User Panel
Posted: 11/29/2023 8:04:18 AM EDT
I just realized that my 03 FFL expired October 1. The ATF sent no renewal notice or communication of any kind.
Is this how they purge us? |
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Don't be so open-minded that your brains fall out.
General education should not be mere job training, but training in how to be fully human. |
Nevermind - bad advice deleted.
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"As God is my witness, I thought turkeys could fly." A. Carlson
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Preferred pronoun: MARINE
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"As God is my witness, I thought turkeys could fly." A. Carlson
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Originally Posted By MRW: I just realized that my 03 FFL expired October 1. The ATF sent no renewal notice or communication of any kind. Is this how they purge us? View Quote |
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LARUEMINATI
NRA Endowment Life Member Originally Posted By Boom_Stick: ""AKs are for villagers you have to tell not to shit in their water supply."" |
Originally Posted By R2point0: I thought that was only for FFL01's? View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By R2point0: Originally Posted By wildearp: ATF will call and ask for the bound book to be turned in. Don't fuck around with this. But just like the check, it's in the mail. |
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"As God is my witness, I thought turkeys could fly." A. Carlson
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Originally Posted By MRW: Is this how they purge us? View Quote By hoping you don't see the printed expiration date on your FFL? Seems like a bold plan... |
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You are absolutely NOT required to turn in your bound book when you surrender your C&R FFL.
https://www.atf.gov/firearms/qa/are-licensed-collectors-required-turn-their-ad-records-atf-if-they-discontinue-their Are licensed collectors required to turn in their A&D records to ATF if they discontinue their collecting activity? No. Licensed collectors are not required to submit their acquisition and disposition (A&D) records to ATF upon discontinuance of their collecting activity. |
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Don't assign malice to what can be explained by typical government incompetence. They probably just forgot to notify you or the mailman ate it or something. As a 03 Curio and Relic FFL you aren't required to send your bound book to the BATFE, you can retain it for your own records or destroy it. If you reapply for a 03 FFL you will be issued a new FFL number and will need to start a new bound book.
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Originally Posted By MRW: I just realized that my 03 FFL expired October 1. The ATF sent no renewal notice or communication of any kind. View Quote Cool. Maybe you can apply for a new license and burn your old log book. |
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Originally Posted By NAM: You are absolutely NOT required to turn in your bound book when you surrender your C&R FFL. https://www.atf.gov/firearms/qa/are-licensed-collectors-required-turn-their-ad-records-atf-if-they-discontinue-their Are licensed collectors required to turn in their A&D records to ATF if they discontinue their collecting activity? No. Licensed collectors are not required to submit their acquisition and disposition (A&D) records to ATF upon discontinuance of their collecting activity. View Quote |
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Originally Posted By AT-ST83: By hoping you don't see the printed expiration date on your FFL? Seems like a bold plan... View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By AT-ST83: Originally Posted By MRW: Is this how they purge us? By hoping you don't see the printed expiration date on your FFL? Seems like a bold plan... You sir............... I salute you. |
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I got my renewal notice around May for late July expiration (this year). Renewal took just a couple of weeks, same as before.
Rob |
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In the OP’s case, if he were to reapply and get a new FFL, could he just rip out the pages from his book and log them into the same book but have the receipt name be his old FFL number or simply their name and address?
I’m really asking here, if you acquire firearms with one 03, it expires, you get a new 03, and the same firearms are still in your collection, do those firearms sit in a limbo state gone from record keeping or do they need to be logged into your new 03? |
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Originally Posted By Mitchman705: In the OP’s case, if he were to reapply and get a new FFL, could he just rip out the pages from his book and log them into the same book but have the receipt name be his old FFL number or simply their name and address? I’m really asking here, if you acquire firearms with one 03, it expires, you get a new 03, and the same firearms are still in your collection, do those firearms sit in a limbo state gone from record keeping or do they need to be logged into your new 03? View Quote You only log stuff in you acquired under a particular license. You would not have to log in firearms you acquired under a previous license (other than a license renewel). The exception is if you sell an item that was previously acquired. In that case you log it into your bound book from yourself and then out to the purchaser. Yes it is a work around if you worry about the ATF knowing what you have but I would not recommend abusing this. I have had different C&R FFLs over time but there was a break of 4-5 years between them. If you are picked for a C&R audit, all they want to see is the activity that occurred under your current license. |
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Originally Posted By NAM: You are absolutely NOT required to turn in your bound book when you surrender your C&R FFL. https://www.atf.gov/firearms/qa/are-licensed-collectors-required-turn-their-ad-records-atf-if-they-discontinue-their Are licensed collectors required to turn in their A&D records to ATF if they discontinue their collecting activity? No. Licensed collectors are not required to submit their acquisition and disposition (A&D) records to ATF upon discontinuance of their collecting activity. View Quote I think the key words are “collection activity”. If you don’t renew, they want your bound book. I just got a letter this summer stating if I didn’t renew my 03 FFL, they wanted all my records. At least that’s how I read the letter. So, I just sent them a check for $30. |
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Originally Posted By Shadyman: I think the key words are “collection activity”. If you don’t renew, they want your bound book. I just got a letter this summer stating if I didn’t renew my 03 FFL, they wanted all my records. At least that’s how I read the letter. So, I just sent them a check for $30. View Quote Mind posting a redacted copy of that letter? I believe it to be incorrect, erroneous, or improperly interpreted. |
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Originally Posted By NAM: You are absolutely NOT required to turn in your bound book when you surrender your C&R FFL. https://www.atf.gov/firearms/qa/are-licensed-collectors-required-turn-their-ad-records-atf-if-they-discontinue-their Are licensed collectors required to turn in their A&D records to ATF if they discontinue their collecting activity? No. Licensed collectors are not required to submit their acquisition and disposition (A&D) records to ATF upon discontinuance of their collecting activity. View Quote This. You do not send in you book. |
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Originally Posted By NAM: Mind posting a redacted copy of that letter? I believe it to be incorrect, erroneous, or improperly interpreted. View Quote Would like to see this letter as well. It even says on the renewal form that if you are not renewing you are NOT required to submit your book. |
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I think I'm on my 3rd or 4th license. There's been a few years gap on all of them. Never have gotten a "we want your bound book" letter
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I called and spoke to a human at ATF
The only thing I can do is reapply for a new one. no mention of turning in my records |
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Don't be so open-minded that your brains fall out.
General education should not be mere job training, but training in how to be fully human. |
It just comes down to jurisdictions and proper training. There are some noobs or poorly trained agents that simply don't know the difference between an 01 and 03 license requirements. Not a problem in every state.
As for the mail issue, I had a license never make it to my mailbox. I called ATF and they e-mailed me one. |
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Looking for Colt AR-15 Serial # SP154280 My first AR
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Originally Posted By Tazaroo: @JAG2955 03 FFL holders DO NOT turn in their A&D books when they cease using their C&R license. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes |
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Looking for Colt AR-15 Serial # SP154280 My first AR
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Originally Posted By Shadyman: I think the key words are “collection activity”. If you don’t renew, they want your bound book. I just got a letter this summer stating if I didn’t renew my 03 FFL, they wanted all my records. At least that’s how I read the letter. So, I just sent them a check for $30. View Quote I am sure they do "want" you records. Too bad they don't have any right to get them after you don't renew. |
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Keep your expired license or at least a copy of it; when you apply for a new FFL ATF will ask if you had an FFL previously and what the number was.
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The worst thing about living in the declining era of a great civilization is knowing that you are. - Robert Heinlein
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I think there is some confusion on C&R bound book records needing to be turned in due to that being part of the proposed "Frame-Receiver" rule changes. I don't know if that part made it into the final ruling, or if it even matters now that the ruling had been struck down (last I knew). That ruling changed the 20 destruction period for FFLs to a permanent retention and turn-in when giving up the license. Including C&R type 03 licenses.
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I just got my renewal packet last week.
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