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Born with a low tolerance for bullshit
KY, USA
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Originally Posted By turtle2472: Thank you for the replies. I read it last night, a few times, thinking through how I can make this happen. Everything from trying to find other sources for this type of zoysia at different supplies for less and maybe be able to buy enough rolls of sod. I've not been able to find ANY plugs for this strain either, sod only. The only place I can find it locally is the one distributor I bought these from. Apparently I chose a strain that golf courses love. Now I know why they charge such a premium for it. I can't say I never had taste. While I don't have champagne taste on a beer budget, but my yard is on a beer budget. To answer my water source, regional water district. I'm willing to pay for the water consumption to get this established though. The logistics of getting a sprinkler set up on that patch is something I'll have to work through but will figure out how to make happen. Would the recommendation be an oscillating wand or impact style? The area is about 460 sqft total (almost perfect square) that is all clay. I'll set up the hose on a timer so I don't have to think about it, it will happen rain or shine on whatever interval is needed. I'm going to see about buying more rolls from the local supplier. There was only about 10 rolls left on the pallet when I picked these up so I will see what is left when I head out there later. From there I'm open to breaking out the machete and chopping up my current patch and spreading it out. When breaking them up and "planting" them, do you mean to mostly cover with the clay too? I'm good with that but I know clay isn't forgiving. I'm envisioning using a dirt knife/trowel to dig a shallow square and then set the sod chunk in it and gently cover with finer clay so blades are exposed but the core mat is mostly covered. Is that about right? What kind of other supplies should I look at getting? I have Tractor Supply, Home Depot and Lowe's all in town I can go to. Of course, anything that is available for delivery will get there too. I'm assuming fertilizer but no idea what is the best for what I'm going to be doing here. For the weeds... the thought had crossed my mind that they would naturally come back. I have a backpack sprayer that is just herbicide, but I'm good with getting another sprayer to spray down weed killer. Ideally, for my lazy style, it would be great if I were applying whatever product with a garden hose and sprayer. If better for the lawn, I'll go out there with a pressure sprayer type and manually walk around instead. View Quote Okay a few things. 1-No, don't bury the sod. But you DO need to hollow out a little space, and "set" the dirt part in the ground, and make sure the edges have dirt sloping up to them. Basically, when you have a big piece of sod, you have the middle that does not dry out completely, and the edges that get very dry, if they are not butted up against something (which they almost always are). With small pieces of sod that you are treating like plugs, you've got to sort of "plant" that piece of sod. Use the soil to help it not die from drying out too fast. Even with you watering plenty, a small piece, without a root ball (like a plug would have) is going to get very dry, very quickly. So this is more work than just rolling out strips of sod, but it will pay off for you. 2-Your sprayer is fine. Herbicide for the weeds in zoysia is what you want. So you want a herbicide that won't hurt the zoysia/warm season grass. It will be primarily 2, 4-D, but usually the formulations have something else in there too, to give it more punch. They are usually generic and very cheap in small bottles. You are going to overspray your turf, and also spray your bare areas. Folks seem to really like Celsius, but you should research that. 3-I tell my customers to go to Lowe's or Home Depot and get decent quality impact sprinklers from there. Cuz they are not gonna order something specific. They just want to buy it, shove it out there, and have it work. The ones @TheStig posted are absolutely fine. I could recommend some truly outstanding sprinklers, but they are more expensive, and you don't need fancy just for establishment. I do have some opinions on timers that I absolutely hate and you should not buy. Pay the money and get the one you can run from your phone. I can't think of the name of the rotten one. If you need that, I'll go look at the POS one I tossed in the garage. HERE IS THE TROUBLE: Zoysia is slow to establish. It does not spread quickly like Bermuda does. Especially at first. It can take a couple of years to really get established and covering ground. That means you are going to be spraying that bare ground a LOT, and you are likely to go over your annual rate for the herbicide use. This is more than just a problem on paper. 1- Weeds develop resistance, just like bugs do. Overuse of one herbicide can make it less viable for you in the future. 2- While we say "X herbicide doesn't hurt Y grass" that's not entirely true. The grass still has to process that herbicide, and it's going to slow down the establishment and spread even more. So you've got yourself kind of between a rock and a hard place here. I do NOT recommend using glyphosate "between the plugs of sod" because you're accidentally going to kill some of it. You can't use a pre-emergent herbicide like prodiamine because that's a root pruner. It will keep your sod from rooting, tacking down runners, etc. Honestly if you can swing it, I'd either sod the whole thing, or go with a different, less-expensive cultivar and just redo the whole thing. Maybe put the fancy sod on a curb strip or something so it all matches in one section? I dunno. This is a tough one. I wish I had a better solution. |
Nobody ever wakes me at 2 in the morning telling me that my grass is out on the highway.~~Radiopat
Wine is sunlight held together by water~~Galileo Galilei Well-behaved women rarely make history~~Marilyn Monroe |
I REALLY like this strain of Zoysia so I don't really want to change it out. Maybe I'm going to be setting aside money each month to add another handful of rolls as I go along every month. It will be a long process, but it sounds like it is going to be much shorter than waiting for it to grow naturally.
Part of the challenge I have is that my wife likes this grass and hates pretty much all other heat tolerant grasses. Y'all have given me some good info and input. Thanks. It really is appreciated. I'll keep asking questions as I go along for sure. |
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Louis L'Amour, “To make democracy work, we must be a nation of participants, not simply observers. One who does not vote has no right to complain.”
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Born with a low tolerance for bullshit
KY, USA
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Originally Posted By turtle2472: I REALLY like this strain of Zoysia so I don't really want to change it out. Maybe I'm going to be setting aside money each month to add another handful of rolls as I go along every month. It will be a long process, but it sounds like it is going to be much shorter than waiting for it to grow naturally. Part of the challenge I have is that my wife likes this grass and hates pretty much all other heat tolerant grasses. Y'all have given me some good info and input. Thanks. It really is appreciated. I'll keep asking questions as I go along for sure. View Quote Yes, ask questions, and show us how it goes! So if you are going to aim for, say, a hundred square feet per month. (just guessing...it could be half that...no idea what you are thinking) MAKE A PLAN. Grid off your yard, and make a paper plan. DECIDE NOW which are the first three squares (300 square feet) you are going to sod. THEN...put prodiamine down (this is a pre-emergent herbicide) on EVERYTHING ELSE. This will save you so, so, SO much hassle. I would also consider getting some bags of peat moss at Lowe's or HD, and spreading that over the bare soil, just to help it hold water and not blow away, turn into a complete mud pit, etc. But That's a "nicety". What you really need is weed prevention. The pre-emergent is your friend, AND...if you do the application correctly, it will wear off in....drum roll please.....three months. Just when you are ready to start your next square of sod. OR you could get landscape fabric and a bunch of staples, put down the pre-emergent, then roll out the fabric and staple the hell out of it. (And lay down some rocks, pavers, etc.) It won't be beautiful but it will help you in the long run. (Or you could do black plastic and no pre-emergent.) |
Nobody ever wakes me at 2 in the morning telling me that my grass is out on the highway.~~Radiopat
Wine is sunlight held together by water~~Galileo Galilei Well-behaved women rarely make history~~Marilyn Monroe |
Louis L'Amour, “To make democracy work, we must be a nation of participants, not simply observers. One who does not vote has no right to complain.”
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Born with a low tolerance for bullshit
KY, USA
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Originally Posted By turtle2472: A week in and I have roots! https://turtle2472.com/ar15/IMG_1198.jpeg I watched that video from LCN so I had to check. It is really nice to see this stuff setting in for the long haul. It does look greener now then it did when I unrolled it and the blades are certainly perking up. :) Progress. View Quote Yes If you haven't, you need to get a little fertilizer on that sod. Something with phosphorus in it is good. That helps with root development. Like what I use on new sod is, I put down a granular starter fertilizer on the bare dirt before I lay the sod (this is NOT a heavy application. It's just a little.) Then I water it like crazy, then I apply RGS, (this is a liquid) which is Greene County Fertilizer's root growth stimulant. Water that in. Then in about four-seven days (depending) I apply a liquid 16-21-2 with humic and fulvic acid. Now, I grow cool season grass (fescue, bluegrass, etc) but I don't think this sod starting technique varies much between cool and warm seasons. |
Nobody ever wakes me at 2 in the morning telling me that my grass is out on the highway.~~Radiopat
Wine is sunlight held together by water~~Galileo Galilei Well-behaved women rarely make history~~Marilyn Monroe |
Beautiful - hold the line! Jealous how healthy and full your yard looks. Excellent work.
We're finally up past 60 degree 5 day average soil temps and green up has been painfully slow with the new sod. It's ugly and patchy at the moment and the ground is super compacted. Waiting on someone to come out to core aerate. Till then, just applied some Lesco CarbonPro-G with 28-3-10 and looking forward to it waking up more. In other non-related lawn care news but landscape-adjacent, I've been getting some hardscape work done. Had masonry edging put in around our flower beds, extended the backyard concrete patio another 144 sqft for a sitting area and future pergola, and having an outdoor kitchen put it. Hoping this time next year we'll be ready to put in a pool. |
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Born with a low tolerance for bullshit
KY, USA
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Originally Posted By Cobalt135: Pic I took a few days ago looking across lawn into neighbors property who don't do anything but cut every week. Other side of property is field like so all the undesirable seeds blow in. Can you say weed pressure. West central OH to give a perspective on the zone I am in. https://i.imgur.com/NJSjG8Y.jpg Very happy so far with application of Stonewall .037% 13-0-0 non slow release N on March 3rd as far as the green-up goes. Another application of over 100 lbs. of slow release 30-0-10 on April 7th to get it out of the garage and out of the way. https://i.imgur.com/CJ4Izyg.jpg Past few days I sprayed some dandelions with some 2-4-d in the backpack sprayer that I should have treated this past fall as they made it through the mild winter we had. Impressed with the green-up so far. Growth rate so far will mean cutting every 4 or 5 days with moisture and rain but I'm OK with that. View Quote Very nice domination line! How many thousand square feet? (I'm wondering how much that 100 lbs was, as far as pounds on the ground per K). |
Nobody ever wakes me at 2 in the morning telling me that my grass is out on the highway.~~Radiopat
Wine is sunlight held together by water~~Galileo Galilei Well-behaved women rarely make history~~Marilyn Monroe |
Born with a low tolerance for bullshit
KY, USA
|
Originally Posted By TheStig: Beautiful - hold the line! Jealous how healthy and full your yard looks. Excellent work. We're finally up past 60 degree 5 day average soil temps and green up has been painfully slow with the new sod. It's ugly and patchy at the moment and the ground is super compacted. Waiting on someone to come out to core aerate. Till then, just applied some Lesco CarbonPro-G with 28-3-10 and looking forward to it waking up more. In other non-related lawn care news but landscape-adjacent, I've been getting some hardscape work done. Had masonry edging put in around our flower beds, extended the backyard concrete patio another 144 sqft for a sitting area and future pergola, and having an outdoor kitchen put it. Hoping this time next year we'll be ready to put in a pool. View Quote We want pics, dude! You got any Greene County Air-8? Throw that to it, as SOON as you core aerate. It is HUGELY helpful to get it in the bottom of those core holes! |
Nobody ever wakes me at 2 in the morning telling me that my grass is out on the highway.~~Radiopat
Wine is sunlight held together by water~~Galileo Galilei Well-behaved women rarely make history~~Marilyn Monroe |
Originally Posted By Kitties-with-Sigs: Very nice domination line! How many thousand square feet? (I'm wondering how much that 100 lbs was, as far as pounds on the ground per K). View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By Kitties-with-Sigs: Originally Posted By Cobalt135: Pic I took a few days ago looking across lawn into neighbors property who don't do anything but cut every week. Other side of property is field like so all the undesirable seeds blow in. Can you say weed pressure. West central OH to give a perspective on the zone I am in. https://i.imgur.com/NJSjG8Y.jpg Very happy so far with application of Stonewall .037% 13-0-0 non slow release N on March 3rd as far as the green-up goes. Another application of over 100 lbs. of slow release 30-0-10 on April 7th to get it out of the garage and out of the way. https://i.imgur.com/CJ4Izyg.jpg Past few days I sprayed some dandelions with some 2-4-d in the backpack sprayer that I should have treated this past fall as they made it through the mild winter we had. Impressed with the green-up so far. Growth rate so far will mean cutting every 4 or 5 days with moisture and rain but I'm OK with that. Very nice domination line! How many thousand square feet? (I'm wondering how much that 100 lbs was, as far as pounds on the ground per K). The Stonewall with 13-0-0 nitrogen was at the published rate of 6.2 Lb. per acre. Applied first week of March with no spring growth evident yet but wanted to get the Pre emergent down before soil temperatures warmed. Non slow release..... TOTAL NITROGEN (N) ........................................................................................13.00% 13.00%Urea Nitrogen* DERIVED FROM: Urea *3.20% Urea Nitrogen Stabilized with (N-(n-butyl) thiophosphoric triamide). April 7th applied just Nitrogen according to the rate on the bag.... 0.8 lb of nitrogen per 1000 sq/ft 30% urea nitrogen* 0.02 water soluble Iron Derived from: Polymer coated urea, Urea, Muriate of Potash, Iron Sucrate, Maganese Sucrate, *4.50 Urea nitrogen stabilized with Dicyandiamide 7.50% slow release nitrogen; from polymer coated urea. Best greenup I have seen in years, but I put some extra effort in this year putting down some extra N. Also sprayed about 3 gallons of 2-4-D this year mainly on dandelions that I should have started spraying in the fall of last year since they seemed to survive the winter. |
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Originally Posted By SWIRE: How do I get rid of this weed without killing off good plants? It comes up from the ground but then grows in between and over everything. I can pull it out by hand easy enough but it is everywhere and I can't get all of it. The weed has fibers all over it that will cause it to stick to clothing and other things. Pretty sure that is how it populates itself. View Quote What are the good plants (grass type/plant name/etc)? You just want to make sure whatever selective herbicide you use will not damage the nearby good plants. I'm not familiar with the pictured weeds but I'm certain someone more knowledgeable can chime in with proper identification and recommendation if they know what plants you don't want hurt/killed accidentally. |
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Originally Posted By SWIRE: How do I get rid of this weed without killing off good plants? It comes up from the ground but then grows in between and over everything. I can pull it out by hand easy enough but it is everywhere and I can't get all of it. The weed has fibers all over it that will cause it to stick to clothing and other things. Pretty sure that is how it populates itself. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/680/weed2_JPG-3189526.jpg https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/680/weed1_JPG-3189525.jpg View Quote That looks like goose grass, AKA catchweed bedstraw. Mixed in with desirable ornamentals hand removal is about all you can do without damaging what you want to keep. It is an annual that sprouts from seeds every year so a pre-emergent like Dimension could help if you get it down before the seeds germinate in the spring. |
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Hi Folks, just ran into this thread. Northeast Ohio here. A bit colder then @Cobalt135 Central Ohio.
Here’s some issues, I’m trying to deal with, hopefully someone can help me. Currently mowing about 3 acres (130,000 sqft), as some would say, that’s small, but it’s a beast. Running a Zero turn with a 64” cut with mulching blades. Granule Fertilizer is expensive, there must be a better way. Burning through about 350 lbs of 28-0-4, roughly cost $400. Which applied about every 3 years. In the other years, using Gordon’s liquid 20-0-0, which if about half the price $200, but not as effective but overall continues to make my grass green, using a 10’ boom sprayer and Crab Grass / Weed killer as well in the same treatment. What's an alternative compared to buying bagged fertilizer? How often to you mow your lawn? Me, in the spring, is like every 4 days. You miss a day, you’re screwed, it looks like the first harvest hay season. I would really like to bag it (that’s another purchase) what do I do with all the grass? And that’s a lot of grass. *Edit – Also core aeration in the fall, should it also be done in the Spring, as in now? |
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"When governments fear the people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny." Thomas Jefferson
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Originally Posted By NotDeaf: Hi Folks, just ran into this thread. Northeast Ohio here. A bit colder then @Cobalt135 Central Ohio. Here's some issues, I'm trying to deal with, hopefully someone can help me. Currently mowing about 3 acres (130,000 sqft), as some would say, that's small, but it's a beast. Running a Zero turn with a 64" cut with mulching blades. Granule Fertilizer is expensive, there must be a better way. Burning through about 350 lbs of 28-0-4, roughly cost $400. Which applied about every 3 years. In the other years, using Gordon's liquid 20-0-0, which if about half the price $200, but not as effective but overall continues to make my grass green, using a 10' boom sprayer and Crab Grass / Weed killer as well in the same treatment. What's an alternative compared to buying bagged fertilizer? How often to you mow your lawn? Me, in the spring, is like every 4 days. You miss a day, you're screwed, it looks like the first harvest hay season. I would really like to bag it (that's another purchase) what do I do with all the grass? And that's a lot of grass. *Edit Also core aeration in the fall, should it also be done in the Spring, as in now? View Quote I don't apply liquid fert. except to some landscape plants and flowers so not going to be any help there. Spring mowing here with a fertilized lawn is every 4 to 5 days typically, especially if you want to follow the 'only cut 1/3 of the grass blade' which I don't always do. Weather obviously factors in. Mowed this past Sunday and will cut again this evening since it could rain tomorrow afternoon and Thursday night. Bagging is just taking away nutrients that would have made it back into the soil. Aeration in the spring on cool season grass just opens up the soil to allow any weeds to germinate (and destroys any pre-emergent barrier you had applied) and can cause the soil to lose moisture more easily as the days are getting warmer until the plugs break up and re-fill the holes. |
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Originally Posted By TinSpinner: That looks like goose grass, AKA catchweed bedstraw. Mixed in with desirable ornamentals hand removal is about all you can do without damaging what you want to keep. It is an annual that sprouts from seeds every year so a pre-emergent like Dimension could help if you get it down before the seeds germinate in the spring. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By TinSpinner: Originally Posted By SWIRE: How do I get rid of this weed without killing off good plants? It comes up from the ground but then grows in between and over everything. I can pull it out by hand easy enough but it is everywhere and I can't get all of it. The weed has fibers all over it that will cause it to stick to clothing and other things. Pretty sure that is how it populates itself. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/680/weed2_JPG-3189526.jpg https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/680/weed1_JPG-3189525.jpg That looks like goose grass, AKA catchweed bedstraw. Mixed in with desirable ornamentals hand removal is about all you can do without damaging what you want to keep. It is an annual that sprouts from seeds every year so a pre-emergent like Dimension could help if you get it down before the seeds germinate in the spring. Hand removal will be a time consuming task. It is everywhere in the yard, flower beds, and gardens. Does it need to be removed as well or is pulling it out and leaving it on the ground this time of year good enough? |
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Get Active or Get Disarmed! That means get involved in helping good candidates in primary and general election. That is in addition to being politically active once they are elected.
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Originally Posted By SWIRE: Hand removal will be a time consuming task. It is everywhere in the yard, flower beds, and gardens. Does it need to be removed as well or is pulling it out and leaving it on the ground this time of year good enough? View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By SWIRE: Originally Posted By TinSpinner: Originally Posted By SWIRE: How do I get rid of this weed without killing off good plants? It comes up from the ground but then grows in between and over everything. I can pull it out by hand easy enough but it is everywhere and I can't get all of it. The weed has fibers all over it that will cause it to stick to clothing and other things. Pretty sure that is how it populates itself. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/680/weed2_JPG-3189526.jpg https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/680/weed1_JPG-3189525.jpg That looks like goose grass, AKA catchweed bedstraw. Mixed in with desirable ornamentals hand removal is about all you can do without damaging what you want to keep. It is an annual that sprouts from seeds every year so a pre-emergent like Dimension could help if you get it down before the seeds germinate in the spring. Hand removal will be a time consuming task. It is everywhere in the yard, flower beds, and gardens. Does it need to be removed as well or is pulling it out and leaving it on the ground this time of year good enough? If you leave it on the ground you are helping it to distribute seeds. I would remove it to help interrupt the cycle. What is in the yard can be controlled with a selective herbicide that your grass is tolerant to, unfortunately though your garden and ornamentals can't tolerate much for herbicides. |
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Originally Posted By TinSpinner: If you leave it on the ground you are helping it to distribute seeds. I would remove it to help interrupt the cycle. What is in the yard can be controlled with a selective herbicide that your grass is tolerant to, unfortunately though your garden and ornamentals can't tolerate much for herbicides. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By TinSpinner: Originally Posted By SWIRE: Originally Posted By TinSpinner: Originally Posted By SWIRE: How do I get rid of this weed without killing off good plants? It comes up from the ground but then grows in between and over everything. I can pull it out by hand easy enough but it is everywhere and I can't get all of it. The weed has fibers all over it that will cause it to stick to clothing and other things. Pretty sure that is how it populates itself. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/680/weed2_JPG-3189526.jpg https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/680/weed1_JPG-3189525.jpg That looks like goose grass, AKA catchweed bedstraw. Mixed in with desirable ornamentals hand removal is about all you can do without damaging what you want to keep. It is an annual that sprouts from seeds every year so a pre-emergent like Dimension could help if you get it down before the seeds germinate in the spring. Hand removal will be a time consuming task. It is everywhere in the yard, flower beds, and gardens. Does it need to be removed as well or is pulling it out and leaving it on the ground this time of year good enough? If you leave it on the ground you are helping it to distribute seeds. I would remove it to help interrupt the cycle. What is in the yard can be controlled with a selective herbicide that your grass is tolerant to, unfortunately though your garden and ornamentals can't tolerate much for herbicides. Does it have seeds now or later in the year? Everything here just started the spring growth spurt. The perennial areas are the worst as I don't touch it with any type of herbicide and typically don't weed the area much. Most of the garden area is perenialls. Are there seeds on these already or do they need to flower and then develop the seeds? Previous years I just pulled it up and left it...clearly that has not been effective. |
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Get Active or Get Disarmed! That means get involved in helping good candidates in primary and general election. That is in addition to being politically active once they are elected.
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Born with a low tolerance for bullshit
KY, USA
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Originally Posted By SWIRE: How do I get rid of this weed without killing off good plants? It comes up from the ground but then grows in between and over everything. I can pull it out by hand easy enough but it is everywhere and I can't get all of it. The weed has fibers all over it that will cause it to stick to clothing and other things. Pretty sure that is how it populates itself. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/680/weed2_JPG-3189526.jpg https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/680/weed1_JPG-3189525.jpg View Quote That's called Cleavers. I'm making medicine out of it today. I expect 2,4-D will get it, but I've never tried to kill it. I will look. ETA: Oh...it's in a flower bed. Shoot. I don't know anything you can use to overspray ornamentals that will take out Cleavers. Look for the little spiny balls (they're really small) on the plants. It is a spring annual so it flowers and seeds very quickly, then dies with the heat. But it leaves the brown, ugly vines all over everything. Pre-emergent in the fall and early spring are your best bets to stop it. But that won't be effective THIS year. That'll be for next year. Going back to read the comments. You may already have gotten help. |
Nobody ever wakes me at 2 in the morning telling me that my grass is out on the highway.~~Radiopat
Wine is sunlight held together by water~~Galileo Galilei Well-behaved women rarely make history~~Marilyn Monroe |
Born with a low tolerance for bullshit
KY, USA
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@SWIRE
You're going to have to pull it by hand this year. As you clear an area, sprinkle Preen all over your flower beds. (Try not to put it ON the ornamental plants, except for the vinca. You can't kill that so don't worry. Sprinkle away.) You will need to reapply Preen every three months. Toss the cleavers in a pile, then pick it up and put it in the trash. It smooshes down much smaller than it seems like it would. It kind of collapses. FYI, this is not in fact goosegrass. That's something else, and is a good reason to use scientific names, cuz regionally the names really vary. But those scientific names can be really offputting. If you type in "Cleavers" you will normally get this plant, though. It grows pretty much everywhere around the country as far as I know, though maybe not in the deep south or southwest--not sure about that. If @TheStig doesn't know it as a weed, maybe it doesn't grow down there. Since you have mixed perennial beds, you should absolutely read the label HERE and avoid anything it says you should avoid. It is my experience that NO granular pre-emergent herbicide is labeled for use around hydrangea (at least, it wasn't last time I looked) so I just stay back a little, away from the roots. Pre-emergent is the key to low-maintenance perennial beds. In GRASS, you can use 2,4-D and/or other broadleaf herbicides. But not in your landscape beds. Unfortunately there is no selective herbicide that will get just the plants you want gone. We all want that, but it doesn't exist. |
Nobody ever wakes me at 2 in the morning telling me that my grass is out on the highway.~~Radiopat
Wine is sunlight held together by water~~Galileo Galilei Well-behaved women rarely make history~~Marilyn Monroe |
Get Active or Get Disarmed! That means get involved in helping good candidates in primary and general election. That is in addition to being politically active once they are elected.
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Born with a low tolerance for bullshit
KY, USA
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Originally Posted By SWIRE: I wasn't sure if it would be ok to use around perennials but it looks ok for what I have. I will pull it or what I can and then put Preen down. View Quote So the seeds that get left from this year (and some from previous years, cuz that's how seeds roll, yaknow?) will lie there until winter. Then they will germinate either in late fall or (more likely) early spring. So it's important, in the fall, to put down a late fall application, and another in, say, late January/early February here. You have to catch them BEFORE they germinate. FYI I usually see Ginormous containers of PREEN at Sam's this time of year. Much cheaper than going to Lowe's or HD. |
Nobody ever wakes me at 2 in the morning telling me that my grass is out on the highway.~~Radiopat
Wine is sunlight held together by water~~Galileo Galilei Well-behaved women rarely make history~~Marilyn Monroe |
Born with a low tolerance for bullshit
KY, USA
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Originally Posted By SWIRE: I wasn't sure if it would be ok to use around perennials but it looks ok for what I have. I will pull it or what I can and then put Preen down. View Quote You do also have chickweed in there, and of course a dandelion. Tis the season. Pre-emergent won't stop a second-year dandelion, but will stop the seeds of new ones. |
Nobody ever wakes me at 2 in the morning telling me that my grass is out on the highway.~~Radiopat
Wine is sunlight held together by water~~Galileo Galilei Well-behaved women rarely make history~~Marilyn Monroe |
Born with a low tolerance for bullshit
KY, USA
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Originally Posted By TheStig: Update on the new yard(s). Core aeration is done and have been maintaining the front yard at .4". Has a long way to go until it's as nice looking as my previous yard but will get there. I will be sand leveling once we are well into the summer months and past the rainy season. https://i.imgur.com/mR7KH1a.jpeg Shot of the masonry work we had done for the flower bed edging. Still need to get a planter for the pedestal and some flowers to add a bit of color. https://i.imgur.com/c80tBAa.jpeg Close up of a dwarf Japanese maple I planted about a month ago. https://i.imgur.com/0rNtZ48.jpeg The back is waking up nicely as well especially with the help of the added nitrogen apps courtesy of my GSD. https://i.imgur.com/Roq9Ujp.jpeg Same guys that did the flower bed masonry also built us a little outdoor kitchen. https://i.imgur.com/jrKq34T.jpeg Of course no new construction home is complete without builder trash in your yard. My reel mower found this rebar left over while scalping from what I presume was a temporary power meter grounding stake. Luckily the greenskeeper that services my mower was able to bend the reel blade back but still had to buy a new bedknife. That was not a fun day. https://i.imgur.com/WtdFp5x.jpeg https://i.imgur.com/UkkRSmp.jpeg And here's a before and after of my elderly mother's back yard whom purchased the property next door. First pic is from March and second is today. Celsius + Sertay app plus some hand pulling and it's starting to look halfway decent. https://i.imgur.com/lSgLYxl.jpeg https://i.imgur.com/mNXtJx4.jpeg View Quote I think your mom is lucky to have her own personal greenskeeper. |
Nobody ever wakes me at 2 in the morning telling me that my grass is out on the highway.~~Radiopat
Wine is sunlight held together by water~~Galileo Galilei Well-behaved women rarely make history~~Marilyn Monroe |
Originally Posted By Kitties-with-Sigs: @SWIRE You're going to have to pull it by hand this year. As you clear an area, sprinkle Preen all over your flower beds. (Try not to put it ON the ornamental plants, except for the vinca. You can't kill that so don't worry. Sprinkle away.) You will need to reapply Preen every three months. Toss the cleavers in a pile, then pick it up and put it in the trash. It smooshes down much smaller than it seems like it would. It kind of collapses. FYI, this is not in fact goosegrass. That's something else, and is a good reason to use scientific names, cuz regionally the names really vary. But those scientific names can be really offputting. If you type in "Cleavers" you will normally get this plant, though. It grows pretty much everywhere around the country as far as I know, though maybe not in the deep south or southwest--not sure about that. If @TheStig doesn't know it as a weed, maybe it doesn't grow down there. Since you have mixed perennial beds, you should absolutely read the label HERE and avoid anything it says you should avoid. It is my experience that NO granular pre-emergent herbicide is labeled for use around hydrangea (at least, it wasn't last time I looked) so I just stay back a little, away from the roots. Pre-emergent is the key to low-maintenance perennial beds. In GRASS, you can use 2,4-D and/or other broadleaf herbicides. But not in your landscape beds. Unfortunately there is no selective herbicide that will get just the plants you want gone. We all want that, but it doesn't exist. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By Kitties-with-Sigs: @SWIRE You're going to have to pull it by hand this year. As you clear an area, sprinkle Preen all over your flower beds. (Try not to put it ON the ornamental plants, except for the vinca. You can't kill that so don't worry. Sprinkle away.) You will need to reapply Preen every three months. Toss the cleavers in a pile, then pick it up and put it in the trash. It smooshes down much smaller than it seems like it would. It kind of collapses. FYI, this is not in fact goosegrass. That's something else, and is a good reason to use scientific names, cuz regionally the names really vary. But those scientific names can be really offputting. If you type in "Cleavers" you will normally get this plant, though. It grows pretty much everywhere around the country as far as I know, though maybe not in the deep south or southwest--not sure about that. If @TheStig doesn't know it as a weed, maybe it doesn't grow down there. Since you have mixed perennial beds, you should absolutely read the label HERE and avoid anything it says you should avoid. It is my experience that NO granular pre-emergent herbicide is labeled for use around hydrangea (at least, it wasn't last time I looked) so I just stay back a little, away from the roots. Pre-emergent is the key to low-maintenance perennial beds. In GRASS, you can use 2,4-D and/or other broadleaf herbicides. But not in your landscape beds. Unfortunately there is no selective herbicide that will get just the plants you want gone. We all want that, but it doesn't exist. You are right about the plant names being somewhat regional, goosegrass is a common name for that plant here as is catchweed or bedstraw like I mentioned. For example: Galium aparine Common Name(s): Catchweed Bedstraw Cleavers Goosegrass Stickyweed Sticky willy Velcro plant https://plants.ces.ncsu.edu/plants/galium-aparine/ I've heard of medicinal uses for it but more familiar with it's use in cheese making. All that's fine if you are trying to cultivate it for those uses but it's a nuisance otherwise. |
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Born with a low tolerance for bullshit
KY, USA
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Originally Posted By TinSpinner: You are right about the plant names being somewhat regional, goosegrass is a common name for that plant here as is catchweed or bedstraw like I mentioned. For example: https://plants.ces.ncsu.edu/plants/galium-aparine/ I've heard of medicinal uses for it but more familiar with it's use in cheese making. All that's fine if you are trying to cultivate it for those uses but it's a nuisance otherwise. View Quote Yup, I kill it for my clients. But I use it at my house. |
Nobody ever wakes me at 2 in the morning telling me that my grass is out on the highway.~~Radiopat
Wine is sunlight held together by water~~Galileo Galilei Well-behaved women rarely make history~~Marilyn Monroe |
I'm looking forward to what others reply with, but where I live it is all clay under a thin top layer. Standing water is a thing for my "level" parts of my yard. There aren't many places that are level, but it is the solid clay under it that holds the water so well in my yard.
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Louis L'Amour, “To make democracy work, we must be a nation of participants, not simply observers. One who does not vote has no right to complain.”
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Originally Posted By SWIRE: I'm getting standing water in my yard from my sprinklers and this is after I core aerated it this spring, added some pelletized gypsum, added sand, and then ran a drag over it. This is how many holes I made with the aerator. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/680/backyard_aerated2-3183435.jpg This was taken while running the sprinkler, so it should be wet but I don't understand how there is standing water just from the sprinklers after aerating it the way I did. Even an hour after turning off the sprinklers the ground makes a squishing noise as I walk on it. At this point is liquid Air8 needed? More core aeration? Top dressing with better quality soil since I have a lot of clay? https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/680/surface_water_JPG-3195164.jpg View Quote How long are you running the sprinklers for? You may need to set them up to cycle and soak. Run the sprinklers for a few min then let the water soak into the ground a set amount of time then rinse and repeat until you get the total amount of water down you want. I do this in my yard with my Rachio irrigation controller automatically which makes it dummy-proof but still needs fine tuning. It's mostly a trial and error thing where you'll need to see how long each zone takes to saturate the ground to the point you start observing water run-off. The goal being you only water that zone a limited time before you start observing water run-off or pooling then stop the zone and let it soak in 15/20/45 minutes or however long it takes for your soil, then start up the zone again. If you haven't already, it'd be a good idea to do what's referred to as a "tuna-can test" (a quick youtube search will come up with some videos on how to do it) - basically you want to measure how long it takes for each sprinkler zone to put down a measured amount of water then from that you can determine how long each zone should run based on what you are watering and how much water it needs. Hope this helps! ETA: There could also just be dips or grading issues in the yard as well which are more difficult to resolve. That could require re-grading or plumbing in drainage like catch basins or a french drain. |
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My main goal at this point is to get new grass seed to germinate and the baby grass to grow. If you look closely you can see the baby grass starting to up in the bare spots. I've done all I can to regrade, amend the soil, and aerate up to now. Standing water isn't deal breaking while trying to get the grass to germinate but once it is growing well I know the problem will continue. I bought a pull behind core aerator and will keep using it but clearly there is something else needed in the soil to get the water water to drain.
The sprinklers are manual at this point. I fire up a generator at the creek and just run them for hours at time. That day it had run about an hour when I took the picture. Not sure how much water was put down. That area would be covered by 1 sprinkler head that shoots out a 40' arc of water. |
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Originally Posted By SWIRE: My main goal at this point is to get new grass seed to germinate and the baby grass to grow. If you look closely you can see the baby grass starting to up in the bare spots. I've done all I can to regrade, amend the soil, and aerate up to now. Standing water isn't deal breaking while trying to get the grass to germinate but once it is growing well I know the problem will continue. I bought a pull behind core aerator and will keep using it but clearly there is something else needed in the soil to get the water water to drain. The sprinklers are manual at this point. I fire up a generator at the creek and just run them for hours at time. That day it had run about an hour when I took the picture. Not sure how much water was put down. That area would be covered by 1 sprinkler head that shoots out a 40' arc of water. View Quote Gotchya. I would still probably water in shorter intervals with some soaking time in between. Leaving it on for the full hour is just saturating the top of the soil and not letting it soak in. Clay takes much longer to soak up water but it does hold water remarkably well. While it's not the exact same as my in-ground irrigation, the premise is still relevant. We have clay soil here and I only run my sprinklers in 5-10 min intervals max at a time with about a 30 min soak time. It's just the nature of clay soils and the only way to really change soil profile will be over a long period of time with frequent soil amendments. |
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You are going to need to add organic material and possibly gypsum and it will be an ongoing thing. Sand can become counter productive in clay.
Here us a little read i found. https://extension.oregonstate.edu/news/diamonds-clay-soils-are-forever#:~:text=%E2%80%9CNo%20amount%20of%20sand%20added,as%20the%20potter Explaining why a soil test is needed to figure out if gypsum will actually work on your soil chemistry. Stop Applying Gypsum For Clay Soil & Lawns - Lawn Care How To |
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