User Panel
User Panel
User Panel
|
Posted: 6/7/2017 4:12:07 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
In theory, academic rigor, critical thinking and analysis skills, necessity to create and defend an argument/premise (Thesis), advanced writing abilities. In practice, see the posts above. Also a discriminator, there are sooooooo many BAs now, they can use it as a selection criteria to reduce the pool of applicants. For people who teach HS or more advanced subjects then it should, in theory, provide them with a more rigorous background to draw from. |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/7/2017 4:12:56 PM EDT
[#2]
stability. people who have a masters are very serious about staying in industry. people who have a bs or ba much less so. so serious, in fact, they've sunk in money they don't have.
you may not learn anything new. but you will absolutely need to know everything you learned in undergrad and use them coherently. at least in the sciences. |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/7/2017 4:15:24 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
She must be young'ish. Give it a few years and she will be making a lot more than that. |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/7/2017 4:17:19 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
NC One of my coworkers has a wife who is a teacher and he just recently mentioned her pay bump for a masters. |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/7/2017 4:46:21 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Really? My mother is a teacher and did her masters in the 90s. It was a 10 or 12% bump then, and national boards was another 10 or 12% (one was 10 and one 12, can't recall which). One of my coworkers has a wife who is a teacher and he just recently mentioned her pay bump for a masters. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
NC One of my coworkers has a wife who is a teacher and he just recently mentioned her pay bump for a masters. They stopped the pay bump for new teachers with masters or if you hadn't completed it by x date about 3 years ago I think She is going to do national boards next and that does come with a pay bump |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/7/2017 4:58:20 PM EDT
[#6]
Rent seeking/barrier to entry.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 6/7/2017 5:03:42 PM EDT
[#7]
Masters in Ed is for your career growth. Either move to Aministration or if in Counseling move to that track.
In Texas, a Masters is worth about $1200/ year in stipend and a PhD about $1500. If you have both, like me, you only get the 1 stipend. My degrees are in content though, not education. It's the years of experience that can make moving hard, not the degrees. |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/7/2017 5:38:38 PM EDT
[#8]
Fake Education for future consumers of Fake News, Fake Science, Fake Life
|
|
|
|
Posted: 6/7/2017 5:50:25 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'm at 18 years teaching high school math and physics with no masters degree. I don't see how it would be worth my time or money except to climb a ladder to administration. But one must offer homage to the liberal gods of progressivism, right? It's a racket. and PS, name me one other industry or field where the incompetent baseline workers get moved into management as a career track?  |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/7/2017 5:55:22 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It's two more years of communist indoctrination before they lock them in a room with your children for 8 hours a day.  however to the OP's point. she started out with her masters before getting a teaching job, and it was 10 times harder to find a teaching job. but getting your masters give you all the con ed credits you need for a while. |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/7/2017 6:28:40 PM EDT
[#11]
Quoted:
So, I know a lot of public school teacher and they all either have, or are working on a master's degree since its significant pay raise, or in many cases mandatory to earn one within 5 years to keep their license/job. Once they get it, its a bitch to move and find a new job, since per the union contract, they're now more expensive than an entry level employee. So, the ones I know well enough to ask, I've been asking WTF they learned getting the Masters that made them a better teacher. As of yet, 1 out of 4 said they had ONE pretty decent class where they learned some new things about child discipline. Otherwise, it was just punching a ticket. I have a real hard time understanding why getting a random education MA is really needed to teach K-3. It seems like a huge scam otherwise. On the plus side it looks like Ohio isn't making people get a masters anymore. What, if any consequence would there be for a teacher with a master's degree not mentioning it, and just taking the entry level position? Usually not required but most will get extra pay based on advanced degrees. There was a kindergarten teacher at my wife's school that was making about 100k because she had her Doctorate. 100k and a doctorate to teach kids to color, not to pick their noses and have nap time. J- |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/7/2017 6:36:49 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'm at 18 years teaching high school math and physics with no masters degree. I don't see how it would be worth my time or money except to climb a ladder to administration. But one must offer homage to the liberal gods of progressivism, right? It's a racket. and PS, name me one other industry or field where the incompetent baseline workers get moved into management as a career track? Women all think just one way about every topic. They are completely as sexist as they can be, and totally unconscious about it. Yes, all of the stuff you love to hate - reflexively left-leaning, unable to recognize threats or harmful intentions in young men, hyper-reactive to young women. |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/7/2017 6:38:38 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I am a teacher. I have a MAgr from Texas A&M. I was awarded that degree long before I became a teacher. It has been useful as a way to slice through some educational bullshit. MEd have gotten to be little more than participation trophies. Districts require them so they can brag that their teachers all have a master's degree. Over the years so much that has been taught in regards to pedagogy has turned out to be bull shit. What was whizzbang one year was discredited in another. What would be useful? Degrees in the subjects that are taught make more sense. In some districts it is difficult for a person with a degree in education to get a classroom position. The districts want mathematicians who have been trained to teach and not teachers who have been taught rudimentary math. In that case there might be some justification for a MEd. When I entered education in 2005, I had zero experience and strong background knowledge. I learned that I was woefully unprepared. I did not have a successful career in public education from a combination of lack of skill and a temperament ill-suited for Title 1 schools. I now teach in a private school. I am a better teacher. I also have ZERO discipline problems. If a student is disruptive, they are expelled. End of story. About 50% of all new teachers quit by the end of their 5th year. Public education is a crappy way to make a living unless you are an admin. They are not educators; they are bureaucrats and as such know how to avoid the difficult stuff, delegate the problematic stuff, and hide the screwed-up stuff. |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/7/2017 8:52:01 PM EDT
[#14]
There is no research I'm aware of that shows that a classroom teacher with a Masters is a better, more effective teacher than one with just a BA. One simple thing districts could do to cut costs while remaining effective would be to get rid of the Masters pay bump. Not retroactively, they should abide by the deals they made, but end it going forward. Remember, most districts have tuition reimbursement too so they are not just paying more for teachers with Masters but also paying for their teachers to get advanced degrees - with no guarantee that the cost translates to better student performance.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 6/7/2017 9:00:09 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
More revenue for colleges is the main reason. |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/7/2017 11:03:40 PM EDT
[#16]
Masters are the new bachelors degree.
now that everyone has a bachelors, you have to set yourself apart by getting a masters. It will get you a pay bump in public schools, and can make you an attractive candidate for private schools. |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/7/2017 11:05:41 PM EDT
[#17]
Punching the ticket pure and simple.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 6/7/2017 11:09:23 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It's two more years of communist indoctrination before they lock them in a room with your children for 8 hours a day. |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/7/2017 11:15:48 PM EDT
[#19]
An irrelevant achievement that has nothing to do with the performance of the teacher that 'qualifies' said "teacher" to receive a higher compensation for their time...
...yah unions & 'higher learning' |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/7/2017 11:16:59 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Automatic raise all about working the system 
|
|
|
|
Posted: 6/7/2017 11:21:00 PM EDT
[#21]
I have a few friends who are teachers. Most pursued their masters in order to be able to move into administration. I think most local school systems pay a little extra for having a masters.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 6/7/2017 11:22:56 PM EDT
[#22]
Part of the system to feed the beast of ever increasing tuition.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 6/7/2017 11:24:56 PM EDT
[#23]
every state is different the Ohio river valley used to only require a masters nothing else.
NCLB requires the teacher be "highly qualified" so a MS degree gills that requirement. Do you realize hoe stupid a BS in elementary education can be  I met one a few years ago that just could not fathom the moon reflects light.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 6/7/2017 11:37:53 PM EDT
[#24]
This topic is what pisses me off.
Overeducation for school teachers. Doctorates for elementary school principals. WTF? Whatever happened to simply promoting the best from within? No fucking wonder our school system has a referendum for tax levies every few years. And according to studies, most that money doesn't even go to teachers, but support staff and equipment. |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/7/2017 11:40:45 PM EDT
[#25]
Two reasons.
1 - can't allow enough time out of camp, they could start thinking for themselves. 2 - $$ Communists sure love dirty, greedy capitalist dollars. |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/7/2017 11:41:24 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I can understand why teachers do it. I'm trying to understand why society/school boards/administrators allow it. Is it that they actually think they're better teachers for it? Is it a cynical move to keep teachers in your system, sort of like non-compete agreements, stock options or whatever in private industry? It makes a lot more sense when you quit thinking about it like the administrators are paying salary out of their own pocket. |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/7/2017 11:54:35 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
every state is different the Ohio river valley used to only require a masters nothing else. NCLB requires the teacher be "highly qualified" so a MS degree gills that requirement. Do you realize hoe stupid a BS in elementary education can be I met one a few years ago that just could not fathom the moon reflects light.According to NCLB, a highly qualified teacher must have “1) a bachelor's degree, 2) full state certification or licensure, and 3) prove that they know each subject they teach.” Beyond that, NCLB does not define its terminology, and it leaves requirements up the states. |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/8/2017 12:21:37 AM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Former co-worker went to tOSU for education. Had to get a Masters. Couldn't find a teaching job. Yeah she'll pretty much be paying those student loans for the rest of her life. |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/8/2017 7:27:32 AM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Punching the ticket pure and simple. |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/8/2017 7:31:55 AM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
But it definitely screws you as far as moving to a new school system, right? |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/8/2017 7:32:24 AM EDT
[#31]
My wife:
-A Masters and 2 Bachelors -Stuck at a $45k job (public school) with 80k in student debt. She's been trying every day since I've known her to find a better job. 
|
|
|
|
Posted: 6/8/2017 7:34:04 AM EDT
[#32]
I'm not aware of public schools that 'require' Masters degrees for teaching.
Instead, I am aware of the competition level for the teaching jobs in certain areas means that the school districts have their choice of applicants for a given position, and usually - in some areas of the country - the jobs are so few and far between. Where-as regular BA's are basically what high school diplomas were 40 years ago, the applicants with Masters will generally get the jobs. |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/8/2017 7:36:38 AM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
But it definitely screws you as far as moving to a new school system, right? It reminds me of a discussion with a soldier who wasn't given an opportunity to re enlist. I had to point out he's got a family and spent time in the shop getting repaired, they can say thank you and go get a high school kid and dump your medical issues on the VA. Sometimes it's all about the bottom line. |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/8/2017 7:37:09 AM EDT
[#34]
Hell, I'm not seeing needing a masters to fudge grades or be in a administration that smiles and waves when it's done.....I guess it helps with your retirement check though.
LINK |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/8/2017 8:36:47 AM EDT
[#35]
OP, you have a basic misunderstanding of the role of education in teaching.
I want my kids to be taught by the most intelligent, most educated, most experienced person available. If your school does not hire that way, it's probably a shitty school. There are plenty out there. But they're not hiring for Chipotle; a learning environment requires bright, talented people who aren't satisfied with meeting the minimal acceptable standards. That this isn't obvious to everyone leaves me dumbfounded even as I write this. While every state is different, most teachers' pay is incentivized through education and experience. Anyone who is motivated to "punch their ticket" (as if there's something wrong with that) and get a Master's degree is a) maximizing the benefit of taking already required continuing education, and b) has an incentive to remain in the school district (paying off loans, etc.) If you don't provide adequate incentives, people will jump ship. They will land at the next school that pays higher. That's why shitty schools remain shitty- they burn through teachers. Also, churn is expensive. There are other reasons of course a person might seek a Master's degree. Their Bachelors degree may not be in Education. They may want to move into administration. They may want to stay current on new education theories, which change even more regularly than business management theories. Again, this seems fairly obvious to me, but I'm going to assume the OP genuinely doesn't know this and is not just trolling. I have no problem with academia being self-supporting by requiring more education. If they're not in their own corner, then who the hell will be? Many of the responses so far (The_Reaper is a notable exception) seem like grumpy old white guy talk by people who think they know something about education because they went to school 30 years ago. They have a name for those people- they're called school boards. 
|
|
|
|
Posted: 6/8/2017 8:43:39 AM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Justification for more pay. It is how they get full time pay for a part time job. |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/8/2017 10:24:22 AM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It's two more years of communist indoctrination before they lock them in a room with your children for 8 hours a day. This nation is in BIG trouble, and it will be lost if we don't get the |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/8/2017 10:42:01 AM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
In theory, academic rigor, critical thinking and analysis skills, necessity to create and defend an argument/premise (Thesis), advanced writing abilities. In practice, see the posts above. Also a discriminator, there are sooooooo many BAs now, they can use it as a selection criteria to reduce the pool of applicants. |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/8/2017 10:44:20 AM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'm at 18 years teaching high school math and physics with no masters degree. I don't see how it would be worth my time or money except to climb a ladder to administration. But one must offer homage to the liberal gods of progressivism, right? It's a racket. and PS, name me one other industry or field where the incompetent baseline workers get moved into management as a career track? |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/8/2017 10:46:35 AM EDT
[#40]
It's not just teaching. The business world is choking on MBA's. A lot of places are sending their engineers to MBA school.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 6/8/2017 10:48:32 AM EDT
[#41]
Quoted:
I have a real hard time understanding why getting a random education MA is really needed to teach K-3. It seems like a huge scam otherwise. Masters isn't required to teach elementary grades in N.Y. |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/8/2017 10:57:54 AM EDT
[#42]
Required to get it, worth about $4,000 year pay increase. No union.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 6/8/2017 11:05:36 AM EDT
[#43]
There is no point. Just like there's no point for anything. It's arbitrary. Completely.
The pay raise isn't there. The costs associated with getting your Master's isn't in any way reimbursed and the pay difference in salary for your average teacher in no way makes up for it. Total bullshit. I could see if if was an administrative job like a Principal or something. But for a teacher? Fuck that. |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/8/2017 11:11:28 AM EDT
[#44]
It weeds out the partial "lipstick" liberals
|
|
|
|
Posted: 6/8/2017 11:33:22 AM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Automatic raise all about working the system |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/8/2017 11:42:22 AM EDT
[#46]
Quoted:
So, I know a lot of public school teacher and they all either have, or are working on a master's degree since its significant pay raise, or in many cases mandatory to earn one within 5 years to keep their license/job. Once they get it, its a bitch to move and find a new job, since per the union contract, they're now more expensive than an entry level employee. So, the ones I know well enough to ask, I've been asking WTF they learned getting the Masters that made them a better teacher. As of yet, 1 out of 4 said they had ONE pretty decent class where they learned some new things about child discipline. Otherwise, it was just punching a ticket. I have a real hard time understanding why getting a random education MA is really needed to teach K-3. It seems like a huge scam otherwise. On the plus side it looks like Ohio isn't making people get a masters anymore. What, if any consequence would there be for a teacher with a master's degree not mentioning it, and just taking the entry level position? Education degrees in general are bullshit, and EDU MA's are for promotion into administration roles. I went through an alternative certification program in 2005, because I got into teaching in my thirties. It cost me... less than a thousand all told? One year? My BA and my MA are both in my content area, and I hope to grow old and die in a classroom to traumatize my students. If you have a science teacher with an Bio BA, versus one with a Bio BA and a Biochem MA for example, the latter will be more knowledgeable (all else being equal). The rudiments of teaching don't take four years to learn, and like virtually every other career, you learn the things you -really- need to know by training on the job. |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/8/2017 11:42:57 AM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
No. But getting teaching jobs can be very competitive, depending on the area. In most of the country, It has the lowest ROI for time and effort, of any job I can think of. Sure is a good ROI here anyway. |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/8/2017 12:05:25 PM EDT
[#48]
Same reason some LEO agencies pay extra when their employees have BS degrees. Pay bump.
It's not just the Education field that has arbitrary education requirements and incentives.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 6/8/2017 12:49:12 PM EDT
[#49]
Self-licking ice cream cone, like 95% of govacademia.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 6/8/2017 1:02:13 PM EDT
[#50]
Pyramid scheme.
Depending on what you get your masters in and what state your looking at $15-$45k. Pay to keep your job basically. The state of Kentucky has limited where you can get your Masters and Rank I too, saying low cost options from out of state do not meet their standards.......go figure. Then let's add on the Rank I, another $20-$50k....... You get a pay increase with each step up but they increase is about $5k........enough to cover 1-2 classes. |
|
|
Win a FREE Membership!
Sign up for the ARFCOM weekly newsletter and be entered to win a free ARFCOM membership. One new winner* is announced every week!
You will receive an email every Friday morning featuring the latest chatter from the hottest topics, breaking news surrounding legislation, as well as exclusive deals only available to ARFCOM email subscribers.
AR15.COM is the world's largest firearm community and is a gathering place for firearm enthusiasts of all types.
From hunters and military members, to competition shooters and general firearm enthusiasts, we welcome anyone who values and respects the way of the firearm.
Subscribe to our monthly Newsletter to receive firearm news, product discounts from your favorite Industry Partners, and more.
Copyright © 1996-2024 AR15.COM LLC. All Rights Reserved.
Any use of this content without express written consent is prohibited.
AR15.Com reserves the right to overwrite or replace any affiliate, commercial, or monetizable links, posted by users, with our own.
