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Posted: 3/8/2024 9:08:17 AM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By EzGoingKev: When I had my Toros T4 it would not eject lighter loads 100% of the time. People in this thread said to swap on the extractor and spring with Benelli parts. I did that and it worked 100%. I think I could have gotten away with just doing the spring as my extractor looked exactly like the Benelli part. Interesting. With the MAC and Panzer being gas operated... how do these parts make a difference? "Bird Shot" is a generic term... I've found the 1200+ FPS loads are also sometimes referred to as "Game Loads". The "Ultra Target" shells (under 1200 FPS) are weak and generally won't eject, not seeing how the above parts would fix that. |
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Posted: 3/8/2024 9:32:47 AM EDT
[Last Edit: EzGoingKev]
[#2]
I know that when I shot lighter loads I would get an empty shell that would hang up in the ejection port.
I had someone else shoot it and it looked like when this happened I could see the shell "dancing" around in there when the bolt came back. I did not see this on rounds that cleanly ejected. Several pages back it was said the ejector did not have enough force to hold All I know is I swapped the parts out on mine and ejection went to 100%. |
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Posted: 3/8/2024 10:14:49 AM EDT
[#3]
Maybe the extraction issue could be because some of the promo loads use aluminum case heads? Maybe they're a little more "sticky" and that's where the extractor and spring become more important. It's possible that the Universals have a little more kick to overcome that. Just theorizing, I don't exactly run cases of these promo loads every month...
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Posted: 3/8/2024 11:02:15 AM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By EzGoingKev: I know that when I shot lighter loads I would get an empty shell that would hang up in the ejection port. I had someone else shoot it and it looked like when this happened I could see the shell "dancing" around in there when the bolt came back. I did not see this on rounds that cleanly ejected. Several pages back it was said the ejector did not have enough force to hold it to the face of the bolt. I know at least one poster said his ejector did not match the Benelli part. All I know is I swapped the parts out on mine and ejection went to 100%. Good to know thanks |
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Posted: 3/8/2024 5:26:47 PM EDT
[#5]
Well, she's clean and the Daves Metal Works tube is on. Actually that's not saying much, the only grease inside was on the bolt tail, the rest of the gun was pretty much spotless. And the mag tube turned right away, no sealant so I took that as a sign and changed tubes right away!
Now she sits in the corner, stil have to swap the stock out but I have to get ready for work soon so it's dinner time. |
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AZ, USA
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Posted: 3/9/2024 9:32:21 PM EDT
[#6]
I just picked up a panzer m2 field clone and it seems pretty nice out of the box. Came with a magazine extension that I didn’t even know was part of the package. I haven’t fired it yet but it looks legit. I ordered a Benelli extractor parts just to be safe.
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Posted: 3/9/2024 10:28:08 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Capt_Destro]
[#7]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By snuffy19608: Well, she's clean and the Daves Metal Works tube is on. Actually that's not saying much, the only grease inside was on the bolt tail, the rest of the gun was pretty much spotless. And the mag tube turned right away, no sealant so I took that as a sign and changed tubes right away! Now she sits in the corner, stil have to swap the stock out but I have to get ready for work soon so it's dinner time. Glad you got some use out of that tube man. I did my homework on it, just never got around to installing it. I was surprised the original tube came off so easy. |
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Posted: 3/10/2024 3:46:45 AM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Capt_Destro: Glad you got some use out of that tube man. I did my homework on it, just never got around to installing it. I was surprised the original tube came off so easy. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Capt_Destro: Originally Posted By snuffy19608: Well, she's clean and the Daves Metal Works tube is on. Actually that's not saying much, the only grease inside was on the bolt tail, the rest of the gun was pretty much spotless. And the mag tube turned right away, no sealant so I took that as a sign and changed tubes right away! Now she sits in the corner, stil have to swap the stock out but I have to get ready for work soon so it's dinner time. Glad you got some use out of that tube man. I did my homework on it, just never got around to installing it. I was surprised the original tube came off so easy. You weren't the only one! I just tried to say I did, and it spun right off! The one you sent fit perfectly. Tks again! |
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Posted: 3/10/2024 9:42:42 AM EDT
[#9]
That’s cool, mine was stuck hard maybe they changed something. Love mine though she is a beast!
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USA
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Posted: 3/10/2024 5:45:35 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By snuffy19608: Well, she's clean and the Daves Metal Works tube is on. Actually that's not saying much, the only grease inside was on the bolt tail, the rest of the gun was pretty much spotless. And the mag tube turned right away... Is this for Panzer M4? |
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Posted: 3/10/2024 5:57:30 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By slack_out: Is this for Panzer M4? Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By slack_out: Originally Posted By snuffy19608: Well, she's clean and the Daves Metal Works tube is on. Actually that's not saying much, the only grease inside was on the bolt tail, the rest of the gun was pretty much spotless. And the mag tube turned right away... Is this for Panzer M4? Yup, I got an anomaly. I had brake cleaner and engine degreaser ready, but didn't need it. The mag tube surprised me, I had the new tube sitting there so I just did the swap. Now I need to get out and shoot the thing. |
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Posted: 3/10/2024 6:03:05 PM EDT
[#12]
The mag tube on my Toros T4 spun right out by hand. There was no loctite on it from the factory.
My Benelli M4's tube was loctited in and needed heat and a pair of pliers. |
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Posted: 3/11/2024 2:58:18 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Capt_Destro]
[#13]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By EzGoingKev: The mag tube on my Toros T4 spun right out by hand. There was no loctite on it from the factory. My Benelli M4's tube was loctited in and needed heat and a pair of pliers. I get the feeling they knew people would be replacing these. My buffer tube came off really easy on the S4 |
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Posted: 3/11/2024 8:28:15 PM EDT
[#14]
Replaced the hammer on one of my MAC 1014's to a US made hammer to work on 922(r) compliance. Straight forward process... the spring clip that holds the hammer pin in place got stretched on removal and I had to squeeze it back down, other than that, no issues.
Will add a Mesa forend and shell follower to round it out. |
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Posted: 3/12/2024 5:55:03 PM EDT
[#15]
Well I took the Panzer out to the range, started in on the 10rd breakin with Black Aces slugs, after 50 of those I started on 50 rounds of Black Acess 00 buck. After about 75 rounds total, the adjustable stock started collapsing on each shot. The tube is fine, the stock appears to lock up in all positions, but collapses with recoil. Any ideas? Could it just be the 1650fps slugs followed by the 1450fps 00 buck? Black Aces is pretty stout stuff.
Speaking of which, I can't believe how good my shoulder feels after what I DID go through. This thing does shoot soft!. |
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Posted: 3/12/2024 7:10:37 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By snuffy19608: Well I took the Panzer out to the range, started in on the 10rd breakin with Black Aces slugs, after 50 of those I started on 50 rounds of Black Acess 00 buck. After about 75 rounds total, the adjustable stock started collapsing on each shot. The tube is fine, the stock appears to lock up in all positions, but collapses with recoil. Any ideas? Could it just be the 1650fps slugs followed by the 1450fps 00 buck? Black Aces is pretty stout stuff. Speaking of which, I can't believe how good my shoulder feels after what I DID go through. This thing does shoot soft!. I've seen that in reviews of that SG... it shouldn't do that regardless of the ammo IMO. |
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Posted: 3/19/2024 4:14:26 PM EDT
[Last Edit: -OdieGreen-]
[#17]
Just a morals warning. There’s a post on Black River’s Instagram where a guy is claiming the Orthos is all US made except the receiver. I posted that isn’t true and even the stock and handguard are Turkish made.
ETA: The guy claiming they are US made is from Turkey. Surprise! Black River deleted my post but they aren’t deleting posts inaccurately claiming the Orthos is US made. You can see the MAC and Orthos stock are the exact same minus the add on cheek piece, and this warning is attached to the stock and handguard descriptions. Yet they censor the people mentioning the guns are Turkish instead…..  Attached File Attached FilePretty shitty to sell a Turkish product at that price while seemingly trying to censor its origin. Vendors shouldn’t have to protect their customers from companies lack of disclosure which could end up with customers in jail. Especially when you’re selling the shit for US made prices. |
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Posted: 3/19/2024 5:38:58 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Capt_Destro]
[#18]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By -OdieGreen-: Just a morals warning. There’s a post on Black River’s Instagram where a guy is claiming the Orthos is all US made except the receiver. I posted that isn’t true and even the stock and handguard are Turkish made. ETA: The guy claiming they are US made is from Turkey. Surprise! Black River deleted my post but they aren’t deleting posts inaccurately claiming the Orthos is US made. You can see the MAC and Orthos stock are the exact same minus the add on cheek piece, and this warning is attached to the stock and handguard descriptions. Yet they censor the people mentioning the guns are Turkish instead….. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/61399/IMG_3279_png-3163744.JPG https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/61399/IMG_3280_png-3163747.JPG Pretty shitty to sell a Turkish product at that price while seemingly trying to censor its origin. Vendors shouldn’t have to protect their customers from companies lack of disclosure which could end up with customers in jail. Especially when you’re selling the shit for US made prices. I feel like KUSA was doing the same shit with Saiga parts. Muzzle Brakes made over seas. Handguards made by CAA Grips and Stocks made in Turkey |
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USA
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Posted: 4/5/2024 4:49:56 PM EDT
[#19]
just picked up a panzer m4 this week and i was wondering what is the best ammo to run on this m4 without any jams ?
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Posted: 4/5/2024 5:31:57 PM EDT
[#20]
Good buckshot to start.
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Posted: 4/5/2024 8:15:30 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By drowningfisherman: just picked up a panzer m4 this week and i was wondering what is the best ammo to run on this m4 without any jams ? Federal LE with Flite Control wads is usually the best, but can be hard to find and expensive. PSA has Black Aces buckshot and slugs at a good price, excellent for the 100 round breakin most recommend. I hd no trouble with mine usin he Black Aces, now it even cycles low brass stuff from WM. Just make sure you take it apart and clean it well before shooting it the first time, some come caked with grease/crud inside, mine came fairly clean but you never know. |
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Posted: 4/5/2024 10:42:15 PM EDT
[#22]
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PA, USA
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Posted: 4/6/2024 2:51:40 PM EDT
[#23]
 Panzer Arms M4 Clone | The Benelli M4 At Home |
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Posted: 4/6/2024 2:51:59 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Bowhntr6pt]
[#24]
Quote HistoryBetter deal? I just received my order. https://palmettostatearmory.com/250-rounds-of-winchester-12ga-00-buck-shotshell.html ETA- just ordered another case. |
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Posted: 4/6/2024 2:52:41 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistorySaw that... now I want a third... 
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Posted: 4/6/2024 3:07:46 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Bowhntr6pt: Saw that... now I want a third... Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Bowhntr6pt: Saw that... now I want a third... You and me both! |
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USA
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Posted: 4/6/2024 4:58:36 PM EDT
[#27]
just pulled the trigger on this
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USA
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Posted: 4/7/2024 5:34:33 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Bowhntr6pt: I've seen that in reviews of that SG... it shouldn't do that regardless of the ammo IMO. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Bowhntr6pt: Originally Posted By snuffy19608: Well I took the Panzer out to the range, started in on the 10rd breakin with Black Aces slugs, after 50 of those I started on 50 rounds of Black Acess 00 buck. After about 75 rounds total, the adjustable stock started collapsing on each shot. The tube is fine, the stock appears to lock up in all positions, but collapses with recoil. Any ideas? Could it just be the 1650fps slugs followed by the 1450fps 00 buck? Black Aces is pretty stout stuff. Speaking of which, I can't believe how good my shoulder feels after what I DID go through. This thing does shoot soft!. I've seen that in reviews of that SG... it shouldn't do that regardless of the ammo IMO. Was watching a vid where the same exact thing happened. Can't recall or I'd post a link. iirc later, in the comments, it was mentioned a small vertical spring in the stock was allowing the stock to unlock during recoil. It started after heavy rounds were fired. The stock would adjust and seem okay but continued to unlock when firing any rounds after that. |
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Posted: 4/7/2024 6:22:56 PM EDT
[#29]
Is anyone selling just the wood stock and forend?
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Posted: 4/7/2024 10:55:34 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Bhart89: Is anyone selling just the wood stock and forend? https://sdsimports.com/mac-1014-turkish-walnut-furniture-set/ MAC 1014 Turkish Walnut Furniture Set Military Armament Corporation SKU: 80041060 | UPC: 723551445631 $99.99  Attached File |
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USA
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Posted: 4/8/2024 3:12:26 AM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By snuffy19608: ... the adjustable stock started collapsing on each shot. The tube is fine, the stock appears to lock up in all positions, but collapses with recoil. Any ideas? Could it just be the 1650fps slugs followed by the 1450fps 00 buck? Black Aces is pretty stout stuff. Here you go. It's the vertical pin in the adjustable stock. I had quoted you earlier and stated it was the vertical spring, but it's the vertical pin. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KOtNhatkvq8 |
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Posted: 4/8/2024 4:58:47 AM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By W_E_G: https://sdsimports.com/mac-1014-turkish-walnut-furniture-set/ MAC 1014 Turkish Walnut Furniture Set Military Armament Corporation SKU: 80041060 | UPC: 723551445631 $99.99 https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/105614/MAC_80041060_1__26078_jpg-3181704.JPG I assume this is the same product? Price is a little better here. https://palmettostatearmory.com/panzer-m4-stock-w-tactical-handguard-set-turkish-natural-walnut-pam4tnwss.html |
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Posted: 4/9/2024 12:02:25 AM EDT
[Last Edit: snuffy19608]
[#33]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By slack_out: Here you go. It's the vertical pin in the adjustable stock. I had quoted you earlier and stated it was the vertical spring, but it's the vertical pin. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KOtNhatkvq8 Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By slack_out: Originally Posted By snuffy19608: ... the adjustable stock started collapsing on each shot. The tube is fine, the stock appears to lock up in all positions, but collapses with recoil. Any ideas? Could it just be the 1650fps slugs followed by the 1450fps 00 buck? Black Aces is pretty stout stuff. Here you go. It's the vertical pin in the adjustable stock. I had quoted you earlier and stated it was the vertical spring, but it's the vertical pin. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KOtNhatkvq8 Sure, NOW ya tell me- lol. Thanks for the info, I put a new stock on in the meantime, I'll Locktite that pin. My buffer tube has a small amount of damage, but it still works. ETA: Everybody out to check their stocks, it's pretty annoying to say the least when you press the trigger and the RDS gets a LOT closer REALLY fast. 
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Posted: 4/12/2024 10:32:03 PM EDT
[#34]
I was picking up some stuff off the "workshop" floor tonight, and I came across the accessories pack that came with the MAC 1014.
In the nifty plastic box containing two additional choke tubes, I also found a little meth-rock baggie that contains the SIGHT ADJUSTMENT TOOLS. Wish I had noticed it before I operated the nut on the front sight with needle-nose vise-grips. 45 ACP case in the pic for scale.  Attached File |
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Posted: 4/13/2024 9:21:52 AM EDT
[#35]
Cool tools! My panzer came with the chokes in a box but I don’t remember a white bag I’ll have to look.
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Posted: 4/13/2024 10:20:16 AM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By W_E_G: https://sdsimports.com/mac-1014-turkish-walnut-furniture-set/ MAC 1014 Turkish Walnut Furniture Set Military Armament Corporation SKU: 80041060 | UPC: 723551445631 $99.99 https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/105614/MAC_80041060_1__26078_jpg-3181704.JPG Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By W_E_G: Originally Posted By Bhart89: Is anyone selling just the wood stock and forend? https://sdsimports.com/mac-1014-turkish-walnut-furniture-set/ MAC 1014 Turkish Walnut Furniture Set Military Armament Corporation SKU: 80041060 | UPC: 723551445631 $99.99 https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/105614/MAC_80041060_1__26078_jpg-3181704.JPG 
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TN, USA
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Posted: 4/14/2024 1:05:58 AM EDT
[#37]
So THATS what those tools are for. I looked up and down on every page of my MAC 1014 manual trying to figure out what they were for with no luck. Thanks man.
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Posted: 4/14/2024 10:23:23 PM EDT
[Last Edit: MSOGDAWG]
[#38]
So before I found this great thread I started one:
My post Kinda pointless now that I found this conversation. I am in the process of swapping my pistol grip stock to a "standard" stock on my Charles Daly 601 DPS. I bought the wood stock set for the MAC1014 from SDS. Wished they offered it in polymer. Anyways, I started collecting parts for the conversion. A buffer tube assembly for a Benelli was higher than giraffe's ears so I found just a tube to start. Glad I did because it will NOT thread into the CD receiver. Thread comparison - 601 top / Benelli OEM bottom  I also found a used complete 601 recoil assembly on fleabay. I figured if I screw mine up I will have a replacement. Here is why I am worried about screwing mine up.  I am going to make my 601 tube work. Grinding and filing it to a round tube. Here are the internals of the 601 recoil assembly.  Very different from Benelli as well - Who'da thunk it 
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Posted: 4/14/2024 10:25:14 PM EDT
[Last Edit: MSOGDAWG]
[#39]
I will also need to deepen the recoil tube hole in the MAC1014 stock because the 601 tube is longer than the Benelli.
 Before I reassemble the 601 recoil assembly I will be recoating the modified tube. And with the sales code at Primary Arms I just picked up another one. This one has the collapsible stock and was $355 all in all done  More to follow.... |
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SOM
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Posted: 4/15/2024 2:13:39 AM EDT
[#40]
Think this is safe to shoot? Just cosmetic damage?
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Posted: 4/15/2024 4:09:32 AM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Blain: Think this is safe to shoot? Just cosmetic damage? https://i.imgur.com/wmYQe7b.jpeg I would not shoot it. Contact whoever you bought it from/makes it and see if they will send you a new gas plug assembly. |
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Posted: 4/15/2024 9:09:08 AM EDT
[Last Edit: MSOGDAWG]
[#42]
@Blaine
What brand is your gun? I mean I know most are all made in Turkey but just curious who the manufacturer and importer is. I seem to find that most of the importers offer little parts or service support....unless I am just looking in the wrong places. |
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SOM
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Posted: 4/15/2024 1:19:28 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Blain]
[#43]
It is a MAC 1014 M4 clone. Found it used in like new condition at a LGS for just over $350. It looks, feels, and functions just like an M4, it's hard to tell them apart by looks alone. I was very impressed with the quality, even the chrome plating on the bolt / barrel looks the same. Took it home and disassembled it to further inspect. The gas plugs (which are supposed to unscrew when turned counter clockwise) would NOT unscrew. They would not budge. I decided to try to use a little bit more elbow grease to try to unscrew it and it broke. Tried to unscrew the other gas plug, same story. Stopped before that one broke, but a chunk nicked off.
Contacted MAC's parent company, they emailed me an RMA form. Filled it out and sent it back, have not heard back. The form alludes that they may just ship me the replacement parts but I am not 100% sure as I have yet to hear from them. I still will need to disassemble the gas system to replace the parts which seems to not want to come apart (pistons themselves move back and forth freely, I just can't disassemble it). Am I going to have to break the plugs in order to get them apart? Very disappointing. I am not sure if the metal itself is weaker than the metal used in the part of an actual M4, or if an M4's gas plugs would also have broken if I had applied the same amount of stress / force to them (was all just hand strength torque, nothing more)? The quality of the gun seems top notch though. Fit, finish, and action wise I can not tell it apart from the real deal. Was really looking forward to shooting it but looks like I'll have to wait (was hoping the break of the plug's disassembly hole wouldn't effect function and I still could take it out to the range to try it out). |
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Posted: 4/15/2024 2:15:02 PM EDT
[#44]
If you are talking about SDS with the MAC (which I am sure you are) they aren't very communicative. I had to send back my Tisas Raider .45 for a safety recall and the comms with that have been very minimal. Not bashing in any way. I am sure they are busy but in CS I think open fluid comms is essential.
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SOM
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Posted: 4/15/2024 11:14:51 PM EDT
[#45]
Ok, I figured out what the issue was. I was finally able to remove the plug to inspect the gas system. The gas plug was red loctited on by the previous owner. It appears that the O ring on the plug is almost worn through. Either from the factory, or something he did but it likely wasn't keeping a seal.
For some reason, he didn't notice the worn O ring and decided that loctiting the plug would make a "tighter seal" to offset whatever functioning issues the worn O ring was allowing. That's why the plug took so much force to remove that it broke. 
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Posted: 4/16/2024 6:12:33 AM EDT
[#46]
Well it sealed it, didn't it? J/k. If you look back a few pages in this thread there's a listing for a pack of replacement O-rings , not Benelli but supposed to be as good as or better than Benelli.
Hope you get things fixed up, sucks that one d******g with a tube of Locktite can screw things up like that. Good luck! |
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Posted: 4/16/2024 6:12:48 AM EDT
[Last Edit: snuffy19608]
[#47]
OOOPS, double post, sorry!
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Posted: 4/16/2024 7:08:25 AM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Blain: Ok, I figured out what the issue was. I was finally able to remove the plug to inspect the gas system. The gas plug was red loctited on by the previous owner. It appears that the O ring on the plug is almost worn through. Either from the factory, or something he did but it likely wasn't keeping a seal. For some reason, he didn't notice the worn O ring and decided that loctiting the plug would make a "tighter seal" to offset whatever functioning issues the worn O ring was allowing. That's why the plug took so much force to remove that it broke. https://i.imgur.com/6U2YCDj.jpeg That sucks, but order new o rings and clean those threads up! Back in the saddle sir! 
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SOM
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Posted: 4/16/2024 11:28:22 AM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Roland-G23: Delta Mike LTD had the Sulun TAC-12 collapsible stock in stock. Sulun TAC-12 Collapsible Stock for Turknelli's Will the MAC 1014 with this stock? I heard that with actual benelli M4's, not all have the appropriate "buffer tube" stock part (whatever the technical name for it is) to accept the collapsible stock. |
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Posted: 4/16/2024 6:57:42 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By snuffy19608: If you look back a few pages in this thread there's a listing for a pack of replacement O-rings , not Benelli but supposed to be as good as or better than Benelli. Glad I saw this!! I have quick scanned the thread and must've sailed right past that. Now I will go back, find it, grab some, and put em in my kit!! |
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