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OH, USA
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Posted: 10/15/2023 8:44:37 PM EDT
[Last Edit: PewPewPete]
Seems like my LWRCI DI upper (mid length gas system) on a carbine buffer system is a bit harsh. I was thinking of changing to an H1 or H2 buffer to smooth it out. Does it really matter the springs? I've noticed the Geissele super 42 and sprinco springs, but I don't know how much of a difference a spring makes.
thoughts?? |
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FL, USA
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Posted: 10/15/2023 9:19:30 PM EDT
[#1]
I'd try a Sprinco Blue and H-2 buffer. Very inexpensive and proven combo
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USA
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Posted: 10/15/2023 9:33:56 PM EDT
[#2]
Naw, I'd say leave the spring alone, put an H2 in it, and call it good.
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Posted: 10/15/2023 10:12:51 PM EDT
[#3]
Standard spring, H2.
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Posted: 10/15/2023 10:20:31 PM EDT
[#4]
Springs control the closing speed of the reciprocating parts, have very little influence over the opening speed. Changing to a higher power spring will almost certainly make things worse in the shooting feel.
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OH, USA
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Posted: 10/16/2023 9:35:06 AM EDT
[#5]
I went with your advice, what do you say to the comment above saying the higher power spring would make it worse? Just wondering
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Posted: 10/16/2023 9:55:21 AM EDT
[#6]
Im a huge fan of Spikes ST T2 buffers. Its a tungsten powder inside instead of individual weights.
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CO, USA
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Posted: 10/16/2023 11:59:36 AM EDT
[Last Edit: Stowe]
[#7]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By laxman09: Im a huge fan of Spikes ST T2 buffers. Its a tungsten powder inside instead of individual weights. Not saying you're wrong. It's all just opinion, but mine is different than yours. I didnt like the feel of that at all and gave it to my kid. It had a feel similar to a "dead blow" hammer. Actually seemed to increase felt/perceived recoil. OP - I'd throw an H2 in there and see what that gets you. I have multiple ARs running blue springs. It's not going to hurt, but start with the H2 I assume what gamma762 was getting at is that the increased velocity of the bolt slaming closed with the stronger spring will detract from the gun's stability on target. He can tell you what he actually meant, but that's what I got from it. |
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Posted: 10/16/2023 12:33:19 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Gamma762]
[#8]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Stowe: I assume what gamma762 was getting at is that the increased velocity of the bolt slaming closed with the stronger spring will detract from the gun's stability on target. He can tell you what he actually meant, but that's what I got from it. Yes. Many seem to think that a stronger spring will slow down the action, when the opposite is true - it speeds it up. You just need enough spring force to strip a round from the magazine, feed and chamber it, and get the bolt rotated to locked. Beyond that, more spring force just increases movement of the rifle, increases harshness of the shooting feel, and increases parts wear. I know it flies in the face of the cottage industry of selling every possible AR15 part in some kind of extra-special version, but I say over and over that in general, stay with standard configuration parts unless you have a real reason to change. Increasing spring force is about the last thing that anyone should be messing with in trying to tune an AR15. |
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Posted: 10/16/2023 5:05:04 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Gamma762: Yes. Many seem to think that a stronger spring will slow down the action, when the opposite is true - it speeds it up. You just need enough spring force to strip a round from the magazine, feed and chamber it, and get the bolt rotated to locked. Beyond that, more spring force just increases movement of the rifle, increases harshness of the shooting feel, and increases parts wear. I know it flies in the face of the cottage industry of selling every possible AR15 part in some kind of extra-special version, but I say over and over that in general, stay with standard configuration parts unless you have a real reason to change. Increasing spring force is about the last thing that anyone should be messing with in trying to tune an AR15. I was always under the impression spring change was to solve issues where the rifle is not succeeding in stripping a round and getting the round/bolt all the way home. For instance your rifle just is not closing and locking the bolt home 100% and failure to go into battery. The same thing is true with pistol recoil springs they slow or speed up the forward momentum of the slide and if you want to reduce that forward momentum you reduce the weight of the recoil spring. |
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NV, USA
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Posted: 10/16/2023 10:36:00 PM EDT
[#10]
I bought three buffer weights off of Amazon. You can try all the weights you’d ever be able to buy and setup your rifle how you like. You might be happier with the heaviest buffer and it probably won’t make anything bad happen.
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CO, USA
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Posted: 10/17/2023 10:48:32 AM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By EdgecrusherXES: I was always under the impression spring change was to solve issues where the rifle is not succeeding in stripping a round and getting the round/bolt all the way home. For instance your rifle just is not closing and locking the bolt home 100% and failure to go into battery. The same thing is true with pistol recoil springs they slow or speed up the forward momentum of the slide and if you want to reduce that forward momentum you reduce the weight of the recoil spring. I see where you're going with that, but if your rifle isn't functioning with normal parts, you have an underlying issue that needs addressed. A modest increase in spring pressure can help an exceedingly dirty rifle cycle, but should never be required to make a rifle in a normal state of filthy function. |
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SC, USA
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Posted: 10/24/2023 3:07:52 PM EDT
[#12]
FWIW my first upper was a RRA HBAR 16" carbine system and it was VERY overgassed. Went to an H3 buffer and Wolff xtra power spring which helped but don't count on it making a significant difference in felt recoil.
Going from a std. buffer to an H3 isn't a significant change in felt recoil. Although I always run the heaviest buffer my setup will reliably allow. Stronger spring is certainly more noticeable but can be even more annoying. I still have the xtra power buffer spring. later ran it in a 9mm AR with an 8.5 oz dedicated buffer, the bolt slamming home was more 'violent' than the initial recoil. But for +p loads it was cheap insurance. My recommendation would be to get an H3 buffer or add some tungsten weights and get the Sprinco intermediate (red & white) & enhanced (blue) buffer sorings and try both to see what you prefer. |
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Posted: 10/24/2023 4:18:35 PM EDT
[#13]
If you have an excessive amount of gas - energy - in the operating system, nothing you do as far as weights or springs is going to fix it. You can maybe mitigate a function problem, but you're not going to change the felt recoil/sight disruption to any significant degree.
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SC, USA
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Posted: 10/24/2023 4:53:13 PM EDT
[#14]
My experience is that almost everything needs an H2/H3 with a milspec weight spring to function well/how I like.
I've had great experiences with the function and durability of Sprinco white springs, and Geissele Super 42 setups. One or the other is in all my guns now (except for the A5 I guess... Sprinco green there) I've had/seen some cheaper factory guns, and cheap carbine recoil springs, which had noticeably less spring tension than milspec. This is one of the very first things I would replace in a "budget" gun. Get a ~milspec quality spring and a good buffer weight in it. YMMV. I had one brutally overgassed upper in which I tried a Sprinco blue (plus power over milspec) and an H3. That effectively tamed it down on the backstroke. I didn't have any issues with it, but as noted above, it is going to close faster/harder than the original design intent. In the end I didn't like that, and got rid of it. If I had to keep an upper like that, I'd probably run it with an A5 system. |
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Posted: 10/25/2023 12:41:18 AM EDT
[Last Edit: WrenchGuy]
[#15]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By laxman09: Im a huge fan of Spikes ST T2 buffers. Its a tungsten powder inside instead of individual weights. These are the only heavy buffers I've ever liked the feel of, and my choice if one is needed. That said, virtually all my mid-length systems run standard carbine buffer weights as most of my barrels are gassed just right for that. The only heavier buffers I've used were for a carbine-length gas system. I run Damage Industries chrome silicon buffer springs in everything, not to change the strength but to extend the effective life of the spring and reduce buffer noise just a touch...no, its not completely necessary but its an inexpensive and easy upgrade. My philosophy with mid-length builds is to use a stock buffer weight and spring initially, and adjust as the results dictate. ETA...also have a JP captured buffer system in my SPR, love the way it shoots. |
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CO, USA
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Posted: 10/25/2023 1:25:01 AM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By DVCNick: My experience is that almost everything needs an H2/H3 with a milspec weight spring to function well/how I like. Tell that to my 14.5 triarc. Yes, it has a BRT tube, but it's just the off the shelf,non specific midlegth tube (i had it laying around. I know it wasnt needed and is probably bigger than the gass port). It doesn't want to lock back with anything short of m193 with a h2. Something like pmc bronze gets almost there. Works well for me. I shoot it suppressed 99% of the time and a std buffer and springco white will lock back with cheap steel and no can. Point being, not everything these days benefits from an H2. |
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OH, USA
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Posted: 10/29/2023 10:52:54 AM EDT
[#17]
My mid-lengths have an H buffer. Carbines all have H2. It works for me in all conditions with the different ammo I shoot.
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TX, USA
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Posted: 1/18/2024 4:33:03 AM EDT
[#18]
My first upper was a PSA mid length which was way overgassed. Went to an H1 buffer and new Aero carbine spring
which helped some. I would have went to an H2 buffer if I had kept. Both my Aero mid length uppers use H1 with near perfect ejection pattern and recoil impulse. |
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NC, USA
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Posted: 1/18/2024 10:16:37 AM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By HighpowerRifleBrony: Standard spring, H2. ^This^ |
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USA
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Posted: 1/20/2024 1:45:03 PM EDT
[#20]
I have 2 factory LWRC DI rifles. Both came with H2 buffers, and standard carbine springs. Both run flawless with factory 5.56 loadings of M193, M855, MK262, and my clone handloads of each. I don't shoot much if any factory .223 power ammo, but my standard high volume, plinking, steel target shooting hand load, isn't quite up to 5.56 power/velocities and they both run those great too.
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Posted: 1/20/2024 5:08:12 PM EDT
[#21]
Be careful that when you're playing with heavy buffers that you don't pick one so heavy that the gun won't function with weak ammo, or when dirty, or in cold weather.
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Posted: 1/23/2024 2:10:41 AM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Lexington1775: My mid-lengths have an H buffer. Carbines all have H2. It works for me in all conditions with the different ammo I shoot. |
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Posted: 1/26/2024 3:29:48 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Gasbar419: I have 2 factory LWRC DI rifles. Both came with H2 buffers, and standard carbine springs. Both run flawless with factory 5.56 loadings of M193, M855, MK262, and my clone handloads of each. I don't shoot much if any factory .223 power ammo, but my standard high volume, plinking, steel target shooting hand load, isn't quite up to 5.56 power/velocities and they both run those great too. My IC-DI runs federal american eagle 223 just fine. Never had a single malfunction with the gun after thousands of rounds 
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TX, USA
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Posted: 2/2/2024 8:17:06 AM EDT
[#24]
If you want less recoil, tune the gas. Weight delays unlock time and should be balanced to the gas. Spring does the least to change recoil and bolt unlock. As stated, it causes faster closing speed, but does almost nothing to keep the bolt closed longer.
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Posted: 2/2/2024 10:14:10 PM EDT
[#25]
This is a good starting point:
 Then makes adjustments based on this:  |
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Posted: 2/2/2024 10:20:05 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By BSOL: This is a good starting point: https://i.imgur.com/2qk7ieY.jpeg Then makes adjustments based on this: https://i.imgur.com/6mHTg3L.jpeg  Attached File |
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NJ, USA
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Posted: 3/6/2024 1:40:59 AM EDT
[#27]
I run an H1 with all my carbines and mid-lengths fine. (Unsuppressed)
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USA
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Posted: 3/9/2024 12:45:27 PM EDT
[#28]
I run a carbine buffer in a Colt 6960 ML. Super soft shooting with Wolf steel case, but still ejects at 3:30.
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Posted: 3/9/2024 12:47:50 PM EDT
[#29]
I tend to run FA BCG and H1 or H2 - usually H2. Been playing with A5. I don't run Carbine wt on anything.
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VA, USA
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Posted: 3/28/2024 12:21:16 AM EDT
[#30]
Just put together 20"upper rifle gas used Damage Industries chrome silicon buffer spring and H-2 buffer. Shot it today 4 - 4:30 ejection very smooth shooting.
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USA
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Posted: 3/28/2024 12:38:24 AM EDT
[Last Edit: AugustineBolishbatfe]
[#31]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By JJL0325: I'd try a Sprinco Blue and H-2 buffer. Very inexpensive and proven combo This is where I'd start, too. Here's what I've done: 1) I bought all of Sprinco's different color springs (and multiples of many of them). They're not terribly expensive. 2) I have All of the buffer weights INCLUDING Slash's XH Heavy Buffer. 3) When I build or purchase a new AR (Every rifle of mine gets its own silencer), I take it out with all of the springs and buffers and I mix and match until I get the best result for suppressed/unsuppressed. 4) when I have my preferred combination, I go ahead and leave it installed, but then order that combo to replenish my "testing kit". For AR15's, easily 7/10 times the best combo is Blue with H2. |
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