Yall can go on ahead thinking murdering babies is the greatest thing since sliced bread but I think ceasing it will have positive effects on society.
I don't think my opinions are very far fetched either.

Op talked about second order effects and I think longer term after maybe seeing some of the pushback discussed in this thread it will ultimately head in the direction I suggest.

Well, so far we murdered 65 million citizens. About half would be taxpayers. About 1.65 million would be in the top 5% bracket. There would be a lot more jobs too. Most likely the military would be meeting their recruiting goals. The illegals would be really pissed. They would have to compete with another maybe 15 million more domestic freeloaders at the entitlement trough.

Not really, the rate would be about the same. More people would be CCW and hopefully help thin them out. Social competition can have a good response.

Oh you sweet summer child.  Are people really this naïve???

Detached from reality is more like it.

The biggest thing you can do to help someone grow the fuck up and be a man is give them responsibility. There isn't much more responsibility than a human infant. I'm not blind to the negative consequences. I don't think they would be as severe as yall seem to think. Even if, grow up in a foster home or be denied life? Which would you chose?

Michigan got screwed as well.

Our statistically most violent and lowest achieving subgroup would also be a much larger portion of the population.

It'll be great. Really.

I wouldn't assume that kids born to women that would have otherwise aborted will follow the proportions of the current living population. They will statistically most likely be born to low income minority communities, will probably have minimal if any prenatal care, probably have mothers that don't abstain from alcohol or drugs during pregnancy, will be born into poverty with lesser opportunity, and mostly be from low IQ parents. At the other end of the spectrum, unwanted pregnancies will likely be a life hinderance for many women who would otherwise have continued their educations and careers.

Given natural reproductive rates, how many people would be among us today from those 63 million? What would our population be...400-450 million? Resources, housing, governmental expansion, urban expansion, crime, poverty...the list goes on.

Abortion is distasteful, but it's a necessary relief valve.

That's not really true.  The women with the highest rates of abortion are women who make money, the more money a woman makes the higher the chances of an abortion.

Correct.

An outsized percentage of abortions are performed on women who fit the following demographics: unmarried, uneducated, unemployed, ethnic minority, and living at or below the poverty line.  Eugenics, or any related justification, is an entirely inexcusable justification for legalized abortion.  But ignoring the completely predictable results of not allowing these women access to abortion is equally inexcusable.

Brookings

NIH

A woman's freedom of choice in regard to her pregnancy does not meet the definition of eugenics.

I agree with your last sentence.

More single moms
More crime
More welfare
More broke men
Less fur babies
Less women in the workforce

Correct, I am pro-choice because I believe in a woman's choice, nothing more.

But that doesn't diminish the impact that a reduced number of abortions would have on society due to the demographics of the women who receive an outsized percentage of abortions.

Can you source that data, please?

Again, who said they were?

What’s with the magical thinking with some here?

If it wasn’t for immigration from Africa, the population of blacks in America would be well under 10% by now.

Have you fucking taken a hard look around in the past oh I don't know 20 years?
Half the adults in America won't lift a finger to better their lives and situation and you think these same idiots are all the sudden going to be more responsible? People are becoming less reliable and responsible

I agree, what a grand and intoxicating innocence.

We will become less of a culture of death and value life more.  However, it will take not only the criminalization of abortion but also of at-home abortion pills.

Abolish abortion.

We agree. More of the worst, either from "migration" or reproduction, will not be a net positive.

Ok, I’ll be that guy..Why not?

We don’t have to live this way.

Some would rather be the “The Last Men” living “Among the Ruins” after the dam of civilization collapses so long as they feel good.

Factor in fraud, and a GOP leadership of the state/National party that wants to lose at all costs.

If what you say is true, then abortion is merely a bandaid (and a pretty deadly one) on a sucking chest wound.

Instead of murdering supposed unborn "undesireables", why not change the culture so that is less of that behavior?

The culture is the problem, and using abortion (an evil in itself) to badly address that problem won't only fail to fix anything), as we've seen over the last 50 years, but only creates more problems. Not to mention that abortion is murder of innocent children.

Fix the culture and we won't have a need for this discussion.

This comment proves my point:

I’d prefer to let the leftists kill their own children than to have to set them on fire ourselves in a civil war.

But you're going to get both

Abortion is murder (as you just pointed out) and murder is evil. It not only ends innocent life, but it rots the culture from the inside out. We are a culture of death. In the name of Christ, end this evil.

LOL, wow, why didn’t I think of that?! Just change the culture!
That is such an easy task and not like their are entrenched, monied interests, or political factions that have zero respect for the law or won’t hesitate to abuse their power, or least of all millions of useful idiots who think a Straight, White, Right-leaning Male tell anyone else anything with it being the 3rd coming of Hitler,and will go out of their way to ruin your life, and all this for the reward of…I don’t know, some nebulous, intangible reward that MIGHT materialize after massive preventable burden and harm has been inflicted upon us, wow, that is totally a winning argument!/s



We have done things your way, and what did we get? More crime, more poverty, more and more burdens and threats, loss of Liberty and all the while being demonized by the same people we tried to save. Just as God gave them over to a reprobate mind so are we giving them over to their reprobate choices. Let the dead bury the dead.

…I’ll buy you a beer for such a based statement.

Because eugenics are bad, mmmmkay kiddo?

So helping enable more people who with a smile on their face and without a single  thought in their empty skulls, who will gladly help rot the culture faster and swell the ranks of the forces of evil in exchange for “free stuff” is a good plan why again?

If you saw a group of 100 communists about to machine gunned by another communist, would you intervene?

I saw one study that showed a large percentage of abortions were women who wanted kids but not right then.

Maybe some inconveniences will cause women to have that child sooner than later and not affect the number of live births while reducing the baby slaughter.

..But it isn’t.*


* So long as it’s not government backed force.

Came here to post that.

I assume you meant increase crime. But you're right. Most of the people getting abortions are those that should not be having kids. The percentage of white and Asian per capita will also decrease as a result. The amount of African American and Latinos per capita will increase, and the problem with that is those groups generally have higher crime rates. They are also generally on welfare at higher rates. The economic outlook won't be as great.

If you're o k with abortion is o k if I abort you? Why not? To old? If im older than you, can I decide that you are still young enough to abort? If you think their family or some stupid metric like some house is not good enough for them to live. If my family is better than you or has more money , can I abort you now? Can I murder your children? Do you understand why you in the middle with the rest of us can't decide someone's fate for a stupid reason? If I'm happer can I decide your not happy enough to live? If I've contributed more can I decide you are a drain? Too much for me to carry and I murder you or your family? If you are not even born yet is it possible it is too early to judge you? This is not just stupid it's evil. The excuses are dumb. I might commit less crime, but I don't think you should receive the death penalty when you have committed no crime. I might be in better physical shape than you but that doesn't give me the right to decide you don't get to live. What if medicine gets better like it has through all of time and later you could be healed. What if you are born healthy in a nice house to a nice family with no crime and you are a shithead?  What if all the people that wanted children that couldn't are not enough to take care of all the kids that weren't murdered is that a good enough reason?  I can't think of anything that's a good enough reason. I believe the outcome would be good but there is no reason whatever you can make up that even if it were real that would be worth it. I pray one day people stop this and it is looked back at it like slavery and children ask their parents how people didn't know it was wrong. Laws be dammed wrong is wrong whatever you write on a paper doesn't change what's right.

The Left changed the culture from one that worshipped God, knew what a woman was, and had strong nuclear families to one that despises God, thinks gender is a spectrum, and where the traditional family is torn apart, ask in in less than 50 years. If the Left can do it, why can't we? Because of people like you who say it can't be done. We know it can because it was done to us.

Nothing has been done my way. If I had my way Roe v. Wade would have been overturned 50 years ago when it was first brought to the Supreme Court. Abortion has been legal in one form or another in every single state for 50 years now, and it still is legal in every state at this very moment, even after the overturning of Roe v. Wade. Over the last 50 years of Pro-life incrimentalism we've murdered over 70 million unborn babies. Do you not think such a genocide effects the state of our nation and society? The blood of over 70 million innocent babies cries out for justice, and you blame those like myself who defend the innocent for the evils of our world? The Right has been doing things your way for the last 50 years and all it got us was a genocide. Pathetic and weak.

What will you have us do for the next 50 years? Continue to murder babies? Your method of population control and eugenics obviously hasn't worked, but rather it has made things worse. It made us desensitized to murder; has turned life into a cheap commodity that can be thrown away for our own comfort; and now even you are fine with the destruction of innocent life.

May God's judgement lay on you lightly.

Who are you to determine someone's future? Only one being has that knowledge and I can guarantee it's none of us.

Innocent lives deserve the chance to live and grow. That is foundational to our nation, and is written right in the beginning of our Declaration of Independence:


The thing you are supporting is, at its very core, un-American. Your ambivalence toward the unborn is part of the infection that is destroying our country and our society. We were founded upon Christian values, and only upon those Christian values can we stand. To quote John Adams:

Nowadays we are neither of those things, and you are a perfect example of that.

I truly can't believe how far we have fallen, that those on the Right are fine with murdering babies. It's rotting us from the inside out. Baby murder will not save you, it will not fix our problems, it will only accelerate our degeneracy and downward spiral. Turn from it and repent.

You left out the way those groups vote.

As a conservative practiceing like injecting an orange or practicing like injecting medicine in people? And what will happen afterwards?more good people will get a chance at lifeWhat about after that?one of the people who lives will give society the answer to the problem they wereIt seems that many good ideas don't ever go through that process.It would be a better world to live in if people cared about the future more than the presentI am pro-life practiceing like injecting an orange or practicing like injecting medicine in people? and I'm not sure most of our leaders have done any planning on what to do when they actually succeed. It would be a better world to live in if people thought about the future more than the present As a first order effect, I think we can reasonably expect an increase in number of children being born. more people positively contributingWhile some women who currently get abortions will switch to more permanent and secure forms of birth control (tubal ligation / birth control implants), they will be a minority. People would act differently to avoid the consequences of their actions, if they face more serious consequences.

Most will try to get by with easier forms of birth control, and some of those will inevitably fail. If any fail does that mean none should try or the ones that succeed were not worth the effort? The knock on effect of that will be need for more child care facilities of all types, primarily educational but also medical.  good thingwe havemore peopletohelp

By implication, many of the 'additional' children  will be born into families which will be struggling to raise them.  Some will succeed, some will muddle through and some will outright fail.  We'll need more help to keep the children in 2nd category from ending up in the 3rd.   i have an idea where those people will come from. They may care enough to do something Traditionally that role has been taken by both government and charitable/philanthropic/civic societies. government should not  be involved it achiveves the opposite of what it attempts We also need to be prepared to have to deal with more children who are outright surrendered to the state, because their parent(s) cannot or do not want to take care of them. I personally know people that would gladly take on this role if not for government prevention. Both of those will require additional levels of investment by the society, but which we as a nation currently do not resource appropriately. My church would not give me money when they know I don't need it. They have limited resources. They're more responsible the government doesn't have this issue They are able to act freely without thought.

I'm sure there are other issues in play, but those are just some things that have been floating in my mind.  I wish I could say that I am confident we'll be able to handle them, but I'm not. We can do anything we want to. Society doesn't take journeys because they worry about bridges they will never cross

If someone that is pro choice cares enough to make a bulletpoint or to itemize every pro choice argument, I will address each individual point. My time is valuable but I will freely give it counter each if someone takes the time to make them in one post. The poor forum decorum is too wasteful to spend my time countering in the format provided. I was going to address this earlier but when I got home I spent the evening with my three children when they went to bed I spent time with my wife. By the time I checked back in it was 3 pages. The back-and-forth would take to much time to try to counter each point. What is occurring is a very shallow muddy conversation. What could be a curing is a very deep clear conversation. Would anybody like to see the bottom of this?

So do you deliberately refuse to differentiate differences or is it that you can’t differentiate differences?

Math, statistics, pattern recognition. If you want to give others a chance, good for you. I refuse to help raise an army against myself, my family, my countrymen and all that I hold dear.



And how many of those “innocent lives” will in a few short years come to blame you for their plight, seeing you as the cause for all their misery, and demanding the state rob you of your property and rights to “make right the wrongs” of their insane worldview?

What then?




Oh? I can’t find a welfare system in the Constitution, nor the idea that everyone should vote in Constitution, or that merely existing entitles a person to the wealth, property, labor of others.  That is what these people overwhelmingly support, so you might wanna take your cries of “Un-Americanism” to the Marxists hordes.

When you think about it telling tyrants and their followers to get fucked is as American as you can get.




Yeah, it’s MY fault for treating the welfare voting hordes who gleefully make life needlessly more difficult, who support the most insane policies, laws, rules, regulations, taxes, etc in exchange for more “free stuff” as the burdens and threats they are, right?


It’s totally not their actions, uh pal? I just hate them for no reason, right?



And what do you call people who are too stupid to plan their lives? People who are so entitled that they think I, YOU our any/everyone exist merely to fund their taxpayer funded experience?  People who truly believe that if we just take away the right amount of property, wealth, and freedoms we will usher in a utopia that never will exist at the lowest of the highest and noblest things?

So maybe you should see the other side of this equation, but you don’t, why might be? I guess it’s easier and safer to criticize me then the hordes who will gladly see you robbed, raped and murdered for the “crime” of doing better than them.

What does that say about you then?



I can and it shocks and appalls me, that we went from noble and righteous men like Jefferson, Washington, Madison, Adams, etc, whom I truly believe to be emissaries of the Lord to the degenerate like Schumer, McConnell, etc and the countless other degenerate who came before them and have harmed this country with countless bills that were forced into law by degenerate men elected to high office.



So what will fix our problems? You seem to love to claim authority, so what’s the plan?…You do have a plan, right?

Parents unable or unwilling to care for a child that will be born.

Not a lot of faith in those kinds of parents.

Crime will rise.