I have a 1949 8N that was smoking VERY bad so I decided it was time for a rebuild. I was just going to hone the cylinders and re-ring the pistons until I found the crack in the #2 cylinder combustion chamber, intake valve.....The area where it was cracked was carboned up and I didnt find the crack until I was cleaning everything up. I know the crack isnt the reason it was smoking. Can something like this be fixed or repaired? The engine itself is a VERY low compression, low horsepower (23hp) engine.

Here is a pic of the crack...

it can be fixed a couple of different ways.

since it appears to be a flat head I am a little stumped on which way is best.

some people would cut into the crack and reweld. requires a special rod though for cast iron. AND, not sure how a 48 block compares to a 68 block (last time I looked into it) nickel content wise.

The other choice is sort of a sleeve. they cut the full ring out and then press/weld another piece in to cover where the crack is in the seat.
problem with that is how close the cylinder wall (which already looks sleeved) is.

I would take pics and drag that around to a few machine shops and engine builders. and point out it is a flat head, and they are looking at the block in the pics, not a head.

I can only think of furnace brazing, which is a pretty big deal.

What about using a dremel to cut a groove into the crack then brazing with a brass rod?  Its just a thought i just had...

Big cracks in cast iron block can be drilled along the crack. Then tapped and a bolt put in one at a time. After that it is milled out to speck. I do not remember it being done on a combustion chamber.

 

Its called lock-n-stitch and I have never heard of it being done in an combustion chamber either...

Any sleeve options available?

quote= The other choice is sort of a sleeve. they cut the full ring out and then press STAKE another piece in to cover where the crack is in the seat.

been there done that , our shop (school) had a tool like a lathe bit went into the valve guide hole , was turned with a heavy drill , new seat in freezer , taped in place , staked and reground for a new valve.

How good did the sleeve in the valve pocket hold up?  I have never heard of that option...

So far.....I have had no luck. Either they are WAY expensive or they are in need of repair of some kind. The only other option is to buy a parts tractor and you still dont know what you will end up with until you tare it down. Hell it could be worse than what I already have

I had the head welded up in my 72" Toyota Land Cruiser due to a crack in the valve seat area. One of the gents that worked at Dads place of work [Aeroquip] who was a heck of a welder did it, wouldn't guarantee it but after owning it for another 5 years, it was sold still running perfectly.

Since this is a valve in block I don't know if you could still make it work, I know he brought the head up to a couple hundred degrees in an oven before he started welding on it.

Actually its a new valve seat installed into a pocket cut into the block
permanent. Lots of engines are built that way today.
You would need to call around and see if anyone local can do it.

Look around , there still fixin them.

parts here

Years:  1939-52


Flat Head Cylinder Head Complete And Ready To
Install. Comparable To OEM In Quality, Materials And Construction.Fits
Tractors: 9N, 2N, 8N.


$185





http://www.just8ns.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=10&products_id=460

 

Thanks for the link but the crack is in the block, not the head.....Hell I wish it was the head, that would be an easy fix

Mate flathead means valves in block not head.

Thanks for the link! I added it to my favorites

Damn...I wasted post 1776 on this

I had the cylinder head on Caterpillar 3406 diesel



<<<<<––––––––––-



repaired in this fashion.



Several cracks between and thru valve seats.



So far, has lasted for over 150,000 miles.



http://www.locknstitch.com/



Seems to be an excellent process, but like any repair situation, the skill of the

technician is paramount.



Find an expert.

These forum guys helped me out alot w/ an 8N


http://www.mytractorforum.com/forumdisplay.php?f=38

Thanks! I just registered

Look into a Ford Flathead V8 conversion for the 8n.  Kits are still available IIRC

I would but they are expensive and this tractor is for working/shredding/plowing. Its not going to be "restored" just worked like a dog.

My brother used to weld cast iron cylinder heads I can call him tomorrow and ask him if he thinks the place he used to work could fit a block in their oven. That process would probably mean a complete tear down though.

Eta:http://www.tristatecylinderhead.com/index.php?main_page=contact_us

Try contacting them but I doubt it would be a cheap fix especially having to ship. Good luck.

Lock n stitch is your best option for repair- if it's needed. I'd have the block pressure tested before I committed to repair, because a real repair is going to entail removing the sleeve for that cylinder, and the valve seat. Once you're that far, you may as well pop for a full valve job and have the cylinders honed, etc and so forth.

I have used the lock n stitch system regularly in a previous lifetime, and it works, but don't go fixing problems that aint necessarily problems.

There's a guy in Stateville, NC who has a business fixing old tractors I had to have a crank repaired once and he said that there is nothing he can't fix since there are no parts for the old tractors he works on. I am sure its not worth sending your block to him but he could tell you the best way to fix it. His business is call Jeff's antique truck and tractor repair I won't be home for a few days but will try to post the number when I get home.

found his card in my wallet heres the number

Jeffs Truck & Tractor Repair
2829 S Chipley Ford Road
Statesville, NC 28625-8714
Phone: (704) 876-4677

Thanks, I will call Monday and see what he says

I emailed your picture to my brother this is his reply. About the possibility of welding it.

Thanks for the help. Im gonna pull the sleeve this week and see how far down the cylinder wall the crack goes. I will update this thread with pics when I do.

this is an interesting thread.

cast iron block will need preheat, interpass, and post heat after welding.... to do it right.  

don't know how long / heavy the front half of the tractor / block is, but it will need some specialized handling.  

any chance if the smoking before teardown was white (ie. coolant getting into the chamber)?

see it is sleeved.  is this common for your tractor or Ford's in general?

any other cylinder's sleeved?      

one thing you still may have a hard time noting is how far down the crack goes, even after you pull the sleeve.  

did you do a leak down test on the cooling system?


just a thought.... does this area leak?  does this affect engine performance?  can you live with it as it is?    



ps: our family has done these repairs before on flat heads but on other easy parts of the block.  we've cut drums in half and used charcoal for heat treating, temp crayons, and a lot of praying was used.  a couple years ago, we did a repair on an '79 kabuta tractor block where a lift point for the bucket separated from the block.  
the old man asked me to do the job as he is getting up there in age - I refused because the block wasn't stripped/prepared like it should have.  

well Dad ran out to the local "bitch store" (everytime he comes from there, he bitches about them), AKA welding supply store, and bought Ni-Rod @ 8 rods for $38.  After grinding a root, he sticked it and as of today it still holds up for it's owner.