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Posted: 2/29/2024 2:19:18 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Blackbeard28: Wife & I are going to start watching it this weekend. I remember watching the original with my parents, but I was 8 yrs old, so I don't remember much other than Allan Quatermain being the Shogun. lol Sanjuro is the Shogun. |
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Posted: 2/29/2024 2:23:10 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By countryflatlander: Original Justified or the steaming pile of crap that came out last year? I'm recording Shogun and I'll binge it when it's over. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By countryflatlander: Originally Posted By Jambalaya: Oh, nice. I just started watching Justified. Will watch this next. Original Justified or the steaming pile of crap that came out last year? I'm recording Shogun and I'll binge it when it's over. Original. I just finished season 3. |
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Posted: 2/29/2024 2:25:23 PM EDT
[#3]
I liked it.
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PA, USA
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Posted: 2/29/2024 2:25:27 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By EzGoingKev: I am a huge fan of both the book and the 80's TV miniseries. I watched the first two episodes. I noticed Lady Moriko has a more forceful role in this version. She ordered Blackthorn to refer to her as Mariko-sama. IIRC in the book and miniseries she is Mariko-chan. She would not rate sama and I am not sure about san. I hope this is not a sign this is going to be another girl power remake of something. There is a female samurai in it, if that gives you a clue |
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MO, USA
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Posted: 2/29/2024 2:29:11 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Aimless: I saw the first episode. I only barely remember the original but think this is better. Supposedly the main female character is now a scrappy sword gurl but nothing on that so far. The writing is good, "Anjin" is calculating and clever. Maybe it's just me but in the 1980 series the Japanese seemed more alien. The Japanese soldiers in this are better written. I edited out some mild spoilers Mariko knew how to use a sword in the book. Many samurai women were taught martial arts. The new series is doing some things I like, some things I don't, and some of the performances will inevitably get compared to the 1980 version (no one is topping John Rhys-Davies as Rodriguez, its the role that jumpstarted his film career). Quite a lot of the dialog is straight from the book. Can't wait to watch Ep 2 tonight. |
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Posted: 2/29/2024 2:29:30 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Ohio]
[#6]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By manowar669: There is a female samurai in it, if that gives you a clue Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By manowar669: Originally Posted By EzGoingKev: I am a huge fan of both the book and the 80's TV miniseries. I watched the first two episodes. I noticed Lady Moriko has a more forceful role in this version. She ordered Blackthorn to refer to her as Mariko-sama. IIRC in the book and miniseries she is Mariko-chan. She would not rate sama and I am not sure about san. I hope this is not a sign this is going to be another girl power remake of something. There is a female samurai in it, if that gives you a clue There were female samurai, and Mariko was one. |
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MO, USA
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Posted: 2/29/2024 2:31:13 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By EzGoingKev: I am a huge fan of both the book and the 80's TV miniseries. I watched the first two episodes. I noticed Lady Moriko has a more forceful role in this version. She ordered Blackthorn to refer to her as Mariko-sama. IIRC in the book and miniseries she is Mariko-chan. She would not rate sama and I am not sure about san. I hope this is not a sign this is going to be another girl power remake of something. -chan would have been a notation of affection. -san for 'honorable' or an equal, -sama would be said to a superior. In the book and first movie, Blackthorn made a point early on that he was Anjin-SAN motherfucker, and it was a good moment to establish him as more than just a barbarian. |
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Posted: 2/29/2024 2:31:22 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Aimless: Anjin is more a motivated operator in this new series, looking to use the japanese for his own purposes. This series seems less enthralled with feudal Japanese culture. It's a political action thriller with the warlords moving against each other and one trying to use anjin somehow against his three enemies. There's scene early on where young samurai enter the ghost ship and find the ill and dying Europeans. The samurai look at each other like "what the fuck is this?" They seem more like any young infantrymen v always fearless super fighters That’s literally straight from the book. |
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MO, USA
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Posted: 2/29/2024 2:32:21 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Going_Commando: The book was a bit too rapey and gross for me. I really enjoyed Taipan. You're remembering Gai Jin, which was a sequel to both Tai Pan and Shogun. Tai Pan would make for an amazing mini series. |
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CA, USA
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Posted: 2/29/2024 2:33:39 PM EDT
[#10]
I like the historical version better, dude almost single-handedly saved Japan from christian cuckery.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Adams_ |
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MO, USA
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Posted: 2/29/2024 2:41:57 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Scalped: Episode two was cool. It's really getting into the complexities of the feuding lords. I'm a little bummed out that Hulu, like others have mentioned in here, seemed to have up-ended the original plot in favor of more feminism bullshit. It seems instead of the original sequences depicted in the clip below, Hulu/FX changed: Click To View Spoiler The original piece:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3F3JQF1khycETA: added spoiler coverage In the book and first movie there was a lone assassin who targeted blackthorn in osaka castle and then, much later in the story, a raid of ninja against Toranagas samurai at Osaka castle, with the objective to capture Mariko alive. The scene you linked is the latter attack. For the Amida Tong assassin to be female isn't it original story but it isn't historically a problem, the book even said there were women among the Amida. |
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Posted: 2/29/2024 3:19:07 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Cargo: I am also very much liking the way they are handling the translation aspects, start a conversation restating everything, but don't make it tiresome. I advise turning on the closed caption, it works well for me even for the English (simulated Portugese) portions . . I saw that as intentional. The priest translated accurately. The woman was softening John's language so as to not offend Japanese sensibilities. |
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Posted: 2/29/2024 3:52:06 PM EDT
[Last Edit: EzGoingKev]
[#13]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Miles_Urbanus: I’ve never heard of baby seppuku for shame. Killing yourself yes but not your kid. I’d be interested to hear if that was historical. My gut is it’s not. Definately killing yourself and your kids if the castle was being besieged and about to be sacked, that happened. But not in the manor shown in the new shogun as far as I know. IIRC in the book and original series Toranaga-sama gives one of his lords (I think it might have been Omi-san) to drop his kids off at the castle to be killed. The lord and his wife were ordered to the castle later and they gave them their kids back. It was a loyalty test. |
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Posted: 2/29/2024 4:48:05 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By drew5337: In the book and first movie there was a lone assassin who targeted blackthorn in osaka castle and then, much later in the story, a raid of ninja against Toranagas samurai at Osaka castle, with the objective to capture Mariko alive. The scene you linked is the latter attack. For the Amida Tong assassin to be female isn't it original story but it isn't historically a problem, the book even said there were women among the Amida. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By drew5337: Originally Posted By Scalped: Episode two was cool. It's really getting into the complexities of the feuding lords. I'm a little bummed out that Hulu, like others have mentioned in here, seemed to have up-ended the original plot in favor of more feminism bullshit. It seems instead of the original sequences depicted in the clip below, Hulu/FX changed: Click To View Spoiler The original piece: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3F3JQF1khycETA: added spoiler coverage In the book and first movie there was a lone assassin who targeted blackthorn in osaka castle and then, much later in the story, a raid of ninja against Toranagas samurai at Osaka castle, with the objective to capture Mariko alive. The scene you linked is the latter attack. For the Amida Tong assassin to be female isn't it original story but it isn't historically a problem, the book even said there were women among the Amida. Yep. |
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Posted: 2/29/2024 4:54:51 PM EDT
[#15]
Can’t find the old one but the new one has been good thus far.
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TX, USA
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Posted: 2/29/2024 5:00:15 PM EDT
[#16]
Two episodes in and I am really enjoying it.
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Posted: 2/29/2024 8:41:52 PM EDT
[#17]
Tried watching the first episode and got to the baby part and had to nope out. I’m in the hospital with my newborn by myself, wife is in ICU after having her heart stop.
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Posted: 2/29/2024 11:49:13 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Coffin-Nail: Tried watching the first episode and got to the baby part and had to nope out. I’m in the hospital with my newborn by myself, wife is in ICU after having her heart stop. Prayers man |
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MO, USA
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Posted: 2/29/2024 11:56:02 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By EzGoingKev: IIRC in the book and original series Toranaga-sama gives one of his lords (I think it might have been Omi-san) to drop his kids off at the castle to be killed. The lord and his wife were ordered to the castle later and they gave them their kids back. It was a loyalty test. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By EzGoingKev: Originally Posted By Miles_Urbanus: I’ve never heard of baby seppuku for shame. Killing yourself yes but not your kid. I’d be interested to hear if that was historical. My gut is it’s not. Definately killing yourself and your kids if the castle was being besieged and about to be sacked, that happened. But not in the manor shown in the new shogun as far as I know. IIRC in the book and original series Toranaga-sama gives one of his lords (I think it might have been Omi-san) to drop his kids off at the castle to be killed. The lord and his wife were ordered to the castle later and they gave them their kids back. It was a loyalty test. It was his son and heir Sudara and his wife Genjiko, who is the sister of Ochiba, the mother of the Heir. In the book the offending samurai in the first episode was denied the privilege of seppuku. He was told by Toranaga in front of everyone that he would be crucified like a low criminal, his son would be killed, his swords broken, and be buried in an eta villiage (the eta being the lowest of the low classes). And then thats what happened. |
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Posted: 3/1/2024 1:34:33 AM EDT
[#20]
Watched the first two episode this evening. Excellent show so far.
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Posted: 3/1/2024 8:57:32 AM EDT
[Last Edit: Miles_Urbanus]
[#21]
I think I’ve found the ahistorical 18th century flintlock pistol they used at the end of episode 1.
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Posted: 3/1/2024 8:59:50 AM EDT
[#22]
I have it taped but haven't watched it yet
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Posted: 3/1/2024 6:10:35 PM EDT
[#23]
I’m 49 min in. It’s fucking phenomal.
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Posted: 3/1/2024 11:30:38 PM EDT
[#24]
Yanushige-the lower level Duke who initially seizes the ghost ship-is one of the better Japanese characters.
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Posted: 3/1/2024 11:33:10 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By lilMAC25: That's literally straight from the book. |
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Posted: 3/1/2024 11:36:24 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Aimless: Yanushige-the lower level Duke who initially seizes the ghost ship-is one of the better Japanese characters. He has the same swagger as Mifune. |
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Posted: 3/2/2024 12:12:46 AM EDT
[#27]
Has there been bewbies in every episode?
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USA
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Posted: 3/2/2024 12:14:03 AM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Yojimbo: Saw the first two. So far it’s been pretty good. Pretty good. More political drama that expected |
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USA
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Posted: 3/3/2024 2:29:20 AM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Scalped: Episode two was cool. It's really getting into the complexities of the feuding lords. I'm a little bummed out that Hulu, like others have mentioned in here, seemed to have up-ended the original plot in favor of more feminism bullshit. It seems instead of the original sequences depicted in the clip below, Hulu/FX changed: Click To View Spoiler The original piece: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3F3JQF1khycETA: added spoiler coverage The YT clip was the second ninja attack. The first assassination attempt was changed to a female, but kunoichi were a real thing so it didn't bother me. While I loved the infiltration of the assassin in the original 1980s series, having an agent in place was done whenever possible. |
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Posted: 3/6/2024 6:29:21 AM EDT
[#30]
I watched the third episode. They wrote Blackthorne's dialog like I write text messages.
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Posted: 3/6/2024 7:50:23 AM EDT
[#31]
Anyone who wants to go back and watch the original it is available on internet archive
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Posted: 3/6/2024 7:53:28 AM EDT
[#32]
You don’t swim in robes and the Japanese have almost no nudity taboo even today. The actor didn’t want to strip down.
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Posted: 3/6/2024 8:13:13 AM EDT
[Last Edit: Miles_Urbanus]
[#33]
Looks like the Shogun was production team have continued to choose firearms that didn’t exist in 1600. Based on this poster Ainjins pistols are true flint locks with hammers modified to look like 1630s dog locks. A Snaphance would have been the correct pistol to use. But those are more difficult to find these days. So they went with the cheaper, easier to acquire options.
Belt hooks we see on these pistols were also a new technology from the late 1590s.  
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Posted: 3/6/2024 8:17:47 AM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By curiomatic: I read the book a long time ago, but I can tell just by watching the trailer that this version has a lot more girl power in it. You must have forgotten the book then. Marino was always a badass. |
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Posted: 3/6/2024 8:19:28 AM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By EzGoingKev: It has been like 20 years since I read the book. Can you point out women defying samurai? Also the part when she goes from being Mariko-chan to Mariko-sama. Hate to break it to you, and others have probably already pointed it out, but Samurai was a class and both men and women were samurai. |
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Posted: 3/6/2024 8:29:54 AM EDT
[Last Edit: Miles_Urbanus]
[#36]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Naffenea: Hate to break it to you, and others have probably already pointed it out, but Samurai was a class and both men and women were samurai. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Naffenea: Originally Posted By EzGoingKev: It has been like 20 years since I read the book. Can you point out women defying samurai? Also the part when she goes from being Mariko-chan to Mariko-sama. Hate to break it to you, and others have probably already pointed it out, but Samurai was a class and both men and women were samurai. The long bladed naginata pole arm Mariko wields in the ambush scene is correct and was the preferred weapon of bushi class women. Naginatajutsu is primarily considered a women’s sport in Japan. 
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Posted: 3/6/2024 8:31:25 AM EDT
[#37]
Two episodes in and I am really enjoying it. It has been decades since I saw the original or read the book.
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Posted: 3/6/2024 10:40:48 AM EDT
[#38]
The only way I stream in on my MacBook Pro laptop. Works great for Netflix but not Hulu and Amazon. I wonder why?
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Posted: 3/6/2024 1:12:39 PM EDT
[#39]
Third episode was great. I've been enjoying the series so far. It's nice to have a main character who's a white guy and not a fucking idiot or pussy again.
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Posted: 3/6/2024 1:19:52 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By cyclone: I have it taped but haven't watched it yet Be careful you don't overwrite your tape with another show. Also better make sure your clock is set right on your VCR or else you'll be watching another show instead. 
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Posted: 3/6/2024 1:31:24 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By EzGoingKev: It has been like 20 years since I read the book. Can you point out women defying samurai? Also the part when she goes from being Mariko-chan to Mariko-sama. It seems to me that she only wants Anjin to call her Mariko-Sama, because he is a dirty barbarian that won't even take a bath. Gross |
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Posted: 3/6/2024 1:34:37 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By drew5337: In the book and first movie there was a lone assassin who targeted blackthorn in osaka castle and then, much later in the story, a raid of ninja against Toranagas samurai at Osaka castle, with the objective to capture Mariko alive. The scene you linked is the latter attack. For the Amida Tong assassin to be female isn't it original story but it isn't historically a problem, the book even said there were women among the Amida. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By drew5337: Originally Posted By Scalped: Episode two was cool. It's really getting into the complexities of the feuding lords. I'm a little bummed out that Hulu, like others have mentioned in here, seemed to have up-ended the original plot in favor of more feminism bullshit. It seems instead of the original sequences depicted in the clip below, Hulu/FX changed: Click To View Spoiler The original piece: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3F3JQF1khycETA: added spoiler coverage In the book and first movie there was a lone assassin who targeted blackthorn in osaka castle and then, much later in the story, a raid of ninja against Toranagas samurai at Osaka castle, with the objective to capture Mariko alive. The scene you linked is the latter attack. For the Amida Tong assassin to be female isn't it original story but it isn't historically a problem, the book even said there were women among the Amida. Thanks for the clarification. It's been over 20 years since I saw the original series. Unfortunately, my core criticism relating to the insertion of a meat-eating super assassin female character remains valid. The good news is there's still a chance we get to see some ninjas. |
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Posted: 3/7/2024 3:04:31 AM EDT
[#43]
The third episode was excellent.
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FL, USA
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Posted: 3/7/2024 9:55:47 AM EDT
[#44]
Incase no one saw it… there is an option for English dubbed if you don’t want to read the whole series .
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TX, USA
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Posted: 3/7/2024 10:34:31 AM EDT
[#45]
Not bad
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Posted: 3/7/2024 4:07:38 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Yojimbo: Be careful you don't overwrite your tape with another show. Also better make sure your clock is set right on your VCR or else you'll be watching another show instead. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Yojimbo: Originally Posted By cyclone: I have it taped but haven't watched it yet Be careful you don't overwrite your tape with another show. Also better make sure your clock is set right on your VCR or else you'll be watching another show instead. Yup, adjust it for daylight savings. |
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Posted: 3/7/2024 5:57:36 PM EDT
[#47]
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Posted: 3/7/2024 6:47:45 PM EDT
[#48]
Buntaro was a bad ass
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Posted: 3/7/2024 7:20:40 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Aimless: Buntaro was a bad ass My wife thinks Buntaro may still be alive, her words are where's the body, but I think that would tarnish his last stand. That being said I could totally see him somehow being overpowered/captured and brought back later...hell maybe he could have escaped. |
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FL, USA
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Posted: 3/7/2024 7:31:39 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By scrambler28: Has there been bewbies in every episode? This! Any tits? |
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