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Posted: 1/30/2024 2:14:39 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By mickdonaldson: IIRC, Holosun's parent company started out in the LASER Diode business in the late 90's / Early 2K - they definitely know diodes. I like Nick, but I've seen him make mistakes before, in regards to Aurora's. Not that this was a mistake, he just filmed what he was given. In some other comments on other posts on his IG, he says he didn't install any fresh batteries, and he also saw the HS employees doing it later. Who knows - we won't be able to buy one before they all get released to the YT shills on "The NDA Expires Day" - so imma just wait and watch. Oh, I didn't know that about Holosun's parent company. Good to know. Well, Holosun has managed to establish a good reputation for their existing regulated civ power lasers. I've seen good reviews on their current lasers from pretty much everyone I think is worth listening to. I still have my issues with purchasing anything Chinese, but I was thinking the other night that by now most U.S. companies are probably using components that are manufactured in China anyways.  A useable IR Illuminator/laser is a must have item for me and at approximately $800-$900 this is going to be a hard deal to pass up. I hope it's everything they say it is and more. |
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Posted: 1/31/2024 12:21:13 AM EDT
[Last Edit: Magsz18]
[#2]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By KaerMorhenResident: Oh, I didn't know that about Holosun's parent company. Good to know. Well, Holosun has managed to establish a good reputation for their existing regulated civ power lasers. I've seen good reviews on their current lasers from pretty much everyone I think is worth listening to. I still have my issues with purchasing anything Chinese, but I was thinking the other night that by now most U.S. companies are probably using components that are manufactured in China anyways. A useable IR Illuminator/laser is a must have item for me and at approximately $800-$900 this is going to be a hard deal to pass up. I hope it's everything they say it is and more. It's impossible to own everything American or non Chinese made in 2024. Holosun employs a bunch of American's and has proven over the years that they are committed to this market. |
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Posted: 1/31/2024 12:47:37 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Magsz18: It's impossible to own everything American or non Chinese made in 2024. Holosun employs a bunch of American's and has proven over the years that they are committed to this market. Yeah, that's the thing I'm kind of realizing. What makes something an "American" product now? It's disturbing how reliant we are now on Asian manufactured electronic components. Somehow I doubt our military hardware isn't reliant on foreign made components. |
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Posted: 1/31/2024 11:47:01 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By KaerMorhenResident: Yeah, that's the thing I'm kind of realizing. What makes something an "American" product now? It's disturbing how reliant we are now on Asian manufactured electronic components. Somehow I doubt our military hardware isn't reliant on foreign made components. I think there are laws or regulations that prevent that from happening. I'm not exactly sure what they are but I think they're in place. Can someone provide more info about this? It's kind of germane to the discussion. |
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Posted: 2/1/2024 2:02:38 AM EDT
[Last Edit: TNVC]
[#5]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Magsz18: I think there are laws or regulations that prevent that from happening. I'm not exactly sure what they are but I think they're in place. Can someone provide more info about this? It's kind of germane to the discussion. Look up "Berry Amendment" |
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Posted: 2/1/2024 4:15:24 AM EDT
[#6]
I'm definitely hoping at this point that the Holosun is legit and Nick was wrong/something was wonky.
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USA
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Posted: 2/1/2024 7:57:01 AM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Magsz18: I think there are laws or regulations that prevent that from happening. I'm not exactly sure what they are but I think they're in place. Can someone provide more info about this? It's kind of germane to the discussion. Defense Acquisition Regulation Supplement (DFARS) 252.225-7000 Qualifying Country Sources As Subcontractors |
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Posted: 2/1/2024 12:12:53 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By DDS87: Defense Acquisition Regulation Supplement (DFARS) 252.225-7000 Qualifying Country Sources As Subcontractors I'm surprised not to see South Korea on that list, since outside of Taiwan I believe they're the only folks making decent semiconductors via Samsung. Not exactly clear how they prevent some of the higher end systems from utilizing TSC semiconductors, but maybe that's why military electronic hardware always seems to be way behind the civilian sector. It's interesting that to be eligible for those DOD contracts means that the U.S. companies are subcontracting out to countries that are going to be more expensive than getting parts from China and perhaps that has a bit to do with the end unit costs being higher for things like RADI Xe and so forth than say something like this IRIS. Since they can't just go to China to get cheaper components. Whereas, here we have Holosun that isn't seeking any DOD or perhaps even LEO contracts and concentrating solely on the civilian market so they can absolutely come in at a much lower price point. Does that make sense or am I way off here in my thinking? |
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Posted: 2/4/2024 12:51:08 PM EDT
[Last Edit: JohnDough]
[#9]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By KaerMorhenResident: I'm surprised not to see South Korea on that list, since outside of Taiwan I believe they're the only folks making decent semiconductors via Samsung. Not exactly clear how they prevent some of the higher end systems from utilizing TSC semiconductors, but maybe that's why military electronic hardware always seems to be way behind the civilian sector. It's interesting that to be eligible for those DOD contracts means that the U.S. companies are subcontracting out to countries that are going to be more expensive than getting parts from China and perhaps that has a bit to do with the end unit costs being higher for things like RADI Xe and so forth than say something like this IRIS. Since they can't just go to China to get cheaper components. Whereas, here we have Holosun that isn't seeking any DOD or perhaps even LEO contracts and concentrating solely on the civilian market so they can absolutely come in at a much lower price point. Does that make sense or am I way off here in my thinking? Mainly, Im glad to see Holosun undercutting the boutique companies like Wilcox, BEM, etc as it will force them to make better products to compete. They can't keep making the same quality of stuff and expect to compete with a cheaper company. They also are stuck by gov contracts, in their price bracket. The only way forward is to make a better product. It will drive improvements in quality, if not design. In the mean time, we can benefit from Holosun, etc as there is no real reason to pay more, until then. |
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Posted: 2/4/2024 4:48:00 PM EDT
[Last Edit: mickdonaldson]
[#10]
They (BEM, L3, Wilcox) don't GAF about the non-gov market (pet peeve: if you aren't subject to the Uniform Code of Military Justice, you are a civilian). I predict nothing will change with their pricing - but would love to be wrong
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Posted: 2/4/2024 4:57:37 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By JohnDough: Mainly, Im glad to see Holosun undercutting the boutique companies like Wilcox, BEM, etc as it will force them to make better products to compete. They can't keep making the same quality of stuff and expect to compete with a cheaper company. They also are stuck by gov contracts, in their price bracket. The only way forward is to make a better product. It will drive improvements in quality, if not design. In the mean time, we can benefit from Holosun, etc as there is no real reason to pay more, until then. None of those companies care about civ sales. They will keep the price and keep targeting contracts. They aren't trying to compete on the civ side. |
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Posted: 2/4/2024 7:57:51 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By FoxValleyTacDriver: None of those companies care about civ sales. They will keep the price and keep targeting contracts. They aren't trying to compete on the civ side. If enough LE sales are to be had, I'd hope it would matter. |
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Posted: 2/4/2024 9:15:37 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By JohnDough: If enough LE sales are to be had, I'd hope it would matter. LE depts don't have the MIL money but, the ones here all have very high budgets. They can afford all of the high dollar lasers. |
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Posted: 2/4/2024 9:48:40 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Loonytik: LE depts don't have the MIL money but, the ones here all have very high budgets. They can afford all of the high dollar lasers. But if they could buy the holosuns that now may well do the same thing for less, they'd have even better balance sheets. |
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USA
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Posted: 2/5/2024 12:08:52 AM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Loonytik: LE depts don't have the MIL money but, the ones here all have very high budgets. They can afford all of the high dollar lasers. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Loonytik: Originally Posted By JohnDough: If enough LE sales are to be had, I'd hope it would matter. LE depts don't have the MIL money but, the ones here all have very high budgets. They can afford all of the high dollar lasers. Many LE’s already run and/or are seeking RFQ’s for Holosun optics for their pistols and duty rifles. Easy for me to see departments seeking a $800 IRIS (even cheaper price point for LE depts) rather than trying to spend 4x times for other names. Holosun really has a market it can carve out here between CIV and LE department needs. Let the EOTech/BEM/Wilcox/L3 Harris all fight against each other for the same pie. |
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USA
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Posted: 2/5/2024 7:34:11 AM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Advance: @mickdonaldson TheNovaGroup is a YT channel run by BF and Hop. BF goes into detail on the IRIS at the 1:35 mark. At 3:33 BF talks about Nick Chen's experience and then goes on to say that he (BF) brought a PVS-14 and a new battery to the Holosun booth and did a little bit of testing.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-40BiC5QNDwOGL no-show is a letdown. Was hoping to hear something. |
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Posted: 2/5/2024 7:36:49 AM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Master_Blaster: OGL no-show is a letdown. Was hoping to hear something. OGL civ will be availabe for around $2999, Mid to late 2024, per Eotech at SHOT. Whether this happens, is anyone's guess. |
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Posted: 2/5/2024 9:07:13 AM EDT
[Last Edit: metalsaber]
[#18]
$3k civie laser is a no go imo. I mean if you got the $$$ and want to flex, go ahead but for the masses, thats a non starter
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Posted: 2/5/2024 11:04:00 AM EDT
[#19]
meh for 3k might as well spend a bit more an pick up an ngal if you have a leo friend... the size of the mawl and raid are way too big and heavy.
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Posted: 2/5/2024 11:17:48 AM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By whiteryno: meh for 3k might as well spend a bit more an pick up an ngal if you have a leo friend... the size of the mawl and raid are way too big and heavy. While I agree ngal is best, its only 1.9oz lighter than the Raid Xe. The real issue is that when it breaks, well, it might be bad news bears. Thats why I bought a Raid Xe, so when it has problems, I can get it fixed by the mothership without issues. |
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Posted: 2/7/2024 3:10:26 PM EDT
[Last Edit: KaerMorhenResident]
[#21]
I'm just not going to spend more for a laser/illuminator than I did for the actual night vision itself, that just seems like I'm being "taken" for a ride honestly.
From what I understand the MIL/LEO manufacturers are limited to procuring electronic components that are NOT from China and that might be one of the reasons that their IR Laser/Illums are so damn expensive, but be that as it may I'm a working man and have competing financial priorities than just night vision. However, even if I had the money to just burn I'd still be reluctant to spend over $3K on a laser, because again that just seems unreasonable to me given that manufacturing night vision is bit more complex and yet you can get a PVS14 cheaper or at the same cost as some of these lasers. |
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AZ, USA
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Posted: 2/7/2024 3:25:31 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Defaultmp3]
[#22]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By JohnDough: While I agree ngal is best, its only 1.9oz lighter than the Raid Xe. The real issue is that when it breaks, well, it might be bad news bears. Thats why I bought a Raid Xe, so when it has problems, I can get it fixed by the mothership without issues. |
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Posted: 2/7/2024 4:07:36 PM EDT
[Last Edit: French1966]
[#23]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By KaerMorhenResident: I'm just not going to spend more for a laser/illuminator than I did for the actual night vision itself, that just seems like I'm being "taken" for a ride honestly. . My feelings also. Lasers, in the grand scheme of things, aren’t exactly some magical force multiplier. They aren’t that serious of a piece of equipment imo, but have garnered a lot of attention in the NV community as just being cool things to have, typical instagram thirst trap stuff. Anything grey market like FP Peqs, LA5, Ngal etc… are popular with certain crowds because you can’t buy them off the shelf as a regular civilian. Thus, they bring a premium. I try to stay under the $1,500 mark as I feel thats the maximum any laser is worth based on the capability it provides. And I’ve scored a good deal of FP units at less than that, including a recent mint chocolate chip peq15 for $1,200 shipped. Again, to each their own if they can justify spending more, I just think the $1,500+ laser market is laughable, and the $2,500+ exotic laser market is even more of a joke. I can buy all the Ngals I want, I have the budget and the connection, but I’ll never do it because of how dumb I think it is to, like you said above, “spend more for a laser/illuminator” than what I can get a good set of beater/loaner binos for. I hope this Holosun VCSEL puts an end to some of the bullshit inflated grey laser market. If it ends up being decent I’ll sell my peq15 and grab two Holosuns. Photo, cause threads are boring without them…  Attached File |
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Posted: 2/7/2024 8:28:20 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Defaultmp3: What makes the NGAL the best? Seems to me that the NGAL trades size for functionality; while the NGAL is definitely smaller and lighter, it does not have adjustable power levels (so if you use the ND filter for the pointer, you defeat your ability to use vis override), does not have the CQB illuminator, is much more difficult to manipulate the focus wheel for the illuminator, and lacks the programmability of the tapeswitch. The guy that L3 consulted to design the NGAL basically only used dual high, thought the rear focus knob was a huge improvement over the front one and didn't use it much anyway, and never used the CQB diffuser (which is terrible for CQB IME). The guy that helped BE Meyers design the MAWL was from the same unit and went the opposite direction on everything, so this is all personal preference. There is no best laser. There may a laser that's best for a particular user though. |
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Posted: 2/7/2024 8:34:11 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By French1966: Lasers, in the grand scheme of things, aren't exactly some magical force multiplier. They aren't that serious of a piece of equipment Couldn't disagree more. While I've been in environments that didn't require an illuminator, I've also been in plenty where you couldn't target discriminate without one at 5 yards. A NV rifle without an illuminator is like a defensive/duty rifle without a weapon light. Half the time it's fine, but half the time it's useless. |
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Posted: 2/7/2024 11:04:16 PM EDT
[#26]
@topgunpilot20
Like your truth serum.
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Posted: 2/7/2024 11:51:17 PM EDT
[Last Edit: French1966]
[#27]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By topgunpilot20: Couldn't disagree more. While I've been in environments that didn't require an illuminator, I've also been in plenty where you couldn't target discriminate without one at 5 yards. A NV rifle without an illuminator is like a defensive/duty rifle without a weapon light. Half the time it's fine, but half the time it's useless. Posting your misunderstanding of what I wrote isn’t “truth serum”, nor is stating the obvious. “Not that serious of a piece of equipment” that justifies paying what another set of night vision costs, building upon what the previous poster said… but I guess that point was lost. It’s important to fully read the previous comments and understand the context of what’s being discussed. Was I without a LAM on the rifle photo I posted? No… So I don’t know what the purpose of your other comments are either. Or was that directed at someone else? |
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Posted: 2/8/2024 9:18:57 AM EDT
[Last Edit: mickdonaldson]
[#28]
After watching a ton of Ukr/Rus vids - I aint' hitting that LAM button if it's real and they have NODs... sucks for you if you didn't do Adjacent Unit Coordinations
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Posted: 2/8/2024 12:16:27 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By mickdonaldson: After watching a ton of Ukr/Rus vids - I aint' hitting that LAM button if it's real and they have NODs... sucks for you if you didn't do Adjacent Unit Coordinations You don’t want to push the “get you killed/droned/mortered/give away your exact position” button? How do you except to have any fun in wartime? Everyone knows you can just respawn after getting killed. |
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Posted: 2/8/2024 12:36:41 PM EDT
[Last Edit: topgunpilot20]
[#30]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By French1966: Posting your misunderstanding of what I wrote isn't "truth serum", nor is stating the obvious. "Not that serious of a piece of equipment" that justifies paying what another set of night vision costs, building upon what the previous poster said but I guess that point was lost. It's important to fully read the previous comments and understand the context of what's being discussed. Was I without a LAM on the rifle photo I posted? No So I don't know what the purpose of your other comments are either. Or was that directed at someone else? Even with the additional context, I still disagree and consider laser/illuminators extremely valuable; as valuable as NODs. I strongly prefer dual tubes, but I'd rather have a PVS14 and illuminator over just duals. I do agree that LAM prices are crazy though. I wouldn't pay over $3k for one either. I think the $1800-2000 PEQ15s are the best deal right now, but Holosun will print money with this new laser if the illuminator performance is similar to the MAWL C1. |
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Posted: 2/8/2024 1:21:45 PM EDT
[Last Edit: French1966]
[#31]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By topgunpilot20: Even with the additional context, I still disagree and consider laser/illuminators extremely valuable; as valuable as NODs. I strongly prefer dual tubes, but I'd rather have a PVS14 and illuminator over just duals. I do agree that LAM prices are crazy though. I wouldn't pay over $3k for one either. I think the $1800-2000 PEQ15s are the best deal right now, but Holosun will print money with this new laser if the illuminator performance is similar to the MAWL C1. So there’s no disagreement. You wouldn’t pay over $3k, that was quite literally my only point (nothing more). I would just say by nature of what IR laser modules are, they aren’t as valuable as Nods (as a stand-alone tool), because you need night vision to even use them. Otherwise they are useless. I guess we can disagree if you think vis lasers are super useful. I don’t think they are |
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CA, USA
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Posted: 2/8/2024 1:22:38 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By topgunpilot20: Even with the additional context, I still disagree and consider laser/illuminators extremely valuable; as valuable as NODs. I strongly prefer dual tubes, but I'd rather have a PVS14 and illuminator over just duals. I do agree that LAM prices are crazy though. I wouldn't pay over $3k for one either. I think the $1800-2000 PEQ15s are the best deal right now, but Holosun will print money with this new laser if the illuminator performance is similar to the MAWL C1. In a theoretical vacuum or if anyone were in an real world crisis/war zone scenario I will feel truly sorry for any of my homies that didn’t invest into NV and LAMs. However, I do agree that for the average Joe, it’s already going above and beyond to even own a PVS-14. That puts you in what, 0.5% of the general population and maybe 3% of gun owners? Add to that, the necessity for a LAM, and I tend to agree that spending more than $1K is an unrealistic expectation. Whether NV purists agree with it or not, I do think that $1K price point is consumers line in the sand. And Holosun recognizes that by intentionally getting well under it. If the industry was ever able to offer $1500-$2000 NODs and $1K VSCEL LAMs, I think you’d see NV buy in from the general gun ownership population jump from 3-5% to 15% immediately. |
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Posted: 2/8/2024 4:14:47 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ct78: In a theoretical vacuum or if anyone were in an real world crisis/war zone scenario I will feel truly sorry for any of my homies that didn't invest into NV and LAMs. However, I do agree that for the average Joe, it's already going above and beyond to even own a PVS-14. That puts you in what, 0.5% of the general population and maybe 3% of gun owners? Add to that, the necessity for a LAM, and I tend to agree that spending more than $1K is an unrealistic expectation. Whether NV purists agree with it or not, I do think that $1K price point is consumers line in the sand. And Holosun recognizes that by intentionally getting well under it. If the industry was ever able to offer $1500-$2000 NODs and $1K VSCEL LAMs, I think you'd see NV buy in from the general gun ownership population jump from 3-5% to 15% immediately. Yeah, Holosun will print money if this new laser performs as hoped. |
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Posted: 2/8/2024 4:44:29 PM EDT
[Last Edit: KaerMorhenResident]
[#34]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By topgunpilot20: Yeah, Holosun will print money if this new laser performs as hoped. Couldn't agree more. There is a lot of what the Gen Z kids would call "flexing" and self-appointed "gate-keepers" in the Night Vision "community." I've never been even remotely close to counting myself among them. I'm a "be well rounded keep it simple kind of guy" rocking my PVS14, I'll update at some point to duals but I'm not in a rush. That and maybe it's because I'm part Dutch, but I'm pretty tight with my coin.  While my wife and I have advanced degrees and earn good money all my friends are working class blue collar guys and I'd like them to get into night vision without having to break the bank. So, I'm just absolutely loving the direction Holosun is going with their Digital Night Vision (I know, digital night vision sucks but it's a start), reasonably priced VCSEL, and even their new white light (kind of ugly in my opinion, but the specs seem nice). Although it's going to suck for the world at large if a Chinese company like InfiRay can crank out more and more affordable night vision and thermal at least my close buddies might just get some night vision capability and as we all know if things ever did go down in some Mad Max, Red Dawn, whatever scenario no lone dude is going to make it no matter how well kitted out they are. I've been slowly nudging my buddies into being more prepared citizens, finally got them going to the range on a regular basis with me. Be nice to get them into some night vision capability. I'm not worried about every single Tom, Dick, and Harry getting night vision and lasers even if they become more affordable, because most folks still don't have body armor or radios and those things aren't costly. |
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Posted: 2/8/2024 10:23:52 PM EDT
[Last Edit: MtnRoamer]
[#35]
Josh from Holosun has another video of it out. Looks a whole lot better than the shot show videos but still waiting to see more.
He also confirms in the comments that the shot show examples weren't running the full vscel and that they have already made changes in regards to the terrible switching system it was originally shown with. https://www.instagram.com/reel/C3GL-SAS2gW/?igsh=MzRlODBiNWFlZA== |
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Posted: 2/8/2024 10:46:20 PM EDT
[Last Edit: French1966]
[#36]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By MtnRoamer: Josh from Holosun has another video of it out. Looks a whole lot better than the shot show videos but still waiting to see more. He also confirms in the comments that the shot show examples weren't running the full vscel and that they have already made changes in regards to the terrible switching system it was originally shown with. https://www.instagram.com/reel/C3GL-SAS2gW/?igsh=MzRlODBiNWFlZA== Thanks for posting that. Too bad he doesn’t have analog night vision to film his videos with smh, that video quality was absolutely terrible. “dIgITaL iS tHe FuTUre” |
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Posted: 2/8/2024 10:47:28 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By MtnRoamer: Josh from Holosun has another video of it out. Looks a whole lot better than the shot show videos but still waiting to see more. He also confirms in the comments that the shot show examples weren't running the full vscel and that they have already made changes in regards to the terrible switching system it was originally shown with. https://www.instagram.com/reel/C3GL-SAS2gW/?igsh=MzRlODBiNWFlZA== Nice. Back on topic. |
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Posted: 2/9/2024 11:10:30 AM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By MtnRoamer: Josh from Holosun has another video of it out. Looks a whole lot better than the shot show videos but still waiting to see more. He also confirms in the comments that the shot show examples weren't running the full vscel and that they have already made changes in regards to the terrible switching system it was originally shown with. https://www.instagram.com/reel/C3GL-SAS2gW/?igsh=MzRlODBiNWFlZA== Okay, that is really encouraging then. Looks pretty good to me. I'm excited about this one. I haven't been exicted about anything I've seen from SHOT Show in a very, very long time. |
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Posted: 2/9/2024 12:39:44 PM EDT
[#39]
Hope this shakes out to be a good product!! We need a fair-priced product with good performance.
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Posted: 2/9/2024 12:40:42 PM EDT
[#40]
Execution will be key but they're onto something with the illumination slider. Moving away from cursed PEQ15 ergonomics is a huge win, putting everything else aside.
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Posted: 2/9/2024 2:07:13 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 135Patriots: Execution will be key but they're onto something with the illumination slider. Moving away from cursed PEQ15 ergonomics is a huge win, putting everything else aside. Yeah, I like their method for adjusting the focus with that little top slider. I'll have to actually feel how it moves to be certain, but it looks like a good concept. |
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Posted: 2/10/2024 2:51:11 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ct78: In a theoretical vacuum or if anyone were in an real world crisis/war zone scenario I will feel truly sorry for any of my homies that didn’t invest into NV and LAMs. However, I do agree that for the average Joe, it’s already going above and beyond to even own a PVS-14. That puts you in what, 0.5% of the general population and maybe 3% of gun owners? Add to that, the necessity for a LAM, and I tend to agree that spending more than $1K is an unrealistic expectation. Whether NV purists agree with it or not, I do think that $1K price point is consumers line in the sand. And Holosun recognizes that by intentionally getting well under it. If the industry was ever able to offer $1500-$2000 NODs and $1K VSCEL LAMs, I think you’d see NV buy in from the general gun ownership population jump from 3-5% to 15% immediately. LOL... You honestly think that 1 out of 200 American citizens own a PVS-14 or better? |
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Posted: 2/10/2024 6:47:56 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By KaerMorhenResident: Yeah, I like their method for adjusting the focus with that little top slider. I'll have to actually feel how it moves to be certain, but it looks like a good concept. The IG reel shows fast adjustment. What do you feel uncertain about? It being too loose or too tight in tension? Sounds like your nitpicking. |
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Posted: 2/12/2024 9:26:46 AM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Advance: LOL... You honestly think that 1 out of 200 American citizens own a PVS-14 or better? Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Advance: Originally Posted By ct78: In a theoretical vacuum or if anyone were in an real world crisis/war zone scenario I will feel truly sorry for any of my homies that didn’t invest into NV and LAMs. However, I do agree that for the average Joe, it’s already going above and beyond to even own a PVS-14. That puts you in what, 0.5% of the general population and maybe 3% of gun owners? Add to that, the necessity for a LAM, and I tend to agree that spending more than $1K is an unrealistic expectation. Whether NV purists agree with it or not, I do think that $1K price point is consumers line in the sand. And Holosun recognizes that by intentionally getting well under it. If the industry was ever able to offer $1500-$2000 NODs and $1K VSCEL LAMs, I think you’d see NV buy in from the general gun ownership population jump from 3-5% to 15% immediately. LOL... You honestly think that 1 out of 200 American citizens own a PVS-14 or better? I've met like 3 people that have night vision in some capacity, but most of those have a PVS-14 worth of PSA rifles or random "too cheap not to buy" pistols and crap. I saved up a few years before I pulled the trigger on mine, mostly because with young kids and shit I have lots of other stuff to spend money on. Finally did it and still have less than 4 hours on it. Only really excited to wear it to the beach this summer. but yeah, I have been kicking around the idea of a $200-600 laser/illuminator. I don't have anywhere near the desire to drop $1k+ on something like this, even though I could. I put a red dot I already had on a mount I already had, My pistol dot has a NV setting, now I can shoot passively in the dark. Probably good enough for anything I'd ever consider needing, but I'll end up with one of these damn things anyway. Or a TRL-IR and just be done. Honestly if I lost all my gun stuff or was just getting into it, this is the order of things I'd suggest overall: 365x/xl for carry/HD kydex holster for same Light for pistol PSA AR Light, sling, dot for rifle dot for pistol armor + belt. Basic but needed to carry ancillary gear and reloads and shit PVS 14 on helmet mount IR light for rifle so many other things. random back ups, SBRs, Cans, maybe a shotgun . . . IR lasers |
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Posted: 2/13/2024 4:41:37 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By WTFShane: The IG reel shows fast adjustment. What do you feel uncertain about? It being too loose or too tight in tension? Sounds like your nitpicking. Oh yeah, I'm totally nitpicking. Just hoping it never gets too loose. I saw some guy on either YouTube or Instagram complain that it was too tight, but I'm thinking "I actually want it to be pretty tight." |
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Posted: 2/13/2024 5:10:27 PM EDT
[Last Edit: KaerMorhenResident]
[#46]
A lot of people brought Night Vision in 2020 when things were getting spicy. Especially when those XLSH tubes came out for such a good deal. I believe TNVC expanded the number of classes just a few years back to handle/acknowledge the growing demand. There was a time when just a few guys would field night vision at MILSIM events and even not counting the rentals now there are a ton of guys at those things with their own night vision (even thermal now).
Night vision is still not as common as say, owning body armor, but it's up there now and growing in popularity. I want it to get more popular so that there is a demand/market for more night vision shoots and competitions at ranges near me. I'll be a happy camper when we reach that level where I can drive just twenty minutes and attend a shoot comp with night vision. |
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Posted: 2/14/2024 3:29:05 AM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By KaerMorhenResident: Oh yeah, I'm totally nitpicking. Just hoping it never gets too loose. I saw some guy on either YouTube or Instagram complain that it was too tight, but I'm thinking "I actually want it to be pretty tight." Run gear, for enough time and you're bound to start hitting shit. That top slider may get bumped. It's a non issue. Period. |
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Posted: 2/14/2024 4:21:51 PM EDT
[#48]
Heading to a Milsim this weekend in Texas. Out of the 20 or so guys I run with about 10-13 of us have NVGs and 3 of us have thermals. Every year the numbers get higher. Out of a 600 person airsoft event you'll have maybe 75-150 guys with NVGs (including rentals). Just 2 years ago thermals were almost unheard of. Now the same Milsim will have 10-20 on the field.
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Posted: 2/14/2024 5:59:08 PM EDT
[Last Edit: KaerMorhenResident]
[#49]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Earax: Heading to a Milsim this weekend in Texas. Out of the 20 or so guys I run with about 10-13 of us have NVGs and 3 of us have thermals. Every year the numbers get higher. Out of a 600 person airsoft event you'll have maybe 75-150 guys with NVGs (including rentals). Just 2 years ago thermals were almost unheard of. Now the same Milsim will have 10-20 on the field. That's incredible honestly. I remember back in the day when Green Mountain Rangers were like the "high speed" MILSIM team and everyone thought they were amazing for all running PVS14s. Love seeing the MILSIM guys running ATAC, drones, night vision, and thermal. A lot of them are younger guys too, which is good. All the social media promotion combined with the motivating factor of the collapse of Western civilization sure do seem to be having an impact finally. I'm guessing a lot of GWOT guys are now in the civilian world and wanting their own night vision as well, probably helps. |
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Posted: 2/15/2024 7:59:37 AM EDT
[Last Edit: Diz]
[#50]
Pulling for Holosun.
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