Archived Posts » 59,699,509
Stamped Rack Numbers on 603s?
3/22/2012 1:12:04 AM
I've got 3 603 uppers that have numbers stamped into the rear of the upper. I can only assume they are rack numbers but I thought any permanent alteration was against regulation? Hence all the spray painted stocks and handguards, dymo tape labels, white out and taped on labels on the furniture.
Someone thought they might be PD markings but since I have 3, I assume they aren't all that rare and it would be strange to have that many PD uppers in circulation with the same type of stampings. I know how PDs love eletropenciling.
Anyone else run across these? Thoughts?
Someone thought they might be PD markings but since I have 3, I assume they aren't all that rare and it would be strange to have that many PD uppers in circulation with the same type of stampings. I know how PDs love eletropenciling.
Anyone else run across these? Thoughts?
3/22/2012 1:42:25 AM
Maybe they were marked that way while in the service of a foreign country / allied-nation perhaps??
Don't know, except to say that I've never noticed such markings on any of the A1's that I've ever handled...
Don't know, except to say that I've never noticed such markings on any of the A1's that I've ever handled...
3/22/2012 5:30:54 AM
Other than a few on the forum like yours the only other one I've seen was a Tampa PD rifle.
3/22/2012 6:36:51 AM
I've had 3 or 4 over the years. One was stamped inside the sight channel groove of the upper and the others were stamped on the back of the sight like yours.
3/22/2012 7:05:38 AM
My XM16E1 is stamped just like yours. This was debated heavily years ago multiple times, and most people seem to think it's a PD thing, but the interesting thing is how many of them have shown up, and I seem to remember a fomer service member mentioning seeing them, (Navy?) but I have CRS, so I'd check the archives. Even then, I can't remember anyone having a really definitive answer.
3/22/2012 8:51:22 AM
My XM16E1 upper is stamped the same way. A few years ago, some board members were suggesting that this was done by the Isrealis. I know many XM16E1s and M16A1s were sent over there during the Yom Kippur War in '73. Alot of surplus uppers were reimported from Isreal during the 80s ande 90s.
3/22/2012 9:32:00 AM
Were they able to stamp it without breaking the anodizing? Or was the stamp done pre anodizing?
3/22/2012 9:36:47 AM
I would say most are imports anyway.
3/22/2012 5:20:49 PM
Originally Posted By boywonder777:
I've got 3 603 uppers that have numbers stamped into the rear of the upper. I can only assume they are rack numbers but I thought any permanent alteration was against regulation? Hence all the spray painted stocks and handguards, dymo tape labels, white out and taped on labels on the furniture.
Someone thought they might be PD markings but since I have 3, I assume they aren't all that rare and it would be strange to have that many PD uppers in circulation with the same type of stampings. I know how PDs love eletropenciling.
Anyone else run across these? Thoughts?
http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k517/s0b3/DSC04292.jpg
http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k517/s0b3/DSC04294.jpg
I've got 3 603 uppers that have numbers stamped into the rear of the upper. I can only assume they are rack numbers but I thought any permanent alteration was against regulation? Hence all the spray painted stocks and handguards, dymo tape labels, white out and taped on labels on the furniture.
Someone thought they might be PD markings but since I have 3, I assume they aren't all that rare and it would be strange to have that many PD uppers in circulation with the same type of stampings. I know how PDs love eletropenciling.
Anyone else run across these? Thoughts?
http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k517/s0b3/DSC04292.jpg
http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k517/s0b3/DSC04294.jpg
I got two like that on the EE around the beginning of the year....both from the same seller. The font used for the numbers on mine is the same as yours, I'm wondering if we got them from the same source.
3/22/2012 7:04:16 PM
Originally Posted By Tiberius:
I got two like that on the EE around the beginning of the year....both from the same seller. The font used for the numbers on mine is the same as yours, I'm wondering if we got them from the same source.
Originally Posted By boywonder777:
I've got 3 603 uppers that have numbers stamped into the rear of the upper. I can only assume they are rack numbers but I thought any permanent alteration was against regulation? Hence all the spray painted stocks and handguards, dymo tape labels, white out and taped on labels on the furniture.
Someone thought they might be PD markings but since I have 3, I assume they aren't all that rare and it would be strange to have that many PD uppers in circulation with the same type of stampings. I know how PDs love eletropenciling.
Anyone else run across these? Thoughts?
http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k517/s0b3/DSC04292.jpg
http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k517/s0b3/DSC04294.jpg
I've got 3 603 uppers that have numbers stamped into the rear of the upper. I can only assume they are rack numbers but I thought any permanent alteration was against regulation? Hence all the spray painted stocks and handguards, dymo tape labels, white out and taped on labels on the furniture.
Someone thought they might be PD markings but since I have 3, I assume they aren't all that rare and it would be strange to have that many PD uppers in circulation with the same type of stampings. I know how PDs love eletropenciling.
Anyone else run across these? Thoughts?
http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k517/s0b3/DSC04292.jpg
http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k517/s0b3/DSC04294.jpg
I got two like that on the EE around the beginning of the year....both from the same seller. The font used for the numbers on mine is the same as yours, I'm wondering if we got them from the same source.
one i got recently but the other 2 i've had for 4 or 5 years.
3/22/2012 9:49:47 PM
Bought mine from a member about 4 years ago - maybe more? Imagine how thrilled I was when I realized it was an original XM16E1 in great condition. I started out just building a simple A1, but the upper dictated I go further. ANother member kindly made me some stencils to match the number, and I FINALLY recently bought paint to finish the stock. As soon as the weather gets nicer I plan on doing some work on the E1 to finish it off now that I finally have the correct BCG! 
(Yes, I will post pics, but I believe some engraving is now in order, so need to get the lower apart and sent out.)
(Yes, I will post pics, but I believe some engraving is now in order, so need to get the lower apart and sent out.)4/20/2012 6:31:41 AM
I just got a 603 off EE with numbers stamped on the back of the upper. 593
4/20/2012 8:30:53 AM
Back in the late 70s a supliment to the M-16 TO/ TM was issued stating that the uppers, lowers or bolt carrier groups were not to be metal stamped or engraved with rack numbers. It seems that a trend was started by some unit Armorer's to mark the rifles this way and the Big Army put a stop to it. I know it was always a challenge to keep the uppers mated up with their proper lowers, especially in the field. This was important to keep accurate data on the maintenance of each rifle.
4/20/2012 11:43:44 AM
Originally Posted By Fortis120:
Back in the late 70s a supliment to the M-16 TO/ TM was issued stating that the uppers, lowers or bolt carrier groups were not to be metal stamped or engraved with rack numbers. It seems that a trend was started by some unit Armorer's to mark the rifles this way and the Big Army put a stop to it. I know it was always a challenge to keep the uppers mated up with their proper lowers, especially in the field. This was important to keep accurate data on the maintenance of each rifle.
Back in the late 70s a supliment to the M-16 TO/ TM was issued stating that the uppers, lowers or bolt carrier groups were not to be metal stamped or engraved with rack numbers. It seems that a trend was started by some unit Armorer's to mark the rifles this way and the Big Army put a stop to it. I know it was always a challenge to keep the uppers mated up with their proper lowers, especially in the field. This was important to keep accurate data on the maintenance of each rifle.
so these could have been done prior to that communication? have you seen any come out of the armory marked like these?
4/20/2012 11:55:13 AM
Originally Posted By boywonder777:
so these could have been done prior to that communication? have you seen any come out of the armory marked like these?
Originally Posted By Fortis120:
Back in the late 70s a supplement to the M-16 TO/ TM was issued stating that the uppers, lowers or bolt carrier groups were not to be metal stamped or engraved with rack numbers. It seems that a trend was started by some unit Armorer's to mark the rifles this way and the Big Army put a stop to it. I know it was always a challenge to keep the uppers mated up with their proper lowers, especially in the field. This was important to keep accurate data on the maintenance of each rifle.
Back in the late 70s a supplement to the M-16 TO/ TM was issued stating that the uppers, lowers or bolt carrier groups were not to be metal stamped or engraved with rack numbers. It seems that a trend was started by some unit Armorer's to mark the rifles this way and the Big Army put a stop to it. I know it was always a challenge to keep the uppers mated up with their proper lowers, especially in the field. This was important to keep accurate data on the maintenance of each rifle.
so these could have been done prior to that communication? have you seen any come out of the armory marked like these?
Yes a few, but they were AF 602s and 604s and the marking varied depending on the method used to stamp or engrave it. It's hard to say if the ones floating around on the market were done by US Military personnel, but it did happen to some and someone thought it was important enough to put it in a Technical Manual.
4/20/2012 8:25:13 PM
My square forge XM receiver has a stamped rack number on the rear of the carry handle. I was made when I noticed it after I received it, but now, I've grown to love it.
4/21/2012 12:46:48 AM
4/21/2012 2:39:56 AM
Originally Posted By jm0502:
http://i542.photobucket.com/albums/gg415/jm0502/IMG_20120421_004406-1.jpg
http://i542.photobucket.com/albums/gg415/jm0502/IMG_20120421_004406-1.jpg
that 5 looks like mine. Fortis120, do you know if there's a standard set of stamps that the army used? these are pretty consistent unlike the later markings done with tape labels, white out, stenciled spray paint, taped on numbers etc...
4/21/2012 2:43:18 AM
in the 60's there were probably only a few makers of stamps. maybe starrett.
4/21/2012 9:48:00 AM
Originally Posted By boywonder777:
that 5 looks like mine. Fortis120, do you know if there's a standard set of stamps that the army used? these are pretty consistent unlike the later markings done with tape labels, white out, stenciled spray paint, taped on numbers etc...
Originally Posted By jm0502:
http://i542.photobucket.com/albums/gg415/jm0502/IMG_20120421_004406-1.jpg
http://i542.photobucket.com/albums/gg415/jm0502/IMG_20120421_004406-1.jpg
that 5 looks like mine. Fortis120, do you know if there's a standard set of stamps that the army used? these are pretty consistent unlike the later markings done with tape labels, white out, stenciled spray paint, taped on numbers etc...
Not sure if there was any standard for the stamps . I've seen several Armorer's tool boxes that had both number and letter hand stamps in them. They were usually stored in a mufti slotted wood box that kept each stamp from getting lost.
4/21/2012 10:06:14 AM
My E1 upper has the exact same stamping. Has it been all 3 digit numbers so far?
5/4/2012 10:16:07 AM
Just noticed this upper in a GB auction, and it has the same rack numbers stamped on the rear of the carry handle. Just thought I'd share another example.
GB Auction
GB Auction
5/4/2012 11:46:46 AM
Originally Posted By MrM1A1:
Just noticed this upper in a GB auction, and it has the same rack numbers stamped on the rear of the carry handle. Just thought I'd share another example.
GB Auction
http://pics.gunbroker.com/GB/284776000/284776360/pix117486804.jpg
Just noticed this upper in a GB auction, and it has the same rack numbers stamped on the rear of the carry handle. Just thought I'd share another example.
GB Auction
http://pics.gunbroker.com/GB/284776000/284776360/pix117486804.jpg
I've been watching that auction, too. The bidder is a co-worker of mine––Army vet who wants a rifle like the one Uncle Sam gave him (actually, he tells me he had an H&R in basic––remembers thinking they gave him a "cheap" version of the Colt).
He called me yesterday to ask about that stamp and I was able to share the info that I'd read in this thread. It made him feel better about the way it's marked.
I love the info I pick up around here!
