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Posted: 3/26/2024 3:19:29 AM EDT
[Last Edit: Jinxsters]
Ship hit it allegedly?
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TX, USA
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Posted: 3/31/2024 2:16:46 AM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By basicAR:  Typical GD mouthbreathing ignorance.. Why do you like making fun of physically handicapped people. Do you also despise the blind and people with cancer? Also, DU is an extremist hate site, it's a better place to make fun of the disabled. |
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Posted: 3/31/2024 6:15:50 AM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By fox2008: lol…the knowledge to build bridges is well beyond what it was historically. I would guess regulation & permitting has gotten significantly worse…which also ties back to corruption. The other thing that can’t be dismissed is risk aversion…11 people died building the Golden Gate Bridge, if half that died rebuilding this bridge the lawsuits would double the cost of the bridge and the project owners would be drug in front of congress and crucified in the media. Being safer is great but it normally means more people, more time and more money. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By fox2008: Originally Posted By Socio: They were taking about this on the radio this morning; that back then people knew how to build bridges, today not so much, that with the dumbing down our education system, going from a meritocracy based education and hiring system to a DEI based system, and the massively increased government regulatory system they speculated at least 20 years before the new bridges completion. That as a result the construction of it will be plagued with failures and flaws far after it is finished. To me that makes sense, just looking at road work/construction today, at least around where I live, I bet it is taking easily 5-10 times longer for jobs to be completed than it did 20 years ago even with all the technological advancements since then. lol…the knowledge to build bridges is well beyond what it was historically. I would guess regulation & permitting has gotten significantly worse…which also ties back to corruption. The other thing that can’t be dismissed is risk aversion…11 people died building the Golden Gate Bridge, if half that died rebuilding this bridge the lawsuits would double the cost of the bridge and the project owners would be drug in front of congress and crucified in the media. Being safer is great but it normally means more people, more time and more money. It took them less than 5 years to rebuild the I-10 twin span bridge after it was destroyed by Katrina, and that is a much longer bridge. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/I-10_Twin_Span_Bridge |
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Posted: 3/31/2024 6:23:24 AM EDT
[#3]
I'm finally back in the US with unfiltered internet. Sitting at the cruise port in Norfolk because we can't dock in Baltimore. We get to ride a bus for 4+ hours to retrieve our minivan and drive home. It's going to be awesome.
 So how tall does ARf think the replacement should be? The Bay Bridge and the original Key Bridge are/were both 158', severely limiting the ships that can reach the harbor. The two Bay Bridge spans were built in '52 and '73. Kharn |
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TX, USA
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Posted: 3/31/2024 6:33:04 AM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Sailboat: Don't bother with the conspiracy people. Videos of the crash and moments leading up to it are all over YouTube. It's a sad situation and nothing nefarious. Some people lean on conspiracy theories to help understand things they cannot grasp, scary but I get it. I've seen a Prius crash with the engine laying on the road. I've also seen some others with engines outside of the vehicle but there was some of the vehicle with the engine. None of those were at the speed of that Bentley. |
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TX, USA
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Posted: 3/31/2024 7:02:20 AM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By chibajoe: It took them less than 5 years to rebuild the I-10 twin span bridge after it was destroyed by Katrina, and that is a much longer bridge. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/I-10_Twin_Span_Bridge There are no major ports on Lake Ponchartrain. The arched sections aren't designed to pass Panamax much less Suezmax vessels. |
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Posted: 3/31/2024 7:43:29 AM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Kharn: So how tall does ARf think the replacement should be? The Bay Bridge and the original Key Bridge are/were both 158', severely limiting the ships that can reach the harbor. The two Bay Bridge spans were built in '52 and '73. Kharn It wouldn't hurt to make the Key bridge taller if the cost is going to be negligible - relatively speaking. I'm not sure it makes a lot of sense since the bay bridges limit the height of what gets to the Key bridge but it wouldn't hurt for possible future port expansion capabilities. |
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Posted: 3/31/2024 8:02:42 AM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryDidn't watch, but premise ignores that original Sunshine Skyway was also unprotected. |
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Posted: 3/31/2024 8:13:10 AM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By KELBEAST: Because they're designed to. The engines come out STUPID easy in a crash, or a bomb blast Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By KELBEAST: Originally Posted By Sailboat: Don't bother with the conspiracy people. Videos of the crash and moments leading up to it are all over YouTube. It's a sad situation and nothing nefarious. Some people lean on conspiracy theories to help understand things they cannot grasp, scary but I get it. I've seen a Prius crash with the engine laying on the road. I've also seen some others with engines outside of the vehicle but there was some of the vehicle with the engine. None of those were at the speed of that Bentley. Because they're designed to. The engines come out STUPID easy in a crash, or a bomb blast |
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Posted: 3/31/2024 8:16:07 AM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Houstons_Problem: I discovered later he was being facetious. Other people said engine blocks don't separate in wrecks. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Houstons_Problem: Originally Posted By Sailboat: Don't bother with the conspiracy people. Videos of the crash and moments leading up to it are all over YouTube. It's a sad situation and nothing nefarious. Some people lean on conspiracy theories to help understand things they cannot grasp, scary but I get it. I've seen a Prius crash with the engine laying on the road. I've also seen some others with engines outside of the vehicle but there was some of the vehicle with the engine. None of those were at the speed of that Bentley. |
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Posted: 3/31/2024 8:23:01 AM EDT
[#10]
Torches, rigging, and crane(s) to get the channel clear...along with divers and support craft/barges.
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Posted: 3/31/2024 8:47:12 AM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By UtahShotgunner: Didn't watch, but premise ignores that original Sunshine Skyway was also unprotected. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By UtahShotgunner: Didn't watch, but premise ignores that original Sunshine Skyway was also unprotected.  |
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Posted: 3/31/2024 8:53:51 AM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryI’m living proof that you can believe our federal (and most state) government is evil, immoral, corrupt, crooked, devious, underhanded, disingenuous, nihilistic, satanic, perverse, counterproductive, and just plain stupid, and still also believe that sometimes crap happens and it wasn’t government’s fault, nor intention, in any direct way. *shrug*. |
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Posted: 3/31/2024 9:04:38 AM EDT
[#13]
I wonder how long until smaller ships will be able to pass through, and if they will do a partial opening.
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VA, USA
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Posted: 3/31/2024 9:05:59 AM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Kharn: I'm finally back in the US with unfiltered internet. Sitting at the cruise port in Norfolk because we can't dock in Baltimore. We get to ride a bus for 4+ hours to retrieve our minivan and drive home. It's going to be awesome. So how tall does ARf think the replacement should be? The Bay Bridge and the original Key Bridge are/were both 158', severely limiting the ships that can reach the harbor. The two Bay Bridge spans were built in '52 and '73. Kharn GO VISIT THE BATTLESHIP! |
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Posted: 3/31/2024 9:13:45 AM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Houstons_Problem: It's hard to build a cable stayed bridge that looks ugly. Bridges aren't buildings. Going to be difficult to apply style terms like brutalist to a bridge. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Houstons_Problem: Originally Posted By LoBrau: They won't. It'll be a triumph of brutalist utilitarianism. No matter how much time and money they throw at it.  Bridges aren't buildings. Going to be difficult to apply style terms like brutalist to a bridge. You're right, if it's cable stayed it'll likely be at least somewhat attractive. I'm thinking more along the lines of the Pocahontas parkway bridge over the James. 
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Posted: 3/31/2024 9:13:59 AM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By -SkyRaider-: I wonder how long until smaller ships will be able to pass through, and if they will do a partial opening. There’s a coast guard 87 (CGC mako) that’s been out there doing a safety zone. If you look at its public AIS track, it’s moved above and below the bridge, going under the un-collapsed section on the west side. It’s still 20+ feet over there and the navigational draft (2x physical draft) of that class is only 12 feet. So as long as the Captain of the Port allows it, the path exists. I would bet it’s still declared closed for the safety of salvage operations though. |
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Posted: 3/31/2024 9:20:12 AM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Piratepast40: Not sure what's going on here. Is there a suggestion that illegal workers filling pot holes on the bridge somehow caused the ship to crash into the bridge? The ship's crew were all Indian guys, paid around $2-3/hour. They were responsible for maintaining and operating the ship. |
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Posted: 3/31/2024 9:21:37 AM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By KELBEAST: There’s a coast guard 87 (CGC mako) that’s been out there doing a safety zone. If you look at its public AIS track, it’s moved above and below the bridge, going under the un-collapsed section on the west side. It’s still 20+ feet over there and the navigational draft (2x physical draft) of that class is only 12 feet. So as long as the Captain of the Port allows it, the path exists. I would bet it’s still declared closed for the safety of salvage operations though. I reckon the Navy is going to move its assets the f__k out of there the literal moment it becomes physically possible. |
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Posted: 3/31/2024 9:28:42 AM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By -SkyRaider-: When dudes are flame cutting the steel members, how do they know that a massive amount of stored energy won’t be released when they complete the cut and unalive their asses? Or do they use expendable/disposable type guys for this type of work? There comes a time when decisions must be made. Do we send the union in or the illegals? 
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Posted: 3/31/2024 9:42:54 AM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By xd341: sank? Nah, that will get recycled. 10K tons of steel at 3 cents a pound! It's half a million bucks in scrap. Does baltimore have tweakers? They'd have it cleaned up in no time. It'll be car bodies or structural beams in a year or two. All the concrete will be dumped off shore for artificial reefs. Depending on costs vs salvage on the metal. At least that’s what they do down here. |
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Posted: 3/31/2024 9:57:05 AM EDT
[#21]
 Salvage at the Baltimore collapse site of the Francis Scott Key Bridge is well underway. |
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Posted: 3/31/2024 9:59:48 AM EDT
[#22]
 Attached FileTried to take a peak this morning...they won't let you anywhere near it on the Anne Arrundel side. |
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Posted: 3/31/2024 10:11:01 AM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 9mmmac: GO VISIT THE BATTLESHIP! Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 9mmmac: Originally Posted By Kharn: I'm finally back in the US with unfiltered internet. Sitting at the cruise port in Norfolk because we can't dock in Baltimore. We get to ride a bus for 4+ hours to retrieve our minivan and drive home. It's going to be awesome. So how tall does ARf think the replacement should be? The Bay Bridge and the original Key Bridge are/were both 158', severely limiting the ships that can reach the harbor. The two Bay Bridge spans were built in '52 and '73. Kharn GO VISIT THE BATTLESHIP! I could see the prow for about five minutes while waiting for our bus. It's Easter, everything is closed. Kharn |
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Posted: 3/31/2024 10:11:04 AM EDT
[Last Edit: tree-hugger]
[#24]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By burnka871: https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/371724/20240331_091154_jpg-3174508.JPG Tried to take a peak this morning...they won't let you anywhere near it on the Anne Arrundel side. What are you trying to say? They won't let you see the wrecked bridge in some way? Is the pic supposed to show chemtrails or something else? For what purpose? ETA: Now I see the 'barriers' in the pic. That's what is preventing folks from looking at the bridge from land or something? |
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TX, USA
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Posted: 3/31/2024 11:23:45 AM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By LoBrau: You're right, if it's cable stayed it'll likely be at least somewhat attractive. I'm thinking more along the lines of the Pocahontas parkway bridge over the James. |
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Posted: 3/31/2024 11:29:38 AM EDT
[Last Edit: brass]
[#26]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By arowneragain: I’m living proof that you can believe our federal (and most state) government is evil, immoral, corrupt, crooked, devious, underhanded, disingenuous, nihilistic, satanic, perverse, counterproductive, and just plain stupid, and still also believe that sometimes crap happens and it wasn’t government’s fault, nor intention, in any direct way. *shrug*. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By arowneragain: I’m living proof that you can believe our federal (and most state) government is evil, immoral, corrupt, crooked, devious, underhanded, disingenuous, nihilistic, satanic, perverse, counterproductive, and just plain stupid, and still also believe that sometimes crap happens and it wasn’t government’s fault, nor intention, in any direct way. *shrug*. I also don' think the .gov is behind all conspiracies (big tech conspires a lot with each other but that's ok as they're private companies), sometimes it's just the news lying/misrepresenting and sometimes a cigar is just a cigar, but those times are rare when it comes to certain events. This isn't one of them. It was pretty clearly an accident but with an odd reason for the turns which is now explained. I never thought this was intentional, though if trying to do intentional, it would also appear nearly the same. |
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Posted: 3/31/2024 12:27:25 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By LurchAddams: The ship's crew were all Indian guys, paid around $2-3/hour. They were responsible for maintaining and operating the ship. Are you implying the crew of a foreign flagged vessel were in the U.S. illegally, taking U.S. citizen jobs and collecting welfare? Not even mad. Impressed actually. |
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Posted: 3/31/2024 12:38:40 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Houstons_Problem: Somewhere on arfcom, someone can't understand why a bridge crash didn't cause a giant 2 stroke Marine diesel to fly out of the ship and land somewhere. I am just asking questions!!!!! Bunker fuel can't melt steel beams! |
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Posted: 3/31/2024 12:41:59 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By KELBEAST: Because they’re designed to. The engines come out STUPID easy in a crash, or a bomb blast Ha! You believe engines are real open your eyes engines are made up by the WEF and the global elite to make us eat bugs! |
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Posted: 3/31/2024 12:58:22 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By LurchAddams: The ship's crew were all Indian guys, paid around $2-3/hour. They were responsible for maintaining and operating the ship. That’s decent money for India. |
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Posted: 3/31/2024 1:15:01 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By -SkyRaider-: When dudes are flame cutting the steel members, how do they know that a massive amount of stored energy won’t be released when they complete the cut and unalive their asses? Or do they use expendable/disposable type guys for this type of work? Pay attention? Metal starts to move, get the fuck out. |
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Posted: 3/31/2024 1:17:09 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Kharn: I'm finally back in the US with unfiltered internet. Sitting at the cruise port in Norfolk because we can't dock in Baltimore. We get to ride a bus for 4+ hours to retrieve our minivan and drive home. It's going to be awesome. So how tall does ARf think the replacement should be? The Bay Bridge and the original Key Bridge are/were both 158', severely limiting the ships that can reach the harbor. The two Bay Bridge spans were built in '52 and '73. Kharn I like the "use a fucking ferry" approach. Clear the port, fuck the bridge. |
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Posted: 3/31/2024 1:32:02 PM EDT
[#33]
Waze says my bus is 50 minutes from Baltimore, but they've already updated the map.
 Attached FileOoof. Kharn |
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TX, USA
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Posted: 3/31/2024 2:01:50 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By dirtyboy: Pay attention? Metal starts to move, get the fuck out. |
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Posted: 3/31/2024 2:27:10 PM EDT
[#35]
From the COE
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Posted: 3/31/2024 2:41:25 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 7empest: .... Bunker fuel can't melt steel beams! Bunker fuel? I thought big ships burned big coal! |
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Posted: 3/31/2024 2:54:35 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Piratepast40: Bunker fuel? I thought big ships burned big coal!  |
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Posted: 3/31/2024 2:55:07 PM EDT
[Last Edit: AeroE]
[#38]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Cycolac: It wouldn't hurt to make the Key bridge taller if the cost is going to be negligible - relatively speaking. I'm not sure it makes a lot of sense since the bay bridges limit the height of what gets to the Key bridge but it wouldn't hurt for possible future port expansion capabilities. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Cycolac: Originally Posted By Kharn: So how tall does ARf think the replacement should be? The Bay Bridge and the original Key Bridge are/were both 158', severely limiting the ships that can reach the harbor. The two Bay Bridge spans were built in '52 and '73. Kharn It wouldn't hurt to make the Key bridge taller if the cost is going to be negligible - relatively speaking. I'm not sure it makes a lot of sense since the bay bridges limit the height of what gets to the Key bridge but it wouldn't hurt for possible future port expansion capabilities. The ship's draft might be the factor unless Maryland wants to dig the channel deeper. Maybe not, ships for the Suez Canal can go to 17 meters, 55 feet. Most of the rest are similar to Dali. |
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Posted: 3/31/2024 4:20:21 PM EDT
[#39]
What's the going rate for commercial divers who are going to "disassemble" the bridge for removal?
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Posted: 3/31/2024 4:26:24 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By doc540: What's the going rate for commercial divers who are going to "disassemble" the bridge for removal? City gets $500/hr. Oyster diving immigrants are sent down with torches for $5/hr |
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Posted: 3/31/2024 5:10:52 PM EDT
[Last Edit: LoBrau]
[#41]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Houstons_Problem: No pics? Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Houstons_Problem: Originally Posted By LoBrau: You're right, if it's cable stayed it'll likely be at least somewhat attractive. I'm thinking more along the lines of the Pocahontas parkway bridge over the James. 
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Posted: 3/31/2024 7:16:35 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Piratepast40: Are you implying the crew of a foreign flagged vessel were in the U.S. illegally, taking U.S. citizen jobs and collecting welfare? Not even mad. Impressed actually. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Piratepast40: Originally Posted By LurchAddams: The ship's crew were all Indian guys, paid around $2-3/hour. They were responsible for maintaining and operating the ship. Are you implying the crew of a foreign flagged vessel were in the U.S. illegally, taking U.S. citizen jobs and collecting welfare? Not even mad. Impressed actually. I'm implying they are probably worth only $2-3/hour. Very little training, experience, certification. AFAIK, while they're on the ship, they're legal because they're technically outside the USA. But they'll need a passport and visa to step off the ship into the USA. |
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Posted: 3/31/2024 7:21:54 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By LurchAddams: I'm implying they are probably worth only $2-3/hour. Very little training, experience, certification. AFAIK, while they're on the ship, they're legal because they're technically outside the USA. But they'll need a passport and visa to step off the ship into the USA. That’s kinda the funny thing about how people are upset the sailors are being kept on the ship. They don’t have entry visas to the USA so why would we let them in? They’ll probably tow the ship to a yard to get the bow repaired and they’ll stay on it there too. They aren’t Americans and don’t have permission to come here. What are we going to do, put them up in a hotel and then “make sure” they don’t disappear in to the country side? |
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Posted: 3/31/2024 7:30:06 PM EDT
[Last Edit: realwar]
[#44]
(10:19) Interesting info on the incoming cargo shipments.
 MV Dali and the Francis Scott Key Bridge | March 31 Update & Who Pays for the Salvage? |
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VA, USA
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Posted: 3/31/2024 7:35:23 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Kharn: I'm finally back in the US with unfiltered internet. Sitting at the cruise port in Norfolk because we can't dock in Baltimore. We get to ride a bus for 4+ hours to retrieve our minivan and drive home. It's going to be awesome. So how tall does ARf think the replacement should be? The Bay Bridge and the original Key Bridge are/were both 158', severely limiting the ships that can reach the harbor. The two Bay Bridge spans were built in '52 and '73. Kharn |
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Posted: 3/31/2024 7:36:07 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AeroE: The ship's draft might be the factor unless Maryland wants to dig the channel deeper. Maybe not, ships for the Suez Canal can go to 17 meters, 55 feet. Most of the rest are similar to Dali. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AeroE: Originally Posted By Cycolac: Originally Posted By Kharn: So how tall does ARf think the replacement should be? The Bay Bridge and the original Key Bridge are/were both 158', severely limiting the ships that can reach the harbor. The two Bay Bridge spans were built in '52 and '73. Kharn It wouldn't hurt to make the Key bridge taller if the cost is going to be negligible - relatively speaking. I'm not sure it makes a lot of sense since the bay bridges limit the height of what gets to the Key bridge but it wouldn't hurt for possible future port expansion capabilities. The ship's draft might be the factor unless Maryland wants to dig the channel deeper. Maybe not, ships for the Suez Canal can go to 17 meters, 55 feet. Most of the rest are similar to Dali. The Baltimore harbor is dredged to 50' deep, the Key Bridge's former span and both spans of the Chesapeake Bay bridge are 158' to the water line. It is a very undersized port for today's ships.  Attached FileKharn |
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Posted: 3/31/2024 7:53:05 PM EDT
[Last Edit: -SkyRaider-]
[#47]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Kharn: The Baltimore harbor is dredged to 50' deep, the Key Bridge's former span and both spans of the Chesapeake Bay bridge are 158' to the water line. It is a very undersized port for today's ships. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/195/Ship_measurements_comparison_svg_png-3174990.JPG Kharn God damn. A Chinamax drafts 79 feet. Down by the keel is practically like a submarine at that point. I wonder how thick the hull is down there to resist the pressure. |
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Posted: 3/31/2024 7:58:01 PM EDT
[#48]
Mayor Pete says he has no idea when the damaged bridge will be cleared. LOL.
https://nypost.com/2024/03/31/us-news/buttigieg-says-timeline-for-clearing-baltimore-bridge-unclear-a-very-complex-process/ |
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Posted: 3/31/2024 10:52:10 PM EDT
[#49]
Dali size container ship steering system. How it’s designed to not hit Francis Scott key bridge
 Dali size containership steering system. How it’s designed to not hit Francis Scott key bridge |
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Posted: 3/31/2024 10:54:22 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By dirtyboy: Pay attention? Metal starts to move, get the fuck out. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By dirtyboy: Originally Posted By -SkyRaider-: When dudes are flame cutting the steel members, how do they know that a massive amount of stored energy won’t be released when they complete the cut and unalive their asses? Or do they use expendable/disposable type guys for this type of work? Pay attention? Metal starts to move, get the fuck out. I climb trees and cut them down. Wouldn't catch me anywhere near that mess with a torch/lance, braver men than I. |
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