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Posted: 5/2/2024 7:55:23 PM EDT
Give you lots of faith in the .gov. Thirteen years of using a deadly strain of ricin for training and not knowing it. What could have gone wrong?
https://www.annistonstar.com/free/officials-say-cdp-trainees-practiced-with-live-toxin-because-of-mix-up/article_5a525f76-adfb-11e6-9cf2-d31e13130638.html Thousands of first responders who have trained with the live biological toxin ricin at a federal training facility in Anniston since 2011 did so using the lethal version of the agent, instead of the non-lethal version federal officials thought was being used, according to those officials in an announcement Friday. |
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AZ, USA
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Posted: 5/2/2024 7:56:10 PM EDT
[#1]
LOL
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Posted: 5/2/2024 7:57:34 PM EDT
[#2]
Train how you fight.
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Posted: 5/2/2024 7:59:08 PM EDT
[Last Edit: HappyCamel]
[#3]
Good, means no one fucked up.
Surprised to see they train with live anthrax and other agents tho Eta: there are so many far more available chemicals far more lethal than ricin, and by that I mean LD50/ how much it takes to achieve the desired outcome |
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USA
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Posted: 5/2/2024 8:00:25 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By TLD05: Train how you fight. Yup. Successful training evolutions. 
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Posted: 5/2/2024 8:01:53 PM EDT
[#5]
lol oospies
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AZ, USA
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Posted: 5/2/2024 8:02:05 PM EDT
[Last Edit: SurvivingAZ]
[#6]
I wonder if that's the same place we put it to go train at back in 2013? One of the pre attendance things was to have a full lab of blood drawn by your health care provider, and bring the results with you. They'd draw your blood again on day one, and it had to match at the end of the week, or you may have to stay for treatment.
Our request was denied by the higher ups.
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USA
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Posted: 5/2/2024 8:04:46 PM EDT
[#7]
I guess their handling protocol works.
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Posted: 5/2/2024 8:06:07 PM EDT
[#8]
I thought back in the day they did use live agent for training. Didn’t go, just what I was told. Somehow missed being able to attend that one.
Might have been some other deadly toxin/chemical thought, not ricin… |
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Posted: 5/2/2024 8:07:26 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By HappyCamel: Good, means no one fucked up. Surprised to see they train with live anthrax and other agents tho Eta: there are so many far more available chemicals far more lethal than ricin, and by that I mean LD50/ how much it takes to achieve the desired outcome I've been 2x to COBRA TF. Best fire related training I've ever done, by a lot. Read deal, live agent, real A Suits, real decon, etc. They tell you at the bulkhead "if you have a real emergency you'll probably die before we can get you through decon." |
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Posted: 5/2/2024 8:08:20 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By SurvivingAZ: I wonder if that's the same place we put it to go train at back in 2013? One of the pre attendance things was to have a full lab of blood drawn by your health care provider, and bring the results with you. They'd draw your blood again on day one, and it had to match at the end of the week, or you may have to stay for treatment. Our request was denied by the higher ups. We couldn't leave until everyone cleared labs on the last day. |
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MI, USA
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Posted: 5/2/2024 8:11:22 PM EDT
[#11]
I went there for Riot training in Spring 2019. Got sick while there and still pretty sick for a little while after. I always wondered if it was due to something there (not that I was exposed to anything that I know of, though).
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Posted: 5/2/2024 8:15:57 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By CAsoldier: I guess their handling protocol works. This. I’m actually kind of impressed. Granted, someone was a complete idiot, but still impressed the training was good enough that they didn’t kill anyone |
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Posted: 5/2/2024 8:19:51 PM EDT
[#13]
Cobra used live Sarin and VX 20 years ago. There were no accidents.
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TX, USA
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Posted: 5/2/2024 8:23:47 PM EDT
[#14]
Trained there with Sarin and VX in the gas chamber of the Cobra Facility.
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TX, USA
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Posted: 5/2/2024 8:26:07 PM EDT
[#15]
They did a blood draw before and after entering the live agent training.
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Posted: 5/2/2024 8:26:40 PM EDT
[#16]
Wasn't me.
 Kharn |
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Posted: 5/2/2024 8:28:02 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By SmilingBandit: Yup. Successful training evolutions. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By SmilingBandit: Originally Posted By TLD05: Train how you fight. Yup. Successful training evolutions. PPE worked as advertised. |
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Posted: 5/2/2024 8:28:33 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By BLUEBOY: Trained there with Sarin and VX in the gas chamber of the Cobra Facility. Wrong. I saw the documentary about that where you left your gun in the sock drawer. |
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Posted: 5/2/2024 8:40:06 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By tac556: I thought back in the day they did use live agent for training. Didn’t go, just what I was told. Somehow missed being able to attend that one. Might have been some other deadly toxin/chemical thought, not ricin… VX and Sarin, I went when it was live stuff. Seeing sarin “boil” was crazy. |
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Posted: 5/2/2024 8:47:50 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Sierra5: VX and Sarin, I went when it was live stuff. Seeing sarin “boil” was crazy. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Sierra5: Originally Posted By tac556: I thought back in the day they did use live agent for training. Didn’t go, just what I was told. Somehow missed being able to attend that one. Might have been some other deadly toxin/chemical thought, not ricin… VX and Sarin, I went when it was live stuff. Seeing sarin “boil” was crazy. I went to Advanced NCO Chemical Warfare School there in 91. It was interesting. Field Flame Expedients was the part I liked best. |
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Posted: 5/2/2024 8:52:54 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By brownbomber: LOL I congratulate you for nailing the first post. |
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Posted: 5/2/2024 8:55:12 PM EDT
[#22]
That was posted back in 2016… when that article came out.
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Posted: 5/2/2024 8:55:57 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By axl: I went to Advanced NCO Chemical Warfare School there in 91. It was interesting. Field Flame Expedients was the part I liked best. I tinkered with that as a kid, but it wasn’t in school
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Posted: 5/2/2024 8:58:21 PM EDT
[#24]
Ft. McClellan keeps on giving.
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Posted: 5/2/2024 9:00:34 PM EDT
[#25]
They told us it was live when I went through and required lab work. Guess the training worked.
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Posted: 5/2/2024 9:11:18 PM EDT
[#26]
We use live sarin and vx during training so it’s not exactly uncommon.
Great motivator for doing it right |
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Posted: 5/2/2024 9:12:49 PM EDT
[#27]
I wonder how the people responsible for the mix-up ended up in their job positions?
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TX, USA
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Posted: 5/2/2024 9:28:06 PM EDT
[Last Edit: bgrhammer]
[#28]
It's a real eye opener when you go through live training, and I understand why we do it. Part of you wants to Play Jonny Dangerous and rip you mask off, and test the water. The sane part of you says fuck all that, survive! Live training instills confidence in the doctrine and the equipment. It also gives experience, I went to a trainer once and the hose team kept collapsing my OBA, I had to drop out reinflate and return to the back of the stack. The training that I had before prepared me how to handle the situation instead of suffocating in a mask I could get back in the fight on the buttercup.
No matter what, never be the first person through the flooded scuttle. You are the turd that just won't be flushed, and if you're a wide body may God help you! |
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FL, USA
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Posted: 5/2/2024 9:35:13 PM EDT
[#29]
Went through in 09-10. While running our final scenarios, one of the instructors suddenly got wobbly legged, leaned against a wall and went unresponsive. Dudes suddenly flooded out of adjacent rooms, tossed him on a gurney and moved him out. Things carried on for us. Didn’t find out till later it was an unannounced test of their protocols in event of a similar emergency. Wish they would have told us because we were like wtf the entire time until we debriefed.
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Posted: 5/2/2024 9:44:38 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Sierra5: VX and Sarin, I went when it was live stuff. Seeing sarin “boil” was crazy. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Sierra5: Originally Posted By tac556: I thought back in the day they did use live agent for training. Didn’t go, just what I was told. Somehow missed being able to attend that one. Might have been some other deadly toxin/chemical thought, not ricin… VX and Sarin, I went when it was live stuff. Seeing sarin “boil” was crazy. Cool. Guess I heard correctly. Is it bad that I kind of feel like I missed out on that part of my CBRNE training by never attending a class there? Ha ha. Yeah live agent would definitely cut the fuck around aspect for some and make sure everything is double checked… |
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Posted: 5/2/2024 9:53:11 PM EDT
[#31]
Real nerve gas?
Genuinely curious, why? |
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Posted: 5/2/2024 9:56:10 PM EDT
[#32]
"If you served at the Center for Domestic Preparedness at Anniston in 2010, you may be eligible for disability, medical assistance, or other compensation"
Can't wait for the hourly commericals! |
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AK, USA
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Posted: 5/2/2024 10:06:35 PM EDT
[#33]
FPFNI
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Posted: 5/2/2024 10:13:39 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By xerxes2695: Real nerve gas? Genuinely curious, why? Ricin isn’t nerve gas, it is a bio toxin. It keeps your Cells from carrying out instructions while nerve gas either stops nerves from transmitting, or makes them continuously transmit(depends on variety) . |
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TX, USA
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Posted: 5/2/2024 11:05:59 PM EDT
[#35]
Top They/Them
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USA
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Posted: 5/2/2024 11:08:53 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By bluedog82: I went there for Riot training in Spring 2019. Got sick while there and still pretty sick for a little while after. I always wondered if it was due to something there (not that I was exposed to anything that I know of, though). Anniston is the old Fort McClellan chemical weapons depot.....ya never know |
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Posted: 5/2/2024 11:09:46 PM EDT
[#37]
Ive trained there twice and everyone I know who went through COBRA did so without killing themselves.
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Posted: 5/3/2024 10:29:35 PM EDT
[#38]
Did anyone go back for the Cobra with the star on it's head?
It was good training and good food. I'd be more worried about the nerve agents over ricin. If I recall, it has to be inhaled or ingested. |
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