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Posted: 9/26/2005 9:15:31 AM EDT
[#1]
Ok after polishing the buffer it still wont load a round after firing. Also on one magazine I had a hard time loading the first round, the bolt rides over the top of the first round, when shooting the 40 grain winchester ammo, it wont eject the shell. Could it be a combo problem of too heavy a buffer and old mags. I really need some help with this one.
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Posted: 9/26/2005 9:15:36 AM EDT
[#2]
Loose gas key on the bolt?
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Posted: 9/26/2005 9:16:03 AM EDT
[#3]
How do I check that-and thanks |
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Posted: 9/26/2005 9:17:38 AM EDT
[#4]
Optional gas port on a bushy?
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Posted: 9/26/2005 9:18:31 AM EDT
[#5]
Dunno where do I look 
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Posted: 9/26/2005 9:18:49 AM EDT
[#6]
There's really no way to check it other than torque driving the mounting screws to the rated PSI and staking them.
If you've ever loosened the gas key for cleaning, etc... and didn't torque the screws back on, then I can assure you that there is play on the gas key. It is impossible to hand tighten those screws to spec. |
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Posted: 9/26/2005 9:25:11 AM EDT
[#7]
Ok just checked the bolt and the gas key is still tight and the stake marks havent moved from one another-any other ideas. Also why wont my mags drop free, I also am having a hard time when I put them in, they dont want to click. I know I m not using the right wording half the time, so yall please forgive me Im at wits end, been working on this for 2 days. 
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Posted: 9/26/2005 9:30:51 AM EDT
[#8]
1 - Rounds not feeding into chamber - Check bolt/bolt face for worn or broken lug, check for proper contact of bolt lug to rear of round (load and insert magazine, pull charging handle to the rear, and ride it forward watching to see if it strips round from magazine and pushes it into chamber, but do this in a safe location with muzzle in safe direction) check magazines/try a different magazine
2 - Magazine not dropping free - Magazine or magazine well in lower receiver tight or out-of-spec; check magazine/try a different magazine for fit 3 - Buffer rough - Only the contact edges should be polished; if any. The entire buffer housing does not contact the inner dimension of the buffer tube I have no experience with EA products, but generally - it is a good idea to use USGI mags. You may be using a mag that doesn't fit well or is unserviceable; or worst case, the mag well may be a bit small. In either case, your feeding malfunction sounds magazine-related. You *might* have a problem with your gas system. The bolt carrier gas key is the uppermost portion of the bolt carrier and is secured with two allen screws. In most cases these are permanently staked. If it is not staked, it can work itself loose and leak gas. If you are leaking gas, there is not enought pressure to cycle the BCG fully and that can also contribute to your feeding problem. You might also try using a different buffer if you have one available. I'm not sure of the modifications you have done to the one you have. ETA: Try inserting a loaded magazine into your weapon. It should be snug with a loaded magazine, but it should "click" when fully engaged. If it is not clicking, try taking out a few rounds. Sometimes the backpressure of a fully-loaded magazine offers too much resistance - and for this reason, 28 rounds might be a better load. What type/brand of magazine are you using? |
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Posted: 9/26/2005 9:40:09 AM EDT
[#9]
1. No broken lug, I dont have any other mags to try right now, I bought several that were suppose to be in great shape, got them and they looked like crap, sold my other mags so Im stuck with these  2. I dont have another mag to try as I said in #1, so on to the mag well area, can I take a buffer in there and smooth anything out, logic tells me before I do that to try a brand new mag first, Im getting impatient  arent I.3.WELL I got the prettiest polished buffer you ever seen I polished the entire thing. The only mods I made to it were installing weights on the inside to get it to 4.4 oz. (123 g) I used melted lead, its pretty much solid on the inside. Thanks for your help any ideas on the mag area on the bushy . Its serial number starts with a L19xxx7 if this helps, have they had a problem with this in the past? Thanksedit for not answering all the questions on the bottom of the mags it says PARSONS PRECISION PRODUCTS PARSONS KS USA I will try taking out a few rounds |
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Posted: 9/26/2005 9:46:46 AM EDT
[#10]
Parsons is a USGI contract manufacturer, but you may have a bad magazine.
Your feeding problem and your tight mag fit may be one in the same: If the magazine is not freely dropping, you may actually think that the magazine is fully engaged and locked into place - however; if it is not, it may not be in far enough/high enough for the bolt to engage the next round. Can't think of anything else ATM. |
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Posted: 9/26/2005 9:48:59 AM EDT
[#11]
Freely dropping is an after thought, I have to pull the mag out with it being fully loaded, I took the upper off and inserted the mag, it clicked fine this time but still I had to pull, quite hard I might add to get the mag out, any ideas where I can look in the mag area or what I can do. Thanks |
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Posted: 9/26/2005 9:54:25 AM EDT
[#12]
How is the mag release working? Does the catch extend out far enough when you have the mag release button depressed? |
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Posted: 9/26/2005 9:54:40 AM EDT
[#13]
Get a hold of another USGI mag.
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Posted: 9/26/2005 9:56:31 AM EDT
[#14]
Yes when I look down from the top, the catch release disappears, or comes out the side, by eye balling about 1/16 of a inch, closer to an 1/8. THanks again, Im checking everything yall are suggesting 
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Posted: 9/26/2005 10:00:07 AM EDT
[#15]
It kinda sounds like your magazine may be swollen or "ballooned". Excessive use/wear can cause this, and while sometimes not noticeable to the naked eye, the small distortions are not forgiving.
Having the magazine loaded can complicate this problem. If the mag is distorted, the follower may not want to move much while loaded. This could make the fit very tight inside the magwell, as well as putting too much pressure on the bolt carrier above it. In other words, the tolerances are too tight for the BCG to function normally. This is a theory, of course, because I'm not standing beside you looking at your weapon with you. I have seen this happen, albeit with very old, worn, distorted USGI mags. Your receiver could be a bit out of spec, but it is more likely a mag problem. I don't think there is much you can do until you have had a chance to test a new mag. |
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Posted: 9/26/2005 10:02:15 AM EDT
[#16]
Ok i just tried an old platstic eagle arms see thru mag, had it for 8 years before one of the lips broke off
 dang plastic. Anywho I put that one in, made a nice click and dropped right out, inserts easy and everything, so its gotta be the mags, I got some payments coming from ebay sales, and when I do I will get some good mags, do yall have any preference and who to buy from, I know someone on here who wont get anymore money from me on "used mags in fine shape"but I still would like to check on the mag well any way or any area that you can clean up a little inside there to help out things. Thanks |
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Posted: 9/26/2005 10:03:52 AM EDT
[#17]
I will try an take some pics of the mags from the top and side, I think your right about the mags, that and after close inspection, the lips arent straight either
pics coming
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Posted: 9/26/2005 10:05:43 AM EDT
[#18]
It might be the magazine then. Perhaps it has widened a bit and does not allow the mag catch to clear the side of the magazine with the button depressed. As for your cycling problem, have you tried any other, "hotter" ammo? I have no experience with what you've mentioned, but I've heard from others that the Remington UMC is on the underpowered side. I could be wrong, but given that and your heavier buffer, perhaps the ammo simply cannot cycle the bolt carrier assembly all the way? |
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Posted: 9/26/2005 10:08:50 AM EDT
[#19]
www.eaglefirearms.net/ar15_magazines.htm I have a couple of the D&H Industries 30 rounders with the teflon coating. Work like a charm. |
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Posted: 9/26/2005 10:09:50 AM EDT
[#20]
I had thought of that but when I fire it with one mag of the UMC 60 grain, it will eject the shell, just wont feed another, in another mag with the 40 gr. Win. it will fire and I feel the buffer going down the tupe on the car stock, here the spring and everthing, and you can see scrape marks on the shell below, it just will not let go of the shell, this mag is also the one I have a hard time of the bolt picking up the shell on the first round. |
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Posted: 9/26/2005 10:12:12 AM EDT
[#21]
Thanks for the link I will be buying some as soon as some guy from Florida pays for his McCoy pots he bought from my wife gotta keep that paypal money flowing-after I buy some new mags I will update here with my progress.
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Posted: 9/26/2005 10:22:41 AM EDT
[#22]
Who knows how many of those problems the new mags will be able to fix. Bad mags can be a major PIA.
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Posted: 9/26/2005 10:31:29 AM EDT
[#23]
Doesn't exist. They haven't made a upper forging in atleast 15 years. |
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Posted: 9/26/2005 10:37:56 AM EDT
[#24]
I know this is going to sound stupid, but check to see that there is hole thru the upper screw of the stock.
I had a problem just like that. Was a very nice bolt action AR. I had the gas port hole in the barrel drilled out, I tried different ammo, I checked the gas key numerous times, I tried different bolts. I was at my wit's end till someone here suggested that I check and see if there was a hole in that screw that went all the way thru. This one didn't. Apparently, there was a batch of those that didn't get the hole drilled. What was going on was that there was a pocket of air in the buffer tube and when the buffer would recoil, it would hit this pocket of air and make the whole thing short stroke. I replaced the old one with a new one and it functioned fine. It is worth checking. |
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Posted: 9/26/2005 10:51:32 AM EDT
[#25]
Sorry about that, your right it is not a Martin/Marietta forged upper it is a LAR / Martin Marietta forged upper. I bought it off the forum here, cant remember if it was landmand303 or fightforyourights, or someone else, it was one of them though
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Posted: 9/26/2005 10:57:47 AM EDT
[#26]
Here are the pics of my used mags, the finish has worn off the top where it goes in and out of the mag well, they were in worse shape but I refinished them at work, is there any thing I can do to get the mags to work, hate to just scrap them, also sorry about my old hp camera to.
    Thanks for yalls help, gotta go weed whack for awhile, to keep SWMBO happy 
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Posted: 9/26/2005 11:18:44 AM EDT
[#27]
Thanks-just checked for the hole, and had one, I also just tried my old eagle arms busted mag, I really think now I may have two problems, one the mags and two the heavy buffer, just tried it with one shell in the mag with the 40 grain and the UMC stuff, now the 40 wont eject at all, and the 60 will sometimes tumble out, its getting where the bolt wont cycle at all. I will try cleaning the gas tube after yard work, anything else I can check, I never would have thought a 4.4 oz buffer with a 16" barrel would be too heavy. Ideas? |
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Posted: 9/26/2005 12:42:55 PM EDT
[#28]
Wouldn't that still make it a martin marietta upper? It has no martin marietta in it. |
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Posted: 9/26/2005 1:09:39 PM EDT
[#29]
Have you tried to see if the bolt locks open after you fire the last round out of that mag?
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Posted: 9/26/2005 1:24:35 PM EDT
[#30]
Look I got no idea all I know is the A1 upper I had before was marked LM, the upper I got now is marked LM and according to this www.biggerhammer.net/ar15/uppers/ it says LM means LAR / Martin Marietta -now I will be the first to admit I dont know all the ends and outs of these little black beautys, Im just going by what Im reading on that site and I know you cant believe everything you read on the internet but thats all I got to go on. Peace. Im more than open minded to everyones views, everyones. This still doesnt help the problem I got though keep em coming
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Posted: 9/26/2005 1:27:46 PM EDT
[#31]
yeah now I have tried all the mags I got which equals 2 questionable and 1 busted, but none of them now will even move the bolt. I even tried fireing the rifle with no mag in and still the shell was left in the chamber -with no mag in the mag well, so now Im thinking its either the buffer too heavy-which I dont see how-doesnt the "h" buffer or 9mm buffer weigh more than 4.4 oz? If not then I made a big mistake in putting that much weight in or my gas tube or system is plugged, but I dont see how, I always have kept my rifle and other guns spotless. Open to any suggestions but Im running out of bullets
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Posted: 9/26/2005 2:04:23 PM EDT
[#32]
You said it was a flattop in your original post. Now it's and A1 with a fixed handle? There is no such thing as a flattop Martin Marietta upper. LM = LAR Martin Marietta |
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Posted: 9/26/2005 2:07:18 PM EDT
[#33]
Well, Randy,
I am far from an expert on this but having read your posts I think it is gas system related. It sounds like there is not enough gas to move the bolt back into the buffer tube. You could put some carb cleaner or even break free down the gas tube and verify that it is making it's way into the barrel through the gas port. If there is not enough (or any) gas getting through the system this will cause the problems you are having. How dirty is your bolt getting? If the gas is getting to the key the bolt should get dirty everytime you shoot. If you do puty anything into the gas tube, make sure you blow it out before you fire the weapon! Since the weapon is firing and the bolt is moving back manually the only problem I could see with the buffer/tube may be the modification to the buffer if the gas system checks out. Good Luck Sarge |
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Posted: 9/26/2005 2:48:32 PM EDT
[#34]
Scotty if you have read my post all the way thru, the upper in question now, is a flat top, the upper I had before was a A1 I have no idea what is made where or when all I know is the upper I had before the A1 was marked LM the flat top upper I have now which I bought from a dealer on this forum-he informed me it was also a LM upper, I just wish to GOD that I could remember whom it was so I could email him and get this straightened out-given time I will figure it out and for sure will let you know who made my upper. I never would have thought me asking a quesiton about my rifle not operating right would get into "who made what upper" I will just add it to the list of things I need to learn |
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Posted: 9/26/2005 3:00:22 PM EDT
[#35]
Sarge I shot some bore cleaner down the gas tupe where I could also see down the barrel from the back and yes as soon as I shot the cleaner it came out the front of the barrel-clean. Where on the bolt should there be dirt when I fire, I check the gas tube on the bolt and it also appears clean also- God it looks like Im running out of ideas yall keep em coming I tear the whole dang gun down before the nights over with.
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Posted: 9/26/2005 3:14:25 PM EDT
[#36]
1 make sure you have a regular buffer and not a heavy buffer, this will cause the gun to short stroke. other then that you might have a out of spec gun... God speed
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Posted: 9/26/2005 3:19:23 PM EDT
[#37]
Well see thats just it, when I had a A1 upper with a 11/5 barrel I had feeding problems, everyone suggested a heavier buffer, so I took the regular buffer I had, took the rubber out of the end and filled it full of melted lead, it came out weighing 4.4 ozs . I had thou, never fired the buffer in the A1 shorty upper, now on my flat top upper with a 16 in barrel, from what I read people use a heavy buffer or 9 mm buffer with no problems, so I ASSumed  the heavy buffer I made would be ok, what I need to know I guess now, is, how heavy is too heavy, I guess with the ammo Im using from Wally world, the buffer I got is too heavy, well, what would happen if I went back to a shorty barrel would the 4.4oz buffer be ok then, I cant find any info on what buffers should weigh, thanks for all yalls help |
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Posted: 9/26/2005 4:07:34 PM EDT
[#38]
The "H" buffer weighs 3.8 oz. Also, does the weight inside your buffer still slide back and forth when you shake it? It should not be solid. |
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Posted: 9/26/2005 4:09:32 PM EDT
[#39]
UH oh, no mine does not slide, I poured molten lead in there till if filled up. No sliding, would that cause it-thanks for your help |
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Posted: 9/26/2005 4:15:56 PM EDT
[#40]
its the buffer then, the heavy buffer's are usually used when it comes to a opened up gas tube. use a regular carbine buffer and you will be good to go
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Posted: 9/26/2005 4:43:21 PM EDT
[#41]
You mean more is not always better? I will try and take it back apart and get some weight out, should it slide back and forth, before I go and do all this. Or should I just keep it and use it when I get another 11" barrel. Do yall think it will work then, the buffer that is. Thanks again sorry to be so much trouble but Im learning
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Posted: 9/26/2005 4:55:10 PM EDT
[#42]
Wait, so when you fire, are you 100% sure, the bolt doesnt even make an attempt to go back at all?
Bang and that's it? When you pull the charging handle all the way back, do you feel any binding or is it smooth? |
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Posted: 9/26/2005 5:02:42 PM EDT
[#43]
Well the last 2 times I fired it today, the bolt moved back maybe a half inch, as long as the mag was in there was no way I could pull the charging handle back, as soon as I dropped the mag and hit the FA I could then pull the charging handle to eject the shell, when I loaded a round with no mag it would fire, move back a little, I could then either hit the FA and pull the charging handle or just pull the charging handle and eject the shell. I never tried it with the Ejection Port Cover closed to see if it moved enough to knock it open, but I dont think it would. I ve got the entire gun apart right now except taking the barrel off the upper, so I can pretty much look at anything you want me to. Got the buffer out, spring out, bolt out, charging handle out, etc. I have already cleaned the gas tube fixing to spray down in the bolts gas key just to make sure its clean but it sure looks like its clean. |
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Posted: 9/26/2005 5:19:52 PM EDT
[#44]
You can try hitting the bump out just below the rectangular mag catch with the plastic handle of a screwdriver. By flattening the bump out just a little, about .010", they will usually drop free. Try one to see if it works. Do not damage the magazine by trying to hit it too hard. If not you can return the lower receiver to us as we have a jig that will open the magazine well slightly, about .020", that should take care of the problem.
Thank you. |
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Posted: 9/26/2005 5:27:46 PM EDT
[#45]
Ive already tried that and may have gone past .010. Do you work for bushmaster, Greg, and if so, do I have to go thru a ffl to send it to you, or in other words how to I send it to you. |
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Posted: 9/26/2005 5:38:21 PM EDT
[#46]
Just an aside, Tapco has the same mags for $15, no matter how many you buy. 
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Posted: 9/26/2005 6:18:30 PM EDT
[#47]
Ok another update, thru everyones suggestions I broke the bolt carrier down, except I didnt take out the key or the actual bolt, took out the cam pin, cam and firing pin. One thing odd though is the cam was pretty much locked in I think the reap position, apparently some severe crud had gotten down inside the bolt carrier around the bolt and made it so sticky I could barely unstick it. It looked like the same kind of crud that I found inside the buffer tube, is there anyway crud from the buffer tube can get inside the bolt carrier and if so sticky will this not allow it to extract a shell and load another one, Ive always cleaned the bolt carrier with solvent, I dont know where this crud came from, I got if off with carb cleaner. Any opinions. Im worn out, Im putting it back together and going to bed, one thing about it, Ive learned all the ends and outs of my rifle tonight. LOL, Think I will try and lighten the buffer down to 4oz tomorrow and start over. Keep the opinions coming Im gonna try everyone I can till this works.
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Posted: 9/26/2005 7:24:49 PM EDT
[#48]
H2 buffer is 4.3 oz |
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Posted: 9/26/2005 7:27:09 PM EDT
[#49]
I agree that you LM A1 upper is LAR Martin Marietta. But in the first few lines in your post, you said.... "I have the same Martin/ Marietta forged flat top upper...." |
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Posted: 9/26/2005 9:09:08 PM EDT
[#50]
scottryan: let it go. There was a misunderstanding - life continues. No need to keep hammering someone.
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