Nobody over-emphasized the exposure of the part as you claimed, you literally made that up. I said it was exposed, period. Which it is.  Last time I checked, dirt and sand do not need much space to ruin your day.  There's a video on you tube you can watch and see it happen.

And once again, I really have no desire to defend any other gun, I made a statement about the Stribog. The fact does remain that the guns you are complaining about have decades of real world use to provide data, whereas the Stribog has little to none, especially not in it's current model and whatever third party parts mashup is required to actually make it run reliably.

I'm willing to bet that the service tests for 500+ military and police entities worldwide probably took care of that requirement. I'm fairly certain somebody has lightly placed an Mp5 in sand or mud at some point and seen the result, however a quick look on google and I still found several MP5 test videos.  Another quick look and I found a half dozen torture tests for the APC 9 that went way above the Stribog tests without failure.

If you can’t see the relevancy of you judging one gun in an overly harsh test and the other gets a get out of jail free card because no one has done the same test (gee, wonder why?) then I don’t think you’re worth continuing the conversation with lol. From accounts I have been given, the MP5 will fail in the same type of tests, period.

Is it a more proven gun? Sure.
Is anyone going to convince me that it’s better or more reliable than the Stribog based on MY experiences and people I know and trust/believe experiences? Absolutely not.
And I feel the same way about B&T. There’s loads of posts here and many many other groups with a very wide range of issues and failures with B&T’s.

Edit: No. mil and police tests are not as harsh as the mud tests the Stribog failed. All of them (that I’m aware of), the gun gets rinsed off after the mud, THEN fired. Not picked directly out the mud and immediately fired.
Not to mention, they have an accept failure rate. The fact that the fun won a contract doesn’t mean it passed said test with zero issues.

You claim to be unbiased, etc - but the things you say show you either are, or are just not educated on a lot of what you say.

They have absolutely done the same tests. You don't get purchased by the US military without that happening. Do a search for APC 9 torture tests, there's tons of them, and they don't just lightly lay the gun in sand and watch it fail like they did with the Stribog.

Once again, the real point here is the Stribog failed exactly like I said it would.




There's 70+ pages of pretty much people complaining about Stribog failures...you're posting in it.

I have an APC9 and a Stribog and have only seen one of them repeatably fail.  Also only one of them was issued by my job, who kinda takes that stuff seriously.

What is your purpose for coming into a specific gun thread ie. This stribog thread and shitting on it? If you don't like the gun move on buy or use what you like

Lemme ask my question again, since it was asked before this pissing match of two pages started, A3S model or full length? It will be suppressed 100% of the time and have a scorpion mag lower. Already have both full size and k clones but want to try out a bog.

SP9A3 and have barrel cut down to 6.5”.
The most aesthetic Stribog setup ever.

I was thinking the 8" and just get the extended rail piece. But a big part of me does like the cut down look. They sell 6.5" barrels also right?

Discussion, same as everyone else. I didn't shit on it, I countered the comment that it was fully vetted with real world use, which it most certainly is not.

If you don't like it, scroll down.

Mine is ran suppressed full time, so I didn’t want the 8.5”.
Didn’t want the S model because the full size offers an extra MLOK space and more picatinny length on the bottom. So I came to the conclusion that the ultimate setup was the full size with a chopped barrel.

Got a SP9A3S from Gun Zone Deals. What type of RDS works best with these? I was reading that someone said a lower mount is better but what do you all think?

With a brace?  Depends on your preferences

If you are looking for concealment, such as in a small backpack, I would stay for a low mount

If you like a head up height then go for what works for you.

Makes sense. Thank you for your input!

Yeah with the SB brace. I’m planning on concealing it in a small backpack.

Does anyone have the width of a SP9A3S with the brace folded?

I put the 1st 200 rounds through my 10mm,180gr blazer my 1st impression this is a very accurate gun also was surprised by the recoil impulse it was much heavier than I expected

Thanks for the post.

And well... hmmm.  That's not encouraging.  The roller delay was supposed to make that mild.  To report that with weak Blazer ammo with light bullets isn't super encouraging.

Is there any word on the SP45A3?

IIRC, GO said "end of February " at SHOT.

I mean it’s 10MM. It’s never going to feel like 9MM, roller delayed or not lol.

Du...duude!  ROLLER DELAYED!!  It's supposed to be soft as a .22.   We're talking .22 SHORT here people.  If you listen closely, it hymns a small ballad every shot!

Kidding aside, the roller delay IS pretty sweet in 9mm.   I guess one will have to compare a RD 10mm vs blowback 10mm, to make a fair assessment of its value there.

It arrived.  Red dot should be here Monday, tempted to yank one off something else to go to the range this weekend.

What red dot are you going with?

Another Romeo 5.   It’s just a range toy.

Perfect little setup.  Can’t wait to see how it runs.

Badass setup! Mine should be in Monday.

What suppressor is that?

Yhm R9.  Still haven’t put a round through it.

Neat!

I will say the factory safety levers are kind of terrible,  and upgrading to the HBI version was a big improvement.  I have every confidence these are at least just as good , and has a few more options even - though only way I'm switching again, is if those lever and barrel are also attached to a binary trigger.  THAT would have my interest!  Especially if priced less than the gun, and has a bolt close trip-sear like Fostec runs, to mitigate outpacing it!

On my setup, I run long throw lever on the main side, and short throw on my trigger finger side, and it's absolutely perfect.  I use one finger with little effort to flip off, and the other with as little effort to flip on.

Any ideas about the best optic to put on a SP10A3?  Promethean LP-1 or a Primary Arms prism or something else?

Have an EOTech on my SP9A3 and it’s 10/10.

300 suppressed rounds this morning.   Ran flawless.  Really loving this thing.  The R9 works great.  Trigger could use a little attention.  Not bad, but I’d like it a bit lighter.

Stribog at the range with UNDER CAM - mounted.  Next, I'm going to see if that actually recorded anything.



Followed by Stribog, in quick-detach SNIPER MODE!



Ran the gun with uber-weak 115 gr 9mm ammo that was barely 1100 FPS (if that), so I ran the US 45 degree block for that.  Ran all 4 mags (including 2 straights) 100%, no problem.

Then went up to a mid-power batch, so switched back to the Euro 40degree block.  It's still pretty mild ammo, but not uber-weak.  And the Stribog ran 4 more mags of that - 100% no problem.

Kind of disappointed with the ACTION CAM footage, resolution sucks, frame rate sucks, ability to keep up to fast-changing scenes kind of sucks.  Ah well.  If you watch, go to 1024 setting and watch full-screen, to see the best it can do, which is only so so.  Gun ran great, even though ammo was pretty weak.  And yes, some of the steel shots are pretty close.  It worked out fine, but yes, typically better to be a little further back.



I have over 3000 rounds on this gun now.

I put a 3x prism on mine,I like it

Any of you fellow 10mm guys have a 30rd mag source?

I don't think one exists.  I really want a 10 and a 30 round mag for the SP10A3.  Also, a good place to buy any mag for the SP10A3 at a better that MSRP price.

Darn,I wanted the same a 30 and a 10

So this is kind of odd…..

About a month ago I was cruising this thread and realized my sub 3000 serial SP9A3 never had the “update” done to it.  I did reach out years ago and got an updated locker (roller?) , so I have both the “US” marked and the original one.

I never had any issue with mine so I never sent it in.  I had asked for them to send me a replacement bolt/roller but they refused.  When i visited the thread again a month ago I reached out to GO again asking to BUY an updated bolt, just in case as this is an SBR and want to have parts in case GO eventually disappears (it will eventually, they all do.). Again they said “no, not unless you send your gun in and we examine it and determine it needs a replacement.”

This pisses me off and I’ve been vocal about it on various boards.  It’s my position that you should be able to buy EVERY part of the gun should you want to.  Why not?  What does it hurt the manufacturer or vendor?  I understand it’s their business and they do what they want.  And I as a customer can let other people know this is an issue and recommend another platform.  (I do like my Stribog, just wish they’d sell parts.  Also too bad they beta tested instead of bringing in a proven product.  It killed their reputation and marketability as I think they’re the best PCC VALUE out there.  Not the best, but the best bang for your buck.)

Anyway, about a month goes by and last night a small parcel arrives from GO in Florida.  It’s a new bolt and roller with hollow pin.  Don’t know why, maybe they just got around to it?  Went back through their prior sub 3000 serial SP9A3 customers and sent them a bolt?  Who knows.

But when I was comparing bolts and tried to fit the new bolt into my gun it won’t fit.  Well, it goes in a bit, with pressure, but does not slide in and won’t be operable.

I was hoping KDG could enlighten me as to why this happens?  Is this the crappy extrusions you were taking about?  It’s the top channel that doesn’t fit.

For comparison my original bolt measures about .856” while the new one is .859”. The upper channel in the receiver is at about .860” give or take.  It goes it, but it rubs.  I may just take a stone to it and see if just a tiny bit will get it to slide freely.  I’ll lose the finish on those side, but as it is I can’t even use it.

I noticed some differences between the bolt, the most obvious being the new one is one piece and weighs less.  The new one has additional lightning cuts as well but is only .2 ounces lighter (11.7 vs 11.5 oz.)

I can post pics if anyone wants me too.

First thing I'd do is follow up with GO.

Also, IPSCSTORE.COM is where I picked a few wear items and springs.  Haven't needed them - but as  P7 owner, faw better to drop $40 on a bunch of cheap specialty springs when they are still cheap, than to wait.
I grabbed a spare roller too, and now have both weights.  Just last weekend I had some way underpowered reloads that wouldn't even cycle some of my handguns.  So I dropped down to US marked block and ran it all through the Stribog, no problem. Which tells you all you need to know about if you really should be running the US marked one as the standard ( Because I sure dont!).

[Doublepost]

Which roller do I need for the a3 to run suppressed full time? I'm up on my HK guns but not sure which roller to get for this one. Will be running usual 115's, 124's, and 147's. Nothing too hot or "NATO" powered.

Shortest you can get.  US is 45 degree and IMHO too weak even for regular weak US ammo.  With warm ammo and a supressor, you'll beat up your gun and rails.  at least 40 degree, and for some reason I thought there was a suppressed 35(?) degree?  but I've never actually seen one anywhere, so maybe not.  But throw away the US 45 and get a 40.  IMHO, the 45 should have never even been made, I never run it, even with mid-power 115 gr ammo.

Does anyone have any experience accurizing the Stribog? I have had just horrendous accuracy compared to all my friends. I have tried different ammo which brought the 50 yard groups from 7" to 6.5" and then swapped the barrel to an ILWT barrel which cut group sizes to 5" at 50 yards. I removed my KDG multi stage buffer and swapped to a HB short stroke buffer which cit groups to about 4" as the KDG had very inconsistent resistance with the forward buffer just stopping in random places in the upper each shot and I was getting crazy vertical stringing.

When I swapped my barrels and removed the original barrel, the outter nut took 100 ft/lbs to remove. The next barrel nut took only 1 ft/lbs to remove. I reinstalled the first nut to 25 and the second to 35.

I noticed that the barrel bushings and barrel seats have these little circular nipple looking marks like the opposite of injection molding ejector marks. The barrel nut even seats up against one of those and it can't be good for a flush fit by the barrel nut. I have considered grinding these flat. Are they necessary or intentional?

Also, I have considered using some kind of sleeve compound to tighten the fit of the barrel in the barrel seat and barrel bushing. Should I do that or is there anything else I can do to accurize the Stribog? I am used to getting my long guns to get to near or under MOA and it is disappointing I can shoot my Glock offhand at 25 yards better than my Stribog with a brace.

Um. Wow - you have done a lot.

Sell it. And buy another one?  Kind of not kidding.

Here's how mine shoots at 100 yards.  Using mixed bag shaped America Reloading 115 gr pulled FMJs loaded with 700x +/- 15% progessive charged ammo.  

@lazyengineer

Yes, I saw those images in my search for answers and almost thought you were lying about the distance for those groups. The very best 5 shot groups I can get currently are 1.5" at 25 yards, but that is just NOT consistent. I will randomly place a round 3-4" low or 1-2" high at 25y if I shoot a 10 round group.

The crazy thing is... almost all my groups are 1" or usually less than 1" wide at 25y. It is almost pure vertical stringing. I shot an unsuppressed group into two groups at 25 yards. Three bullets into one hole  at 25 yards and two bullets into one hole 4" above the first group.

Unsuppressed seems to be worse than suppressed, so I am thinking the weight must be helping hold the barrel in place.
Also my unsuppressed groups are a good 4" lower at 25 yards than my suppressed groups. First time I have ever had a 16 MOA up shift on target going suppressed.

Please post pics. I am wondering if my accuracy problem is due to a bolt fit mismatch to my upper. I would love to see where you measured and compare.

Best I can measure, my upper channel is 0.876" if measured at the bottom of channel, 0.879" if measured at the top of the channel. If I measure the height of that channel it seems to be about .601" inside. The lower body opening appears to be 1.249" at the top of the channel and 1.256" at the bottom of the channel in width. So it seems both channels are smaller near the upper rails and flare outward slightly.

Bolt face width (upper portion which would be the carrier if this gun had a seperate bolt and carrier) is 0.859" across the section where the roller inserts up front and also 0.859" wide where the recoil spring inserts in the rear.

Also,  my 40 degree roller shaft (silver part where the roller pin sits) has a small amount of rotational play and an almost undetectable amount of fore/after play in the square portion of the roller block body (the black part that fits into upper in front of bolt and behind charging handle) That roller block body is also 0.856" across. My US roller block is also 0.856" across but has ZERO detectable shaft play.

My bolt face is flat but the extractor sits several thou proud of the bolt face. You can both see and feel that is is sitting proud of the bolt face. My bolt front to back appears to be 2.517" but measured over the extractor it is 2.520" so the extractor face sits 3 thou proud of the bolt face. I know the extractor touches the barrel when the bolt is in battery because I can see the imprint/silver wear through the carbon on the back of the barrel with bolt removed and that there is no contact of the bolt from about 5 o'clock to almost 3 o'clock where the extractor touches. Could that effect accuracy?

Wonder how yours or others compare.

From what I have measured so far... the 40 degree block is possibly loose when it should not be? Would love to get others measurements to see and see if you have shaft play in your roller block. Also it seems my upper channel is possibly not square and most definitely oversized.

more Stribog accuracy issues I see.
i sent mine off to get fixed but apparently nothing is wrong with mine and its juuuust fine when they shot it.
they sent me pics of their groupings with certain ammo that was used. i purchased the same exact ammo they shot and will be doing testing hopefully this weekend.
contemplating recording it and uploading to youtube. mine still shoots all over the fuckin place.
they also ignored me a few times asking for a different roller to use for full time suppressed. it seems like they dont give a shit about fixing issues and will just gaslight you until you tell them to just send the gun back to you.
one thing they did not have was the collapsible pistol brace, i dont think that having it on there would make the accuracy worse. they shot it with the plastic 1913 back plate.

weird how i can make accurate groups at 25 yards with micro pistols with red dots. but cant seem to keep this thing inside a 4" circle at 25 yards with red dot, 3x magnifier, tripod, bipod, rear bag, etc etc.
im sure its just that i cant shoot well...

Hmmm.  That's not right.  Let's try some elimination. I think some of which you already did.

Run it bare (exposed threads)

Use your thumb to apply pressure on the end of the barrel while gun empty!  It better not wiggle.
.

Have someone else try to shoot it (I know, I know)

FWIW I have noticed consistency of shoulder pressure can make a difference in my own tests.  If you are running yours with no shoulder pressure but just hand pressure, 8" is a lot of travel time for a n awkward "pistol" to move from shot-to-shot of free handing it (I guess)? You sound like you've testing it with great care and likely been consistent on that, so that's maybe a bit casual for me to just say; but yea - in your next test, try to do it so the guns mechanical recoil is very consistent during the shot?  (Such as shoulding it, and consistently - I'll let you work through the legalitis, and jus tsay I assume of couse this is aregistered SBR blah blah )

In my experience Stribog is not ammo particular so bad for accuracy behavior.  Though POI can shift if notably higher power level - such as from bullet setback.   So .. maybe try a 5 shot string with each round manually loaded by hand into into the chamber?  I doubt thats actually it either, but just try it as an method of elemination.

Finally, try get a borescope and let's see what your throat and crown look like.

say, while I've never actually heard of this - if they botched the install of the steel insert the roller delay rides into, I could see that causing irregular bolt movement and maybe throwing off a shot.  Maybe show some of your fired brass, and see if you can feel the insert (not easy) and confirm it's not wiggling around or anything like that.  And your bolt itself along with the weight, has easy and free movement in the channel as well.    Related to that, when I clean, I will run a thick patch/wad all the way down the channel to clear out the rails all the way through the gun.  Make sure using a cleaning rod tip or whatever that the pathway is smooth and clear.

your roller is still round, right?

I’m using the 40 degree suppressed and it has zero issues with various brand and weight of ammo.
I’m actually contemplating even trying the 35 to get it to shoot even softer.

So they do make a 35?  Considering how well mine runs even mid-power 115's with a 40, I would think a supressor would likely need to go to a 35 - if they make it.  Where can you get one?

I’m pretty sure I remember seeing somewhere that they do offer a 35. I could be remembering wrong though.
I would imagine GO would have them if they do.

I'm not sure if this got covered yet but the Lingle Industries gen2 CZ mag lower has an updated bolt catch design.

https://lingleindustries.com/gen-2-aluminum-stribog-lower/
Attached File


I already have the A3 Tactical Scorpion mag lower but curious if anyone has tried this one out? Like @daemon734 pointed out I've always found the factory bolt catch to be a sub par design.