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Posted: 4/21/2024 8:55:36 PM EDT
[#1]
Both eyes open.
If you are getting one for your pistol, that takes more getting used. Practice drawing and presenting. Slow at first, speed up as you go. On both, bring your weapon to your eyes, not your eyes to your dot. |
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Posted: 4/21/2024 8:56:56 PM EDT
[#2]
 Watch the eyes |
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Posted: 4/21/2024 8:59:05 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryI forgot about that video. That's another banger from Stoeger. |
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USA
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Posted: 4/21/2024 9:14:35 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Never_A_Wick: Start doing it right away. Don’t even bother experimenting with one eye shooting with the dot. It’s going to suck at first. But you’ll get it if you practice. Cover the front of the optic with blue painters tape. It will force you to keep both eyes open and target focus |
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Posted: 4/21/2024 9:16:07 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryAbsolutely watch these videos, OP. Ben Stoeger is a USPSA champion, now professional instructor. He explains things in a way that just makes sense. Watch them again after your range session tomorrow. Subscribed to see how this goes. Keep us posted! |
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TX, USA
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Posted: 4/21/2024 9:16:47 PM EDT
[#6]
Originally Posted By dsmaccullen: So my agency is transitioning to red dots tomorrow. I personally have never shot anything red dot. We will be at the range all day tomorrow practicing . Any tips? The whole day?!?! 😆 |
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USA
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Posted: 4/21/2024 9:23:24 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By JASIRR: The whole day?!?! 😆 The whole day tomorrow and Friday. Will put down nearly 1500 rounds total. |
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Posted: 4/21/2024 9:25:23 PM EDT
[#8]
it’s yo funeral
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Posted: 4/21/2024 9:26:01 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RamaSita: Look at the target You might try “occluding” (covering) the dot with masking tape and letting your brain merge the dot image with the target image. Counterintuitive but it works. Consistent presentation is key; the dot will pretty much force you to grip, draw to chest, push gun out to target…giving your eye more time to find the dot. |
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Posted: 4/21/2024 9:26:26 PM EDT
[#10]
Get top quality instruction if you don't have it at work. Pay for it. Travel for it. You may, or may not, have anyone who knows how to train someone to use a dot.
Its a lot like tennis, or golf, or trap/skeet. You can only get so good at it by yourself. You need a legit professional coach. |
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Posted: 4/21/2024 9:32:37 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Never_A_Wick: No. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Never_A_Wick: Originally Posted By Badlatitude: Close your eyes, loosen up your body and stance, draw and open your eyes. Adjust and repeat until you are seeing the dot every time. Then draw on a target if you are seeing the dot and it’s in the right place break the shot (or dry fire). If not do it again. Repeat until you forget why you are doing it No. The point of loosening up eyes closed before you draw is to set yourself neutral. Possibly my explanation is lacking but the goal is to make yourself naturally centered. Vs subconsciously. When you do it the dot should be in your vision. |
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Posted: 4/21/2024 9:55:42 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 11boomboom: It helped me initially and when I revisited my performance with the dot when I was noticing some focus issues on transitions, too. It's a good tool to use periodically even if you're "good" at shooting dots/irons with a target focus. I occluded when I started getting serious and I’ve stayed occluded ever since. It works great for me and I have no issue seeing the target at any distance. I know some guys use it sporadically too. I’ve tried to take the cover off and I don’t like it 
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Posted: 4/21/2024 10:01:43 PM EDT
[#13]
Stay target focused. Draw gun to eye level and punch out. The eye should pick up the dot on the way out.
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TX, USA
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Posted: 4/21/2024 10:02:15 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By dsmaccullen: The whole day tomorrow and Friday. Will put down nearly 1500 rounds total. 
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IN, USA
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Posted: 4/21/2024 10:04:34 PM EDT
[#15]
Look at the target.
Dot will find its way there. Look at the target on the draw. Moves eyes first before the gun during transitions. |
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MI, USA
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Posted: 4/21/2024 10:06:35 PM EDT
[#16]
I remember my first dot.
After the first mag I was faster than I’d ever been and couldn’t believe I waited that long. As long as you have the fundamentals (drawing with the gun pointed at the target, trigger pull, stance, etc) it’s really easy to pick up! I’ve never met anyone that didn’t figure out a dot on the first mag. It also has great feedback so you actually get better than you ever were pretty fast. Most of my drills went down by 20-30% in time the range trip after getting my first dot. |
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Posted: 4/21/2024 10:08:46 PM EDT
[#17]
Hopefully you don't have a astigmatism
 |
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USA
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Posted: 4/21/2024 10:09:39 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Lungbuster:I’m shooting running little varmints at 30+ yards. I wish I switched years ago. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/196752/IMG_5440_jpeg-3194654.JPG I gotta get out to the desert before the pigs go back to sleep. |
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AZ, USA
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Posted: 4/21/2024 10:19:42 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Never_A_Wick: For the OP. Draw gun while staring at the target. Dot should end up right where you’re looking. A plain cardboard torso with a 1” orange dot will give you something to focus on. It will take plenty of reps before you develop a good index. After that, do it regularly to maintain the skill because it’s a bit perishable. You will probably be a little frustrated at first as you’ll lose the dot quite a bit. As you practice, you’ll lose it less. Then, do it strong hand. And weak hand. Practice reloads. Get your eyes back onto the target after the reload and getting the dot back where you’re looking. Then do it with a lean around a wall. Etc. This is solid advice. You may also find your second shot is shit when shooting pairs because you are firing just because you saw red. You don’t track the dot like you do irons but you still need an acceptable picture. That will vary based on distance/difficulty. You will feel slow waiting for the dot to settle but you will be faster than you think. Close stuff will probably be slower/sloppier at first but distance/difficult shots will be faster and easier. It took me a month or so to get bill drills back below 2 seconds with good hits and my draw back reliably below a second at 15 yards or so. Anything with draws or pairs slowed, everything single shot and far sped up. |
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Posted: 4/21/2024 10:20:05 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By evnash: I always teach to start at compressed ready with your gun aimed a bit high. When you punch straight out and drop the gun down into target, the dot will drop down into the windo from 12 o’clock. Once you’ve mastered that, add the draw from holster. Please stop teaching this immediately. |
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Posted: 4/21/2024 10:22:44 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Subpar: My advice is to immediately remove the RDS and stick to using the iron sights. Adventures in the sub-optimal continues. |
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AZ, USA
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Posted: 4/21/2024 10:22:47 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ScopeEye: Hopefully you don't have a astigmatism I do. The dot looks like shit but it is still effective. A Trijicon SRO was cleanest for me. Almost round in sunlight. Inside or in low low light and it looks like a spider on fire. Not a functional problem but I wish it was cleaner. |
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TX, USA
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Posted: 4/21/2024 10:29:12 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Brackeen22: You’re still shooting with an eye closed? Oh boy this is gonna be quite the day tomorrow. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Brackeen22: Originally Posted By dsmaccullen: The both eyes open is going to take some time to get used too You’re still shooting with an eye closed? Oh boy this is gonna be quite the day tomorrow. I have to. With these iron-sighted pistols. I've even gotten to where I'm using a ghetto peeper affixed to the glasses lens in front of my sighting eye, with closing the other one. Shit is ridiculous. I'm getting a concave illusion with the top of the blade when it comes near the fuzzy bottom of the bull. The dot, OTOH, is look at target, see dot on it, squeeze shitty Glock wannabe trigger as fast as I can, watch as holes blossom very close to dot. Could not be easier. I need to just ditch the irons and Ultradot/Aimpoint all the bullseye things. |
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TX, USA
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Posted: 4/21/2024 10:34:08 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Subpar: My advice is to immediately remove the RDS and stick to using the iron sights.  Attached FileThe shade of rogueboss feels only sadness at what his legacy has become. |
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TX, USA
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Posted: 4/21/2024 10:38:32 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By LDAguy: ‘ You must have been taught by an instructor that went to Modern Samurai Project course. I tried the bent elbows, but I always revert back to locked elbows. It works for me. 40 years of isosceles is hard to defeat. Take bits and pieces that they teach, and make it work for you. . Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By LDAguy: Originally Posted By SuperStormBryan: You probably shoot irons by locking your arms straight out and burying your head down into the sight picture. Don't do that with a dot. You draw keeping your head up straight, present with slightly bent elbows and pistol up a little higher than normal. . ‘ You must have been taught by an instructor that went to Modern Samurai Project course. I tried the bent elbows, but I always revert back to locked elbows. It works for me. 40 years of isosceles is hard to defeat. Take bits and pieces that they teach, and make it work for you. . This is going to sound weird, but with irons two-handed, bent elbows worked a lot better. Because now I could see the damned front sight. I'll deal with handling recoil later. Maybe. Damnit. Anyone got any ideas for installing an Ultradot on this weirdass not-a-Novak's dovetail RIA uses? |
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TX, USA
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Posted: 4/21/2024 10:43:39 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Badlatitude: The point of loosening up eyes closed before you draw is to set yourself neutral. Possibly my explanation is lacking but the goal is to make yourself naturally centered. Vs subconsciously. When you do it the dot should be in your vision. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Badlatitude: Originally Posted By Never_A_Wick: Originally Posted By Badlatitude: Close your eyes, loosen up your body and stance, draw and open your eyes. Adjust and repeat until you are seeing the dot every time. Then draw on a target if you are seeing the dot and it’s in the right place break the shot (or dry fire). If not do it again. Repeat until you forget why you are doing it No. The point of loosening up eyes closed before you draw is to set yourself neutral. Possibly my explanation is lacking but the goal is to make yourself naturally centered. Vs subconsciously. When you do it the dot should be in your vision. It's a position shooting thing. Close eyes, arrange body, open eyes. Are we on target? No? Move body until we are. Repeat. If yes, Yay! Commence breath,squeeze, etc... Works. Anything to where I can turn off conscious control of muscles and focus on grip, trigger, wobble, time is good. |
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TX, USA
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Posted: 4/21/2024 10:45:00 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ScopeEye: Hopefully you don't have a astigmatism Still works---though mine is very mild----just turn down brightness and put the "star" on target, lol. |
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Posted: 4/21/2024 10:46:51 PM EDT
[#28]
That red dot course isn’t 40 hours?
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Posted: 4/21/2024 11:09:54 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Lungbuster: You’ll need at least 1000 draws from the holster to be proficient. 5000 draws to be good. I switched last year. The “focus on the front sight” I did for decades took a long time to unremember. After 1000’s of dry fire and many trips to the range, I’m shooting running little varmints at 30+ yards. I wish I switched years ago. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/196752/IMG_5440_jpeg-3194654.JPG And username checks out. |
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Posted: 4/22/2024 12:52:05 AM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By xciapup: Get top quality instruction if you don't have it at work. Pay for it. Travel for it. You may, or may not, have anyone who knows how to train someone to use a dot. Its a lot like tennis, or golf, or trap/skeet. You can only get so good at it by yourself. You need a legit professional coach. No. Do not spend any money on a "red dot" class. If he's struggling to find the dot, he needs to dry fire until he fixes his index. |
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Posted: 4/22/2024 5:50:39 AM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By BMSMB: No. Do not spend any money on a "red dot" class. If he's struggling to find the dot, he needs to dry fire until he fixes his index. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By BMSMB: Originally Posted By xciapup: Get top quality instruction if you don't have it at work. Pay for it. Travel for it. You may, or may not, have anyone who knows how to train someone to use a dot. Its a lot like tennis, or golf, or trap/skeet. You can only get so good at it by yourself. You need a legit professional coach. No. Do not spend any money on a "red dot" class. If he's struggling to find the dot, he needs to dry fire until he fixes his index. Genius. Pure genius. |
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Posted: 4/22/2024 5:56:06 AM EDT
[#32]
Target focus
Don't stare at the dot. |
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Posted: 4/22/2024 6:14:57 AM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Aikibiker: For me it seems the biggest hurdle is losing the dot during recoil and not being able to find it again for my follow up shots. So I would say practice your follow through. I just got a Leupold Deltapoint Micro on my Glock 44 and have been playing with it. Looks like the secret to using a red dot equipped pistol is going to be lots of practice. Which is why I have one on a .22 lr. I will move on to a dot on my centerfire handguns once I am confident in my presentation and reacquiring the dot after firing. Had no idea that would work. Just sold my G44 and bought a Sig p322 for the rds capability. Put 500 rds through it with Romeo zero this weekend. Shoots where I'm thinking. I will look into this on my next G44. Maybe by then glock will figure out how to make an optics ready 20 round .22lr. |
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TN, USA
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Posted: 4/22/2024 8:14:42 AM EDT
[#34]
I suspect you are mounting the dot on a Glock. Glocks do not lend themselves to the best alignment due to the angle of the grip. It usually points the gun high for most users.
That is something you have to learn to overcome. I altered the hump on my grip and it made the gun spot on when a natural point was taken and therefore the dot was immediately centered. As all the others have said, practice and yea shall succeed. |
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Posted: 4/22/2024 9:04:13 AM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By : For me it seems the biggest hurdle is losing the dot during recoil and not being able to find it again for my follow up shots. So I would say practice your follow through. I just got a Leupold Deltapoint Micro on my Glock 44 and have been playing with it. Looks like the secret to using a red dot equipped pistol is going to be lots of practice. Which is why I have one on a .22 lr. I will move on to a dot on my centerfire handguns once I am confident in my presentation and reacquiring the dot after firing. How did you mount your red dot to your glock 44 slide ? The red dot is the best cheat code for shooting fast and accurate OP. Much easier to learn to shoot a red dot compared to iron sights. Easy peasy...you will see. |
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Posted: 4/22/2024 10:06:23 AM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By xciapup: Genius. Pure genius. He’s correct, though. |
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USA
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Posted: 4/22/2024 10:12:55 AM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By SpankMonkey: Focus on the target. The dot will show up once your mind catches up. This. I grew up on shotgun with target focus. It is the way for me. Given that upbringing, handgun irons have always been an issue for me. I still "shotgunned" handguns and did very well in matches. Now I am moving to dots with "aging eyes," it was the answer a long time ago, just catching up. Lots of dry fire, watch and listen to Scott Jedlinski (Modern Samurai). |
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Posted: 4/22/2024 10:15:43 AM EDT
[#38]
it's slightly daunting at first especially if you're used to standard iron sights but it's a pretty easy learning curve.
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Posted: 4/22/2024 10:34:07 AM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By xciapup: Genius. Pure genius. He’s not wrong. At all. |
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Posted: 4/22/2024 10:48:43 AM EDT
[#40]
Just use the iron sights through the optical gizmo.
Ignore the dof. |
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USA
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Posted: 4/22/2024 5:29:44 PM EDT
[#41]
Loved it!!! My scores went up. The bets advise I received was to focus on the target and not the dot. Thank you everyone!
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Posted: 4/22/2024 5:40:37 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuote HistoryOriginally Posted By 11boomboom: Originally Posted By MARINE-ORDIE: I can't stop looking at the dot!!!  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9WqtRj8yPAE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P2lqy3v0ErQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tvOXPLBLCPQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yYZjLIy487gLOOK AT EXACTLY WHERE YOU WANT TO HIT. Not the general outline of the target. Not the black/brown area, look at the fibers in the target you want to hit. Dry fire draws, looking exactly on a target where you want to hit. |
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Posted: 4/22/2024 5:41:12 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By W_E_G: Just use the iron sights through the optical gizmo. Ignore the dof. |
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Posted: 4/22/2024 5:59:30 PM EDT
[Last Edit: BMSMB]
[#44]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By xciapup: Genius. Pure genius. The red dot is not the problem. It's their ability to index the gun that is. "Red dot" classes are simply a way to separate fools from money. |
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Posted: 4/22/2024 6:03:31 PM EDT
[#45]
Everyone means well but it's best to consult an ocular scientist.
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Posted: 4/22/2024 6:05:35 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By PacNW5: Everyone means well but it's best to consult an ocular scientist. Better do that in triplicate |
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Posted: 4/22/2024 6:07:37 PM EDT
[Last Edit: BMSMB]
[#47]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By DernHumpus: All of this. LOOK AT EXACTLY WHERE YOU WANT TO HIT. Not the general outline of the target. Not the black/brown area, look at the fibers in the target you want to hit. Dry fire draws, looking exactly on a target where you want to hit. Vision fuckus?
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Posted: 4/22/2024 6:09:22 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By BMSMB: Vision fuckus? I still need to buy his shirt where he’s holding the cat. |
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Posted: 4/22/2024 6:10:19 PM EDT
[#49]
If their paying you should be okay
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Posted: 4/22/2024 6:12:19 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Never_A_Wick: I still need to buy his shirt where he’s holding the cat. I had not seen that one... thats awesome  
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