DIY California-Compliant 'Non-Pistol' Grip

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[ARCHIVED THREAD] - DIY California-Compliant 'Non-Pistol' Grip

Posted: 11/1/2016 6:06:21 PM EDT

In my remaining time in CA, I'm trying not to catch any felonies.

At the same time, I'm also trying to save money.

While I can't get around buying new muzzle breaks (my plan is to roll-pin my collapsible stocks), the pistol grip was the last hurdle. So, I looked at the 'legal configuration' and compared it with the 'illegal configuration':

Then, I modified one of my old lower parts kit stock grips so that it no longer is a 'pistol grip':

I know the New York laws seem to indicate that a thumb hole or thumb access is illegal, but the California law law just says "pistol grip." In my estimation, this isn't a pistol grip, since it has the same angle common to standard rifle stocks.

I can post more photos if anyone wants to try it.

Posted: 11/1/2016 6:13:00 PM EDT

[#1]

I commend your effort. And +1 for the DIY approach.

However, the last thing I'd want is to give some gun grabbing district attorney or politician over there any little thing to take to court. You may well be right and you may well get away with it if it goes to court. But it won't be cheap. The ammount you'd spend on lawyers to argue your case would be hundreds of times what the cost of an ugly CA-friendly stock is.

Posted: 11/1/2016 6:20:42 PM EDT

[#2]

Good point, but so far there hasn't been a legal 'interpretation' that officially approves of any of the replacements out there. There's no guarantee of anything right now.

The only other option I though of was the 'bullet button' approach: cut the grip off just below the nut, and use a ring bolt to secure the remaining stump to the receiver. Then have a grip piece with a hook that slides onto the ring when you are holding it, but otherwise won't stay on the receiver. As long as it isn't attached, it can't really constitute a violation.

Posted: 11/1/2016 6:22:37 PM EDT

[#3]

Search around Calguns a little, you'll find some pretty distinct language about what constitutes a pistol grip to the CADOJ. Look into some of the other options that are proven to be legal, like paddle grips. You can make your own reasonably cheap.

Posted: 11/1/2016 8:42:25 PM EDT

[#4]

A kydex grip "wrap" is pretty simple to make and considered legal and easy to reverse.

Posted: 11/1/2016 10:44:26 PM EDT

[#5]

Hmmm...

Posted: 11/2/2016 3:23:42 AM EDT

[#6]

As far as CADOJ is concerned, anything that shoots bullet is evil and immoral. It's less of a matter of you having an AR15 that has no pistol grip and more of you having anything capable of harm. Of course they have to protect the public from those "black evil things"...

By owning guns you're already identified yourself as an enemy combatant in the eyes of CADOJ, and what little feature or whatnot is immaterial. If they want to convict you of a felony, they will. The angle of the pistol grip will not change that.

Your best bet is to move to a state where you are not considered an enemy, like Texas or Nevada.

Posted: 11/2/2016 6:04:46 AM EDT

[#7]

Unfortunately, California's definition of a banned grip, one that "protrudes conspicuously" is about as good as ATF's "sporting purpose" and open to interpretation. The only way to clearly be safe, would be to submit a request for an "opinion" from the state, the same way we request similar from ATF, and keep that response letter with your rifle(s).

12276.1(a) Notwithstanding Section 12276, “assault weapon” shall also mean any of the following:
(1) a semiautomatic, centerfire rifle that has the capacity to accept a detachable magazine and any one of the following:
(a) pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon.
(b) thumbhole stock.
(c) folding or telescoping stock
(d) grenade launcher or flare launcher.
(e) flash suppressor.
(f) forward pistol grip.

View Quote

Posted: 11/2/2016 6:59:33 AM EDT

[#8]

Quoted:
I know the New York laws seem to indicate that a thumb hole or thumb access is illegal.

View Quote

For the record, NY does not say anything about "thumb access" being illegal. Thumb hole stocks are specifically banned, but stocks like the Thordsen FRS-15 have sold in large numbers in NY without any arrests.

Posted: 11/2/2016 12:38:34 PM EDT

[#9]

Quoted:I know the New York laws seem to indicate that a thumb hole or thumb access is illegal, but the California law law just says "pistol grip." In my estimation, this isn't a pistol grip, since it has the same angle common to standard rifle stocks.

I can post more photos if anyone wants to try it.

View Quote

But it isn't a stock, it is still a grip.

I can see it going either way...

Posted: 11/2/2016 4:23:20 PM EDT

[#10]

What if you removed the gas system, fixed the magazine (so it is no longer removable), would that be more CA compliant?

Posted: 11/2/2016 5:14:44 PM EDT

[#11]

What would you do with an AR and no gas system? Do they make a blowback .223? You could tie a white flag to it and wave it around I suppose.

Posted: 11/2/2016 5:29:13 PM EDT

[#12]

This won't be an issue in January. Just wait it out.

Posted: 11/2/2016 6:04:25 PM EDT

[#13]

Quote History

Quoted:
What would you do with an AR and no gas system? Do they make a blowback .223? You could tie a white flag to it and wave it around I suppose.

View Quote

Straight pull bolt action. The Brits are pretty good with them these days.

Posted: 11/2/2016 9:40:29 PM EDT

[#14]

The idea is since California seems to have issue with any semi auto rifles... making them straight pull bolt action with a fixed magazine would negate any "assault weapon" laws. Then they'd have to ban weapons based on cosmetics and it'd fall flat on its face.

Posted: 11/2/2016 11:01:05 PM EDT

[#15]

I think the Brits have worked out a pump action setup

Posted: 11/2/2016 11:17:26 PM EDT

[#16]

Oh shit i almost fell off my chair laughing. Maybe the judge will have a sence of humor.

Posted: 11/3/2016 1:25:54 AM EDT

[#17]

Quote History

Quoted:
I think the Brits have worked out a pump action setup

View Quote

Doesn't Troy make a pump action AR style rifle? Pump action lower with a standard upper in it.

Edit, found the link.
https://troydefense.com/pumpactionrifle/

Looks like a typical AR, with a side charging like upper. Instead of a charging handle out the side, it has a slide that works the bolt.

I guess being a single shot nullifies the ban laws on evil semi auto rifles?

Posted: 11/3/2016 4:52:26 AM EDT

[#18]

As far as I understand it, the rifle has to be both semi-auto, and accept detachable magazines. THEN the "evil features" make it an "assault rifle". This has been the reason for the "bullet button", as this has been considered a "fixed" magazine due to requiring a tool for removal of the magazine.

So, yes, something like a side charger with the gas system disabled (plugged gas block with no gas tube installed?) or somehow installing a "pump" forearm with a push rod attached to it just like a piston system's push rod, could not be an assault rifle.

Posted: 11/3/2016 9:19:20 AM EDT

[#19]

DPMS used to market a pump back in the 1990's.

Posted: 11/3/2016 3:14:34 PM EDT

[#20]

Pump action AR? Well that is... odd? different?

Posted: 11/3/2016 4:12:23 PM EDT

[#21]

Quote History

Quoted:
This won't be an issue in January. Just wait it out.

View Quote

How is that?

Posted: 11/5/2016 3:25:04 AM EDT

[#22]

OP your modified grip does not work. The web between the thumb and finger has to be aBovey a line even with the top of the trigger, per DOJ regulations. You are close, but not high enough.

[ARCHIVED THREAD] - DIY California-Compliant 'Non-Pistol' Grip

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