I bought 8lbs of AR-Comp and 748 powders back when I couldn't find anything else. Many here seem to like the AR-Comp but I never found a load that worked well. Especially 748. I've used 748 in blasting .223 and 308 loads in the past. The days of blasting ammo are over with component pricing now days.

What bullet load combination has worked well for you? I'm willing to buy a projectile and test to use up these powders.

Here are some Alliant recipes.
https://www.alliantpowder.com/reloaders/powderlist.aspx?page=/reloaders/powderlist.aspx&type=1&powderid=35&cartridge=46

I like ARComp for progressive loads using the 77 gr, but it works for as light as 55 gr up to 90 gr.

Of course, I liked it better before they started jacking the price.....

I’ll let you know how my 69 & 77 TMK trials go with AR Comp!

My take on 748 and similar ball powders.  Start low, work up and stop on the first accuracy node you hit unless at the very lowest I guess.  It’s temp sensitive so you have to be aware that

1. if you have a hot load in April it’s going to be too hot in July.  Don’t ask me how I know.
2. Any accurate load worked up at one temp might likely blow apart accuracy wise when it’s 25-30 degrees warmer.   Did this too.  

My HBAR I had a good load I worked up in spring that popped primers in June or July.  It was not at max either.  Over midway in the range between min and max.   That was BLC2 but 748 is about the same.  

I started out with 748 as one of the recommended powders in the M1a.

I admit I have a bit of a chip on my shoulders from my ball powder rifle loading.  There are places I am content to use it. I still use AA2200 in the 6.8 because it works well.  I use WC844 (a mil equivalent to H335) in my plinking 5.56 loads.  Powder charge wise, my load is a middling load, well away from max and with the Hornady 55 FMJ it’s satisfyingly accurate, enough so when I shot local service rifle league I’d often use those loads if I didn’t have my normal 69 SMK loading done.

Now my friend who seeks top velocities will always grab the hottest powder for the best speeds he can get.  He works his loads up as a hobby like I drink coffee, he loves it.


ETA.......Since the bullet is the largest accuracy factor start there or at least temper expectations with what bullet you start out with.

I certainly haven’t tried everything and once I find something I tend to stick with it.  

A plinking load? or GP load?  My goto is the Hornady 55 FMJ.  Other bulk bullets of that type were made to a much lower standard, Winchester were the worst dregs I ever saw.  Every bullet appeared to come off a different machine with different forming die shapes, different ogive curves, different bullet lengths, cannelure locations all over the place, boat tails formed differently or not completed at all.  Floor sweeping grade.   Runner up would be a 55 soft point, here it seems the makers put a little more care in to them as I suppose the figure prairie dog shooters that buy bulk boxes of these are fussier than military rifle reloaders.  Any of the better known brands would do I think.  I can not give an experienced viewpoint on the second lesser known tiered bullet brands catering to prairie dog guys.   A Nosler bulk box of 52 BTHP used to be the cheapest and satisfying bullet.  More than adequate in accuracy.  I kept plenty on hand for my .22-250 and they were almost on par with the SMK version.

Any of those bullets bought in bulk at the right price would work.   I avoided the bulk PRVI bags.  Their match bullets don’t live up to the name from any reports from guys I shot with.  

A ballistic tip bullet type will cost more but they shoot very well.  The Nosler brand BT’s always shot as well as match bullets for me.  I have used them from .222 Rem up to .300 Win mag and they are always accurate.  

If you are looking at less shooting but want satisfaction of small groups the Nosler Ballistic tips will do it.  My .223 bolt gun load is the BT 55 and Varget.....until I run out of it.   My AR economy load is the Hornady 55 FMJ and WC844 (H335 equivalent), it’s not match grade but it’s pretty close and shoots better than any FMJ from the big three I buy off the shelf already loaded.  Easily under 2 MOA, closer to one.

Either I or H 4895 will work well but I don’t like the current price of the stuff, fricken outrageous.   Lately I bought Vihtavouri N140 to try as it was cheaper than anything from Hodgdon or Reloader. Same owner od course with those two and others.


My notes show in the M1a that a 168 SMK did well with 43.2 to 43.5 grains of w748.  I was using commercial Remington cases not the heavier LC.  Oddly I tried similar loads in FC cases and they were stiff, my notes say 43 was stiff and 43.5 was too stiff according to my notes.  Granted these are really old notes and I was still a babe learning.  I did learn that neither of the commercial cases held up well in my Springfiels M1a but I firstly had a bad chamber where the factory spin chips with the reamer putting deep rings in it causing cases to stick and I was compounding the issue by camming over with the FL sizing die leaving a lot of free head space which begat partial case head separations quickly.


If I was to use the 748 with a 168 again, I’d drop to 43.0 as a max as the later manuals curtailed m14s loads.  Bolt guns were fine with the older data as that’s what they were developed with.

Guess it must be different guns like different things, as I have never had a bad load using AR-comp.
AR-comp is my favorite 223 powder. It has shot accurately in both my heavy barrel AR and my heavy barrel savage bolt action.
It has out performed tac, xbr8208, blc2, 748, varget and most everything else I have tried.  
I have the same results with it in 308 (AR and bolt action).
It has very similar performance (and almost identical charge weights) to IMR 3031.

My M1-A Super Match shot very well using 43.0 grains of WW-748 in Lake City brass using 168 grain SMK's.

Early in my learning curve shooting AR-15's in NRA/CMP tournaments I ran 25.0 grains of WW-748 with 69 grain SMK's. Some guys ran 26.0 to 26.5 grains of WW-748 with 52/53 grain SMK's.

I have given up on ball powders in general. At least as far as using them for competition. If you shoot on an open range exposed to direct sunlight for hours, ball powders will give you headaches unless you can keep them in the shade somehow. I still protect my ammo from getting too hot, even though I'm using single base powders.

Winchester calls for 24.5 grains of WW-748 when loading Sierra 69 grain Match Kings. I would start there. I know several people that had pressure issues in the summer running CLE chambered match rifles using 25.3 to 25.5 grains of WW-748 with 69 grain SMK's. I never did with 25.0 grains in a Wylde chamber or 5.56mm NATO chamber, but it's something you should be aware of.

Sorry about the fine print.

These targets were from a match shooting sling supported in prone using 52 gr smk with 748 in a 6.5 twist service rifle barrel. My kid consistently cleaned the MR31 target at 100 yard matches with that load. You can see the group start to open up on the second target as fatigue starts to set in through the second half on the 20 round string.

I did not developed this load. I just used what others were using for charge weight. It did not matter what brass or primer was used, I just made sure what was used at a match was consistent.

From today….

The 69 TMK speeds were about 20 fps slower than my last time out at 23.2 gr. I’m going to try 23.2, 23.3 & 23.4 next time and see what it looks like.

On the 77 TMK, I’m going to try 22.8, 22.9 & 23.0 next time. I think the 23.0 will get to 2750 fps and match my XBR loads.

AR Comp also has the lowest over all SD’s I’ve seen in 223/5.56 loadings!

Attached File

No kidding on the blasting ammo. I just paid for one pound of powder, about what I paid for a 5 pound jug of powder in 2019.

I'm kind of an odd duck in that one of my best performing powders over a wide range of cartridges has been IMR 3031. I never loved IMR 4064 or H4895 like others have. I like Varget, but I don't really like the slow end of the spectrum like 748 too much due to some of my rifles such as the M1A, and smaller calibers such as 30-30. This year, especially due to the prices on everything, I'm trying to figure out some other good options. I've been mostly focusing on AR Comp and IMR 8208 XBR. I know you didn't ask about 8208, but there's a reason I mentioned it. If you look at most burn charts, AR Comp and 8208 are right next to each other. AR Comp is supposed to be slightly slower, but both are closer to H4895 than IMR 3031. If you look at load data, it almost makes it look like 8208 is kind of fast, especially with heavier bullets.

The really odd thing through is in my testing so far, 8208 has been the slower powder. What I was shooting yesterday was a 180gr SST in 308, AR Comp I worked up to 41 grains, which is the listed max from Alliant, and I was really close to 2660 fps, I'll have to look up the exact number I got. I got no sign of unsafe pressures, but my primers were looking like I was getting close. I don't like to push it, so I feel the listed max is a good stopping point. 8208 on the other hand, Hodgdon lists a max of 40, yet at 40 grains I was clearly not even close to reaching a safe maximum. I kept going to 42 grains, which is listed on Nosler as a max, and even there the primers did not look quite like AR Comp at 41 grains. I bet I could safely go higher, but my velocity was about 2580 fps.

It's probably a case of one of my powder lots being a little faster or slower, but it does seem both powders are comparable in burn rate. So far both are performing really well. I have not tested it, but just in dropping charges on a scale, it seems both are pretty good from a measure. Its way, way, too early to tell, but so far AR Comp is producing slightly lower velocity spreads than 8208, but I need to shoot more to confirm. And remember that is one bullet, in one gun. It doesn't mean that will be the case in other cartridges. As of now, I would recommend you try in 308, 40.5 gr AR Comp and a 180gr SST. It looks like a phenomenal performing load. That was about 2630 fps, ES was 11, but that was only 5 shots.

Wah Hoo!  Great shooting!  It must be a great load, too.

Thanks for all the ideas!!

I did some playing with Win 748 in my AR.

Results were, okay.

20", 1-7, pencil profile, running suppressed, with Hornady 55gr SP.

iirc, my SDs were alright, within 40 at most (being generous to account for faulty memory). Accuracy was consistent, and I could get palm-sized groups or better at 100 without too much effort. I forgot to bring a tape measure

What I didn't like though, was (imo) a lack of velocity and how dirty it made my BCG. I started with a clean rifle, shot 200 rounds, and by the time I got done, it appeared as if I had shot 1000. On another outing, the BCG got so dirty with this powder that it would fail to go into battery. Had to take it apart and add lube to keep it going. That was when I found out how much carbon and other junk was getting blown back into the gun. Running suppressed on other rifles (including this one) using factory ammo did not yield so much dirt.

Fwiw, I do have adjustable gas.

Other than those two things, accuracy was acceptable, and the soft point was traveling plenty fast enough to expand very nicely.

bottom line was that the developed load was, okay. Even at max charge per hornady, I didn't touch 3100 fps. 3090 was the closest I got. Compared to some FMJ out of the same gun going 3300.

Based on that experience, if I had another option I would use it instead. But if 748 was all I had, and I really needed it, I'd go for it and keep some oil with me at least, and a good cleaning after every outing.

Am still using 748 in 223 and 308, and the temp sensitivity seems more noticeable in 308.  But am not out in the sun past 85 degrees, and do most shooting cooler weather.  Have found best accuracy when pairing 748 with mag primers. Rem 7 1/2 for 223 and and CCI 34's for 308.  Key advantage for me is not having to weigh every charge, and the accuracy.  Another user of the about 43 gns with 168 hpbt's, which is very accurate in every 308 owned.  Bolt, lever or semi.

This mirrors my experience with 748, and BL-C2.  I was trying a bunch of different powders in the spring time, working up different loads, then when I went back to them in warmer weather, they were spicy with the pressure to say the least.

I have had good results with AR-Comp, well, at least to the degree my skill set allows me to tell anyway :)