Chinese AR's???

Hello to all,

I know in the US there's allot of brands of AR's that are made well including the no name versions that gun shops produce themselves and sell. Now I'm hearing that there's allot of parts that are being made and imported by the Chinese. Are these made on the same CNC maching and are to the same specs in the US???? Is the metal they use just as good as the US brands???

Impala

China is the leading country in the world when it comes to manufacturing most anything. They have the best factories; updated CNC and can get what ever raw material that they need. All they need is someone to order the parts....

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They're (primarily accessories) exported by the Chinese and imported by bottom-feeding dealers here in the US.
That should answer your other two questions, as well.

Here you go:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UjM5dk9ydHQ&feature=fvwrel

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j5e0TM7O8j8&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yU9xwJA57WE

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gUMyjigEFoc

and one more:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cahWZkE4dLw&feature=related




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Being from a Chinese background, and traveling there extensively with work and family in the past decade, I would not trust their factories to be as up to par as "mil spec" as Made in USA, I would much rather buy a Mil Spec made here than a knock off or a high quality part from China, remember China is THE country/manufacturer of most goods in the world, BUT it is proven and a fact that they DO CUT CORNERS in order to gain profits, I know this from experience.


Just to give everyone here a bit of info, Milk has been found contaminated with added chemicals and genetically altered in a low budget way, the meat can be sometimes replaced by newspapers, organic vegetables have been sprayed by pesticides and various other chemicals to make them look "fresh/tasteless". Foodwise the only food I would consider buying is imported from other countries (at an increased import tax price of 33%+), veggies and eggs we use to get from farmers who had relatives in the city, even farmers don't eat the veggies they produce for markets, because they spray them down, they eat the natural hand picked stuff right on their table.
And lets not get into counterfeit products, leather, electronics, clothing......

Hope this helps.

Firearms is one of the few categories of products where I can avoid buying Chinese crap. And I do.

Still, they did make some pretty nice AKs back in the day, especially the Polytech Legend Series. Thanks Mr. Bush (Sr.) for protecting us from the import of those infernal machines

i agree they did make nice AK'S the polytech's are beautiful

All I can say at the time I got my polytech M14s they were and currently are better than the springfield M1a with its cast receiver and non chromelined barrels and not to spec receiver of course those rifle were made off tooling we sold them in the late 60s.At least the polytech and its parts are forged.I got a GI bolt conversion on mine and there were no hardness issues with the receiver of course I knew that because before I got the conversion 2 years ago its run fine for 18 years and 22k rounds on the rifle with no change out on parts until I got the new bolt wich has 800 rds on it.

They dont import ARs in this country but go to marstar of canada they advertise them on there.

they have the best factories???? that would be news to the chinese

Ok; I'll back up and say not the best but they can make anything at any level of quality that they want. It may suck for the workers but they can and do produce almost all of our products. Car parts, guns/ammo, ect.... India will be next.

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The thing with the Chinese is that they can build parts up to any spec you want. The problem is most companies that buy from China want to have a product that is cheaper, so they go with a lower quality part. However this is not always the case, an example would be the optics from Primary Arms. While they aren't going to compete with top of the line products, they are very good entry level scopes and red dots. It's all about what the customer (importer) wants.

Believe it or not, the recent Norinco AR clone is a well made animal as well. Although not available in the US, it is finished as well as any commercial AR I've seen on this side of the pond.

Chinese manufacture.
India does tech support.

This. China is no different than the US or any other country. We all have the capabilities to build top quality parts, or the capabilities to pump out lots of junk parts. It all depends on the specs and requirements provided to the factory. The idea that everything from China is junk and CNC machines only work accurately and consistently within the US borders is just silly.

However, a lot of decisions to import parts are based on cutting costs, which can result in sub-par parts coming from a foreign country.

well comon, whatever the quality of the chicom guns,lets just buy american made when we can. its also good for resale value.

Its very simple for me, since I am an American I buy American whenever I can. Im not going to minimize the reality that Chinese manufacturing has jumped LEAPS in the past 20 years, but there is MUCH more to the equation then the simple quality of components produced, or at least there is for me.

want a good AR? get it made in america.....or canada

chicom women ,however are ok. they look like they would function well as commercial or milspec.
maybe just a little too skinny.

Hi guys/gals,

I was just wondering about them and how they compare to the US brands. I want to try and shoot for cheaper but don't want to cut any corners in quality. In some cases I heard the steel is better than the US brands and so I just wondered.

My buddy went to and bought an AR uppers from a dealer that to my knowledge had no brand markings on it what so ever. It does look decent in quality but since no name was labeled. It was a shortie with what had was a fake "can" on the end of the barrel to make it California legal. It came without a bolt nor a "T" handle so he had to buy all the separately. Can't say if it had a chrome bore or not. Where it came from and who put it together I can't say but it was much after the show I thought it came from Chinese parts. It attaches OK to the American lower fine so who knows??

Impala

Great Post & thanks for it!

+1

Seems as though the Chinese are A#1 at making anything that "looks just like" the original. My brother-in-law is in quality control for a major manufacturer of heavy equipment. They are building manufacturing plants in main land China and buying from the Chinese. Problem is, while products look good, they are off on tolerances and the finished steels/alloys/metals tend to be way under limits on quality, strength, specs, etc. This is all within the last two years.

Seems I also remember a major issue with the aerospace industry buying high grade nuts and bolts from China many years ago that looked great, cost a fraction of US products, and . . . . failed miserably when put in service. Too much at risk for me. But I'm sure their day will come.

As I have always said why send my money to keep Jing Do in a job when I can keep Joe Doe in a job over here. But thanks to our govt and over regulation of business and over taxation we end up sending job there. I will not get into that now but buy American when I can yes I do nick pick when I shop. I would buy American everything if I could find it all. Especially guns American is the way to go.

ETA .... Dey took our JOBS!!!!!

< inappropriate image removed - F >

Metallurgy is their downfall.
Although they do have the ability to accurately machine parts, their materials lack conformity to standards and traceability.

For example, there is some aluminum barstock of Chinese origin on the US market these days and it can range from acceptable to total crap.

It is supposed to adhere to the standard (say 6061 T6, material grade and temper) but it's anybody's guess what it really is.

I've seen reports of finding a lump of steel or carbide in the middle of a piece of aluminum billet.

I wouldn't trust Chinese manufacture parts for anything that matters... barrels bolts extractors carriers receivers springs fire control parts to name a few.

Joe

Did I really see someone claim that the Norinco M14 is better than the US made one? WTF O_O

Is he rly comparig a m14 to a M1a

wow where did you get your weed? there is no comparison between a polytech and springfield. its like trying to compare a kia to a corvette. the finest example of a polytech couldn't coddle the springfields nut bag. let me guess, you have a polytech?

Its true springfield armory receivers are cast not forge and factory seconds they sold 4 or 5 years ago sucked too with the receivers spring guide slots cut deeper than they should have been and made into rifles and sold anyway..its a fact the polytech receivers compared to the springfield..the polytechs are better and dont have the heat treat problems that are claimed no hardness problems on my receiver.Your M1As receiver isnt machined from a 12lb hammer forged 8620 forging.$500 more than what springfield wants will get you the closest you can have in materials used and competent construction and LRB is it.

...LRB would be the best of em all.Yea I have the polytech and facts are facts the springfield made M1a isnt even made to GI specs...they still using parts from brazille.They dont even use chromelined barrels...so if anyones smoking weed its you and the $1500 you spent on your springfield made M1A...enjoy the cast receiver.and yea not norinco theres a difference between late model side marked IDE MICH polytechs and norincos.Even earlier late 80s springfiled M1As at least were built with GI parts.Try putting a GI bolt in your M1A...wont work.

Do some reasearch on those non-spec M1As the only threads metric on polytechs are the gas cyclinder assembly and there not chromelined.A GI barrel will thread to a polytech reciever with no problems...polytechs were made back then off of tooling the US sold china..not so for Springfiled armory cast rifles.So to M164 real your right there is no comparison between the late model Polytech M14s and your Springfield Armory $1500 cast receiver some non made US parts rifle..so I agree with ya

I went through 8 Springfield Armory M1A receivers before I found three that were serviceable for making NM rifles, and ALL those three receivers needed machining to correct inadequate complex curves.

I had five LRB M1A receivers. I could not use any of them for NM rifles.

I will not put $400 more into a M1A type receiver that should have been made right the first time.

Of the 20+ registered M14 receivers I have worked on, all of them made perfect NM rifles. USGI M14s are made right.

I am completely disappointed with Springfield and LRB. Luckily, the AR-10 type rifle can be made to shoot more accurately for a longer period (higher round count), and it has many more advantages over the M14/M1A.

The Polytech had better geometry than the Springfield or LRB. The rest of the parts on the Polytech were crap.

The USGI M14 was a great rifle in its heyday. The civilian producers do not make a good semi-auto version.

I do not care for the Chinese made AR.

If you are going to buy an AR, I strongly advise buying one made in America, by one of the major suppliers of ARs.

The Polytech and Norinco M14S rifles are for the most part much better than Springfield rifles offered since they exhausted their supply of US made M14 surplus parts.

The Norinco 1911 clones are also very well made, and surpass the quality of Colt pistols made during the '90's.

People need to get over their xenophobia. When the Chinese are held to a standard, they can produce to that standard. Look at Apple for an example. It's when they are not held to a standard that corners get cut.

The Chinese can build a decent firearm, no doubt. Their SKS/Type 56 carbines, AK/Type 56 rifles, M14s, and 1911s were all decent to good. However, somehow I'm not sure I would trust them on an AR15. I love the AR, but I think it's a relatively fragile design (compared to the AKs and SKSs), primarily because of the bolt design. There are a number of US manufacturers that shall remain nameless that I wouldn't trust to build an AR15, either. It's not xenophobia, it's just skepticism.

I was just wondering of this cuz when I head to the shows generic seems to flood the entire show where evryone selling AR's for cheaper. OK I can understand the quality issues at hand but what happens if and when anyone buys an AR-15 kit???? How do you know where each part comes from except for looking for a brand name attached to the parts???? It seems a guy like me on a budget has no choice but to buy from a well know manufacturer like Snith and Wesson, Del-Ton, CMMG, Doublestar and the like.

Impala

Buying from well known manufacturers is what most people tend to do. Most people buy a complete upper, a stripped lower and a lower parts kit. Popular lower parts kits are from Rock River Arms, DPMS, Palmetto State Armory, BCM, Daniel Defense and Colt.

yes, they do. even though they are run by slaves.

look, even the Chinese can make a high quality product if you pay for it. I'm sure that if I wanted to farm out a production of "mil spec" rifles I could get the Chinese to make it if I paid for the high quality parts and quality control. The key word is PAY, Money, moola, if you want good stuff you have to pay for it.

I have been doing business daily with Chinese factories for many years, and my business partner and I are over there frequently. I can assure you you are 100% WRONG when it comes to the factories that are making gun parts. Most of the "factories" are being run out of people's homes and garages.

The only factories that are updated as you speak of, are the factories like the one Apple owns to make their phones and iPads etc. Mainly electronics. You would not believe your eyes if you saw the factories making castings and metal parts ete...casting equipment from the 1940's in peoples garages. I see it all the time in person as I am in a business that deals with metal casting in China.

I have friends who deal with Chinese factories all the time. It is true, they can make a very good product, BUT you must have a company rep at the factory at all time to insure QC. If not, they start to cut corners and let things slip by. They do not seem to take pride in their products as some other countries do, but who can blame them when we line to buy their cheap crap.

+1
Metallurgy, metal blending technology, heat treat and temper are things the Chinese have yet to master.
They can reverse engineer almost anything, they just can't produce anything exacrly to specification.

+1

I like mine, even thought it is an older type that is not being imported into Canada anymore. The current crop are M4 clones with 14.5" bbls and removeable carry handles, whereas mine is an A1 clone. The new models have standard threads throughout while mine has metric threads, thus limiting the tacti-crap I can bolt onto it. The concensus is that they work well, are accurate and make for a good rifle for the average Joe who wants a cool toy. Guys are souping them up and taking courses with them and are generally happy. The caveat with all Norinco products is that you have to be willing to do your own QC and buy from a dealer with a return policy.

Incidentally, Norinco/Polytech M14 clones are awesome. The issues with your rifles down there (soft bolts, loose chambers, etc) were corrected years ago. When you factor in that a Springer is $2k+/- up here, there are a steal at $450.

+1

The Chinese can and do build some really good fire arms products. I have never seen any documentation that the Chinese manufacturer any AR parts other than hand guards, sights and accessories. No LPK parts or BCG parts that I'm aware of.

when chinese mfg's can make aircraft engines lets talk.

You forgot to say, lets talk in chinese, because when that happens america will be a second rate country with no future.

yeah, how dare you diss US made firearms!!!!one

Springfields have tons, TONS of issues, particularly relating to the material and construction of the receivers. Sorry to bust your bubble, but they ain't no Corvette. Try a Yugo. This is coming from a guy that always wanted an M1A, but after seeing a bunch of jam-o-matics and parts broken during regular use I have absolutely no desire to own one. Yes, the Chinese make a better M1A than Springfield does.

They do make aircraft engines. Mostly copies of other aircraft engines but they still make them.

LOL, aren't you the former QA manager at Armalite? Glass houses and all...

More parts of the M1A are made in Taiwan, Canada and Korea than in the USA.

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