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Originally Posted By DB0351: The new RI-60s are posted. https://public.powerdms.com/MSP1917/documents/1742579 View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By DB0351: The new RI-60s are posted. https://public.powerdms.com/MSP1917/documents/1742579 Originally Posted By DB0351: https://public.powerdms.com/MSP1917/documents/1742580 Interestingly they also changed the RI-60A to the same format at the new RI-60s, removing any doubt of their intention to have all firearms registered in the near future. RI-60a is for use only by FFLs to register multiple pistols, now says firearms, but FFLs are exempt from the new requirements for long guns currently. So this change makes no sense, without intent to change the law in the near future. Here's the official mi.gov/MSP link (under Firearms & Backgrounds Records): https://www.michigan.gov/msp/forms-stats/forms Soooo.....apparently no "RI-010 License To Purchase (LTP)"? It's just the RI-60 changed to Firearm Sales Record (FSR)?? This absolutely leaves the door wide the fuck open for universal registration (which is the end goal), that will surely follow this Universal Background Check scheme. Just "revise and date" the requirements on these forms and boom. "Oh, yeah..All your long guns need to be registered now" (which I was completely expecting anyhow). Make no mistake, this is all by design, folks. All this garbage is taken verbatim, from the Biden Regime's anti-gun policy, for those that aren't aware. Blue house, blue senate, blue executive branch, insane/autocrat governor=ALL boxes checked. The only speed bump between us and complete tyranny is the courts. ETA: Spoke to Nathan @MSP Firearms Unit, and he had no clue regarding the distribution of the aforementioned "storage and gun safety" brochures, nor the signed statement of receipt, other than MDHSS was in charge. So are we mandated to give out 1/3 or all of the 3 brochures at our expense? And the question still remains as to where this alleged signed statement can be found. It's apparent, that inter-agency communication is little, to non-existent. This is by design I'm sure, and a GREAT way to revoke FFLs, as we are to be 100% compliant with federal regulations as well as state. |
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CAGE Codes:8LSV6/13629/1S002/3J629/0BJZ8/3S679
"Handle that rifle like you've got ice in your veins." "What's wrong with you, Abu Hajaar?" |
I'm hearing a local store, Frank's in Linwood, is requiring a purchase permit to buy a long gun if the customer does not have a CPL. Is that correct? Based on the chart on the first page, I don't believe that to be correct.
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Originally Posted By AMG08: I'm hearing a local store, Frank's in Linwood, is requiring a purchase permit to buy a long gun if the customer does not have a CPL. Is that correct? Based on the chart on the first page, I don't believe that to be correct. View Quote Appears they didn't see the exemption section. Section 28.422 Sec. 2. (1) Except as otherwise provided in this act, a person shall not do either of the following: ... (b) Purchase a firearm that is not a pistol in this state without first having obtained a license for the firearm as prescribed in this section.... ... Section 28.422a Sec. 2a. (1) The following individuals are not required to obtain a license under section 2 to purchase, carry, possess, use, or transport a firearm: ... (d) An individual purchasing a firearm other than a pistol who has a federal national instant criminal background check performed on the individual by a federally licensed firearms dealer not more than 5 days before the purchase. |
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I read the above posted Law and I'm curious.
Did I miss read it or is transfer of a longarm that does not involve a sale/purchase not required to get/fill out the form? I.e. I give my sons each a rifle that I own. |
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Originally Posted By AMG08: I'm hearing a local store, Frank's in Linwood, is requiring a purchase permit to buy a long gun if the customer does not have a CPL. Is that correct? Based on the chart on the first page, I don't believe that to be correct. View Quote That was my initial understanding, but No. For a long gun (s), we (FFLs) run NICs, and following a 'proceed' will issue the buyer/transferee an RI-060 FSR, that literally goes nowhere (for now), except the buyer/transferee holds onto their copy for 30days. Currently, FFLs are under no obligation to keep copies of the long gun RI-060, unless dealer policy dictates otherwise. I can see a lot of big box stores hanging on to them. |
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CAGE Codes:8LSV6/13629/1S002/3J629/0BJZ8/3S679
"Handle that rifle like you've got ice in your veins." "What's wrong with you, Abu Hajaar?" |
Originally Posted By IronBalaclava: That was my initial understanding, but No. For a long gun (s), we (FFLs) run NICs, and following a 'proceed' will issue the buyer/transferee an RI-060 FSR, that literally goes nowhere (for now), except the buyer/transferee holds onto their copy for 30days. Currently, FFLs are under no obligation to keep copies of the long gun RI-060, unless dealer policy dictates otherwise. I can see a lot of big box stores hanging on to them. View Quote Hold up, what? I thought the ri-60 business for long guns didn't apply to FFLs? |
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Originally Posted By DB0351: Hold up, what? I thought the ri-60 business for long guns didn't apply to FFLs? View Quote If the buyer/transferee gets a "proceed" from NICs on a long gun, then a RI-060 (now the Firearms Transaction Record) must be completed by the FFL, but is NOT required to be submitted after the sale. Buyer has to hold on to his copy for 30 days, though. ETA: I just triple confirmed with Anne @MSP Firearms Unit a couple hours ago, who is arguably the most knowledgeable over there about MI FA laws. P.S.-That dude Nathan doesn't know what the hell he's talking about most of the time. |
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CAGE Codes:8LSV6/13629/1S002/3J629/0BJZ8/3S679
"Handle that rifle like you've got ice in your veins." "What's wrong with you, Abu Hajaar?" |
Originally Posted By IronBalaclava: If the buyer/transferee gets a "proceed" from NICs on a long gun, then a RI-060 (now the Firearms Transaction Record) must be completed by the FFL, but is NOT required to be submitted after the sale. Buyer has to hold on to his copy for 30 days, though. ETA: I just triple confirmed with Anne @MSP Firearms Unit a couple hours ago, who is arguably the most knowledgeable over there about MI FA laws. P.S.-That dude Nathan doesn't know what the hell he's talking about most of the time. View Quote Agreed. I'm annoyed that I somehow missed the ri-60 thing for FFLs and long guns. |
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Originally Posted By Bucket-Back: MGO Prays at the altar of the 501C, therefore no or limited political crap there or at Michigan Sportsman Forum You don't have to pay to view this MGO Legal Beagle Oar Outdoor Trading Post, where I have same handle, and "Big Ken" @ OTP is Admin @ MGO You need a reference to join at OTP OTP Link this is for pistol though https://i.imgur.com/iC0HXZ1.png https://theoutdoortradingpost.com/showthread.php?21065-Big-Ken-need-private-pistol-sales-info-now-that-the-demoncrats-passed-the-new-law/page2 View Quote So in the imgur link it talks about a seller being non ffl and buyer being a CPL holder and the only thing is the seller needs to turn in the RI-060. In the past I have inherited a hand gun filled out the RI-060 and in the seller box put inherited and turned in the paper work myself. Is that still the case after this goes into effect? Thanks |
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Originally Posted By DB0351: Agreed. I'm annoyed that I somehow missed the ri-60 thing for FFLs and long guns. View Quote These law changes are convoluted as all hell. RECEIVER UPDATE (PISTOL BUILD SPECIFIC) per Anne@MSP Firearms Unit 2.23.2024: *FFLs are NOT required to complete, nor issue RI-060s for receivers, frames and FCUs. Logic being, that they are in a non-fireable configuration. NOT considered "firearms" by MSP, but of course, considered firearms federally. *CPL holders or LEOs (with MCOLES # in lieu of CPL #) will still be able to self fill RI-60s as the "Purchaser/Seller" before or after build is complete. MSP prefers: "Built from parts" in the blank "Seller Name" field. *NON-CPL holders will need to undergo a SEPARATE NICS check to obtain an RI-010 (valid for 30 calendar days) from their local PD/SO before, or after build is complete. It Does NOT matter if you just purchased or transferred the lower/receiver/FCU from an FFL, or if you've had it in your possession. You need to undergo another NICS check to obtain the RI-010, which will be individually issued and numbered with it's own alpha-numeric permit #. MSP suggests building the pistol first, THEN obtaining an RI-010, as they are only valid for 30 calendar days from issue (ex. If you obtain an RI-010, prior to the build and finish it on day 31 or longer, you will need to go back to the PD/SO and repeat the RI-010 process all over again). ETA: UPDATED 2/23/2024 |
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CAGE Codes:8LSV6/13629/1S002/3J629/0BJZ8/3S679
"Handle that rifle like you've got ice in your veins." "What's wrong with you, Abu Hajaar?" |
Originally Posted By IronBalaclava: These law changes are convoluted as all hell. RECEIVER UPDATE per Anne@MSP Firearms Unit: *FFLs are NOT required to complete, nor issue RI-060s for receivers, frames and FCUs. Logic being, that they are in a non-fireable configuration. *CPL holders will self fill RI-60s before or after build is complete. *NON-CPL holders will need to obtain an RI-010/NICS check(valid for 30 calendar days) from their local PD/SO before or after build is complete. View Quote What the bloody?!?!?!? You're saying that if I don't have a CPL. I can go to a gun store and buy a reciever on a 4473. Then when I want to finish it, I have to go to the local PD, pick up a RI-010, fill it out in triplicate and then keep it for 30 days and then what... So, let's say I currently have 100 unfinished recievers from a gun show 10 years ago. Now for me to build them I need to get an RI-010 for all of them? |
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Originally Posted By 243savage: What the bloody?!?!?!? You're saying that if I don't have a CPL. I can go to a gun store and buy a reciever on a 4473. Then when I want to finish it, I have to go to the local PD, pick up a RI-010, fill it out in triplicate and then keep it for 30 days and then what... So, let's say I currently have 100 unfinished recievers from a gun show 10 years ago. Now for me to build them I need to get an RI-010 for all of them? View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By 243savage: Originally Posted By IronBalaclava: These law changes are convoluted as all hell. RECEIVER UPDATE per Anne@MSP Firearms Unit: *FFLs are NOT required to complete, nor issue RI-060s for receivers, frames and FCUs. Logic being, that they are in a non-fireable configuration. *CPL holders will self fill RI-60s before or after build is complete. *NON-CPL holders will need to obtain an RI-010/NICS check(valid for 30 calendar days) from their local PD/SO before or after build is complete. What the bloody?!?!?!? You're saying that if I don't have a CPL. I can go to a gun store and buy a reciever on a 4473. Then when I want to finish it, I have to go to the local PD, pick up a RI-010, fill it out in triplicate and then keep it for 30 days and then what... So, let's say I currently have 100 unfinished recievers from a gun show 10 years ago. Now for me to build them I need to get an RI-010 for all of them? I do recall from the convo yesterday, that she mentioned that folks building pistols (non-CPL holders) and attempting to register them on an RI-060 and signing off as both the purchaser and seller, were getting the RI-060 rejected and sent back to the owner. Tried to get her on the horn 3 times today for clarification to no avail. Will try again tomorrow. ETA: 2/22/2024: Played phone tag today. Will try again tomorrow. 2/23/2024: Updated/Clarified with Anne@MSP Firearms Unit |
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CAGE Codes:8LSV6/13629/1S002/3J629/0BJZ8/3S679
"Handle that rifle like you've got ice in your veins." "What's wrong with you, Abu Hajaar?" |
I believe the U. S. military term to describe the new gun laws is "Charlie Foxtrot".
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Went to a gun store in Westland and picked up a lower I transferred to them. They had me fill out the RI-60. Barrel- NA Caliber- NA Capacity- NA Overall Length- NA. It's quiet funny seeing that.
Took the reciever to a store in Livonia to get it NFA engraved. Asked them about the RI-60. They said they are NOT filling them out for recievers because they aren't firearms. |
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Originally Posted By 243savage: What the bloody?!?!?!? You're saying that if I don't have a CPL. I can go to a gun store and buy a reciever on a 4473. Then when I want to finish it, I have to go to the local PD, pick up a RI-010, fill it out in triplicate and then keep it for 30 days and then what... So, let's say I currently have 100 unfinished recievers from a gun show 10 years ago. Now for me to build them I need to get an RI-010 for all of them? View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By 243savage: What the bloody?!?!?!? You're saying that if I don't have a CPL. I can go to a gun store and buy a reciever on a 4473. Then when I want to finish it, I have to go to the local PD, pick up a RI-010, fill it out in triplicate and then keep it for 30 days and then what... So, let's say I currently have 100 unfinished recievers from a gun show 10 years ago. Now for me to build them I need to get an RI-010 for all of them? As fucked up as it is, this correct, and you will need to undergo another NICS check to obtain an RI-010, if you are/planning to build a pistol from a receiver/frame/FCU. I've updated my prior post to reflect that: RECEIVER UPDATE (PISTOL BUILD SPECIFIC) per Anne@MSP Firearms Unit 2.23.2024: *FFLs are NOT required to complete, nor issue RI-060s for receivers, frames and FCUs. Logic being, that they are in a non-fireable configuration. NOT considered "firearms" by MSP, but of course, considered firearms federally. *CPL holders or LEOs (with MCOLES # in lieu of CPL #) will still be able to self fill RI-60s as the "Purchaser/Seller" before or after build is complete. MSP prefers: "Built from parts" in the blank "Seller Name" field. *NON-CPL holders will need to undergo a SEPARATE NICS check to obtain an RI-010 (valid for 30 calendar days) from their local PD/SO before, or after build is complete. It Does NOT matter if you just purchased or transferred the lower/receiver/FCU from an FFL, or if you've had it in your possession. You need to undergo another NICS check to obtain the RI-010, which will be individually issued and numbered with it's own alpha-numeric permit #. MSP suggests building the pistol first, THEN obtaining an RI-010, as they are only valid for 30 calendar days from issue (ex. If you obtain an RI-010, prior to the build and finish it on day 31 or longer, you will need to go back to the PD/SO and repeat the RI-010 process all over again). ETA: UPDATED 2/23/2024 My advice, get a CPL, if you don't have one already. Originally Posted By 243savage: Went to a gun store in Westland and picked up a lower I transferred to them. They had me fill out the RI-60. Barrel- NA Caliber- NA Capacity- NA Overall Length- NA. It's quiet funny seeing that. Took the reciever to a store in Livonia to get it NFA engraved. Asked them about the RI-60. They said they are NOT filling them out for recievers because they aren't firearms. Yeah, no RI-60 needed to buy a receiver/frame/FCU. But, at this point and as screwed up and confusing as this whole mess is, I'm not going to fault any other FFLs for either doing everything they can to cover their asses liability wise, not understanding these new laws, and/or fucking up somewhere along the way. I mean...It's not like our licenses, livelihoods, and businesses are at stake here, or anything. |
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CAGE Codes:8LSV6/13629/1S002/3J629/0BJZ8/3S679
"Handle that rifle like you've got ice in your veins." "What's wrong with you, Abu Hajaar?" |
Just for the fun of it, what would be a penalty to constantly send in an RI-60 to the State every time I reassemble an AR? I wouldn't mind filling one out every time I change calibers, which is quiet often. To clarify they are SBRs under 26 inches so pistol registration is required.
For 16 years I use scap booking scissors with different cutting edge designs to cut my RI-60s and mail them in. My little protest to the system. |
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More tyranny from the socialist.
Whatever it takes to destroy the republic. |
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Celebrating the remains of the Second Amendment one Fine Firearm at a Time.
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