User Panel
User Panel
User Panel
|
Posted: 9/19/2007 6:28:31 PM EDT
[#1]
Awesome, as I have HD stocks!
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/19/2007 6:31:36 PM EDT
[#2]
Alot of people are cautiously cutting back on recreational spending and motorcycles are just one item on the list. Fortunately I got my scooter already.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/19/2007 6:32:57 PM EDT
[#3]
People finally figured it out. HD's are lame.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/19/2007 6:35:02 PM EDT
[#4]
Isn't there a boatload of profit in Harleys? The last time I saw prices I was surprised that they were as expensive as they were. Ditto for the huge assortment of Harley branded misc. merchandise in the lavish dealerships.
I was pretty amazed when I was told that someone could not walk into a Harley dealership and order the MC they wanted - they way they wanted. Some kind of bizarre lottery system where you get your choice of pre-configured models once you number is randomly drawn. That struck me as really odd. |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/19/2007 6:38:06 PM EDT
[#5]
How long before its sent to China
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/19/2007 6:39:14 PM EDT
[#6]
I heard a similar thing, order it, wait and get what they want you to get. For the price I wouldnt want that hassle |
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/19/2007 6:39:19 PM EDT
[#7]
I guess the price of oil will go down. Not so many HD's to burn it all up.
 
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/19/2007 6:41:40 PM EDT
[#8]
HD workers were on strike earlier this year, IIRC.
Paybacks a bitch. |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/19/2007 6:42:11 PM EDT
[#9]
naaah, those who put "straight pipes" or loud pipes on them are... i hate fuckers who modify their exhaust to make it louder with little engine performance gains. |
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/19/2007 6:42:46 PM EDT
[#10]
If they would sell the bikes for retail, instead of $3K over MSRP, they could sell all they could build.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/19/2007 6:46:31 PM EDT
[#11]
this has been coming for years
they built themselves up on the back of baby boomer rubs people who are now getting too old to ride The papers everywhere are full of used 1-2 year old HDs with like 500-1000 miles and the local dealers are starting to actually *gasp* deal on stock and not charging retail plus 3K in bullshit fees I like HDs I truly do but they are a 10K bike that costs 20K I'm betting within 3-5 years their prices get back in line with Jap stuff |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/19/2007 6:46:57 PM EDT
[#12]
You can order what you want, for a hefty deposit, and if the factory can get it to you they will make one for you, average wait time is 36 months, the deposit is nonrefundable for any reason. One of my friends ended up spending about 30% over msrp on a sportster a few years back cus that was the cheapest "out the door today" price he could find in three states. |
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/19/2007 6:47:48 PM EDT
[#13]
The lottery thing and the long wait was just part of the marketing mystique. Kind of like Krispy Kreme. Now the thrill is gone and prices/availability will come back into line.
Next to Arm & Hammer baking soda, I have always thought that Harley had some of the best marketing that I have ever seen. Fuel costs should make scooters more attractive. However the overall malaise in the economy is definitely slowing the purchase of big ticket items. |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/19/2007 6:48:16 PM EDT
[#14]
If I had $20,000 I would certainly buy a metric bike, an old vette, a wide screen TV and a new computer before blowing the whole wad on an over priced status symbol.
Oh wait! then I couldnt live the "Harley Lifestyle" could I? |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/19/2007 6:49:51 PM EDT
[#15]
Its hard for me to feel sorry for a company that sticks it to its customers/potential buyers that way. |
||
|
|
|
Posted: 9/19/2007 6:50:17 PM EDT
[#16]
They're all buying Star motorcycles now!
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/19/2007 6:50:17 PM EDT
[#17]
you can leave a 100 bucks as a deposit and there is no 36 month wait... a good dealer will call another dealer to see if they have that bike/model/color on hand. sheesh. |
||
|
|
|
Posted: 9/19/2007 6:53:47 PM EDT
[#18]
what lifestyle? I ride a Harley. I bought a Harley because I like the bikes and the history behind them. Plus, they're GOOD bikes contrary to what others say. I also have met a lot of good people and made friends with other Harley and non-Harley riders. I haven't seen a "lifestyle" of any sorts. |
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/19/2007 6:54:33 PM EDT
[#19]
Thats simply not how it worked a few years ago when he bought his, might be different now. |
|||
|
|
|
Posted: 9/19/2007 6:57:06 PM EDT
[#20]
The biker build off fad is over and the dickhead wanna-be's are starting to realize they have no earthly reason to be on a bike.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/19/2007 6:59:45 PM EDT
[#21]
Shhh! You know facts have no business in threads once the bashing begins. Loose the hounds!!! |
|||
|
|
|
Posted: 9/19/2007 7:05:25 PM EDT
[#22]
As others have stated the Motorcycle fad has ended and the market is totally saturated with barly used bikes for sale.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/19/2007 7:05:57 PM EDT
[#23]
when i bought mine, i requested the bike be a certain color with several aftermarket modifications. they didn't have anything remotely resembling what i wanted, so they ordered in a black bike from another dealership and did all the mods in house. time from order to take home? less than 3 days 
|
||||
|
|
|
Posted: 9/19/2007 7:06:36 PM EDT
[#24]
fad hasn't gone away, but the money people used to buy them(credit, home equity) has... |
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/19/2007 7:13:05 PM EDT
[#25]
I don't know about that. I have noticed that there are not near as many motorcycle TV shows and bike builder shows as there where just afew years ago. It's atleast a combo of the two. |
||
|
|
|
Posted: 9/19/2007 7:15:03 PM EDT
[#26]
Best move Harley could make is to offer a trailer with every bike sold.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/19/2007 7:16:29 PM EDT
[#27]
They leak more than they burn...fill em up with oil and check the gas
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/19/2007 7:16:35 PM EDT
[#28]
Kidding right? Why do you think they are now called Harley boutiques? Why do you think that the dealers have to provide a set amount of floorspace for the clothing line? Why do you think you see every wanna be bad ass Dr, Lawyer, banker, etc. fully geared out in HD stuff riding chromed out bikes down to the local diner on the wekend? So they can be seen................... Once again, HD absolutely had one of the best marketing schemes of the modern era, cashed in on it, and now is finding out it is coming to a screaching halt. The major shareholders have made their money 10x over. The employees and small shareholders are in for a rude awakening. |
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/19/2007 7:18:08 PM EDT
[#29]
The baby-boomer RUBs have all made it past their mid-life crises... maybe they realised "wtf did I spend $25,000 on this for?"
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/19/2007 7:19:54 PM EDT
[#30]
They Should have taken their marketing to the next level (a la DeBeers)... "A Harley Is Forever" |
||
|
|
|
Posted: 9/19/2007 7:20:23 PM EDT
[#31]
The real reason? The used market is FLOODED so who will buy new?
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/19/2007 7:20:44 PM EDT
[#32]
Take a look at where a lot of the "official HD" products are made. Hint: it's not in North America. Think Walmart.
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/19/2007 7:22:30 PM EDT
[#33]
And a LOT of the smaller parts on the bikes...chrome plating is an environmental headache so shifting that part of the process to China is a REAL cost savings. |
||
|
|
|
Posted: 9/19/2007 7:23:48 PM EDT
[#34]
Well, that's the issue....lots of people went out and bought them, thanks to Jesse James, American Chopper and gang. Then proceed to put a few miles on them and decide, why did I buy this again? So now you have lots of very nice ridiculous low mileage pre-owned examples for sale. |
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/19/2007 7:26:48 PM EDT
[#35]
I like the looks and the sound of Harleys, but when I get my first bike (late bloomer, I'm 38) it'll be either a Gold Wing or a big displacement dual sport.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/19/2007 7:28:37 PM EDT
[#36]
Other brands that have faced similar challenges have revamped their line and come out with "all new models" - attempting to draw a clear distinction between the "new" models and the "old" (inference: less desireable) models. This tries to de-value the used market and lead buyers to believe that old Harleys are passe and its not stylish to be seen on one. |
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/19/2007 7:29:15 PM EDT
[#37]
Guess the 'mystique' of owning a Harley has worn off with the yups/boomers.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/19/2007 7:31:12 PM EDT
[#38]
Sad that sales are slowing but it was time , HD has been on top of big bike sales for many years . I have owned many HD's over the years and loved all of them but if I were to get another bike today , it would be a BMW R1200GS Adventure !
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/19/2007 7:31:30 PM EDT
[#39]
I was in Fairfax (VA) Harley Davidson 2 years ago with a HD friend of mine. A sales guy (older, knowledgeable) told me that I could walk in with a briefcase with $25,000 in cash in it - and he would not order a bike for me. Lottery only. I heard some older dealers may not play this game - but clearly HD tolerates it. |
|||
|
|
|
Posted: 9/19/2007 7:34:39 PM EDT
[#40]
Interesting. I've read before that HD got in trouble with the "subprime" financing debacle, offering bikes to any cadaver that could fill out a form. Now there's lots of clean used bikes out there, hurting their market.
And they blame fuel prices? I know the Buells with HD engines get phenomenal milage (in the 50's-60's) so I'd guess their big cruisers do as well..?? Couldn't that be a selling point, too? Also got a mag yesterday with the new liquid cooled overhead cam Buell in it (Buell is majority owned by HD, always use HD made powerplants) Well, HD said they were "too busy" to produce the new engine, so it's being farmed out to Rotax. Of course, i'm sure this was a couple years ago so maybe they were busy, but how about some initiative? They treat their only innovative group as bastard step children, missing out that the cruisers could benefit from the tech developed by Buell too. I wish they would have used the V-Rod motor (ironically, one of the plants that's "idled") then I could have bought a predominantly american performance bike. Sure it might not be the fire breather that the Japanese make, but i'm willing to swallow some crap if I can get respectable performance at a fair price. But now, this bike is predominantly foreign, so why not spend the same money on something foreign that is arguably more reliable, and without a question higher performance? I will never buy a Harley. I don't say this with venom, but with the belief that the company is truly managed from a different mindset that will never offer to me what I want at a reasonable price. |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/19/2007 7:39:07 PM EDT
[#41]
It's good to know something harley idles.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/19/2007 7:46:45 PM EDT
[#42]
HaHa, some things are timeless! Same thing said in the 70's when I bougth a KZ900 instead of a Harley. Much better bike in all areas, and it didn't leak oil!!!
|
||
|
|
|
Posted: 9/19/2007 7:46:55 PM EDT
[#43]
They don't idle...they shake. Harley made bad engineering a trademark. |
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/19/2007 8:01:27 PM EDT
[#44]
It's already started... sort of.. 
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/19/2007 8:15:59 PM EDT
[#45]
I own a Harley, nice bike with no problems. The leaking oil jokes date back to the shovel head engines from 1966-1982, this has not been a problem with the Evos or Twin Cam motors since then.
One of the reasons the market is flooded, is the number of people who want to update to the new 96 cubic inch motor, six-speed tranny, and fuel injection as well as some other improvements. Three year-old bikes have dropped in price faster than I've seen Harleys fall before. They just don't hold value like they used to. As far as updating the design. People buy HDs for the vintage look and feel, "Updating" upsets loyal buyers. Is my bike the best out there? No far from it. BUT, I choose the ride it for the feel of something passed. The same reason I have a classic car in the garage. |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/19/2007 8:35:37 PM EDT
[#46]
Fixed.
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/19/2007 8:39:35 PM EDT
[#47]
H-D is suffering some of the pains the automotive companies felt a few years back, the creeping EPA requirements. It is causing a limit to the air-cooled engine designs and forcing them to go to water cooled in the near future. Also, sound restrictions are causing many expensive design changes to accomodate them. So far they are doing a pretty good job getting by, that is the reason the 96 ci engine came out, it is much cleaner emissions wise and quieter. As is the new 6 speed which is much quieter, except for 5th gear but it sounds loud due to the other gears being so quiet.
It is true that some of the past buyers are no longer interested in Harley's and selling them off, but there is still a high demand. I have not seen 36 month waits ever, but about 10 years ago it was not uncommon for a 12 month wait. Some dealers are basically crooks and charge over sticker prices just because they can. I guess it depends on the area and how high the popularity is there. In Illinois where I live, you can buy Harley's at sticker, or less, all day long about anywhere. The recreation market is always cyclical. Harleys will go down somewhat in popularity but after 3-5 years of lower sales they will head back up. Harley today is much more responsive to consumers and its reflected in the light years advancement in technology on their bikes. Example: the 2008 Electra Glide models have fly by wire throttles standard. Who woulda thunk it on a Harley? |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/19/2007 8:46:15 PM EDT
[#48]
Oh goodie! I tried to get book prices a few years ago, maybe now they will go for it.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/19/2007 9:07:36 PM EDT
[#49]
it aint just harleys that are over priced,a lot of the so called aftermarket "choppers" were WAY over priced. 30 to a hundred grand!! for a motorcycle! like a orange county chopper 40 grand to start! please it,s only a motorcycle!!
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/19/2007 9:17:21 PM EDT
[#50]
 Yeah, you'll be getting passed, all right. I'd like to know how the sales trends looked for other bike brands. Maybe a significant percentage of those new RUBs, having had a HD, are now looking to other brands. |
|
|
|
Win a FREE Membership!
Sign up for the ARFCOM weekly newsletter and be entered to win a free ARFCOM membership. One new winner* is announced every week!
You will receive an email every Friday morning featuring the latest chatter from the hottest topics, breaking news surrounding legislation, as well as exclusive deals only available to ARFCOM email subscribers.
AR15.COM is the world's largest firearm community and is a gathering place for firearm enthusiasts of all types.
From hunters and military members, to competition shooters and general firearm enthusiasts, we welcome anyone who values and respects the way of the firearm.
Subscribe to our monthly Newsletter to receive firearm news, product discounts from your favorite Industry Partners, and more.
Copyright © 1996-2024 AR15.COM LLC. All Rights Reserved.
Any use of this content without express written consent is prohibited.
AR15.Com reserves the right to overwrite or replace any affiliate, commercial, or monetizable links, posted by users, with our own.
