I never knew that about Hagee and his wife, but there are issues with Charles Stanley as well............he is divorced ( which in and of itself isnt a problem) but from what I have been told and heard he will not marry anyone who has been divorced, while being divorced himself.  

John Hehge is the real deal IMO. Tells - preaches - it like the bible says. Doesn't try to candy coat it to keep from offending. He's a true southern baptist *preacher* lime they should be, and like I haven't been able to find since I moved away from home in eastern KY. They are all motivational speakers up here in central KY. Id watch John Heghe every day if he was on.

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Jesus told his disciples "Do not procure for yourself gold or silver. You received free, give free." In short, ministers are to have regular jobs as the disciples did and everyone else. They are not supposed to make money from  preaching.

Even if he's teaching something to thousands of other people that is flatly contradicted by scripture?

Maybe I'm just being overly picky, but it's the way he does it that rubs me the wrong way. It's not unlike an atheist saying "Going to church is boring and it means you miss football games. Life is more enjoyable if you suppose there is no God". If someone calls themselves an atheist with that kind of basis ("I don't like silly rules"), then I'm kind of forced to wonder whether or not he really believes what he says he does.



And if a Christian lives his life on the idea that a love of Jesus will bring him prosperity on this earth, and less suffering, I also must question the sincerity of his belief. It's a lousy foundation. Is there such a thing as a CINO?



I'll let people a lot smarter than me opine on that last one, but the whole thing just rubs me the wrong way. From my perspective, what he's doing isn't abjectly harmful, it's just strikes me as...less than honest. It's sales, not evangelism.



 

He is instructing his viewers to find a Bible-based church to get involved with.  His viewers are probably not receiving the bulk of their spiritual teaching from him, IMO.

Divorce is a touchy subject. Suffice to say I think most evangelicals are 'off' on the issue, and the SBC contains a lot of the worst offenders.

1 Timothy 3 is the classic passage on the qualifications for church leadership.

Here's what it says:



Here's what we have caricatured it into:

-A preacher must claim to have a calling from God and woe unto anyone who doubts him
-He must never have been divorced, no matter the circumstances, though he can neglect his family for 'ministry' and be lauded for it.
-His kids can be hellions from day 1 and we can't speak a word against it
-No experience necessary, especially if he's left his local church and got a seminary degree that gave him -0- experience in real ministry
-He must never, ever drink a beer, even on hot summer days


I could get on a soapbox here...suffice to say, I believe I can demonstrate from Scripture that the majority of pastors, elders, and deacons in modern evangelical churches are unqualified or disqualified based on either an inability to teach, character issues, or inability to lead their families, and, worse, the vast majority of evangelicals have no real grasp of what Biblical leadership looks like.  

That would do no good.

<arowneragain stops, breathes into paper bag, then continues slowly>

To answer Stanley's position directly, well, I have no huge issue with it. I disagree with his position, but respect it...he's opposed to second marriages. That's fine. I think he's wrong, but it wouldn't stop me from calling him 'brother'. If he made it an issue of church membership (i.e. threatened expulsion to someone who was 'innocently' divorced and sought remarriage elsewhere) then I'd take exception to it, but if he simply won't perform the ceremony himself, well, I can respect that and agree to disagree.


Now, to throw a wrench in all that.....it's my understanding that many people believe Stanley's wife left him because he neglected her for the sake of the ministry. If that is true, then he shouldn't be in the pulpit himself,,,,however, I don't know whether it's true, and have no desire to delve into other people's dirty laundry.

Never heard of Hagee, but Osteen is definitely a fraud.  In fact, I pretty much put anyone who preaches the so-called "prosperity Gospel" into the fraud category.  That whole "Jesus wants you to be rich" thing is about totally anathema to what Christ taught.

For instance, a big-box/mall/mega church here in town is headed by an "apostle" and his wife.  They've both had plenty of plastic surgery and live in a pretty substantial mansion on an umpteen-acre estate here in town.  I talked to the guy who installed their home theater––it cost $50,000, and the installer was impressed by the Italian and Japanese gardens on the manor's grounds.  These guys have only one objective, and it's not saving souls.  It's fleecing them.

Ehhh...hold on. All his heresy aside, Hagee isn't a Southern Baptist.

Preaching rubs me the wrong way, regardless of who does it (politicians, motivational speakers, Oprah) and being on tv makes it worse. The people you listed may be less icky, but I'd probably still find them icky.

Not true. since he holds himself as a 'teacher' and 'preacher' There is a bible verse that talks about teachers being held to a higher standard. One absolutely should question whether the teachings of someone (anyone) jive with what is taught in the bible. There are some things that Christians can agree to disagree on, but other tenets of theology are not.





 

Jas 3:1  My brethren, be not many masters, knowing that we shall receive the greater condemnation. (KJV)

Or in a modern-english translation:

Jas 3:1  Let not many of you become teachers, my brethren, knowing that as such we will incur a stricter judgment.(NASB)
Jas 3:1  Not many of you should become teachers, my brothers, for you know that we who teach will be judged with greater strictness. (ESV)

It's a sobering thought.....it's one thing to be misled, or to misunderstand doctrinal issues. It's quite another thing to go around misleading others.

I think his comments on the Prosperity Gospel are appropriate here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PTc_FoELt8s

I'd rather listen to Benny Hinn. He seems a lot more sincere.

Did someone mention Hinn in a thread about Hagee?

The plot thickens...



 

I like the message, I'm not sure about his style.

I don't know what to think about TV evangelists sometimes. I'm not to crazy about them.
But some of them are very sincere. My wife's uncle is a retired Church of Christ minister that got rich after he retired. His wife and he inherited a large number of mineral right deeds in Texas. They were bringing in 7 figures a month for a while.
He pays for a 30 minute broadcast out of his own pocket every Sunday morning where he and one of his friends discuss matters out of the Bible.
He doesn't ask for money, he just tries to bring the Holy Spirit into the lives of those who want to listen.
You can only pray and ask for divine guidance to seek the truth and the real Holy Spirit when you listen to some TV preacher.
If you're sincere, your prayer will be answered.

It is my feeling that a divorced man is eligible to be a pastor.

However, if a divorced man remarries while his ex-wife still lives then he is then no longer eligible.

A widower who remarried or a divorced man who's ex-wife no longer lives is a different situation and is still eligible.  Bible says, "Husband of one wife."

I'd contend (between friends, and not to be argumentative) that the phrase 'husband of one wife' does NOT mean 'only one living wife at a time' necessarily, but means 'he's a one-woman kind of man'.

Man who is wrongfully abandoned by his wife and later seeks remarriage: Husband of one wife.
Man who kills his wife and then remarries: Not husband of one wife.
Man who even breaks an engagement for selfish reasons then marries another: not husband of one wife
Man who divorces his wife without cause, or with weak cause and without trying every means of reconciliation: not husband of one wife.

The crux of the matter, for me, is the man's faithfulness to those he has been given a responsibility to, and not what others do beyond his control.

Seems like a great job to me,spin a web of bullshit all day,make a bunch of money tax free without really working....I'll take that job,when do I start?

Olsteen makes his dough "selling" the old "success through tithing" spiel.  I am NOT against tithing, nor scripture pertaining to it...but guys like Olsteen are using it to line their pockets and their bank accounts.



Hagee makes HIS money by selling "THE END IS NIGH!!!" CRAP, just like the Global Warming loonies.  The old "the End is a GREAT Means to an End" thing has been around as long as the tithing scam.  Hal Lindsey has scammed MILLIONS off of this stuff.



I am NOT criticising Scripture, the Apostles or serious Men and Women of God, but I have been around preachers all of my life.  I've personally met TWO that were men that were worth a shit.



I suspect the rest are going to hell right along with me.





So be it.

hagee is a fire and brimstone kind of guy.  osteen is a joke.  they both focus on one thing, and forget the fact that God gave us free will and that he's not going to reward everyone with riches, either in the spirit or wealth.  people take both of these jokers too seriously.

The End is nigh.....And there is prosperity in following after Jesus.
But.... nether one of those subjects defines a life changed by Jesus Christ.
And neither one of those subjects is as simply defined as these two men make it seem.

The Bible never tells every follower of Jesus to expect physical health and wealth but that some will even endure trials and suffering.
The Bible doesn't tell followers of Jesus to only focus on the end but act and serve in the here and now....go into the world and make disciples.

This s the problem when we focus on a single aspect of Truth to the detriment to the complete picture.
Jesus message to the sinner is far more life changing than simply get rich quick and then focus on the end of time.

this thread needs more Benny Hinn

Ditto