Quoted: Quoted: an ARMS vs. LaRue debate always brings out the best of AR15.com.. What's even more amazing is the number of arfcom safe queens that have experienced ARMS failures. It's more about fashion than function for most of these folks. Let's face it, the QRP was good enough kit for the US military. I'd say LT improved the breed in some aspects, but that doesn't mean ARMS isn't quite acceptable for any use on the sport utility rifle.

Yeah ipschoser, your right, ARMS has now been relegated to "sport-only" status.  Make sense. Good call.  

HOW DID I MISS THIS THREAD?

I'VE STAYED OUT OF THE ARMS VS LARUE DEBATES. BUT IT'S TIME TO SPEAK UP.

M.S.T.N. USED TO CARRY ARMS GEAR. WE DID WELL WITH IT. MRS SWAN IS A VERY NICE PERSON.

ABOUT FOUR YEARS AGO, I HAD WHAT I FEARED WAS A BAD BATCH OF CUSTOM PRECISION BARRELS COME THROUGH COMPASS LAKE. NEITHER PAUL OR I COULD GET ANY OF THEM TO SHOOT. THEN WE NOTICED THE GROUPS ALL HAD A SIMILAR APPEARANCE. TWO SHOTS CLOSE TOGETHER, AND THREE SHOTS CLOSE TOGETHER, SEPARATED BY AN INCH OR MORE.

NATURALLY, WE CHECKED THE SCOPES AND MOUNTS. BOTH OF OUR ARMS #35 QD BASES WITH #35 TRACK-LOCK RINGS WERE SLIPPING ON THE RAILS. IT DID NOT MATTER WHAT TYPE RECEIVER, EITHER. COLT, LMT, ETC.

WE HURREDLY BUILT UP MORE SCOPE MOUNTS WITH NEW ARMS #35 COMPONENTS. THEY DID THE SAME THING AFTER A HALF-DOZEN CYCLES.

WE RETURNED THE ONES WE HAD TO ARMS AND THEY GRACIOUSLY REPLACED THEM, NO QUESTIONS ASKED. BUT THEN, THE SAME THING HAPPENED WITH THE NEXT BATCH.

SO .... WE QUIETLY QUIT SELLING ARMS SCOPE MOUNTS. HOW COULD WE CONTINUE, IN GOOD CONSCIENCE?

FOR OUR TESTING, WE WENT TO THE ARMS #36 RAIL, HARD-MOUNTED TO THE RECEIVER, TO GET THE NEEDED EYE RELIEF. FOR RINGS WE USED BADGER. OUR COMPASS LAKE BARRELS WERE ALL FINE, BTW.

THEN, WHEN LARUE PRODUCTS ENTERED THE CIVILIAN MARKETPLACE, WE AT M.S.T.N. WERE FORTUNATE ENOUGH TO BE SELECTED TO BE A LARUE DEALER. WAS I EVER GLAD TO SEE THE LARUE SPR SCOPE MOUNT!

SHORTLY AFTERWARD, IT BECAME DIFFICULT TO GET ORDERS WITH ARMS FILLED. NOTHING WAS EVER SAID, OF COURSE.

HERE'S A PIC OF MY TRUSTY NIGHTFORCE 3.5-15X50 NXS I USE FOR MOST OF MY PRECISION UPPER BREAK-IN AND TESTING. IT SITS IN ITS ORIGINAL LARUE MOUNT, WITH BRONZE COLORED STAINLESS STEEL HARDWARE.



IN THE THREE YEARS I'VE HAD THIS MOUNT, THIS COMBINATION HAS BEEN STRAPPED ONTO TO MORE CUSTOM PRECISION UPPERS THAN I CAN COUNT. THE SCOPE STILL TRACKS BUT THE MOUNT MAKES IT POSSIBLE. I DOUBT ANYONE HAS PUT A LARUE SCOPE MOUNT THROUGH MORE CYCLES. IT SHOWS NO SIGN OF WEAR, WHATSOEVER.

HERE'S ANOTHER NIGHTFORCE, A 2.5-10X24 NXS IN ANOTHER LARUE SPR SCOPE MOUNT. IT NORMALLY LIVES ON ONE OF MY PERSONAL UPPERS. BUT, I FREQUENTLY TAKE IT OFF AND MOUNT IT ON CUSTOMER'S UPPERS FOR PHOTOS.



THE FIRST FEW TIMES, WHEN I CHECKED THE ZERO, IT WAS ALWAYS RIGHT THERE. I'M A BUSY GUY. NOW, I DON'T EVEN BOTHER WASTING THE AMMO. SAME THING WITH MY CLASSIC LARUE AIMPOINT MOUNT WITH BRONZE COLORED STAINLESS FITTINGS.

LARUE PRODUCTS HAVE BECOME A CORNERSTONE OF OUR BUSINESS AT M.S.T.N. MARK, MIKE, ELLEN, AND THE GANG THERE HAVE BENT OVER BACKWARDS TO TAKE CARE OF M.S.T.N.

I'LL NEVER FORGET GETTING A CALL ONE FRIDAY NIGHT FROM MARK, OFFERING TO DRIVE 50 MILES INTO AUSTIN TO PUT A SHIPMENT I NEEDED ON A BUS TO MEMPHIS.

CAN YOU IMAGINE JUST HOW DANGEROUS A PLACE THE BUS STATION IN AUSTIN IS ON A FRIDAY NIGHT? OR HOW MANY OTHER THINGS A GUY COULD THINK OF TO DO AT 9 PM ON A FRIDAY?

AT THIS POINT, IF I COULD NOT BE A LARUE DEALER, I'D JUST QUIT.

SOMEONE ELSE SAID IT FIRST: IF LARUE IS AN OPTION, LARUE IS THE ANSWER. THEY MAKE THE BEST GEAR, AND THAT'S ALL I WANT TO WORK WITH.

WES GRANT
M.S.T.N.
ORIGINAL LARUE DEALER

I have never heard the terms Hard and Soft mount used in this particular instance.

From all that I have seen or been taught in the military hard and soft mounts relate to typically support weapon mounts - hard being the standard pintel or tripod - and soft being ones with a cushioned cradle that will have some sort of pnuematic buffering system.

I no longer use ARMS mounts except those on a few weaponlights that have not been relaced with either thumscrew mounts or the Larue setup.  ALL my optics from EoTech to S&B or NF go in Larue...




Oh and a ARMS shill on this board - who would have thunk that

Quoted: Yeah, this could be the best thread on ar15.com in a very long time.   Let me just say, In Before The Lawsuit, because some guys get their business by intimidation and lawsuits rather than integrity and competition. . . .

Funny you say that,  because it is rumored that a certain mount maker, with a reputation for suing, may have already sued Smith&Wesson over S&W's using Troy handguards on their new line of black rifles.

Quoted: I use both. I like some of the ARMS products because of how they were designed but I dislike how they use MIM in the levers and no adjustability. However, I hate cheerleaders with a passion, and one side certain has more than its fair share of blind cheerleaders.

... NOT WHAT I WOULD CALL A NORMAL EMOTIONAL REPSONSE TO A DISCUSSION OF GUN PARTS.

IF OUR ENTHUSIASM UPSETS YOU SO BADLY, IT IS PROBABLY WISE FOR YOU TO AVOID DISCUSSIONS OF LARUE PRODUCTS. ADD NOVESKE PRODUCTS TO THAT LIST.

BTW, BLIND WE ARE NOT, NOR ARE WE ONE TINY BIT IMPRESSED WITH YOUR RHETORIC.

WES

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: I use both. I like some of the ARMS products because of how they were designed but I dislike how they use MIM in the levers and no adjustability. However, I hate cheerleaders with a passion, and one side certain has more than its fair share of blind cheerleaders. ... NOT WHAT I WOULD CALL A NORMAL EMOTIONAL REPSONSE TO A DISCUSSION OF GUN PARTS. IF OUR ENTHUSIASM UPSETS YOU SO BADLY, IT IS PROBABLY WISE FOR YOU TO AVOID DISCUSSIONS OF LARUE PRODUCTS. ADD NOVESKE PRODUCTS TO THAT LIST. BTW, BLIND WE ARE NOT, NOR ARE WE ONE TINY BIT IMPRESSED WITH YOUR RHETORIC. WES Do you really want to discuss LaRue vs. Arms parts? Pro's and cons? I have no problem doing so but I have a feeling you, Grant, Boom, and a bunch of others will get all hurt and start pouting. There really are ups and downs to both LaRue and ARMS. Both have compromises in design (probably due to patents). LaRue really shines in execution and CS but has a couple of draw backs. ARMS uses sub-par materials and its PR is atrocious.

LET ME EXPLAIN MY THOUGHTS REGARDING YOU AND YOUR OPINIONS.

YOU HAVE ESTABLISHED ABSOLUTELY NO CREDIBILITY. THEREFORE, WHAT YOU THINK HAS NO REAL SIGNIFICANCE.



WES GRANT
M.S.T.N.

Argue the good points vs bad points all you want. Keep the personal attacks off this site. You won't be asked again.

Quoted: If the Larue products were a little bit less expensive, they would dominate.  IMHO.

paulosantos,

We're doing our damndest to price-compete against you-know-who...but our stuff is CNC hogged-out of solid billet ...ala Jesse James.    The joke here is - "We're doing aerospace quality for blacksmith pricing...and so you should drink cheap beer to make up the difference".

No fooling, we do appreciate everyone's feedback from this site - and I do mean everyone ian187.   :-)

Mark LaRue