AR15.Com Archives
 carbine buffer tube w/ foam pad?
tkm3d1a  [Member]
9/18/2011 10:28:25 AM
So I can't seem to find a definitive answer to this. Is it legal to assemble a pistol with a milspec carbine buffer tube with a foam tube around it? Does the foam have to permantly attached in some way or would say zip ties securing it work? I am going to build a 10.5 upper and would like to put it on a pistol till I can register a lower for sbr and really don't want to do the whole pistol buffer tube thing. So, what say you?
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MOS11C  [Team Member]
9/18/2011 10:37:38 AM
Some one mentioned having a letter from ATF regarding carbine tubes in this thread:
http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_3_122/525036_Request___Scans_of_any_letters_from_the_BATFE__that_pertain_to_AR_pistols.html
hottnucks  [Member]
9/18/2011 10:51:39 AM
I would say that slipping foam over a carbine buffer tube would not be sufficient. You could easily slip off the foam and put a stock on it. Meaning it can be converted into a SBR too easily. The ATF would frown upon that.
MOS11C  [Team Member]
9/18/2011 11:11:43 AM
Originally Posted By hottnucks:
I would say that slipping foam over a carbine buffer tube would not be sufficient. You could easily slip off the foam and put a stock on it. Meaning it can be converted into a SBR too easily. The ATF would frown upon that.


I don't have any AR pistols and not that I ever would do it but you can easily make
a stock from a pistol tube too. Easily slipping an ace buttplate on.....WHICH WOULD NOT BE ADVISABLE AND VERY ILLEGAL TOO.
eeeticket  [Member]
9/18/2011 3:48:21 PM
If using a carbine tube you could fill the slot with JB weld making it impossible to attach a stock.
MOS11C  [Team Member]
9/18/2011 4:09:16 PM
Originally Posted By eeeticket:
If using a carbine tube you could fill the slot with JB weld making it impossible to attach a stock.


If you don't posses a stock then welding your tube will not be necessary.
Just buy the stock "after" you get the stamp.
browningfan91  [Member]
9/19/2011 8:28:08 PM
Originally Posted By hottnucks:
I would say that slipping foam over a carbine buffer tube would not be sufficient. You could easily slip off the foam and put a stock on it. Meaning it can be converted into a SBR too easily. The ATF would frown upon that.


Why would you say the ATF would "frown upon that"? Are you saying it is illegal?

Pistols may be converted to a rifle and then back again per ATF reg 2011-4 and buffer tubes are not stocks.

There are many letters out there that say to be a rifle a firearm must have a stock.

This letter posted on the letter thread states it is permissible to use a carbine buffer tube on a pistol.
Lamron  [Member]
9/19/2011 9:33:00 PM
It doesn't have to be impossible to attach a stock, just don't actually have one on there. If the ability to attach a stock was a problem, then every factory Glock (and several other guns) would be illegal too. Putting the foam on the tube makes it more comfortable, and helps makes it obvious that you don't have any intention of slipping a buttstock on when no one is looking.
browningfan91  [Member]
9/19/2011 10:10:06 PM
Originally Posted By Lamron:
It doesn't have to be impossible to attach a stock, just don't actually have one on there. If the ability to attach a stock was a problem, then every factory Glock (and several other guns) would be illegal too. Putting the foam on the tube makes it more comfortable, and helps makes it obvious that you don't have any intention of slipping a buttstock on when no one is looking.


I agree, but I think there may be one instance where a carbine buffer tube on a pistol may get you into trouble. That would be if you have a 15.999 inch barrelled upper on a receiver with a carbine buffer tube and a stock for it in the area and no 16 inch or longer barrel nearby. That "could" get you on some constructive possession, maybe. Another instance is if you have all of the parts to build an ar pistol including a carbine buffer tube and a stock. If all the parts are not assembled and the barrel is less than 16 inches in length that "could" get them to look harder. That would only apply if those were the only parts you had in your possession. If in addition you had a 16 inch barrel that would be the defense for having a stock.

jrzy  [Team Member]
9/19/2011 10:35:52 PM

Originally Posted By browningfan91:
Originally Posted By hottnucks:
I would say that slipping foam over a carbine buffer tube would not be sufficient. You could easily slip off the foam and put a stock on it. Meaning it can be converted into a SBR too easily. The ATF would frown upon that.


Why would you say the ATF would "frown upon that"? Are you saying it is illegal?

Pistols may be converted to a rifle and then back again per ATF reg 2011-4 and buffer tubes are not stocks.

There are many letters out there that say to be a rifle a firearm must have a stock.

This letter posted on the letter thread states it is permissible to use a carbine buffer tube on a pistol.

Yeah but why are you leaving out the part right after that , thats the part where you can get arrested.

This from your letter below.

"However possessing a rifle buttstock that COULD READILY BE INSTALLED ON YOUR PISTOL could constitute possession of a short barreled rifle"




browningfan91  [Member]
9/20/2011 1:09:04 AM
Originally Posted By jrzy:

Originally Posted By browningfan91:
Originally Posted By hottnucks:
I would say that slipping foam over a carbine buffer tube would not be sufficient. You could easily slip off the foam and put a stock on it. Meaning it can be converted into a SBR too easily. The ATF would frown upon that.


Why would you say the ATF would "frown upon that"? Are you saying it is illegal?

Pistols may be converted to a rifle and then back again per ATF reg 2011-4 and buffer tubes are not stocks.

There are many letters out there that say to be a rifle a firearm must have a stock.

This letter posted on the letter thread states it is permissible to use a carbine buffer tube on a pistol.

Yeah but why are you leaving out the part right after that , thats the part where you can get arrested.

This from your letter below.

"However possessing a rifle buttstock that COULD READILY BE INSTALLED ON YOUR PISTOL could constitute possession of a short barreled rifle"






The only way someone "could" be arrested is if they had a receiver which was first barrelled as a rifle and a stock attached before it was made into a pistol and they removed the stock. OR, If they only had a receiver with a carbine buffer, an upper with a 15.9 inch barrel or less and a stock near it. The former would be a SBR and the latter "could" be constructive possession.

If I have a glock 17 handgun which was first assembled as a handgun, then remove the barrel in favor of a 16 inch barrel and a snap on stock I have created a rifle from the pistol. All I must do to make it a pistol again is unclip the stock and it is a pistol. I can lay the stock near the pistol all day long as it is used to make my glock a rifle in conjunction with the 16 inch barrel. The day I sell the barrel and keep the stock I "could" maybe be tracked down and prosecuted for constructive possession, maybe.

jrzy  [Team Member]
9/20/2011 11:43:02 AM

Originally Posted By browningfan91:
Originally Posted By jrzy:

Originally Posted By browningfan91:
Originally Posted By hottnucks:
I would say that slipping foam over a carbine buffer tube would not be sufficient. You could easily slip off the foam and put a stock on it. Meaning it can be converted into a SBR too easily. The ATF would frown upon that.


Why would you say the ATF would "frown upon that"? Are you saying it is illegal?

Pistols may be converted to a rifle and then back again per ATF reg 2011-4 and buffer tubes are not stocks.

There are many letters out there that say to be a rifle a firearm must have a stock.

This letter posted on the letter thread states it is permissible to use a carbine buffer tube on a pistol.

Yeah but why are you leaving out the part right after that , thats the part where you can get arrested.

This from your letter below.

"However possessing a rifle buttstock that COULD READILY BE INSTALLED ON YOUR PISTOL could constitute possession of a short barreled rifle"






The only way someone "could" be arrested is if they had a receiver which was first barrelled as a rifle and a stock attached before it was made into a pistol and they removed the stock. OR, If they only had a receiver with a carbine buffer, an upper with a 15.9 inch barrel or less and a stock near it. The former would be a SBR and the latter "could" be constructive possession.

If I have a glock 17 handgun which was first assembled as a handgun, then remove the barrel in favor of a 16 inch barrel and a snap on stock I have created a rifle from the pistol. All I must do to make it a pistol again is unclip the stock and it is a pistol. I can lay the stock near the pistol all day long as it is used to make my glock a rifle in conjunction with the 16 inch barrel. The day I sell the barrel and keep the stock I "could" maybe be tracked down and prosecuted for constructive possession, maybe.


NOT TRUE FOR THE 100TH time
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