $14,000 hoist so we don't have to drag a harbor freight floor jack across the shop. And there it is! You don't need an expensive "scan tool" to change rear pads. How many rear brake jobs have you done on cars with an electronic parking brake? |
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Posted: 5/4/2024 10:29:42 AM EDT
[#29]
First off wtf is giving a pass on a $4k water heater or $87k bathroom? But $500 is a rip off for 1 hour work and $100s in parts…not even that for discount you get on parts and using air tools and a lift…
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Posted: 5/4/2024 10:32:39 AM EDT
[#30]
Go price out pads and rotors from your local parts store. What if you're doing rears and need the scan tool to release the emergency brake? Tool set for twist in calipers? Do you want a pad slap or silicone grease on your slide pins, new pad clips and the rust cleaned off the caliper so the clips fit right and the pads move correctly?
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USA
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Posted: 5/4/2024 10:33:50 AM EDT
[#31]
Moonlighters are a thing
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Posted: 5/4/2024 10:35:39 AM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Foxtrot08: All my guys are salary or hourly. They’re very happy with it. Yes, i know, but we've gone over this before and fleet service shares almost nothing with general automotive. We need a high level of flexibility not required in fleet. That requires a flexible system of billing and paying. Paying the tech is only half the puzzle. The pieces from your puzzle don't fit my picture. |
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Posted: 5/4/2024 10:36:57 AM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Cooper1: Moonlighters are a thing They're hacks and crooks of the highest level. |
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Posted: 5/4/2024 10:38:50 AM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AgeOne: Yes, i know, but we've gone over this before and fleet service shares almost nothing with general automotive. We need a high level of flexibility not required in fleet. That requires a flexible system of billing and paying. Paying the tech is only half the puzzle. The pieces from your puzzle don't fit my picture. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AgeOne: Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: All my guys are salary or hourly. They’re very happy with it. Yes, i know, but we've gone over this before and fleet service shares almost nothing with general automotive. We need a high level of flexibility not required in fleet. That requires a flexible system of billing and paying. Paying the tech is only half the puzzle. The pieces from your puzzle don't fit my picture. I’d argue fleet requires even more flexibility. Working on doing an in frame, then swapping to fixing a light or air leak, to doing a manual regen that comes in, oh shit grab a tire for an emergency road call. You can’t just stay on 1 or 2 projects. Limited shop space. You’re bouncing around a lot more. Either way, I see flat rate as a motivator for normal shops, yes. In an ideal world, that motivation wouldn’t be needed. But, the world isn’t ideal. |
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Posted: 5/4/2024 10:39:24 AM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By BillofRights: It would be far more honest to just say : That looks like it could get very involved; sorry, but I’d rather just do simple $500 rear brake jobs on late model Hondas. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By BillofRights: Originally Posted By AgeOne: Originally Posted By smashedminer: 5000.00 for a set of head gaskets seems a bit high I think. 99 Ford 5.4 having no idea what it costs for that job. there's two reasons a quote will seem high. either, they don't want to work on your vehicle, or they know getting involved into a job like that is not going to be as simple as you think. People often assume that because a vehicle is older its going to be cheaper to fix... news flash, its not, often its full of pitfalls and boobie traps of corrosion and people who did shit work previously and now you have to unfuck that as well. so, I'm quoting really high.. cause in that same time I could make more doing brakes, services, ect. remember, its a business. It would be far more honest to just say : That looks like it could get very involved; sorry, but I’d rather just do simple $500 rear brake jobs on late model Hondas. Felt the same. I knew they were just after easier money, unless they got a windfall amount for the job. I slid off road a 50 hitting a rock a something, bent the driver side front rim and rear axle. I took it in and when I took it for a test drive. It was making a revolution type rub,grinding. I asked about the grinding and the shop owner said it's fine just drive it and it will break its self in and be fine. I refused to take it and said there has to be a better fix than that. Problem he said was he would have to reshim the rear end real loose after fixing the axle. What I didn't know at that time was , they took that axle to a machine shop and straightened it and put it back on. All under my insurance coverage. When I told them to fix the grinding they had my truck for 6 months before they would touch it. Or a body repair and paint on the cab. Got the truck back and there was primer overspray on the inside bezel of the speedometer. Specks of yellow. I asked them about and they told me that wasn't there primer and they didn't do it. No such thing as an honest days work. One exception was, 200 miles from home in Reno for Dr. Appt. My water pump goes out, threw the belt as I was pulling in to the parking lot. I knew what I needed and can do some stuff in the shape I'm in, but I may be able to go half hour or a couple at a time doing things. But not away from home and no tools. So called a couple places and settled on a small shop. Got it towed there. And by noon the next day they replaced the water pump,thermostat and belt for 550.00 out the door. I felt that was a pretty good deal and now I would go back to that shop if needed. Cool shop too. Dude was part of early hotrod scene in Reno. Pictures and history were a bonus. |
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USA
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Posted: 5/4/2024 10:39:47 AM EDT
[#36]
If you have a transit van and need new rotors for the rear, you are going to pay more than 500 for the rear in just labor.
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Posted: 5/4/2024 10:40:14 AM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Foxtrot08: Depends on the vehicle. But sometimes you do. Newer vehicles I know you do to retract the piston. Fucking Volkswagens. |
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TX, USA
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Posted: 5/4/2024 10:41:15 AM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By DayandNight1701: But you're good with the $3000 water heater job that you could install yourself for $900 all in? Fuck it. Go get some jack stands and a jack from harbor freight. Oh, you're doing rear pads? That requires at least some kind of scan tool that can retract the calipers. What's that cost? Say Autel? The cheapest of the cheap. $1500, min. Oh, we can get it done for you in a few hours because we have a $14,000 hoist so we don't have to drag a harbor freight floor jack across the shop. I thought it would be easier to use an air compressor...that requires a plumber to run the air lines from the compressor to the shop. Oh, I had to pay the electrician another few thou to wire up that air compressor and the rest of the shop. I loves telling clients like you to DIY and good luck. You drive a 70 Camaro or 2014 Camry? Then why are you commenting in the post? Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By DayandNight1701: Originally Posted By MeanTime: $500 for a brake job? Is that labor only? Is that for all four? If that is parts and labor for all four with quality parts, I'd pay that all day long. Around here, all four is twice that plus, and the parts may or may not be junk. Last Sunday I r&r'ed the front rotors and pads in the truck in 30 min of my time plus $200 in quality parts. What home mechanics get pissed about is the fact that every shop job has a pre-determined job time/duration when, in fact, they are quite inflated. That's not even taking into account the inflated rate which is more than most people make "per hour". And I understand overhead and hidden labor costs, but when we see a half hour job billed out at 3 hours and an inflated rate, we're not happy. But you're good with the $3000 water heater job that you could install yourself for $900 all in? Fuck it. Go get some jack stands and a jack from harbor freight. Oh, you're doing rear pads? That requires at least some kind of scan tool that can retract the calipers. What's that cost? Say Autel? The cheapest of the cheap. $1500, min. Oh, we can get it done for you in a few hours because we have a $14,000 hoist so we don't have to drag a harbor freight floor jack across the shop. I thought it would be easier to use an air compressor...that requires a plumber to run the air lines from the compressor to the shop. Oh, I had to pay the electrician another few thou to wire up that air compressor and the rest of the shop. I loves telling clients like you to DIY and good luck. You drive a 70 Camaro or 2014 Camry? Then why are you commenting in the post? Swapped the powertrain from a 2015 Fusion to a 2016 Fusion over the weekend. Used a new $3,100 Max Jax from Home Depot and about $1,200 worth of tools. Used a FORScan OBD2-USB dongle and their software for about $100 to scan/clear codes and reprogram the computer with the shift solenoid schedule from the donor transmission. Only had two codes. One for a generator voltage failure and the other for open circuit of the post-cat HO2S. Used the PC based FORscan scan tool to plot the generator related signals to/from the BCM and the PCM. Found there was no GENMON signal from the generator. Did some probing with a DMM and found no 12V power to the control circuit on the generator body. Traced that to a corroded 10A dual fuse. Swapped out the power distribution box from the donor car and the problem was fixed. Also fixed the no brake lights because that was the other half of the dual fuse was for the brake pedal switch. O2 sensor was fixed with a new Bosch one as the donor's car sensor had two broken wires from not being careful during the powertrain removal. And this was my vacation, where I flew out, on my dime, to help a good friend. This is the second time I did this. We were able to take three broken Fusions and make two good ones over two weekends. We are getting confident at fixing any problems on these cars. Next trip might be to rebuild the slipping 6F35 transmission as a reman one is $3,500 and a rebuild kit with a Sonnax shift kit is $600. |
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Posted: 5/4/2024 10:44:59 AM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Foxtrot08: Depends on the vehicle. But sometimes you do. Newer vehicles I know you do to retract the piston. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Foxtrot08: Originally Posted By aod886: Originally Posted By DayandNight1701: Oh, you're doing rear pads? That requires at least some kind of scan tool that can retract the calipers. What's that cost? Say Autel? The cheapest of the cheap. $1500, min. Oh, we can get it done for you in a few hours because we have a $14,000 hoist so we don't have to drag a harbor freight floor jack across the shop. And there it is! You don't need an expensive "scan tool" to change rear pads. Depends on the vehicle. But sometimes you do. Newer vehicles I know you do to retract the piston. Sure. However, I'm talking about your everyday/normal person vehicle. Not super expensive sport/race cars. Wifes' 2019 Odyssey has those electronic parking brakes on the rear. They do not require special tools. And I'd me pissed if some mechanic told me the high cost to replace pads were due to needing special tools for it. I think that's the jest of this topic. |
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Posted: 5/4/2024 10:47:19 AM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 69rrdriver: How many rear brake jobs have you done on cars with an electronic parking brake? Wifes' '19 Odyssey. One is enough to know all aren't needed to have "scan tools" to do pads. |
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Posted: 5/4/2024 10:48:35 AM EDT
[#41]
Forscan is an awesome tool. Unfortunately a tool that good doesn't exist for every make. So for many cars a professional scan tool is needed.
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Posted: 5/4/2024 10:50:30 AM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By bigbryce31186: The other trades don't get a pass. people expect them to do free shit too. I've never understood it either. We usually get the "I can do it myself" or I know a guy who can do it cheaper. We say 'then hire him and call us when it doesnt work right.' |
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Posted: 5/4/2024 10:50:54 AM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By aod886: Wifes' '19 Odyssey. One is enough to know all aren't needed to have "scan tools" to do pads. One job on one vehicle does not an expert make. Let me know when you've done thousands, on almost every make on the road, and have seen many of the ways something can go sideways. |
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Posted: 5/4/2024 10:52:05 AM EDT
[#44]
As stated many times, the auto repair business has a reputation for ripping people off any doing half ass work. We bought my wife a new Bronco in 2022. Last summer, I put skid plates on it before a trip to Moab.
My policy is if a vehicle is under warranty, I take it to the dealer I bought it from for oil changes/ maintenance until it’s out of warranty so If something happens it’s squarely on them. Well, my wife took her Bronco in for an oil change and she comes home and these skid plates are flopping loose beneath the vehicle with most of the bolts missing. I took it back up there myself and raised hell. Told them most people won’t know any difference when they do stuff half ass, but once in a while you get someone who does, and that’s me, and that it pissed me off I can’t trust them to take care of my wife when she comes in by herself. I am a pretty good mechanic, and there’s a reason I do stuff myself when I have the time to do it. Figure I do a better job and save myself a boat load of money in the process. |
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Posted: 5/4/2024 10:53:00 AM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By aod886: Sure. However, I'm talking about your everyday/normal person vehicle. Not super expensive sport/race cars. Wifes' 2019 Odyssey has those electronic parking brakes on the rear. They do not require special tools. And I'd me pissed if some mechanic told me the high cost to replace pads were due to needing special tools for it. I think that's the jest of this topic. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By aod886: Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: Originally Posted By aod886: Originally Posted By DayandNight1701: Oh, you're doing rear pads? That requires at least some kind of scan tool that can retract the calipers. What's that cost? Say Autel? The cheapest of the cheap. $1500, min. Oh, we can get it done for you in a few hours because we have a $14,000 hoist so we don't have to drag a harbor freight floor jack across the shop. And there it is! You don't need an expensive "scan tool" to change rear pads. Depends on the vehicle. But sometimes you do. Newer vehicles I know you do to retract the piston. Sure. However, I'm talking about your everyday/normal person vehicle. Not super expensive sport/race cars. Wifes' 2019 Odyssey has those electronic parking brakes on the rear. They do not require special tools. And I'd me pissed if some mechanic told me the high cost to replace pads were due to needing special tools for it. I think that's the jest of this topic. You clearly do not understand how businesses work. But cool. You do you on your Odyssey. |
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Posted: 5/4/2024 10:53:51 AM EDT
[Last Edit: AgeOne]
[#46]
doubletap
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Posted: 5/4/2024 10:54:05 AM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Foxtrot08: I’d argue fleet requires even more flexibility. Working on doing an in frame, then swapping to fixing a light or air leak, to doing a manual regen that comes in, oh shit grab a tire for an emergency road call. You can’t just stay on 1 or 2 projects. Limited shop space. You’re bouncing around a lot more. Either way, I see flat rate as a motivator for normal shops, yes. In an ideal world, that motivation wouldn’t be needed. But, the world isn’t ideal. Its more complex than that. Its a feast or famine business. just part of the deal. Flatrate not only motivates during busy times, it helps scale during slow times, and it fits every tech into their own levels of skill and motivation. the world is not perfect, an "imperfect" system is going to fit that imperfect world better than a rigid system that requires a higher level of stability. |
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Posted: 5/4/2024 10:54:15 AM EDT
[#48]
Fuck turning wrenches for the general public.
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Posted: 5/4/2024 10:55:52 AM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 69rrdriver: One job on one vehicle does not an expert make. Let me know when you've done thousands, on almost every make on the road, and have seen many of the ways something can go sideways. I'm not saying I'm an expert. I'm saying one dosent need expensive tools for every brake job. Don't confuse the two. |
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Posted: 5/4/2024 10:56:38 AM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By bigbryce31186: The other trades don't get a pass. people expect them to do free shit too. I've never understood it either. We usually get the "I can do it myself" or I know a guy who can do it cheaper. My favorite is "that only took you ______ amount of time! This is robbery!" Okay, well you go back in time, buy a whole bunch of expensive tools, do this repetitive task a thousand times, then it will only take you ____ time |
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