CSA: The Confederate States of America. (The movie)

[ARCHIVED THREAD] - CSA: The Confederate States of America. (The movie) (Page 1 of 3)

Posted: 12/22/2004 11:07:04 AM EDT

Due to come out next year this promises to blast the south with a "what if" the south had won the civil war. I think it will make a lot people angry, but I guess we'll just have to wait until the film comes out.

www.csathemovie.com/

Posted: 12/22/2004 11:20:52 AM EDT

[#1]

Confederate States of America (2004)
What fate would have befallen the United States had the South won the Civil War? That is the provocative question writer/director Kevin Wilmott attempts to answer in his brilliantly conceived faux documentary, CSA: Confederate States of America. While at 91 minutes that include an incendiary collection of phony commercials, this deadly serious satire continues long after it's made its point, there is no denying its power to provoke thought and, hopefully, a dialogue among the races in this country that is long overdue.
Modeled after a Ken Burns-style documentary, Wilmott presents his fictional doc as a British product making its controversial TV debut in the Confederate State of America. This is a country where the Gray side proved triumphant, where the Great Emancipator Abraham Lincoln, instead of dying by an assassin's bullet at Ford's Theater, fled in surrender to Canada. Slavery is so enshrined that slaves are bought and sold over the Internet, the country sided with Hitler during World War II, and there's an ongoing cold war with Canada, the country to which escaping slaves and abolitionists have traditionally fled. CSA's power extends to Central and South America where a system of apartheid separates the white, North American ruling class from the region's indigenous population. And in the 21st century, CSA's women still don't have the right to vote.

Wilmott leaves nothing out of his perfectly realized re-creation of this alternate history. As talking-head historians explain the events of the past 140 years, there are archival photos, old newspaper accounts and editorial cartoons, and dramatized scenes. There are clips from a fiction D.W. Griffith movie, The Hunt for Dishonest Abe and '50s-era sitcom, Leave It to Beulah. Interspersed throughout are ads for such products as Darkie toothpaste, Coon Chicken Inn and others, most of which were at one time actual products sold in the United States.

At a time when so many people still defend the Confederate flag and insist on putting the Civil War in terms of "states' rights," CSA explicates the full implications of those positions. In satirizing history, Wilmott lays down a gauntlet, indicting ingrained attitudes and prejudices, and daring us all to do something about it.

— JAMES PLATH

more garbage from the independant film idiots

Posted: 12/22/2004 11:24:13 AM EDT

[#2]

I wonder if he tells us how the CSA actually won the war and took over the north. I call BS on this one. If the South would have 'won' they would have formed their own nation and there would be to Americas, the CSA and the USA. Most likely it would have abolished slavery soon after the War too.

Posted: 12/22/2004 11:26:30 AM EDT

[#3]

What a complete load of utter crap.

The South fought for independence from the US, for States Rights. Not to change the direction of the existing USA. Someone doesn't know their history.

I'll bet some DAMN yankee came up with this!

Posted: 12/22/2004 11:29:31 AM EDT

[#4]

IBTL.

Oh yeah, this one's on the way to being locked. I think the CoC should be revised to disallow anything even remotley suggestive of a racial topic.

Posted: 12/22/2004 11:32:33 AM EDT

[#5]

Quoted:
I'll bet some DAMN yankee came up with this!

Wasn't me, I promise!

Posted: 12/22/2004 11:35:57 AM EDT

[#6]

Quoted:
Confederate States of America (2004)
What fate would have befallen the United States had the South won the Civil War? That is the provocative question writer/director Kevin Wilmott attempts to answer in his brilliantly conceived faux documentary, CSA: Confederate States of America. While at 91 minutes that include an incendiary collection of phony commercials, this deadly serious satire continues long after it's made its point, there is no denying its power to provoke thought and, hopefully, a dialogue among the races in this country that is long overdue.
Modeled after a Ken Burns-style documentary, Wilmott presents his fictional doc as a British product making its controversial TV debut in the Confederate State of America. This is a country where the Gray side proved triumphant, where the Great Emancipator Abraham Lincoln, instead of dying by an assassin's bullet at Ford's Theater, fled in surrender to Canada. Slavery is so enshrined that slaves are bought and sold over the Internet, the country sided with Hitler during World War II, and there's an ongoing cold war with Canada, the country to which escaping slaves and abolitionists have traditionally fled. CSA's power extends to Central and South America where a system of apartheid separates the white, North American ruling class from the region's indigenous population. And in the 21st century, CSA's women still don't have the right to vote.

Wilmott leaves nothing out of his perfectly realized re-creation of this alternate history. As talking-head historians explain the events of the past 140 years, there are archival photos, old newspaper accounts and editorial cartoons, and dramatized scenes. There are clips from a fiction D.W. Griffith movie, The Hunt for Dishonest Abe and '50s-era sitcom, Leave It to Beulah. Interspersed throughout are ads for such products as Darkie toothpaste, Coon Chicken Inn and others, most of which were at one time actual products sold in the United States.

At a time when so many people still defend the Confederate flag and insist on putting the Civil War in terms of "states' rights," CSA explicates the full implications of those positions. In satirizing history, Wilmott lays down a gauntlet, indicting ingrained attitudes and prejudices, and daring us all to do something about it.

— JAMES PLATH

more garbage from the independant film idiots

I take it as being a Michael Moore history lesson?

Posted: 12/22/2004 11:39:59 AM EDT

[#7]

What a shame.

This could have been a good idea for a movie.

Posted: 12/22/2004 1:53:33 PM EDT

[#8]

Quoted:
Due to come out next year this promises to blast the south with a "what if" the south had won the civil war. I think it will make a lot people angry, but I guess we'll just have to wait until the film comes out.

www.csathemovie.com/

At the risk of being flamed by my southern colleagues here at ARFCOM, I'm glad the North won and I don't think we'd enjoy the country we have if the North had been defeated. All the oppressive Federal laws that hinder our pursuit of happiness now came 100 years after the civil war, with aggressive input from southern politicians as well as northern ones.
Having prefaced my little post here, this movie sounds like revisionist history attacking everything about the south. Like most political agendas, it'll be clothed in commentary on the Old South, but in effect it'll be a subtle attack on ALL of white paternal America. The Old South will be just a prop.
Just like the article that featured the sick child that told his mother in Spanish that he had cancer; that article was an agenda piece to assimilate the unsuspecting into accepting multiculturalism and bi-lingual education.
I'm afraid this movie will be just PC indoctrination for future generations, displaying how "evil" the white man is.

Posted: 12/22/2004 1:57:48 PM EDT

[#9]

The great America of the 20th century was forged in the Civil War.

Posted: 12/22/2004 2:00:23 PM EDT

[#10]

Quoted:Most likely it would have abolished slavery soon after the War too.

Tee-hee. Their constitution would not have allowed new territories to abolish slavery.

(Always remember - on this board - the Civil War had nothing to do with slavery.)

Posted: 12/22/2004 2:00:28 PM EDT

[#11]

Quoted:
What a complete load of utter crap.

The South fought for independence from the US, for States Rights. Not to change the direction of the existing USA. Someone doesn't know their history.

I'll bet some DAMN yankee came up with this!

I thought it was because the south was contributing more to the federal treasury than the north and receiving little back in spending?
Could be wrong.

Posted: 12/22/2004 2:04:15 PM EDT

[#12]

Quoted:
Quoted:Most likely it would have abolished slavery soon after the War too.

Tee-hee. Their constitution would not have allowed new territories to abolish slavery.

(Always remember - on this board - the Civil War had nothing to do with slavery.)

You're right, the mantra of ARFCOM is "slavery had nothing to do with the Civil War"....and the fact that there WAS slavery before the war, and it ended with the victory of the North, is mere coincidence. To question otherwise makes you a "liberal."

Posted: 12/22/2004 2:04:38 PM EDT

[#13]

Quoted:
IBTL.

Oh yeah, this one's on the way to being locked. I think the CoC should be revised to disallow anything even remotley suggestive of a racial topic.

You need to reread your history, the civil war wasnt about slavery untill Lincon pulled a political trick out of his hat to make it one. Slavery would of ended no matter what, next thing you know, cant talk about NASCAR.

Posted: 12/22/2004 2:05:46 PM EDT

[#14]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:Most likely it would have abolished slavery soon after the War too.

Tee-hee. Their constitution would not have allowed new territories to abolish slavery.

(Always remember - on this board - the Civil War had nothing to do with slavery.)

You're right, the mantra of ARFCOM is "slavery had nothing to do with the Civil War"....and the fact that there WAS slavery before the war, and it ended with the victory of the North, is mere coincidence. To question otherwise makes you a "liberal."

Umm. please explain a lil for me, a bit slow tonight.

Posted: 12/22/2004 2:08:15 PM EDT

[#15]

Quoted:
Quoted:
IBTL.

Oh yeah, this one's on the way to being locked. I think the CoC should be revised to disallow anything even remotley suggestive of a racial topic.

You need to reread your history, the civil war wasnt about slavery untill Lincon pulled a political trick out of his hat to make it one. Slavery would of ended no matter what, next thing you know, cant talk about NASCAR.

(SIGH)-OK. There was no abolitionist movement, the southerners didn't see Lincoln as a tool of the abolitionists, slavery was never even brought up in some of the articles of southern seccession, and John Brown was a Dish Direct salesman!

Posted: 12/22/2004 2:09:37 PM EDT

[#16]

Judging by the quality of that website, this one will go straight to video.

Posted: 12/22/2004 2:10:36 PM EDT

[#17]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
IBTL.

Oh yeah, this one's on the way to being locked. I think the CoC should be revised to disallow anything even remotley suggestive of a racial topic.

You need to reread your history, the civil war wasnt about slavery untill Lincon pulled a political trick out of his hat to make it one. Slavery would of ended no matter what, next thing you know, cant talk about NASCAR.

(SIGH)-OK. There was no abolitionist movement, the southerners didn't see Lincoln as a tool of the abolitionists, slavery was never even brought up in some of the articles of southern seccession, and John Brown was a Dish Direct salesman!

Posted: 12/22/2004 2:19:45 PM EDT

[#18]

To save us from rehashing this deal again. Can someone please post a link to the last three War Between the States dispute?

Time once again to educate those that do not know again.

Posted: 12/22/2004 2:21:52 PM EDT

[#19]

Quoted:
Judging by the quality of that website, this one will go straight to video.

Cool!

I'll own the DVD even sooner than I would have imagined!

Oops! On second thought, after visiting that website, I sincerely doubt I'd buy this movie at all.

I thought it was going to be something along the lines of Harry Turtledove's Alternative History!

Not Turner's Diaries.

Eric The(Unreconstructed)Hun

Posted: 12/22/2004 2:22:03 PM EDT

[#20]

Isn't the south currently winning this war?

Posted: 12/22/2004 2:31:27 PM EDT

[#21]

Quoted:
Isn't the South currently winning this war?

Pretty much!

Eric The(Wishful)Hun

Posted: 12/22/2004 2:32:57 PM EDT

[#22]

Quoted:
Isn't the south currently winning this war?

America is currently winning this war.

Posted: 12/22/2004 2:34:11 PM EDT

[#23]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Isn't the south currently winning this war?

America is currently winning this war.

Yeah, but which part of America?

The Red or the Blue?

Eric The(ISay'Red')Hun

Posted: 12/22/2004 2:34:41 PM EDT

[#24]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Judging by the quality of that website, this one will go straight to video.

Cool!

I'll own the DVD even sooner than I would have imagined!

Oops! On second thought, after visiting that website, I sincerely doubt I'd buy this movie at all.

I thought it was going to be something along the lines of Harry Turtledove's Alternative History!

Not Turner's Diaries.

Eric The(Unreconstructed)Hun

That movies gonna be nothing but an anti-American progaganda piece! Slaves in the western world in the 21st century? Gimme a break!

Posted: 12/22/2004 2:35:47 PM EDT

[#25]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Isn't the south currently winning this war?

America is currently winning this war.

Yeah, but which part of America?

The Red or the Blue?

Eric The(ISay'Red')Hun

Lotsa red counties in even the bluer-than-blues states.
I've got three friends over there right now, they come from a "blue" state but a "red" county.

Posted: 12/22/2004 7:25:22 PM EDT

[#26]

Quoted:
What a shame.

This could have been a good idea for a movie.

It was a better idea for a novel, or a short story. Go read The guns of the South for a nice alternative-history take.

Also, in one of the Dozois annuals, there is a beautifully-written short story that was supposed to serve as a back-story for another "future history", in which a young boy takes up arms after his friend and family are killed by Yankee occupation troops. (Regrettably, I don't recall the (female) author's name, nor which year. It might have been in the 8th Annual, but was probably later; definitely not earlier.)

Posted: 12/22/2004 11:51:29 PM EDT

[#27]

If any "whatif" movie is going to be made about what if the CSA won, they should make Harry Turtledove's "Guns of the South" it.

Posted: 12/22/2004 11:54:39 PM EDT

[#28]

Quoted:
At the risk of being flamed by my southern colleagues here at ARFCOM, I'm glad the North won and I don't think we'd enjoy the country we have if the North had been defeated.

I pretty much agree.

And judging from the previous election maps it seems the south has done well for its self now that it pretty much controls this country.

I'm also Mexican-American and I'm definately glad the US won the Mexican-American war, Hispanics in the US will be in a similar way several years down the road.

Why just settle for what we once had when we can have this whole nation.

Posted: 12/22/2004 11:58:03 PM EDT

[#29]

I'd watch it, I have seen worse.

Doesnt say when its out though.

Posted: 12/23/2004 12:42:32 AM EDT

[#30]

I'd better not comment on some of the comments....

Posted: 12/23/2004 1:21:18 AM EDT

[#31]

You'd think with over 64,000 members here, we would have the resources to create our own indie film group to make the crap we'd like to see.

Posted: 12/23/2004 3:02:05 AM EDT

[#32]

Quoted:

Go read The guns of the South for a nice alternative-history take.

Harry Turtledove also wrote a trilogy called "The Great War" which does a great job with the concept.

- The CSA won the war, creating a separate country (it never was their intention to overthrow the .gov in Washington).

- The story is set in WW I

- The CSA has sided with the British, and the USA (with Teddy Roosevelt as president) has sided with the Kaiser.

- This creates a two-front war for the USA, fighting with the CSA and Canada.

- With the rise of Marxism, a communist revolution of blacks begins in the South

To write credible alternative history one has to understand real history. Harry Turtledove nails it.

The film in the original post is just more anti-Confederate propaganda.

Posted: 12/23/2004 3:08:50 AM EDT

[#33]

Quoted:
Quoted:

Go read The guns of the South for a nice alternative-history take.

Harry Turtledove also wrote a trilogy called "The Great War" which does a great job with the concept.

- The CSA won the war, creating a separate country (it never was their intention to overthrow the .gov in Washington).

- The story is set in WW I

- The CSA has sided with the British, and the USA (with Teddy Roosevelt as president) has sided with the Kaiser.

- This creates a two-front war for the USA, fighting with the CSA and Canada.

- With the rise of Marxism, a communist revolution of blacks begins in the South

To write credible alternative history one has to understand real history. Harry Turtledove nails it.

The film in the original post is just more anti-Confederate propaganda.

Thier is another set made post Alternate WWI and another one thats in progress thats Alternate WWII

Posted: 12/23/2004 3:20:21 AM EDT

[#34]

Quoted:

Thier is another set made post Alternate WWI and another one thats in progress thats Alternate WWII

I read the first in the WW II series, where the warring humans join forces to fight the invading aliens.

Posted: 12/23/2004 3:21:55 AM EDT

[#35]

Quoted:
Quoted:

Thier is another set made post Alternate WWI and another one thats in progress thats Alternate WWII

I read the first in the WW II series, where the warring humans join forces to fight the invading aliens.

Not that one this is a new one.

That one was the WorldWar series. The first one of the new series is called Settling Accounts or something like that.

Posted: 12/23/2004 4:05:01 AM EDT

[#36]

Quoted:
Quoted:

Go read The guns of the South for a nice alternative-history take.

Harry Turtledove also wrote a trilogy called "The Great War" which does a great job with the concept.

- The CSA won the war, creating a separate country (it never was their intention to overthrow the .gov in Washington).

- The story is set in WW I

- The CSA has sided with the British, and the USA (with Teddy Roosevelt as president) has sided with the Kaiser.

- This creates a two-front war for the USA, fighting with the CSA and Canada.

- With the rise of Marxism, a communist revolution of blacks begins in the South

To write credible alternative history one has to understand real history. Harry Turtledove nails it.

The film in the original post is just more anti-Confederate propaganda.

The indie comic series "Captain Confederacy" had a similar back history. Though in it's backstory the cold war tensions between the USA & CSA kept both from getting involved in WW1 (though the pro Germany north, pro Brit/France south bit was the same). WW1 runs longer with a much better outcome for the Central Powers.....no humiliated Germany (the Kaiser stays in power), the Turks keep the middle east, etc.

Posted: 12/23/2004 4:05:19 AM EDT

[#37]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Isn't the south currently winning this war?

America is currently winning this war.

Yeah, but which part of America?

The Red or the Blue?

Eric The(ISay'Red')Hun

Lotsa red counties in even the bluer-than-blues states.
I've got three friends over there right now, they come from a "blue" state but a "red" county.

blue state, red county here

Posted: 12/23/2004 4:33:18 AM EDT

[#38]

Quoted:
You'd think with over 64,000 members here, we would have the resources to create our own indie film group to make the crap we'd like to see.

I can produce and edit it...I do it everyday....

Posted: 12/23/2004 4:44:09 AM EDT

[#39]

Quoted:
Quoted:
You'd think with over 64,000 members here, we would have the resources to create our own indie film group to make the crap we'd like to see.

I can produce and edit it...I do it everyday....

I thought Sarge was in charge of production here!

Posted: 12/23/2004 4:47:43 AM EDT

[#40]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
You'd think with over 64,000 members here, we would have the resources to create our own indie film group to make the crap we'd like to see.

I can produce and edit it...I do it everyday....

I thought Sarge was in charge of production here!

No, I don't do dolls, I work with real people and make real films/videos.

Posted: 12/23/2004 10:42:01 AM EDT

[#41]

Quoted:
Quoted:

Go read The guns of the South for a nice alternative-history take.

Harry Turtledove also wrote a trilogy called "The Great War" which does a great job with the concept.

- The CSA won the war, creating a separate country (it never was their intention to overthrow the .gov in Washington).

- The story is set in WW I

- The CSA has sided with the British, and the USA (with Teddy Roosevelt as president) has sided with the Kaiser.

- This creates a two-front war for the USA, fighting with the CSA and Canada.

- With the rise of Marxism, a communist revolution of blacks begins in the South

To write credible alternative history one has to understand real history. Harry Turtledove nails it.

The film in the original post is just more anti-Confederate propaganda.

I got in a heated (to say the least) conversation at work when I declared the Civil Rights Movement in this country was really nothing but Communist agitation.
I think the history of the Civil Rights Movement vindicates my position; what started out as "civil rights" morphed into racial preference, and a socialist entitlement system.
Ml King was known to hang around members of the American Communist party-show me "civil rights" in a communist state.

Posted: 12/23/2004 4:30:44 PM EDT

[#42]

AMEN brother !!!!!!1

Posted: 12/23/2004 4:41:22 PM EDT

[#43]

Darkie Toothpaste is no joke. It has a picture of a black man wearing a black silk top hat and a big white grin. It used to be sold in Hong Kong back in the '80s and my friends had some tubes (and boxes). They still sell it today, but it's called, "Heimei" or "blackface" in Chinese. While the box is still green and black, there's no picture on Heimei.

Posted: 12/23/2004 4:45:42 PM EDT

[#44]

I agree with the CSA for the most part except for the slavery.

....and I'm not a southerner

Posted: 12/23/2004 6:03:22 PM EDT

[#45]

Anyone read the Draka series by S. M. Stirling. The gist is that loyalists (mainly from the slave holding South) from the American Revolution emigrate to South Africa and establish an Empire in Africa. The timeline is actually a pretty good read. Good alternate history:

www.gpfn.sk.ca/~geis/draka/history.html

RJ

Posted: 12/23/2004 7:07:31 PM EDT

[#46]

Quoted:
Harry Turtledove also wrote a trilogy called "The Great War" which does a great job with the concept.

- The CSA won the war, creating a separate country (it never was their intention to overthrow the .gov in Washington).

- The story is set in WW I

- The CSA has sided with the British, and the USA (with Teddy Roosevelt as president) has sided with the Kaiser.

- This creates a two-front war for the USA, fighting with the CSA and Canada.

- With the rise of Marxism, a communist revolution of blacks begins in the South

To write credible alternative history one has to understand real history. Harry Turtledove nails it.

The film in the original post is just more anti-Confederate propaganda.

Yeah its a good series I've read all the books that have came out in it so far.

It started off with a book titled "How few remain."

In that timeline the reason the Confederacy won was because a copy of Lee's battleplans were never found by union forces.

In real life some union troops found some cigars lying in the ground and they happened to be wrapped up in a copy of the confederate plans.

In the book some random Confederate soldier some officer "hey you dropped your cigars," and they make a joke about how things would have gone differently if he lost those plans and union forces found them.

Posted: 12/23/2004 7:19:28 PM EDT

[#47]

Quoted:
I wonder if he tells us how the CSA actually won the war and took over the north. I call BS on this one. If the South would have 'won' they would have formed their own nation and there would be to Americas, the CSA and the USA. Most likely it would have abolished slavery soon after the War too.

ummm weren't the slaves set free before the war ended?

Posted: 12/23/2004 7:26:22 PM EDT

[#48]

Nope. The emancipation proclamation applied only to those states in rebellion. So, Kentucky, West Virginia, Maryland and Delaware could keep their slaves.

Posted: 12/23/2004 8:15:55 PM EDT

[#49]

Quoted:
Quoted:
You'd think with over 64,000 members here, we would have the resources to create our own indie film group to make the crap we'd like to see.

I can produce and edit it...I do it everyday....

Well hell, we're halfway to making UC, Patriots and Lights Out then!

Posted: 12/23/2004 8:25:05 PM EDT

[#50]

Quoted:
Quoted:Most likely it would have abolished slavery soon after the War too.

Tee-hee. Their constitution would not have allowed new territories to abolish slavery.

(Always remember - on this board - the Civil War had nothing to do with slavery.)

A great many of the South's leaders were for abolition. It was mainly economic and state's rights reasons. In fact, Jefferson Davis swore to the Pope that the CSA would abolish slavery within five years of independence.

[ARCHIVED THREAD] - CSA: The Confederate States of America. (The movie) (Page 1 of 3)

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