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Robert Strange McNamara
2/25/2009 2:17:44 PM
I've forgiven and mellowed a lot over the years, but I have a lot of work to do toward forgiving Robert McNamara for knowing his policies were getting America's best and bravest planted yet still enforcing those policies.
And I think he and Les Aspin were cut from the same cloth.
Anyone care to discuss?
And I think he and Les Aspin were cut from the same cloth.
Anyone care to discuss?
2/26/2009 10:17:20 PM
I've been reading a book by John Prados and Ray Stubbe about the siege of Khe Sanh. I'm currently reading about McNamara's scheme of a barrier clear across The northern part of Viet Nam known as "Practice Nine". Apparently thist thing was going to run around $1.6 billion (1967 dollars) in R&D and another $600 million for a command center. This fence was supposed to involve a Berlin Wall type of barrier using over 200,000 spools of barbed wire mine fields, reaction team bases the whole nine yards. McNamara was a big "numbers" man having run Ford motor company there wasn't any problem that couldn't be solved with the right application of numbers. Apparently Westmoreland signed onto this thing, but later got cold feet when he fully realized the cost and manpower requirements,, plus the fact that the NVA upon learning of this plan, began moving arty units into the construction areas. Khe Sanh was supposed to play a big role in this wall but things sorta fell apart. I've always had my suspicions about the guy, (never read "A Bright and Shining Lie") but reading about this scheme of his, I'm convinced the Viet Nam war was a doomed effort due to people like him.
2/28/2009 4:37:37 PM
In his later years he admitted that he knew some of his policies were doomed to failure and costing lives yet he still continued to feed our boys into the maw.
There are many confirmations of that damning fact.
There are many confirmations of that damning fact.
3/2/2009 9:38:20 PM
McManara was forced to those policies out of fear...
open Chinese intervention in Vietnam was the elephant in the room.
Policies had to be created that made the apperance we were fully commited while staying non-threatening to Chinese interest. It was impossible.
McManara was also responsible for the napalm campains in Japan which endagered and killed many American airmen, but also shortened the war.
I think McManara knew what he wanted but woefully underestimated the resolve of the Communist, and either ignored and was uniformed of the level of Chinese intervention already taking place.
open Chinese intervention in Vietnam was the elephant in the room.
Policies had to be created that made the apperance we were fully commited while staying non-threatening to Chinese interest. It was impossible.
McManara was also responsible for the napalm campains in Japan which endagered and killed many American airmen, but also shortened the war.
I think McManara knew what he wanted but woefully underestimated the resolve of the Communist, and either ignored and was uniformed of the level of Chinese intervention already taking place.
3/15/2009 6:08:52 PM
IF you want to see him in his total delusioned state admitting his part in war crimes watch his documentary ( I rented it at Hollywood video) "Fog of War". He's a puppet for the new world order.
7/6/2009 12:11:47 PM
Died
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/07/06/AR2009070601197_pf.html
He is personally responsible for planting thousands of America's finest.
I do not now, nor ever will include him among them.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/07/06/AR2009070601197_pf.html
He is personally responsible for planting thousands of America's finest.
I do not now, nor ever will include him among them.
7/8/2009 7:19:38 AM
Originally Posted By SD307:
McManara was forced to those policies out of fear...
open Chinese intervention in Vietnam was the elephant in the room.
Policies had to be created that made the apperance we were fully commited while staying non-threatening to Chinese interest. It was impossible.
McManara was also responsible for the napalm campains in Japan which endagered and killed many American airmen, but also shortened the war.
I think McManara knew what he wanted but woefully underestimated the resolve of the Communist, and either ignored and was uniformed of the level of Chinese intervention already taking place.
McManara was forced to those policies out of fear...
open Chinese intervention in Vietnam was the elephant in the room.
Policies had to be created that made the apperance we were fully commited while staying non-threatening to Chinese interest. It was impossible.
McManara was also responsible for the napalm campains in Japan which endagered and killed many American airmen, but also shortened the war.
I think McManara knew what he wanted but woefully underestimated the resolve of the Communist, and either ignored and was uniformed of the level of Chinese intervention already taking place.
I know they were afraid, but they were also arrogant and stupid, a very bad combination.
The dirty little secret is: we actually won the war twice, in 1968 and 1972, but were convinced by Russian propaganda supporting their side of the war, and our own fears, that we hadn’t.
We had three choices when we intervened in VN:
Don’t intervene
Intervene and fight hard and win; things like invading NV and capturing Hanoi.
Intervene and mess around, with no plan or intent to win. Send “messages” to the Communists that we were “serious.”
We picked the last one. It was obviously the worst possible thing we could do. We sent messages, but they only told the Communists we weren’t serious.
Can you imagine McNamara and Johnson sitting around a small table in the White House and picking bombing targets? You have got to be kidding, but they really did it. What a bunch of bozos.
7/9/2009 11:55:38 AM
"Can you imagine McNamara and Johnson sitting around a small table in the White House and picking bombing targets? You have got to be kidding, but they really did it. What a bunch of bozos."
And week after week, month after month of doing just that they were sending our best and brightest to their deaths.
criminal
And week after week, month after month of doing just that they were sending our best and brightest to their deaths.
criminal
7/17/2009 9:43:43 AM
An interesting perspective from an economic historian:
I read his blog fairly frequently.
He even ties it back in with what's going on today with BHO (bailouts, etc).
ETA: Hell, it's short, so why not.
note: I have added a comma to the above (between "home front" and "such as"), for readability
* Don Boudreaux (2009). Hubris Universal. Cafe Hayek.
I read his blog fairly frequently.
He even ties it back in with what's going on today with BHO (bailouts, etc).
ETA: Hell, it's short, so why not.
July 07, 2009
Hubris Universal
Don Boudreaux
Here's a letter that I sent today to USA Today:
Scolding the late Robert
McNamara for the hubris of his foreign policy is now de rigueur. As
you correctly argue, on Vietnam Mr. McNamara "didn't assess the limits
of American power" ("McNamara's hubris holds lessons for today's
leaders," July 7). Like so many Really Smart People, he possessed a
mindless faith in the ability of analytical genius, backed by
government power, to right the world's wrongs.
But the dangers of hubris and the limits of top-down solutions designed by geniuses don't exist only outside of our borders; they're just as real domestically. If unpredictability, incalculable details, and unintended consequences threaten to make a mess of interventions abroad, surely the same stubborn aspects of reality threaten to make a mess of centralized, genius-planned interventions on the home front, such as those that aim to supply universal health care and to create a "green economy."
Sincerely,
Donald J. Boudreaux
But the dangers of hubris and the limits of top-down solutions designed by geniuses don't exist only outside of our borders; they're just as real domestically. If unpredictability, incalculable details, and unintended consequences threaten to make a mess of interventions abroad, surely the same stubborn aspects of reality threaten to make a mess of centralized, genius-planned interventions on the home front, such as those that aim to supply universal health care and to create a "green economy."
Sincerely,
Donald J. Boudreaux
note: I have added a comma to the above (between "home front" and "such as"), for readability
7/17/2009 2:33:46 PM
Originally Posted By wise_jake:
An interesting perspective from an economic historian:
I read his blog fairly frequently.
He even ties it back in with what's going on today with BHO (bailouts, etc).
ETA: Hell, it's short, so why not.
note: I have added a comma to the above (between "home front" and "such as"), for readability
An interesting perspective from an economic historian:
* Don Boudreaux (2009). Hubris Universal. Cafe Hayek.
I read his blog fairly frequently.
He even ties it back in with what's going on today with BHO (bailouts, etc).
ETA: Hell, it's short, so why not.
July 07, 2009
Hubris Universal
Don Boudreaux
Here's a letter that I sent today to USA Today:
Scolding the late RobertMcNamara for the hubris of his foreign policy is now de rigueur. Asyou correctly argue, on Vietnam Mr. McNamara "didn't assess the limitsof American power" ("McNamara's hubris holds lessons for today'sleaders," July 7). Like so many Really Smart People, he possessed amindless faith in the ability of analytical genius, backed bygovernment power, to right the world's wrongs.
But the dangersof hubris and the limits of top-down solutions designed by geniusesdon't exist only outside of our borders; they're just as realdomestically. If unpredictability, incalculable details, andunintended consequences threaten to make a mess of interventionsabroad, surely the same stubborn aspects of reality threaten to make amess of centralized, genius-planned interventions on the home front,such as those that aim to supply universal health care and to create a"green economy."
Sincerely,
Donald J. Boudreaux
But the dangersof hubris and the limits of top-down solutions designed by geniusesdon't exist only outside of our borders; they're just as realdomestically. If unpredictability, incalculable details, andunintended consequences threaten to make a mess of interventionsabroad, surely the same stubborn aspects of reality threaten to make amess of centralized, genius-planned interventions on the home front,such as those that aim to supply universal health care and to create a"green economy."
Sincerely,
Donald J. Boudreaux
note: I have added a comma to the above (between "home front" and "such as"), for readability
very well said
7/28/2009 9:30:50 AM
Originally Posted By SD307:
McManara was forced to those policies out of fear...
open Chinese intervention in Vietnam was the elephant in the room.
Policies had to be created that made the apperance we were fully commited while staying non-threatening to Chinese interest. It was impossible.
McManara was also responsible for the napalm campains in Japan which endagered and killed many American airmen, but also shortened the war.
I think McManara knew what he wanted but woefully underestimated the resolve of the Communist, and either ignored and was uniformed of the level of Chinese intervention already taking place.
McManara was forced to those policies out of fear...
open Chinese intervention in Vietnam was the elephant in the room.
Policies had to be created that made the apperance we were fully commited while staying non-threatening to Chinese interest. It was impossible.
McManara was also responsible for the napalm campains in Japan which endagered and killed many American airmen, but also shortened the war.
I think McManara knew what he wanted but woefully underestimated the resolve of the Communist, and either ignored and was uniformed of the level of Chinese intervention already taking place.
McNamara said that he did not believe we could win in Vietnam, but he did not speak out because it would have endangered his career. He was sort of right. We could not win with himself and Johnson in charge.
