Watching the M110 cans go to $9500, and seeing EC's sell around $19,000, and guys with Mk13's typically not having the compatible SR25 cans (nevermind the SR25 suppressor was not really designed for .300 MAG), it seemed like the people needed cans for their rifles, so they could shoot them suppressed as they were intended to be shot.  

I needed an M110 can myself, and I might as well have a shooter for the MK11, as the included can is apparently like not replaceable. These are compatible cans, not clones in any sense.  This was an interesting project and I designed the locking system with my son Owen on the weekend.  These were a little challenging to manufacture.  The holes for the gate are helix bored on a mill-turn machine.  When I inspected the first part, we cut those holes center to the diameter of the mount to .0005" TIR.  The gates were milled from solid material.  It was neat to see them come together.  We had to buy a larger oven to fit these cans because they are abnormally long.  Fixturing to assemble the system, little things to make the project complicated.

It was interesting how the accuracy of the MK11 compared to the rail gun when we checked the accuracy of the CMP 168 GMM ammo.  The MK11 with me behind it was shooting .4MOA worse than the rail gun. Really not a great statement for the ammo.

I never found one at a price that made any sense, so I’ll probably have an accurate 16” .308 at some point due to spending a year of my life developing and manufacturing it.  

Thanks, I appreciate it.




There are a small number of everything complete and painted for immediate sale.  So like tomorrow hopefully they will allocate some inventory or initiate whatever makes the product saleable.

They aren’t all painted due to offering two colors in the models that aren’t the MGL-11, and not knowing what will be demanded.

Normally I'm ready to jump on the Griffin hate bandwagon, but this is nothing but a good thing for guys who want an M110 or Mk11 style can today. I don't think you can buy those cans from Knight's any more, and on the secondary market they go for stupid money. Plus if you have a Knight's can and something were to happen to it, what's the chances of having it repaired or replaced today?

This is a solid win for us mere mortals who don't have the real thing.

Exactly.

If it is, I'm sure Reed Knight has lawyers and money for litigation.

If not, then nothing will come of anything.

Beyond that, good on them for releasing an interesting product which fills a market niche.

To be fair we were intentionally making the can in a completely different way, because we don't want to step on the look of the KAC unit, and because competing with the design (even our undeveloped essential production prototype to their tuned can) was part of the interest we had in the project.  This is like a Borla exhaust for fitment to a Ford car. The cosmetic look of the KAC unit is mostly a byproduct of how the can is made (punched holes and spot welds), so I'm not really sure there is any protected appearance there, but we stayed away from that anyway, because this is the Griffin Exhaust system for the KAC rifle.  

I also once made a 2 lug QD coupler to mount a Optimus to an unmodified British Enfield sniper rifle, and the only thing that really hurt that for me was that the Enfield "sniper" shot like 5MOA, so it just fell short of being fun to shoot because it isn't accurate.

Nefarious makes barrels, LMT BCG's are functional in them.  SR25 cartel makes an upper, Charlies Custom clones has a house brand gas block clone.  So finding a rail is the hard part of making a clone upper.  We were targeting guys who already owned rifles, including MK13's that don't have cans as the target customer for these.  

There is no patent, and if there had been one, it would be expired at this point.  I do think the Colt AR15 BFA of this style used until the 1990's, was likely the inspiration for the Mk11 suppressor mount.  You can see the wire creates a pair of "pins" that bayonet into the BFA groove on an M16A1, and the wire itself comprises the detent.  This would be considered an item that has all the same attributes as the KAC suppressor system (a bore receiving a muzzle attachment, 2 pins comprising "a gate", and a detented retention mechanism):
https://www.gunbroker.com/item/1029543894
1972 Colt Industries Patent Blank Adapter
I'm not saying the mount isn't a good piece of work for the time in which it was made.  Obviously firearms things inspire other firearms things, and that's why KAC has the Institute of Military Technology, showcasing all the items of the past that may have relevance in the future, to inspire something new.  



As far as I know, Crane put the SR25 cans on the MK13's and that probably involved little or no engineering involvement from KAC.  One of the guys I went to sniper school with was in Afghanistan with 19th Group when he had a SR25 can tear through the 3-4 welds on the rear mount on the MK13 (.300 win mag).  He e-mailed me and told me that he had the failure at ~45 rounds fired on the new system.  He did he say it had a "sweet sound", right up until it catastrophically failed and launched the can downrange.  Our MGL-11 is probably 3 or more times stronger than the SR25 suppressor between the material attributes and the circumferential laser welding (3 being on the conservative side of estimations).  Given the high value of the cans, your can may have value as a collectable to keep with the MK13, but it may be smart not to fire the MK13 with the SR25 suppressor, at least not without some additional welding to bolster the assembly.  If you find a picture of the SR25 EC can for the 16" barrel, you will notice the rear mount was circumferentially welded on for the higher pressure of the 16" .308 barrel.  

The spot welds probably improved the straightness of the suppressors by reducing the amount of heat put into the joints.  Making welded suppressors that are straight is kind of a whore.  The CNC laser welding doesn't itself solve the problem but it provides the tools and consistency to make the problem solve-able.  

Thanks.   The cans worked out really nicely.

Thanks we are going to try to post the sound comparison of the other two models tomorrow.  We didn't have an M110 can to compare but we did test an M110 with the can at silencer research in December 2008 and it metered 138 muzzle and 142.5 @ right ear with M118LR.

The Carbine can was kind of the best all around performer of the bunch in everything except first round flash which was just slightly brighter than the others, with zero flash after the first round.  Really surprising.  M110 with the MGL-110 took best muzzle SPL, but the MGL-C was oddly in the middle at 136.1DB muzzle.  

We did zero tuning of these cans.  We took our fully developed G2 PSR-7 stack, added one baffle for obtaining original length (also replaced a blast baffle with a 40% thicker aperture blast baffle designed to confront the fact that none of these guns have muzzle brakes), and put our best flash suppressor cap on the cans.   The cap is a design we know we lose 2-3DB of sound performance to use, but that performs exceptionally well for muzzle flash.  The thicker blast baffle is probably inferior for sound reduction, but we wanted the blast baffle to essentially compete with a muzzle brake for durability.  

The test in keeping with the concept of a contest was conducted cold- so we never metered their can or our can prior to the shoot.  We only shot the one group with each configuration for accuracy/shift.  We only fired the flash test one time for each can.  

In my experience the flash test is something we will do better at if our can is heavily fouled, because the can is all shiny inside when it is new- the surfaces reflect light.  We only had 5 rounds on the cans when we did the flash test, with the exception of the MK11 which had 10 rounds on it, due to accuracy / sound, and then flash. The KAC SR25 can had at least 5 rds from the factory, then the 5 round sound test, so maybe they both had 10 rounds fired for the test.

Our can was not designed to look like a Knights armament can. That is where there is consistency.  We also only brought it because there was zero supply of the can to market. It wasn’t low supply, it was no supply at all.

And Im not actually sure the appearance of the KAC can is protected by trade dress, because it is 100% comprised of features that have utility.  Like the punched holes that allow the baffles to fit the tube and be fusion spot welded to the tube- those are not a cosmetic feature, although a lot of end users want that look. < they don’t really understand that look is just a byproduct of the manufacturing process.

However part of the fun of the project is to do the design work differently to see how the results compare/ work out.

Firearms are such an emotional space.  The cry for give us cool stuff, is followed by “what the fuck!  Why did they bring that cool stuff!”

The people imagine design and utility patents that don’t exist. Ive even seen people refer to patents that don’t exist.

They imagine protections more obscure even than trade dress.  They forget patents expire.  

But nobody freaks out when a person puts a ruger can on a Bergara 10/22.  

And nobody cares that Bergara makes a 10/22, or that 5 oufits make a glock and every other company has a Glock derived pistol model at this point.

I heard a story once about Eugene Stoner pointing at the bolt in the Aug and shaking his head, but that was actually Melvin Johnson’s bolt lug design, before it was associated to Armalite, and Johnson was on the design team for the AR15, but he did that lug design in the 30’s, 39 years before the AUG. Thats how emotional this stuff gets.

We transfer units for to your door sales, and we have 10 of each model and color going in there in a few days to a week.  A dealer e-mail will go out, but you could potentially send an e-mail to sales to try to reserve a unit.  I heard a sales person say MGL-110's sold out this morning.  The other two models haven't sold through yet, so that implies some MGL-11's are still available (I believe ~25 of each). We will try to get them back in production, but demand for cans across the line is stupidly high right now so we're hiring additional machinists to improve output across the 3 shifts.  

I also noticed the sound in the video we posted had the adobe project video audio streams for both the cans ~6DB higher than the unsuppressed gun audio (not the sound test results from HBK/AHAAH, but the video audio people would be listening to as they watch the video).  We were comprising the Sound Test specific videos this afternoon to post the MGL-110/MGL-C and also the MGL-11/SR-25 overview and comparisons respectively, and I realized that doesn't really convey the audio performance properly, as the ability of videography microphones to pick up unsuppressed audio is already impaired vs suppressed audio.

I believe the video editor was doing this thing video editing people try to do which is "sort of normalizing volume levels" across the composition which is considered a best practice for youtube video, but does nothing positive for conveyance of the experience.

@tracer_bullet
@Cdwadleigh
That was miss-communicated to me by sales.  They said they were sold out, but 20 were allocated to to your door.  That release hasn't occurred so there are 20 floating - 10 in each color.  Those are technically not sold, and the sales people really meant they were all allocated or spoken for.