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User Panel
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CA, USA
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Posted: 3/31/2024 5:34:33 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Akin]
Greetings all!
Does anyone know if anyone has ever released something similar to this old classic? Every time someone sees me use mine, they immediately want one, but alas, it was discontinued long ago. It’s just such an incredibly useful tool, though, that I can’t believe no one else has ever come out with something similar. The KNS guys at the SHOT Show always tell me there is no possibility that they’ll re-release it, assuming they've even been around long enough to remember it; so the only way to get one nowadays would be if someone else made a tool like it. I don’t even let people borrow mine unless I’m actually there watching them... I’m worried it might accidentally go home with someone else... :-D Here's an old video that shows what it does for those not familiar with it. Sure, you can install a hammer without it, but damn does this make it so much easier... The KNS Precision Hammer Cage and Trigger and Hammer Guide Pins https://smallarmsreview.com/kns-precision-ar-15-hammer-cage/ |
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Posted: 3/31/2024 5:45:59 PM EDT
[#1]
Looks like you could make a paper template and reverse engineer it real easy. You could sell them since KNS won’t. Little home business. I don’t want one but I bet a lot of builders on here would buy them.
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GA, USA
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Posted: 3/31/2024 7:42:36 PM EDT
[#2]
Coming soon.
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?243344-For-the-tool-nerds |
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PA, USA
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Posted: 3/31/2024 7:54:17 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By OTDR: Coming soon. https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?243344-For-the-tool-nerds They will want over $100 for one? lol |
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Posted: 3/31/2024 8:50:04 PM EDT
[#4]
Originally Posted By Akin: Greetings all! Does anyone know if anyone has ever released something similar to this old classic? Every time someone sees me use mine, they immediately want one, but alas, it was discontinued long ago. It’s just such an incredibly useful tool, though, that I can’t believe no one else has ever come out with something similar. The KNS guys at the SHOT Show always tell me there is no possibility that they’ll re-release it, assuming they've even been around long enough to remember it; so the only way to get one nowadays would be if someone else made a tool like it. I don’t even let people borrow mine unless I’m actually there watching them... I’m worried it might accidentally go home with someone else... :-D Here's an old video that shows what it does for those not familiar with it. Sure, you can install a hammer without it, but damn does this make it so much easier... The KNS Precision Hammer Cage and Trigger and Hammer Guide Pins https://smallarmsreview.com/kns-precision-ar-15-hammer-cage/  The KNS Precision Hammer Cage and Trigger and Hammer Guide Pins |
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CA, USA
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Posted: 3/31/2024 8:57:03 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Karankawa: Looks like you could make a paper template and reverse engineer it real easy. You could sell them since KNS won’t. Little home business. I don’t want one but I bet a lot of builders on here would buy them. Alas, I don’t have clue one as to how to go about making something and selling it. |
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CA, USA
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Posted: 3/31/2024 8:58:16 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuote HistoryOriginally Posted By backbencher: Originally Posted By Akin: Greetings all! Does anyone know if anyone has ever released something similar to this old classic? Every time someone sees me use mine, they immediately want one, but alas, it was discontinued long ago. It’s just such an incredibly useful tool, though, that I can’t believe no one else has ever come out with something similar. The KNS guys at the SHOT Show always tell me there is no possibility that they’ll re-release it, assuming they've even been around long enough to remember it; so the only way to get one nowadays would be if someone else made a tool like it. I don’t even let people borrow mine unless I’m actually there watching them... I’m worried it might accidentally go home with someone else... :-D Here's an old video that shows what it does for those not familiar with it. Sure, you can install a hammer without it, but damn does this make it so much easier... The KNS Precision Hammer Cage and Trigger and Hammer Guide Pins https://smallarmsreview.com/kns-precision-ar-15-hammer-cage/  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4FdP4TLBns4? That’s the same video I linked to in my post? |
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CA, USA
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Posted: 3/31/2024 9:01:08 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By OTDR: Coming soon. https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?243344-For-the-tool-nerds Well, even though I’ve built dozens of ARs for friends and people at work who wanted custom patrol rifles, I’m not sure if I’d need a hundred dollar tool. Interesting that I’m not the only one thinking about this kind of thing, though… |
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Posted: 3/31/2024 9:05:48 PM EDT
[#8]
Seems like you might be able to 3d print one.
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CA, USA
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Posted: 3/31/2024 9:07:00 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By jaqufrost: Seems like you might be able to 3d print one. That was kind of my thought, if someone who knew how to 3D print things took an interest. |
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CA, USA
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Posted: 3/31/2024 9:12:29 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By jaqufrost: Seems like you might be able to 3d print one. That was kind of my thought, if someone who knew how to 3D print things took an interest. |
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USA
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Posted: 3/31/2024 9:41:11 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Jnat]
[#11]
I’ve never understood the difficulty some have installing triggers/hammers
Edit |
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USA
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Posted: 3/31/2024 9:42:00 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By OTDR: Coming soon. https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?243344-For-the-tool-nerds Looks like a nice tool tho |
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CA, USA
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Posted: 3/31/2024 9:46:47 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Jnat: I’ve never understood the difficulty some have installing triggers. ? No one I know has trouble with triggers. Hammers can be a pain sometimes, though, especially if you’re doing multiple builds at a time… hence the usefulness of tools like this… |
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Posted: 3/31/2024 11:39:23 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Akin: ? That’s the same video I linked to in my post? Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Akin: Originally Posted By backbencher: Originally Posted By Akin: Greetings all! Does anyone know if anyone has ever released something similar to this old classic? Every time someone sees me use mine, they immediately want one, but alas, it was discontinued long ago. It’s just such an incredibly useful tool, though, that I can’t believe no one else has ever come out with something similar. The KNS guys at the SHOT Show always tell me there is no possibility that they’ll re-release it, assuming they've even been around long enough to remember it; so the only way to get one nowadays would be if someone else made a tool like it. I don’t even let people borrow mine unless I’m actually there watching them... I’m worried it might accidentally go home with someone else... :-D Here's an old video that shows what it does for those not familiar with it. Sure, you can install a hammer without it, but damn does this make it so much easier... The KNS Precision Hammer Cage and Trigger and Hammer Guide Pins https://smallarmsreview.com/kns-precision-ar-15-hammer-cage/ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4FdP4TLBns4? That’s the same video I linked to in my post? I hope so. That's why I embedded it for you. |
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GA, USA
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Posted: 4/1/2024 12:51:56 AM EDT
[#15]
 KNS Hammer Cage (discontinued and now rare!) |
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PA, USA
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Posted: 4/5/2024 9:17:53 PM EDT
[#16]
Ned Christiansen at MichiGuns is getting ready to release his Superior Hammer Install Tool which is the same thing. Ned's stuff is pricey but 100% USA Made and will last a lifetime. I've got his MOAKS staking tool, gas tube bender, 556 Gage and a few of his OACKS screws. This dude is at the top for quality & function.
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Posted: 4/5/2024 9:32:37 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Grimjaw5]
[#17]
I had never heard of these until I saw a thread on here about them in Nov 21. I found one in stock and ordered it. It is a darn handy tool. While it is not required, it does make things easier.
Not much different that having a 1/4" clevis pin in your tools. Not required, just darn handy. |
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GA, USA
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Posted: 4/5/2024 9:48:48 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Cunningham1420: Ned Christiansen at MichiGuns is getting ready to release his Superior Hammer Install Tool which is the same thing. Ned's stuff is pricey but 100% USA Made and will last a lifetime. I've got his MOAKS staking tool, gas tube bender, 556 Gage and a few of his OACKS screws. This dude is at the top for quality & function. Ned said about another month and $100. |
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MN, USA
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Posted: 4/5/2024 11:30:59 PM EDT
[#19]
It looks like a neat little tool, one of those that you could do without but would be nice to have.
Honestly tho, even on a bad day it might take me all of 30 seconds to pin a hammer assembly so I put this in the same circular file as the buffer tube thingy 
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Posted: 4/6/2024 2:49:45 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By s4s4u: It looks like a neat little tool, one of those that you could do without but would be nice to have. Honestly tho, even on a bad day it might take me all of 30 seconds to pin a hammer assembly so I put this in the same circular file as the buffer tube thingy Until one does 15-25 guns all in succession. |
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Posted: 4/6/2024 3:16:15 PM EDT
[Last Edit: j3_]
[#21]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By TGWLDR: Until one does 15-25 guns all in succession. I have to believe it would be the reverse where about 15 times in a row of using that thing it would be thrown in a box and one would go back to the quickest and because of less steps easiest way. I could see the use if one had some type physical need reason to use it. Every time I watch a video of a trigger group being installed with someone installing a pin to help install a pin I wonder why they like doing something twice. |
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MN, USA
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Posted: 4/6/2024 4:07:05 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By TGWLDR: Until one does 15-25 guns all in succession. IDK, I think as much, or more, time would be spent wrapping the hammer assy in that "cage" than it would take to just push the hammer assy down with the thumb and sliding in the pin. But, then I don't assembly 15-25 guns in a day 
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Posted: 4/6/2024 5:46:42 PM EDT
[#23]
Originally Posted By j3_: I have to believe it would be the reverse where about 15 times in a row of using that thing it would be thrown in a box and one would go back to the quickest and because of less steps easiest way. I could see the use if one had some type physical need reason to use it. Every time I watch a video of a trigger group being installed with someone installing a pin to help install a pin I wonder why they like doing something twice. Originally Posted By s4s4u: IDK, I think as much, or more, time would be spent wrapping the hammer assy in that "cage" than it would take to just push the hammer assy down with the thumb and sliding in the pin. But, then I don't assembly 15-25 guns in a day Not something that I'd use personally. But I've had times where a thumb cramp made things less than enjoyable. |
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MN, USA
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Posted: 4/6/2024 6:10:33 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By TGWLDR: Not something that I'd use personally. But I've had times where a thumb cramp made things less than enjoyable. I hate when that happens |
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Posted: 4/7/2024 8:51:00 PM EDT
[#25]
This new tool is neat but waaaaay overpriced. He’s trying to retire off the proceeds in a short time.
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GA, USA
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Posted: 4/7/2024 9:08:41 PM EDT
[Last Edit: OTDR]
[#26]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By QtrHorse: This new tool is neat but waaaaay overpriced. He’s trying to retire off the proceeds in a short time. Agreed. |
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Posted: 4/8/2024 9:27:32 PM EDT
[#27]
I don't really have much of a problem getting the hammer in. Getting the damn disconnector in right is a pain. When I get stuck I hand the lower to FW_wife & she just slides it in.
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Posted: 4/8/2024 9:38:31 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By backbencher: I don't really have much of a problem getting the hammer in. Getting the damn disconnector in right is a pain. When I get stuck I hand the lower to FW_wife & she just slides it in. Every once in awhile I get one where the fucking hammer fights me to the end. Maybe 1 out of 5-6. |
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CA, USA
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Posted: 4/8/2024 9:40:56 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Akin]
[#29]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By backbencher: I don't really have much of a problem getting the hammer in. Getting the damn disconnector in right is a pain. When I get stuck I hand the lower to FW_wife & she just slides it in. This won’t help if you don’t have them, but I think it was Giessele that included little trigger and hammer pins with their… err… triggers and hammers. They’re the correct diameter and they are short enough that they don’t stick out at all. So, it holds the trigger and disconnector together but it doesn’t protrude and interfere with dropping the trigger in the receiver. You drop it in, then you push out the short pin with the real trigger pin. Ridiculously easy. I saved the ones I’ve come across and I use them every time I build up a lower for buddies from work or whatever. I also use this on the hammer… sometimes it’s a pain in the ass getting a pin in past that damn j-spring, and that pointed pin makes it effortless. And the little red pusher thing saves your thumb… :-D |
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Posted: 4/8/2024 10:04:37 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Akin: This won’t help if you don’t have them, but I think it was Giessele that included little trigger and hammer pins with their… err… triggers and hammers. They’re the correct diameter and they are short enough that they don’t stick out at all. So, it holds the trigger and disconnector together but it doesn’t protrude and interfere with dropping the trigger in the receiver. You drop it in, then you push out the short pin with the real trigger pin. Ridiculously easy. I saved the ones I’ve come across and I use them every time I build up a lower for buddies from work or whatever. I also use this on the hammer… sometimes it’s a pain in the ass getting a pin in past that damn j-spring, and that pointed pin makes it effortless. And the little red pusher thing saves your thumb… :-D Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Akin: Originally Posted By backbencher: I don't really have much of a problem getting the hammer in. Getting the damn disconnector in right is a pain. When I get stuck I hand the lower to FW_wife & she just slides it in. This won’t help if you don’t have them, but I think it was Giessele that included little trigger and hammer pins with their… err… triggers and hammers. They’re the correct diameter and they are short enough that they don’t stick out at all. So, it holds the trigger and disconnector together but it doesn’t protrude and interfere with dropping the trigger in the receiver. You drop it in, then you push out the short pin with the real trigger pin. Ridiculously easy. I saved the ones I’ve come across and I use them every time I build up a lower for buddies from work or whatever. I also use this on the hammer… sometimes it’s a pain in the ass getting a pin in past that damn j-spring, and that pointed pin makes it effortless. And the little red pusher thing saves your thumb… :-D Ooooooh. I could chop a pin w/ ze Dremel. I have a couple of long pins in the toolbox that solve the problem, but of course I fergit about em and grab a tack hammer instead.
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CA, USA
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Posted: 4/8/2024 10:14:17 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Akin]
[#31]
I tapped a few in with a brass hammer a couple of times until I used my first Geissele and found those nice little pins.
Ever since then, it’s little pin in the trigger and no worries at all. And KNS pointy long pin with thumb protector for the hammer, even with the KNS Cage EDIT TO ADD: Here ya go https://shop.roninsgrips.com/product/ar-trigger-slave-pin-makes-installation-a-breeze/ |
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Posted: 4/15/2024 12:11:38 PM EDT
[#32]
I just saw a video of Ned's new tool, it looks pretty slick but not something I need.
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MI, USA
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Posted: 4/15/2024 11:03:54 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Akin: This won’t help if you don’t have them, but I think it was Giessele that included little trigger and hammer pins with their… err… triggers and hammers. They’re the correct diameter and they are short enough that they don’t stick out at all. So, it holds the trigger and disconnector together but it doesn’t protrude and interfere with dropping the trigger in the receiver. You drop it in, then you push out the short pin with the real trigger pin. Ridiculously easy. I saved the ones I’ve come across and I use them every time I build up a lower for buddies from work or whatever. I also use this on the hammer… sometimes it’s a pain in the ass getting a pin in past that damn j-spring, and that pointed pin makes it effortless. And the little red pusher thing saves your thumb… :-D I can't remember if it was the Schmid trigger from Armorally or the SOLGW version, but one of them came with a slave pin like that. SUPER helpful. |
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OR, USA
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Posted: 4/18/2024 5:13:49 PM EDT
[#34]
I just use a pin punch as a slave pin.
I have the Geissele trigger fitting pin, somewhere, never used it |
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GA, USA
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Posted: 4/21/2024 10:50:47 PM EDT
[#35]
I received an email from Ned last night, the price for his tool is now $120.00.
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Posted: 4/22/2024 12:23:56 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By OTDR: I received an email from Ned last night, the price for his tool is now $120.00. You going to get one? |
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GA, USA
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Posted: 4/22/2024 6:36:49 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By HipSh0T: You going to get one? Yeah, I love cool tools. I'm 65 years old, retired, enjoying the fruits of my past labor. Sent him the payment last night.  |
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Posted: 4/22/2024 9:40:05 PM EDT
[Last Edit: SLR15]
[#38]
I've personally been teaching Armorers and Gunsmiths for decades. Occasionally I see people struggle with getting the hammer inserted into the receiver, and attribute this to having to compress the hammer spring while aligning the hammer to get it pinned into the receiver. Half the battle to working on guns, is figuring out how to hold things, so what works for me may not work for another person. Sometimes the struggle can be attributed to finger strength, as the hammer spring can have quite a bit of tension to it upon installation of the hammer as you compress it into the receeiver.
The KNS Hammer Cage is a nice tool. Too bad they don't make them anymore. I have thought of looking at making them, but haven't researched it to see if they have some type of patent on it or not. Years ago after watching people struggle occasionally in Armorer courses, I made a simple tool which we call the Sully Hammer Handle. I designed this based off of what us older people call a Church Key (You younger people may call it a bottle opener). The tool has two ends where we have machined out a channel on each end. One end is for single stage hammers in both semi-auto and auto. The other end is for working with 2-stage hammers, which we have used plenty of hammers from Geisselle, Larue MBT, Scmhid, and Rockriver. It allows you to use the handle as a lever to get the hammer spring compressed, while aligning the hammer so it can be pinned into place. I     I look forward to the Michiguns version of their tool as well, as Ned is a great designer and thinker. It is something we will show in our Armorer courses, as we like to put as many tools as we can in peoples hands so they can make an educated decision of what's available and how to use it. CY6 Greg Sullivan "Sully" SLR15 Rifles DefensiveEdge.com (763) 712-0123 |
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GA, USA
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Posted: 4/22/2024 9:53:49 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By SLR15: I've personally been teaching Armorers and Gunsmiths for decades. Occasionally I see people struggle with getting the hammer inserted into the receiver, and attribute this to having to compress the hammer spring while aligning the hammer to get it pinned into the receiver. Half the battle to working on guns, is figuring out how to hold things, so what works for me may not work for another person. Sometimes the struggle can be attributed to finger strength, as the hammer spring can have quite a bit of tension to it upon installation of the hammer as you compress it into the receeiver. The KNS Hammer Cage is a nice tool. Too bad they don't make them anymore. I have thought of looking at making them, but haven't researched it to see if they have some type of patent on it or not. Years ago after watching people struggle occasionally in Armorer courses, I made a simple tool which we call the Sully Hammer Handle. I designed this based off of what us older people call a Church Key (You younger people may call it a bottle opener). The tool has two ends where we have machined out a channel on each end. One end is for single stage hammers in both semi-auto and auto. The other end is for working with 2-stage hammers, which we have used plenty of hammers from Geisselle, Larue MBT, Scmhid, and Rockriver. It allows you to use the handle as a lever to get the hammer spring compressed, while aligning the hammer so it can be pinned into place. I https://cdn4.volusion.store/ytvfv-wvjwt/v/vspfiles/photos/SullyHammerHandle-2T.pnghttps://cdn4.volusion.store/ytvfv-wvjwt/v/vspfiles/photos/SullyHammerHandle-3T.png https://cdn4.volusion.store/ytvfv-wvjwt/v/vspfiles/photos/SullyHammerHandle-4T.pnghttps://cdn4.volusion.store/ytvfv-wvjwt/v/vspfiles/photos/SullyHammerHandle-5T.png I look forward to the Michiguns version of their tool as well, as Ned is a great designer and thinker. It is something we will show in our Armorer courses, as we like to put as many tools as we can in peoples hands so they can make an educated decision of what's available and how to use it. CY6 Greg Sullivan "Sully" SLR15 Rifles DefensiveEdge.com (763) 712-0123 Never met you but how you always conduct yourself in public as a true Professional is refreshing. |
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Posted: 4/22/2024 10:22:42 PM EDT
[#40]
I have one and forget to use it most of the time.
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Posted: 4/23/2024 12:19:09 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By OTDR: Yeah, I love cool tools. I'm 65 years old, retired, enjoying the fruits of my past labor. Sent him the payment last night. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By OTDR: Originally Posted By HipSh0T: You going to get one? Yeah, I love cool tools. I'm 65 years old, retired, enjoying the fruits of my past labor. Sent him the payment last night. Nothing wrong with that. 
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GA, USA
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Posted: 4/23/2024 1:38:45 PM EDT
[Last Edit: OTDR]
[#42]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By HipSh0T: Nothing wrong with that. I have something coming Friday I am real excited about. It will be the center piece of my AR tool collection if the Post Office don't lose it and as far as I can tell from Google searching there is no pictures of it on the internet. Wasn't cheap. Just 3 more days, requires signature so I will be sitting in a chair at my mailbox starting at 9AM lol. Dont want to say what it is till its actually in my hands. |
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Posted: 4/23/2024 2:36:29 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By OTDR: I have something coming Friday I am real excited about. It will be the center piece of my AR tool collection if the Post Office don't lose it and as far as I can tell from Google searching there is no pictures of it on the internet. Wasn't cheap. Just 3 more days, requires signature so I will be sitting in a chair at my mailbox starting at 9AM lol. Dont want to say what it is till its actually in my hands. It is not another gauge to measure an extractor groove is it? 
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GA, USA
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Posted: 4/23/2024 3:15:11 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By j3_: It is not another gauge to measure an extractor groove is it? NO lol! 
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CA, USA
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Posted: 4/24/2024 10:10:59 PM EDT
[#45]
Speaking of old KNS Precision Hammer Cages, if anyone should suddenly hear about one becoming available, I’d appreciate a heads up.
Mine was stolen, along with more than five thousand dollars worth of gunsmithing tools and parts, including a pistol, three stripped lowers and a bunch of other stuff. The methhead who took everything will probably sell my entire collection of tools for fifty bucks at the swap meet, but who knows, maybe someone will recognize some of them and they’ll pop up somewhere… |
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Posted: 4/25/2024 1:48:18 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By OTDR: I have something coming Friday I am real excited about. It will be the center piece of my AR tool collection if the Post Office don't lose it and as far as I can tell from Google searching there is no pictures of it on the internet. Wasn't cheap. Just 3 more days, requires signature so I will be sitting in a chair at my mailbox starting at 9AM lol. Dont want to say what it is till its actually in my hands. No fair. And teasing about AR tools shouldn't be allowed.
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GA, USA
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Posted: 4/25/2024 2:48:19 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By bfoosh06: No fair. And teasing about AR tools shouldn't be allowed. Sent you a PM. |
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