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AL, USA
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Posted: 5/14/2024 6:18:20 AM EDT
I was in the third book of Solzhenitsyn's Gulag Archipelago. This part had a lot on the cruelty and outright murder committed by gulag camp guards. During his stint, he said most of these guards were young brainwashed fellows who'd been born after the revolution. They would shoot anyone down on any whim or even perceived infractions.
In all the books he kept mentioning that the guards used Tommy guns. The guards monitoring work details away from camp, guards in camp or in watch towers. He also reported there were thousands of individual "islands" in the Soviet "Archipelago". If a decently large camp had five thousand, then it stands to reason a camp of such size would have at least 100 armed guards. That was a slew of Thompsons. I recall Roosevelt sent a lot of arms and aid to Soviet Russia during WW2. I wonder if it's possible to know how many were sent to them or bought by them? |
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USA
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Posted: 5/14/2024 6:21:18 AM EDT
[#1]
We should rescind the “lend lease” on all firearms 50 years and older.
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AL, USA
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Posted: 5/14/2024 6:23:36 AM EDT
[#2]
Not related. Talking about homegrown subs with drums
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Posted: 5/14/2024 6:25:54 AM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By DrKlahn: We should rescind the “lend lease” on all firearms 50 years and older. They were written off decades ago. |
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QC, CAN
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Posted: 5/14/2024 6:30:05 AM EDT
[Last Edit: Thump_rrr]
[#4]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By fadedsun: They were written off decades ago. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By fadedsun: Originally Posted By DrKlahn: We should rescind the “lend lease” on all firearms 50 years and older. They were written off decades ago. Yet I still can’t bring my M1 Garand back into the USA on my Form 6NIA 81 years after it was manufactured. |
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Posted: 5/14/2024 6:30:06 AM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By billyhill: Not related. Talking about homegrown subs with drums This. He was talking about PPSH-41s. |
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FL, USA
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Posted: 5/14/2024 6:39:13 AM EDT
[Last Edit: FMJshooter]
[#6]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By SkullFarmer: This. He was talking about PPSH-41s. No, there were lots of Thompsons sent over. They became a sort of status symbol.  No idea on the actual number though. |
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Posted: 5/14/2024 6:43:44 AM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Thump_rrr: Yet I still can’t bring my M1 Garand back into the USA on my Form 6NIA 81 years after it was manufactured. Take it to Mexico and bring it in. |
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FL, USA
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Posted: 5/14/2024 6:43:54 AM EDT
[#8]
I saw an article where the author claimed that over 130 000 were send to russsia.
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Posted: 5/14/2024 6:46:59 AM EDT
[#9]
George Racey Jordan (January 4, 1898, New York - May 5, 1966, Los Angeles) was an American military officer, businessman, lecturer, activist, and author. He first gained nationwide attention in December 1949 when he testified to the United States Congress about wartime Lend-Lease deliveries to the Soviet Union, in the process implicating Harry Hopkins and other high officials in the transfer of nuclear and other secrets to the USSR.
 1963 Final Speech of American Military Officer Major George R Jordan |
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USA
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Posted: 5/14/2024 6:47:02 AM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By SkullFarmer: This. He was talking about PPSH-41s. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By SkullFarmer: Originally Posted By billyhill: Not related. Talking about homegrown subs with drums This. He was talking about PPSH-41s. The PPSH and all the variations of it made by the different countries are probably still plentiful in the millions. |
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NC, USA
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Posted: 5/14/2024 6:47:11 AM EDT
[#11]
When we sent over M-4 Shermans as part of Lend Lease, which the Soviets actually liked, they were shipped equipped with Thompson sub guns for the crew. The Soviets put many of these in storage. Iirc, a big cache was recently uncovered.
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ME, USA
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Posted: 5/14/2024 6:56:23 AM EDT
[#12]
I purchased one of the Russian M1A1 parts kits when they were $600. Everything was there except the center section of the receiver. The thing was absolutely flawless, it had obviously never been fired, the bore was bright and shiny, there was no wear on the metal parts, the wood was perfect.
It had just sat in storage somewhere in Russia for decades, a firearm made by American craftsmen, paid for by the American taxpayer, given away to dirty communists for FREE, and when it was time to bring it home it had to be cut into pieces to render it useless. Talk about fraud, waste, and abuse. Absolutely disgusting. |
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NC, USA
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Posted: 5/14/2024 6:57:01 AM EDT
[#13]
I remember that in the early 2000s Sportsman's Guide advertised Thompson M1 "kits" that were said to be de-milled from Soviet Lend-Lease weapons that had been in storage since new.
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ME, USA
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Posted: 5/14/2024 6:58:33 AM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By USMC2111: I remember that in the early 2000s Sportsman's Guide advertised Thompson M1 "kits" that were said to be de-milled from Soviet Lend-Lease weapons that had been in storage since new. Those are the exact kits I referenced just above you. |
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Posted: 5/14/2024 7:05:44 AM EDT
[#15]
A large amount of them are (or were) stored in the salt mines of Soledar Ukraine which was captured by Russians.
The Wagner troops were showing off all the crates Thompsons by the thousands in a video last year. That action almost makes it guaranteed they will never be available in the U.S. market. Lots of surplus was in that mine from M1s to MG42s, PPsh, etc. |
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Posted: 5/14/2024 7:49:56 AM EDT
[#16]
I watched a news report from a warehouse in Ukraine at the begining of the current war. It was lend lease arms and ammo from ww2. They broke open a wooden case of thompsons. Original markings on case. Never used guns. It was beautiful.
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TX, USA
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Posted: 5/14/2024 8:05:08 AM EDT
[Last Edit: tsg68]
[#17]
The Chinese had thousands sent to the Nationalists during WWII and we faced them in Korea later. David Hackworth said there were piles of captured ones he would “liberate” for his little raider unit.
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JPN
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Posted: 5/14/2024 8:43:59 AM EDT
[#18]
A friend of mine from grad school, formerly an officer in the French Army, living in Lichtenstein now. With a collector's license they are allowed to own any pre-WWII small arms. A couple years ago he got a call from his MilSurp dealer and ran over to this dealer's shop where he had two boxes of Thompsons found in some warehouse that was being torn down in Russia. One box was unfired M-1928's and the other was unfired M-1's. My buddy got one of each for about US$500 each.
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Posted: 5/14/2024 8:45:48 AM EDT
[Last Edit: joekizanyu]
[#19]
Deleted. Most of my "information" was incorrect, at best.
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IA, USA
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Posted: 5/14/2024 10:06:52 AM EDT
[#20]
"Tommy Gun" was/is a somewhat generic term for any submachine gun.
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Posted: 5/14/2024 10:11:58 AM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Ameshawki: "Tommy Gun" was/is a somewhat generic term for any submachine gun. Unless it was an MP40. Then it was incorrectly referred to as a Schmeisser. 
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PA, USA
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Posted: 5/14/2024 10:18:06 AM EDT
[#22]
There were some parts kits brought in by Bowman becore the you crain invasion.
Not sure how many Robert got in though they sold for around 1200 bux a kit. |
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USA
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Posted: 5/14/2024 11:01:15 AM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Ameshawki: "Tommy Gun" was/is a somewhat generic term for any submachine gun. Yep. I remembered my step dad a ww2 vet saying the police were at the bank with tommy guns when they moved to the building next door to the old bank. The bank was moving the cash in a wheelbarrow. The town cops were holding AR15s. He knew what a thompson was. |
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Posted: 5/14/2024 11:03:25 AM EDT
[#24]
Every tank we lended them also came with I think 1 tsmg iirc
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Posted: 5/14/2024 11:11:29 AM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Ameshawki: "Tommy Gun" was/is a somewhat generic term for any submachine gun. This. It's been more or less forgotten these days, but back then pretty much any submachine gun was referred to as a 'tommy gun'. They could have been actual Thompsons, but I wouldn't assume so. |
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Posted: 5/14/2024 11:20:03 AM EDT
[#26]
Wagner showed off the vintage US machine guns they captured in the salt mines in Ukraine. Theres a video if you search for it.
 Attached File |
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Posted: 5/14/2024 11:24:04 AM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By DKUltra: Wagner showed off the vintage US machine guns they captured in the salt mines in Ukraine. Theres a video if you search for it. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/110810/IMG_1754_jpeg-3214094.JPG Man I would love one of those. |
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Posted: 5/14/2024 11:33:47 AM EDT
[#28]
We sent around 4,100 Shermans to Russia. Each one had five Thompsons as crew weapons. The Russians never unpacked them and they went into storage.
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USA
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Posted: 5/14/2024 11:33:57 AM EDT
[#29]
TheFirearmsBlog claims 137,000 Thompsons went to the USSR in total. There were 4,000 Shermans and about 1,000 Grants sent to the USSR, and each one came with a pair of Thompsons so that's 10,000 right there.
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TN, USA
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Posted: 5/14/2024 11:42:46 AM EDT
[#30]
Oh, that's nice, give thousands of automatic weapons to commies but prohibit your own citizens from owning. Who's the commies now?
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Posted: 5/14/2024 11:45:55 AM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By amprecon: Oh, that's nice, give thousands of automatic weapons to commies but prohibit your own citizens from owning. Who's the commies now? The same Presidential signature is on both the National Firearms Act and the Lend-Lease Act. |
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USA
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Posted: 5/14/2024 11:47:51 AM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By amprecon: Oh, that's nice, give thousands of automatic weapons to commies but prohibit your own citizens from owning. Who's the commies now? Us. We always were. |
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TX, USA
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Posted: 5/14/2024 12:01:08 PM EDT
[#33]
Video showing the Soledar depot with Thompsons. Starts at 4:33. I'd bet there is more in some Russian depots.
 Wagner Finds Only Antique Weapons In Ukraine's Underground Weapons Cache |
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OK, USA
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Posted: 5/14/2024 12:02:45 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By PJF: I purchased one of the Russian M1A1 parts kits when they were $600. Everything was there except the center section of the receiver. The thing was absolutely flawless, it had obviously never been fired, the bore was bright and shiny, there was no wear on the metal parts, the wood was perfect. It had just sat in storage somewhere in Russia for decades, a firearm made by American craftsmen, paid for by the American taxpayer, given away to dirty communists for FREE, and when it was time to bring it home it had to be cut into pieces to render it useless. Talk about fraud, waste, and abuse. Absolutely disgusting. I remember when sportsman's guide sold those. |
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Posted: 5/14/2024 12:12:12 PM EDT
[#35]
I’m not sure about Russia but here is a pile of Thompsons in Vietnam…
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Posted: 5/14/2024 12:19:39 PM EDT
[Last Edit: ITCHY-FINGER]
[#36]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By FMJshooter: No, there were lots of Thompsons sent over. They became a sort of status symbol. https://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2019/08/1477979615233095545.jpg No idea on the actual number though. Yes, many thousands were sent. A bunch of new-in-wrap M1's were captured by the Russians in a Ukrainian salt-mine armory. I believe a few Thompsons were sent with each tank we sent over but I'm sure a bunch were sent separately also. Using the M1's for gulag guard duty makes sense since it would not make for logistics and resupply problems like a front-line unit. edit: Beat by most everyone. It's a huge shame we gave anything to Russia. |
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Posted: 5/14/2024 1:28:27 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By DKUltra: Wagner showed off the vintage US machine guns they captured in the salt mines in Ukraine. Theres a video if you search for it. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/110810/IMG_1754_jpeg-3214094.JPG Damn 
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SGP
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Posted: 5/14/2024 1:38:00 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By DrKlahn: We should rescind the "lend lease" on all firearms 50 years and older. |
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USA
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Posted: 5/14/2024 1:43:47 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Inneedofhelp]
[#39]
Already mentioned.
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AZ, USA
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Posted: 5/14/2024 1:46:26 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Ameshawki: "Tommy Gun" was/is a somewhat generic term for any submachine gun. Yep, particularly if it was equipped with a drum mag. |
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AL, USA
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Posted: 5/14/2024 1:59:05 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By SkullFarmer: This. He was talking about PPSH-41s. OK, that makes sense. I guess "Tommy Gun" might have been a generic name for SMGs, like we southern folks use "Coke" to describe most carbonated beverages. |
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Posted: 5/14/2024 2:01:13 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Snallygaster: When we sent over M-4 Shermans as part of Lend Lease, which the Soviets actually liked, they were shipped equipped with Thompson sub guns for the crew. The Soviets put many of these in storage. Iirc, a big cache was recently uncovered. They didn't use the Thompsons at the time due to a lack of .45 ammo. |
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Posted: 5/14/2024 2:01:52 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Flysc: OK, that makes sense. I guess "Tommy Gun" might have been a generic name for SMGs, like we southern folks use "Coke" to describe most carbonated beverages. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Flysc: Originally Posted By SkullFarmer: This. He was talking about PPSH-41s. OK, that makes sense. I guess "Tommy Gun" might have been a generic name for SMGs, like we southern folks use "Coke" to describe most carbonated beverages. That is my guess. He doesn't really strike me as a kind of person that was a gun expert. More likely PPSHs. |
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Posted: 5/14/2024 2:05:59 PM EDT
[#44]
We should have never given them any weapons
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AL, USA
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Posted: 5/14/2024 2:10:00 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By FMJshooter: No, there were lots of Thompsons sent over. They became a sort of status symbol. https://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2019/08/1477979615233095545.jpg No idea on the actual number though. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By FMJshooter: Originally Posted By SkullFarmer: This. He was talking about PPSH-41s. No, there were lots of Thompsons sent over. They became a sort of status symbol. https://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2019/08/1477979615233095545.jpg No idea on the actual number though. Well, you found a pic. Those are Thompsons or copies. I now wonder if the Soviet murder machine liked the design and copied them. Solzhenitsyn was often extremely detailed and specific in descriptions of some trappings of the military, prisons and camps. Hardware not so much, like with prison escape attempts where vehicles were used. He would use "car" or "transport truck". He did specify "Tommy Guns" a lot. |
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AL, USA
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Posted: 5/14/2024 2:19:05 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Fltot: I saw an article where the author claimed that over 130 000 were send to russsia. If i recall my history, the Thompson was developed around the time of WW1 (and the Bolshevik revolution). Intent was to sell them to our military. I think they were also advertised as "ranch guns". They were rather expensive, so they later became famous as gangster guns because wealthy Prohibition era outlaws were a segment who could afford the outlay. You could also just mail order them before the 1930s. Mailman would just leave the crate on your front porch. |
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IN, USA
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Posted: 5/14/2024 2:30:35 PM EDT
[#47]
When the RF took back Ukraynian territory that had the weapon storage mine on/in it there was footage of Thompsons being pulled out of the grease paper storage crates.
200,000 wooden crates of stored weapons . |
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OH, USA
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Posted: 5/14/2024 2:54:57 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By OTHP: There were some parts kits brought in by Bowman becore the you crain invasion. Not sure how many Robert got in though they sold for around 1200 bux a kit. Yep. Got one. Low serial M1A1 |
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AL, USA
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Posted: 5/14/2024 3:03:54 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Squeefoo: George Racey Jordan (January 4, 1898, New York - May 5, 1966, Los Angeles) was an American military officer, businessman, lecturer, activist, and author. He first gained nationwide attention in December 1949 when he testified to the United States Congress about wartime Lend-Lease deliveries to the Soviet Union, in the process implicating Harry Hopkins and other high officials in the transfer of nuclear and other secrets to the USSR.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0XYRwOaQ_g0Absolutely fascinating and totally believable. I can see how he got unpersoned. McCarthy was right. I also miss Paul Harvey's commentaries. Cool to hear him preamble that speech. He was one of a kind and very popular when i was young. |
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AL, USA
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Posted: 5/14/2024 3:07:09 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ServusVeritatis: A large amount of them are (or were) stored in the salt mines of Soledar Ukraine which was captured by Russians. The Wagner troops were showing off all the crates Thompsons by the thousands in a video last year. That action almost makes it guaranteed they will never be available in the U.S. market. Lots of surplus was in that mine from M1s to MG42s, PPsh, etc. I'd forgotten about that story. |
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