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Posted: 10/18/2016 9:16:41 PM EDT
[#1]
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Very interesting, thanks for posting that. I can't remember the science fiction work that dealt with an alien intelligence that had no consciousness. But it's an interesting idea. It's interesting to think that what we think of as consciousness is a fairly recent "software upgrade". That might explain why human civilization only recently took off. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Interesting read on the bicameral mind. It was specifically mentioned in Ep3, but is also the title of Ep10...... https://www.inverse.com/article/14264-bicameral-mind-westworld-julian-jaynes-origin-of-consciousness-hbo Very interesting, thanks for posting that. I can't remember the science fiction work that dealt with an alien intelligence that had no consciousness. But it's an interesting idea. It's interesting to think that what we think of as consciousness is a fairly recent "software upgrade". That might explain why human civilization only recently took off. Old mans war had a race that had no consciousness. A human created it for them and it allowed humanity to make a deal with their race. |
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Posted: 10/18/2016 9:20:20 PM EDT
[#2]
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So anyone notice the scene where the gunfighter shot at those masked cannibals and his gun didn't do anything? Does that indicate that those were actually people? Remember the black dude who said to his buddies that they should get outside of town "where the real deplorable stuff" goes on? I'm thinking they took the bait from an 'evil' host to go on an evil quest. |
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Posted: 10/18/2016 9:30:41 PM EDT
[#3]
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So anyone notice the scene where the gunfighter shot at those masked cannibals and his gun didn't do anything? Does that indicate that those were actually people? My thought exactly. |
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Posted: 10/19/2016 6:05:44 AM EDT
[#4]
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My thought exactly. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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So anyone notice the scene where the gunfighter shot at those masked cannibals and his gun didn't do anything? Does that indicate that those were actually people? My thought exactly. They could also be rogue hosts whose programming has changed, and they are improvising based on a combination of all their previous story lines. In episode 2 there was one that went off script and killed other hosts like it had a grudge based on previous roles. Regarding why they didn't die, if you recall the same one that went off script was shot several times and kept running. When it drank milk, the milk leaked out of all the bullet holes. When they are running right, they might shut down when they record damage, otherwise they could keep running until they lose enough fluids or are hit in a critical place such as the heart or head. |
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Posted: 10/19/2016 6:30:58 AM EDT
[#5]
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She liked her shotguns, went from a Winchester 1887 to an 1897 and sprayed some lead. http://www.imfdb.org/images/thumb/7/71/WestS1E01_22.jpg/600px-WestS1E01_22.jpg. http://images6.fanpop.com/image/photos/38700000/Ingrid-Bols-Berda-ingrid-bols-C3-B8-berdal-38719193-2313-3000.jpg Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Posting the characters names and actor - to help me from getting confused... Feel free to make corrections. Dr Robert Ford - Anthony Hopkins // park founder, creative director Dolores Abernathy - Evan Rachel Wood // oldest host in the park Teddy Flood - James Marsden // host, Dolores romantic interest Maeve Millay - Thandie Newton // prostitute house mom Clementine Pennyfeather - Angela Sarafyan // prostitute Armistice - Ingrid Bolsø Berdal // Hectors sidekick girl with the guns Theresa Cullen - Sidse Babett Knudsen // operations manager Bernard Lowe - Jeffrey Wright (aka black science man and/or Bond CIA dude) // head programmer Elsie Hughes - Shannon Woodward // engineer (she kissed the Clementine host) Lee Sizemore - Simon Quarterman // head story writer Hector Escaton - Rodrigo Santoro // most wanted guy The Man in Black - Ed Harris (aka The Gunslinger) // main antagonist? Ashley Stubbs - Luke Hemsworth // head of security There are some good looking women on this show. Armistice cleaned up is a hottie Norwegian. She liked her shotguns, went from a Winchester 1887 to an 1897 and sprayed some lead. http://www.imfdb.org/images/thumb/7/71/WestS1E01_22.jpg/600px-WestS1E01_22.jpg. http://images6.fanpop.com/image/photos/38700000/Ingrid-Bols-Berda-ingrid-bols-C3-B8-berdal-38719193-2313-3000.jpg Ok I was gonna wait until the end of the season to binge watch. But that blonde changed my mind. Txl |
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Posted: 10/19/2016 6:47:41 AM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Ok I was gonna wait until the end of the season to binge watch. But that blonde changed my mind. Txl Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Posting the characters names and actor - to help me from getting confused... Feel free to make corrections. Dr Robert Ford - Anthony Hopkins // park founder, creative director Dolores Abernathy - Evan Rachel Wood // oldest host in the park Teddy Flood - James Marsden // host, Dolores romantic interest Maeve Millay - Thandie Newton // prostitute house mom Clementine Pennyfeather - Angela Sarafyan // prostitute Armistice - Ingrid Bolsø Berdal // Hectors sidekick girl with the guns Theresa Cullen - Sidse Babett Knudsen // operations manager Bernard Lowe - Jeffrey Wright (aka black science man and/or Bond CIA dude) // head programmer Elsie Hughes - Shannon Woodward // engineer (she kissed the Clementine host) Lee Sizemore - Simon Quarterman // head story writer Hector Escaton - Rodrigo Santoro // most wanted guy The Man in Black - Ed Harris (aka The Gunslinger) // main antagonist? Ashley Stubbs - Luke Hemsworth // head of security There are some good looking women on this show. Armistice cleaned up is a hottie Norwegian. She liked her shotguns, went from a Winchester 1887 to an 1897 and sprayed some lead. http://www.imfdb.org/images/thumb/7/71/WestS1E01_22.jpg/600px-WestS1E01_22.jpg. http://images6.fanpop.com/image/photos/38700000/Ingrid-Bols-Berda-ingrid-bols-C3-B8-berdal-38719193-2313-3000.jpg Ok I was gonna wait until the end of the season to binge watch. But that blonde changed my mind. Txl She was in the preview as well. Looks like she is getting a speaking role. |
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Posted: 10/19/2016 9:16:18 AM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
They could also be rogue hosts whose programming has changed, and they are improvising based on a combination of all their previous story lines. In episode 2 there was one that went off script and killed other hosts like it had a grudge based on previous roles. Regarding why they didn't die, if you recall the same one that went off script was shot several times and kept running. When it drank milk, the milk leaked out of all the bullet holes. When they are running right, they might shut down when they record damage, otherwise they could keep running until they lose enough fluids or are hit in a critical place such as the heart or head. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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So anyone notice the scene where the gunfighter shot at those masked cannibals and his gun didn't do anything? Does that indicate that those were actually people? My thought exactly. They could also be rogue hosts whose programming has changed, and they are improvising based on a combination of all their previous story lines. In episode 2 there was one that went off script and killed other hosts like it had a grudge based on previous roles. Regarding why they didn't die, if you recall the same one that went off script was shot several times and kept running. When it drank milk, the milk leaked out of all the bullet holes. When they are running right, they might shut down when they record damage, otherwise they could keep running until they lose enough fluids or are hit in a critical place such as the heart or head. In the Westworld subreddit presented as a forum for players, one of the Guests asks if anyone has ever encountered a Host which requires a headshot. He theorizes that there was a zombie storyline. Link left cold. https://www.reddit.com/r/WestworldForums/comments/5816p0/has_anyone_encountered_hosts_that_glitched_out/ |
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Posted: 10/19/2016 10:23:54 AM EDT
[#8]
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Maybe Ed harris is the next level. When you get far to the edges of the park you run into Ed Harris. Ed Harris was the original synth given consciousness. He can't ever leave the park because he is a synth and they just programed him to be searching for something. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I think Ed Harris is the "Arnold" guy Ford was speaking of...... Or one of Arnold's original creations that achieved the goal of complete consciousness. Maybe Ed harris is the next level. When you get far to the edges of the park you run into Ed Harris. Ed Harris was the original synth given consciousness. He can't ever leave the park because he is a synth and they just programed him to be searching for something. I'm not buying him being anything other than a guest. When he smoked the cousins and wife of the guy (that always plays an annoying lowlife character in every movie), the park employees make a comment about a guest doing a lot of damage. I'm curious as to why he hasn't been mentioned by anyone though, because they seem to keep pretty close tabs on everyone. As far as the cannibals go, I think they are guests. I also think that Thandie's scalping nightmare, is memories of guests playing renegade Indians. |
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Posted: 10/19/2016 11:43:08 AM EDT
[#9]
As far as the cannibals go, I think they are guests. I also think that Thandie's scalping nightmare, is memories of guests playing renegade Indians. Wasn't it mentioned that Delores' father (the one they put away in storage) had been at one time been used in a cult story line? He was put away because he was showing signs of a composite personality drawn from parts of all the previous characters he played. This seems to be happening to several characters, remembering previous story lines. I could see the crazies in the hills as being glitched hosts. |
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Posted: 10/19/2016 11:49:44 AM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Maybe Ed harris is the next level. When you get far to the edges of the park you run into Ed Harris. Ed Harris was the original synth given consciousness. He can't ever leave the park because he is a synth and they just programed him to be searching for something. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I think Ed Harris is the "Arnold" guy Ford was speaking of...... Or one of Arnold's original creations that achieved the goal of complete consciousness. Maybe Ed harris is the next level. When you get far to the edges of the park you run into Ed Harris. Ed Harris was the original synth given consciousness. He can't ever leave the park because he is a synth and they just programed him to be searching for something. I think Ed Harris's character is a human that wants to become an android. The maze he's looking for is probably the network of service tunnels we've already seen. Ed Harris stated that once he finds it, he's going to stay in westworld, and never leave. So, I think he's an old guest, maybe someone related to the project like Dr. Ford's old partner, who wants immortality by transferring his consciousness to a copy of himself. Once he does, he'd be the perfect Yul Brynner android from the Old Westworld. A living person that wants to become an android to escape old age and death. OR ....he is already an Android, a copy of Dr. Ford's old partner, who died 30 years ago, and because of who he was is given a higher set of abilities than the other androids. Only he doesn't know it. Through the maze he'll learn the truth about himself. That he's already a "permanent guest" of Westword. A machine that doesn't know it's a machine. |
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Posted: 10/19/2016 12:23:17 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Wasn't it mentioned that Delores' father (the one they put away in storage) had been at one time been used in a cult story line? He was put away because he was showing signs of a composite personality drawn from parts of all the previous characters he played. This seems to be happening to several characters, remembering previous story lines. I could see the crazies in the hills as being glitched hosts. Quote HistoryQuoted:
As far as the cannibals go, I think they are guests. I also think that Thandie's scalping nightmare, is memories of guests playing renegade Indians. Wasn't it mentioned that Delores' father (the one they put away in storage) had been at one time been used in a cult story line? He was put away because he was showing signs of a composite personality drawn from parts of all the previous characters he played. This seems to be happening to several characters, remembering previous story lines. I could see the crazies in the hills as being glitched hosts. I agree, I believe this is part of the spreading malfunction tied to Dr. Ford's "reveries" code. Subtle things like Teddy's intro scene on the train always being the same except after he got shot. The next intro scene he reached under his jacket and rubbed his torso where he was shot the previous night. This also makes me believe that Thandie's visions of an indian raid are in fact her . . . AI subconscious or whatever they're going to call it accessing deleted but not overwritten narratives in her memory storage. I'm linking this to the same malfunction that caused Walter to shoot all the hosts in the bar that he'd been killed by in previous narratives. And it's all somehow tied to Dr. Ford's "deceased" partner from 30 years ago and the hosts that have been seemingly talking to a "Arnold" that isn't there. ETA: Maybe some code that Arnold put in 30 years ago in an effort to achieve true AI is interacting in an unexpected way with the "reveries" code? |
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Posted: 10/19/2016 1:02:33 PM EDT
[#12]
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1) did anyone else catch the universal globe in the terminal on sub level 87 (or where ever the hell they went)? Haven't read through the whole thread, just got caught up to episode 2. That globe says "Delos" on the side, the original name for the resort in the original movie. I assumed the cold storage area is the original welcome center based on the globe and escalators. Looks like the Futureworld set maybe. |
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Posted: 10/19/2016 1:43:15 PM EDT
[#13]
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Digging the show but I find the writing to be distractingly imitative of other movies. Those cannibal zombie skin wearing guys are right out of Bone Tomahawk. The other thing that bugged me was when the bad guy said Dolores was probably ""as juicy as a freshwater clam." That line is verbatim from Pale Rider. Were they paying homage to it, or being lazy and cribbing the expression? Crichton later wrote that since "most of the situations in the film are cliches; they are incidents out of hundreds of old movies" that the scenes "should be shot as cliches. This dictated a conventional treatment in the choice of lenses and the staging |
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Posted: 10/19/2016 2:16:20 PM EDT
[#14]
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Posted: 10/19/2016 2:26:53 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Berard told Delores if she could make it through the maze, she would be free. This could be a physical maze, like the structure underneath the park, or it could be a metaphoric maze or game that requires you to interract in certain ways with characters to get hints on becoming self aware. The maze could be part of an 'underground railroad" for synths. |
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Posted: 10/19/2016 3:50:09 PM EDT
[#16]
OMG I just realized what fate befell the partner.
Fava beans and Chianti. |
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Posted: 10/19/2016 3:59:13 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I think Ed Harris's character is a human that wants to become an android. The maze he's looking for is probably the network of service tunnels we've already seen. Ed Harris stated that once he finds it, he's going to stay in westworld, and never leave. So, I think he's an old guest, maybe someone related to the project like Dr. Ford's old partner, who wants immortality by transferring his consciousness to a copy of himself. Once he does, he'd be the perfect Yul Brynner android from the Old Westworld. A living person that wants to become an android to escape old age and death. OR ....he is already an Android, a copy of Dr. Ford's old partner, who died 30 years ago, and because of who he was is given a higher set of abilities than the other androids. Only he doesn't know it. Through the maze he'll learn the truth about himself. That he's already a "permanent guest" of Westword. A machine that doesn't know it's a machine. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I think Ed Harris is the "Arnold" guy Ford was speaking of...... Or one of Arnold's original creations that achieved the goal of complete consciousness. Maybe Ed harris is the next level. When you get far to the edges of the park you run into Ed Harris. Ed Harris was the original synth given consciousness. He can't ever leave the park because he is a synth and they just programed him to be searching for something. I think Ed Harris's character is a human that wants to become an android. The maze he's looking for is probably the network of service tunnels we've already seen. Ed Harris stated that once he finds it, he's going to stay in westworld, and never leave. So, I think he's an old guest, maybe someone related to the project like Dr. Ford's old partner, who wants immortality by transferring his consciousness to a copy of himself. Once he does, he'd be the perfect Yul Brynner android from the Old Westworld. A living person that wants to become an android to escape old age and death. OR ....he is already an Android, a copy of Dr. Ford's old partner, who died 30 years ago, and because of who he was is given a higher set of abilities than the other androids. Only he doesn't know it. Through the maze he'll learn the truth about himself. That he's already a "permanent guest" of Westword. A machine that doesn't know it's a machine. But at the same time, he isn't damaged by park host bullets, as seen in the first episode gunfight with Teddy. My guess is he's a very longtime guest, very wealthy, and he gets deferential treatment from park management because of that. It's just that he's been there so many times, he's looking past the menagerie now, while still partaking in the alternate reality of the park. |
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Posted: 10/19/2016 4:10:37 PM EDT
[#18]
I think the Verbal Commands, which are supposed to be the last vestige of Arnold's code will be interesting to keep an eye on.
Bernard telling Dolores "Improvise" in her answers led to something very close to 'self-awareness'. And did anyone else think the Stray Woodcutter smashed his own noggin to destroy evidence? SWAT guy was going to cut off his head to get the CPU. I go back to what I said a few pages ago, I think there is an insurgency/religious uprising of some sort already working. That star chart and the maze drawings are the Jesus Fish for the movement, just like the early Christians. The raising in this episode of the bicameral mind and 'God Talking' cemented it for me. |
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Posted: 10/19/2016 4:40:11 PM EDT
[#19]
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OMG I just realized what fate befell the partner. Fava beans and Chianti. I had that thought watching that scene too. 
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Posted: 10/19/2016 5:05:25 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted: And did anyone else think the Stray Woodcutter smashed his own noggin to destroy evidence? SWAT guy was going to cut off his head to get the CPU. |
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Posted: 10/19/2016 5:20:59 PM EDT
[#21]
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Suicide. Driven mad my memories of past abuse. They may make a replacement model but it won't be "him." Quote HistoryQuoted:
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And did anyone else think the Stray Woodcutter smashed his own noggin to destroy evidence? SWAT guy was going to cut off his head to get the CPU. His actions were directed towards escaping from the Westworld employees - his drive to do so even overrode the sleep mode they put him in. When HSLD guy started to cut the host's head off, he responded with force, not necessarily to hurt HSLD guy, but to effect an escape. Then we thought he was going to smash the female tech with the boulder, but rather than harm her, he chose instead to destroy himself and whatever evidence he carried in his head. I'm curious to see if the data will be recoverable. |
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Posted: 10/19/2016 5:25:04 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I think the Verbal Commands, which are supposed to be the last vestige of Arnold's code will be interesting to keep an eye on. Bernard telling Dolores "Improvise" in her answers led to something very close to 'self-awareness'. And did anyone else think the Stray Woodcutter smashed his own noggin to destroy evidence? SWAT guy was going to cut off his head to get the CPU. I go back to what I said a few pages ago, I think there is an insurgency/religious uprising of some sort already working. That star chart and the maze drawings are the Jesus Fish for the movement, just like the early Christians. The raising in this episode of the bicameral mind and 'God Talking' cemented it for me. |
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Posted: 10/19/2016 5:34:25 PM EDT
[#23]
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I thought the same thing about the woodcutter. Someone (?) took him out of sleep mode to escape and told him to destroy his own head. Just like someone took the Madame out of sleep mode during surgery. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I think the Verbal Commands, which are supposed to be the last vestige of Arnold's code will be interesting to keep an eye on. Bernard telling Dolores "Improvise" in her answers led to something very close to 'self-awareness'. And did anyone else think the Stray Woodcutter smashed his own noggin to destroy evidence? SWAT guy was going to cut off his head to get the CPU. I go back to what I said a few pages ago, I think there is an insurgency/religious uprising of some sort already working. That star chart and the maze drawings are the Jesus Fish for the movement, just like the early Christians. The raising in this episode of the bicameral mind and 'God Talking' cemented it for me. More likely he wanted to make the voice in his head shut up |
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Posted: 10/19/2016 6:30:34 PM EDT
[#24]
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But at the same time, he isn't damaged by park host bullets, as seen in the first episode gunfight with Teddy. My guess is he's a very longtime guest, very wealthy, and he gets deferential treatment from park management because of that. It's just that he's been there so many times, he's looking past the menagerie now, while still partaking in the alternate reality of the park. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I think Ed Harris is the "Arnold" guy Ford was speaking of...... Or one of Arnold's original creations that achieved the goal of complete consciousness. Maybe Ed harris is the next level. When you get far to the edges of the park you run into Ed Harris. Ed Harris was the original synth given consciousness. He can't ever leave the park because he is a synth and they just programed him to be searching for something. I think Ed Harris's character is a human that wants to become an android. The maze he's looking for is probably the network of service tunnels we've already seen. Ed Harris stated that once he finds it, he's going to stay in westworld, and never leave. So, I think he's an old guest, maybe someone related to the project like Dr. Ford's old partner, who wants immortality by transferring his consciousness to a copy of himself. Once he does, he'd be the perfect Yul Brynner android from the Old Westworld. A living person that wants to become an android to escape old age and death. OR ....he is already an Android, a copy of Dr. Ford's old partner, who died 30 years ago, and because of who he was is given a higher set of abilities than the other androids. Only he doesn't know it. Through the maze he'll learn the truth about himself. That he's already a "permanent guest" of Westword. A machine that doesn't know it's a machine. But at the same time, he isn't damaged by park host bullets, as seen in the first episode gunfight with Teddy. My guess is he's a very longtime guest, very wealthy, and he gets deferential treatment from park management because of that. It's just that he's been there so many times, he's looking past the menagerie now, while still partaking in the alternate reality of the park. I don't know. If they can set up bullets not to affect guest, I would assume they could do it with androids. The vulnerability to weapons has to be programmable. Since they don't explain how that works, it's an ex machina box. We really don't know how the firearms work. .Obviously bullets make contact with guests, since we saw a guest get up after being shot, and we've seen bullets making contact with guest. So somehow the "bullet" turns unlethal to guest. So those have to be fairly fancy bullets. One that changes its properties depending on who it hits or is fired at. How that works I have no idea. But I can only assume that function is controllable. In the original Westworld, the firearms wouldn't fire a lethal shot at a human, and Yul Brynner's character was somehow able to change that safeguard, and kill humans. So it's not a stretch with this ex machina box to assume they could make an android impervious to bullets, just like guest are impervious to bullets. I'm leaning towards the theory that Ed Harris's character is "special" android. He's a copy of Dr. Ford's partner, who doesn't know he's a machine. I think the maze for him, is self discovery. He'll find out he's already a machine. |
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Posted: 10/19/2016 6:57:08 PM EDT
[#25]
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I don't know. If they can set up bullets not to affect guest, I would assume they could do it with androids. The vulnerability to weapons has to be programmable. Since they don't explain how that works, it's an ex machina box. We really don't know how the firearms work. .Obviously bullets make contact with guests, since we saw a guest get up after being shot, and we've seen bullets making contact with guest. So somehow the "bullet" turns unlethal to guest. So those have to be fairly fancy bullets. One that changes its properties depending on who it hits or is fired at. How that works I have no idea. But I can only assume that function is controllable. In the original Westworld, the firearms wouldn't fire a lethal shot at a human, and Yul Brynner's character was somehow able to change that safeguard, and kill humans. So it's not a stretch with this ex machina box to assume they could make an android impervious to bullets, just like guest are impervious to bullets. I'm leaning towards the theory that Ed Harris's character is "special" android. He's a copy of Dr. Ford's partner, who doesn't know he's a machine. I think the maze for him, is self discovery. He'll find out he's already a machine. I see the logic behind your theory, but all the park personnel believe he's a guest, or at least they haven't given an indication that they think he's anything but human. That said, Arnold is a pretty enigmatic character at this point - nobody but Ford knows about him, and the rest of the park personnel seem to have come on board after his departure. So maybe nobody really knows if hes an android or not except for Ford, as they purposefully didnt show Arnold in the flashback sequence with younger Ford. And maybe he does have the full Arnold algorithm, which is why he seems to be self aware and knows Westworld isnt real. |
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Posted: 10/19/2016 7:07:39 PM EDT
[#26]
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I see the logic behind your theory, but all the park personnel believe he's a guest, or at least they haven't given an indication that they think he's anything but human. That said, Arnold is a pretty enigmatic character at this point - nobody but Ford knows about him, and the rest of the park personnel seem to have come on board after his departure. So maybe nobody really knows if hes an android or not except for Ford, as they purposefully didnt show Arnold in the flashback sequence with younger Ford. And maybe he does have the full Arnold algorithm, which is why he seems to be self aware and knows Westworld isnt real. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I don't know. If they can set up bullets not to affect guest, I would assume they could do it with androids. The vulnerability to weapons has to be programmable. Since they don't explain how that works, it's an ex machina box. We really don't know how the firearms work. .Obviously bullets make contact with guests, since we saw a guest get up after being shot, and we've seen bullets making contact with guest. So somehow the "bullet" turns unlethal to guest. So those have to be fairly fancy bullets. One that changes its properties depending on who it hits or is fired at. How that works I have no idea. But I can only assume that function is controllable. In the original Westworld, the firearms wouldn't fire a lethal shot at a human, and Yul Brynner's character was somehow able to change that safeguard, and kill humans. So it's not a stretch with this ex machina box to assume they could make an android impervious to bullets, just like guest are impervious to bullets. I'm leaning towards the theory that Ed Harris's character is "special" android. He's a copy of Dr. Ford's partner, who doesn't know he's a machine. I think the maze for him, is self discovery. He'll find out he's already a machine. I see the logic behind your theory, but all the park personnel believe he's a guest, or at least they haven't given an indication that they think he's anything but human. That said, Arnold is a pretty enigmatic character at this point - nobody but Ford knows about him, and the rest of the park personnel seem to have come on board after his departure. So maybe nobody really knows if hes an android or not except for Ford, as they purposefully didnt show Arnold in the flashback sequence with younger Ford. And maybe he does have the full Arnold algorithm, which is why he seems to be self aware and knows Westworld isnt real. There is no doubt that Harris's character believes he's human. But I'm leaning towards the option that he's not. As far as the staff believing he's human, do we really know that. All we know is that one tech asked if " ...we should slow him down", and the other saying "special guests get what they want". There is absolutely no doubt that the Harris character is important, but we don't know that he's human. I think one of two possibilities explain him. Either he is a guest seeking immortality by being made into an android, OR, he is Ford's old partner who is already a machine, that isn't aware of this fact. The maze to him is either a gateway to becoming immortal, or of self-discovery. |
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Posted: 10/19/2016 8:06:28 PM EDT
[#27]
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Haven't read through the whole thread, just got caught up to episode 2. That globe says "Delos" on the side, the original name for the resort in the original movie. I assumed the cold storage area is the original welcome center based on the globe and escalators. Looks like the Futureworld set maybe. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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1) did anyone else catch the universal globe in the terminal on sub level 87 (or where ever the hell they went)? Haven't read through the whole thread, just got caught up to episode 2. That globe says "Delos" on the side, the original name for the resort in the original movie. I assumed the cold storage area is the original welcome center based on the globe and escalators. Looks like the Futureworld set maybe. I noticed that too. I would like to see more of the "old" complex. |
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Posted: 10/20/2016 6:53:00 AM EDT
[#28]
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I think the Verbal Commands, which are supposed to be the last vestige of Arnold's code will be interesting to keep an eye on. Bernard telling Dolores "Improvise" in her answers led to something very close to 'self-awareness'. And did anyone else think the Stray Woodcutter smashed his own noggin to destroy evidence? SWAT guy was going to cut off his head to get the CPU. I go back to what I said a few pages ago, I think there is an insurgency/religious uprising of some sort already working. That star chart and the maze drawings are the Jesus Fish for the movement, just like the early Christians. The raising in this episode of the bicameral mind and 'God Talking' cemented it for me. I'm thinking the same way about the woodcutter. He smashed his own head in to avoid recovery of information. Regarding the carving of Orion on his various carvings, that might lead the way to a part of the maze or puzzle clues, |
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Posted: 10/20/2016 8:30:12 AM EDT
[#29]
Something I forgot about. Anyone have a good shot of the star pattern? Which constellation did they say it was? If they show it again it might be a good way to tell if they are on earth or at least close.
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Posted: 10/20/2016 8:48:51 AM EDT
[#30]
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Something I forgot about. Anyone have a good shot of the star pattern? Which constellation did they say it was? If they show it again it might be a good way to tell if they are on earth or at least close. The constellation was Orion. |
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Posted: 10/20/2016 8:50:27 AM EDT
[#31]
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I'm thinking the same way about the woodcutter. He smashed his own head in to avoid recovery of information. Regarding the carving of Orion on his various carvings, that might lead the way to a part of the maze or puzzle clues, Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I think the Verbal Commands, which are supposed to be the last vestige of Arnold's code will be interesting to keep an eye on. Bernard telling Dolores "Improvise" in her answers led to something very close to 'self-awareness'. And did anyone else think the Stray Woodcutter smashed his own noggin to destroy evidence? SWAT guy was going to cut off his head to get the CPU. I go back to what I said a few pages ago, I think there is an insurgency/religious uprising of some sort already working. That star chart and the maze drawings are the Jesus Fish for the movement, just like the early Christians. The raising in this episode of the bicameral mind and 'God Talking' cemented it for me. I'm thinking the same way about the woodcutter. He smashed his own head in to avoid recovery of information. Regarding the carving of Orion on his various carvings, that might lead the way to a part of the maze or puzzle clues, And they commented that he was not programmed to look at stars. So he has improvised... improvisation. |
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Posted: 10/20/2016 8:51:43 AM EDT
[#32]
Since there are supposedly 5 years of shows drawn up, I'm hoping this thing turns into a Ringworld or something like that.
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Posted: 10/20/2016 10:08:36 AM EDT
[#33]
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Obviously, a resort like Westworld, would be very attractive to those with certain personality disorders, as well as psychopaths and sociopaths. It seems strange that in this day and age, the writers would associate homosexuality with those negative aspects of human behavior. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Is anyone else noticing all the homosexuality, or bisexuality, being portrayed in the show? That's pretty much a staple on several HBO. Showtime, and Starz series. It's part of character and story development at this time. It shows there are no rules there, and also shows that repeat customers come back for other reasons than playing cowboy. Obviously, a resort like Westworld, would be very attractive to those with certain personality disorders, as well as psychopaths and sociopaths. It seems strange that in this day and age, the writers would associate homosexuality with those negative aspects of human behavior. Hedonism |
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Posted: 10/21/2016 11:28:34 AM EDT
[#34]
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Hedonism Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Is anyone else noticing all the homosexuality, or bisexuality, being portrayed in the show? That's pretty much a staple on several HBO. Showtime, and Starz series. It's part of character and story development at this time. It shows there are no rules there, and also shows that repeat customers come back for other reasons than playing cowboy. Obviously, a resort like Westworld, would be very attractive to those with certain personality disorders, as well as psychopaths and sociopaths. It seems strange that in this day and age, the writers would associate homosexuality with those negative aspects of human behavior. Hedonism In the original film there was a section of the property called Roman World. Imagine the crazy pagan heathen stuff going on there! |
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Posted: 10/21/2016 3:41:52 PM EDT
[#35]
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In the original film there was a section of the property called Roman World. Imagine the crazy pagan heathen stuff going on there! butt stuff |
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Posted: 10/21/2016 3:49:13 PM EDT
[#36]
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There is no doubt that Harris's character believes he's human. But I'm leaning towards the option that he's not. As far as the staff believing he's human, do we really know that. All we know is that one tech asked if " ...we should slow him down", and the other saying "special guests get what they want". There is absolutely no doubt that the Harris character is important, but we don't know that he's human. I think one of two possibilities explain him. Either he is a guest seeking immortality by being made into an android, OR, he is Ford's old partner who is already a machine, that isn't aware of this fact. The maze to him is either a gateway to becoming immortal, or of self-discovery. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I don't know. If they can set up bullets not to affect guest, I would assume they could do it with androids. The vulnerability to weapons has to be programmable. Since they don't explain how that works, it's an ex machina box. We really don't know how the firearms work. .Obviously bullets make contact with guests, since we saw a guest get up after being shot, and we've seen bullets making contact with guest. So somehow the "bullet" turns unlethal to guest. So those have to be fairly fancy bullets. One that changes its properties depending on who it hits or is fired at. How that works I have no idea. But I can only assume that function is controllable. In the original Westworld, the firearms wouldn't fire a lethal shot at a human, and Yul Brynner's character was somehow able to change that safeguard, and kill humans. So it's not a stretch with this ex machina box to assume they could make an android impervious to bullets, just like guest are impervious to bullets. I'm leaning towards the theory that Ed Harris's character is "special" android. He's a copy of Dr. Ford's partner, who doesn't know he's a machine. I think the maze for him, is self discovery. He'll find out he's already a machine. I see the logic behind your theory, but all the park personnel believe he's a guest, or at least they haven't given an indication that they think he's anything but human. That said, Arnold is a pretty enigmatic character at this point - nobody but Ford knows about him, and the rest of the park personnel seem to have come on board after his departure. So maybe nobody really knows if hes an android or not except for Ford, as they purposefully didnt show Arnold in the flashback sequence with younger Ford. And maybe he does have the full Arnold algorithm, which is why he seems to be self aware and knows Westworld isnt real. There is no doubt that Harris's character believes he's human. But I'm leaning towards the option that he's not. As far as the staff believing he's human, do we really know that. All we know is that one tech asked if " ...we should slow him down", and the other saying "special guests get what they want". There is absolutely no doubt that the Harris character is important, but we don't know that he's human. I think one of two possibilities explain him. Either he is a guest seeking immortality by being made into an android, OR, he is Ford's old partner who is already a machine, that isn't aware of this fact. The maze to him is either a gateway to becoming immortal, or of self-discovery. All I can say in response to your possible scenarios is that I am really looking forward to seeing this story unfold. HBO hasn't had a show this good since True Detective Season 1. |
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Posted: 10/21/2016 9:26:41 PM EDT
[#37]
The more I watch this show the more I like it.
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Posted: 10/23/2016 11:54:31 AM EDT
[#38]
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The more I watch this show the more I like it. It has richness and depth and rewatching episodes to look for missed details is entertaining. I think it's got legs. |
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Posted: 10/23/2016 9:22:25 PM EDT
[#39]
The Cure's A Forest on the player piano this week.
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Posted: 10/23/2016 10:04:53 PM EDT
[#40]
Pretty good episode. Things are unfolding nicely. Can't wait to see next episode. Hopkins and Harris have a interesting conversation.
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Posted: 10/24/2016 12:30:22 AM EDT
[#41]
Sooner or later I think Bernard is going to find out he himself is a synth.
I'm getting a Tyrell/Rachael vibe from his interactions with Ford. |
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Posted: 10/24/2016 12:54:10 AM EDT
[#42]
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Pretty good episode. Things are unfolding nicely. Can't wait to see next episode. Hopkins and Harris have a interesting conversation. Yes, it was. The writers did a pretty damn good job. |
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Posted: 10/24/2016 12:56:01 AM EDT
[#43]
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Sooner or later I think Bernard is going to find out he himself is a synth. I'm getting a Tyrell/Rachael vibe from his interactions with Ford. I did as well. I had a wild idea that perhaps many, if not all, the workers are synths. |
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Posted: 10/24/2016 7:18:22 AM EDT
[#44]
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I did as well. I had a wild idea that perhaps many, if not all, the workers are synths. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Sooner or later I think Bernard is going to find out he himself is a synth. I'm getting a Tyrell/Rachael vibe from his interactions with Ford. I did as well. I had a wild idea that perhaps many, if not all, the workers are synths. That could be why Ford left out the third tier on the pyramid he drew when talking about Arnolds' theory of what is required to develop consciousness in a host. |
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Posted: 10/24/2016 7:20:59 AM EDT
[#45]
Am I the only one that thinks that Bernard isn't actually meeting with Dolores and that those are dreams manifested by the code Arnold put in?
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Posted: 10/24/2016 7:59:45 AM EDT
[#46]
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Am I the only one that thinks that Bernard isn't actually meeting with Dolores and that those are dreams manifested by the code Arnold put in? That's quite possible Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile |
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Posted: 10/24/2016 8:30:41 AM EDT
[#47]
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That's quite possible Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Am I the only one that thinks that Bernard isn't actually meeting with Dolores and that those are dreams manifested by the code Arnold put in? That's quite possible Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile Hadnt thought of that, but it doesn't sound unlikely. Only prediction / pure guess I'm going to take is the Human "Good Guy" that is helping Delores is going to die. Just seems like any time HBO makes someone out to be good, and really tries to get the audience to like them they kill them off... Or maybe I'm just watching too much GOT lol |
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Posted: 10/24/2016 9:28:15 AM EDT
[#48]
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That could be why Ford left out the third tier on the pyramid he drew when talking about Arnolds' theory of what is required to develop consciousness in a host. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Sooner or later I think Bernard is going to find out he himself is a synth. I'm getting a Tyrell/Rachael vibe from his interactions with Ford. I did as well. I had a wild idea that perhaps many, if not all, the workers are synths. That could be why Ford left out the third tier on the pyramid he drew when talking about Arnolds' theory of what is required to develop consciousness in a host. I don't know, I think that maybe we're reading too much into it, the "Lost" effect, where we automatically assume that the show writers are intentionally attempting to deceive us into thinking something isn't what it seems. Take for example Ed Harris' character, he at first gave clues that he was a longtime guest, that he was a VIP and therefore got deference from the park staff. I thought that was what he was, and then we (me included) started the speculation of if he was a robot, etc., but then we learned last night that he was indeed a longtime, very wealthy, VIP guest. It's like Nic Pizzolatto said, that we've been abused as an audience for so long, we assume they're trying to trick us, so we come up with ideas instead of letting the story unfold. Sure it's an enigmatic show, but I don't get the feeling they're trying to trick us. Time will tell though. |
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Posted: 10/24/2016 10:15:26 AM EDT
[#49]
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Hadnt thought of that, but it doesn't sound unlikely. Only prediction / pure guess I'm going to take is the Human "Good Guy" that is helping Delores is going to die. Just seems like any time HBO makes someone out to be good, and really tries to get the audience to like them they kill them off... Or maybe I'm just watching too much GOT lol Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Am I the only one that thinks that Bernard isn't actually meeting with Dolores and that those are dreams manifested by the code Arnold put in? That's quite possible Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile Hadnt thought of that, but it doesn't sound unlikely. Only prediction / pure guess I'm going to take is the Human "Good Guy" that is helping Delores is going to die. Just seems like any time HBO makes someone out to be good, and really tries to get the audience to like them they kill them off... Or maybe I'm just watching too much GOT lol It's the "Stephen King formula". King builds up "good guy" heroes, makes the reader care about them, sets them up to look like they might save the day, and then kills them. |
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Posted: 10/24/2016 10:18:27 AM EDT
[#50]
The fact that they said there are 5 seasons worth of material written up ready to go makes it feel like not much of significance will really happen. I just don't see how they can take this premise and stretch it that long.
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