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Posted: 5/22/2005 8:14:36 AM EDT
[#1]
Your rifle buffer is longer correct? Is that why you are having troubles? Also, Carbine buffers are lighter in weight. Is there a problem using the carbine buffer?
My bad. I see that it comes with the rifle buffer. Could be that you are not getting enough gas to cycle the action. If you place an empty magazine in the weapon and pull back on the charging hangle, does the bolt stop engage correctly? What ammo are you using? Wolf or quality ammo for testing? I have seen so many people listing problems who have no problem when using xm193 (not the pd suff) or xm855 (not the pd stuff) and then change over to Wolf and then start having problems. Also, what kind of chambe do you have .233 vs 5.56? |
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Posted: 5/22/2005 8:33:36 AM EDT
[#2]
I haven't test fired it, just function checks.
Pulling the charging handle as far back as the buffer will allow, and looking in the ejection port, shows the bolt face about .75" in front of the bolt catch. The normal ACE stock ships with a carbine spring and buffer. The long ships with a rifle (at least per the DSG web page). The instruction sheet with the ACE stock DID say carbine buffer/spring, but no where on the sheet did it mention (or appear) to be for the LONG version... the pic on the sheet is the short model. |
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Posted: 5/23/2005 8:20:15 AM EDT
[#3]
It does use a rifle buffer and spring, but you might want to call Bob @ Ace and ask him about it. He's knows his stocks inside and out and may be able to shed some light on it...
www.aceltdusa.com/index2.htm |
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Posted: 5/23/2005 8:39:15 AM EDT
[#4]
Thanks for the info... I kicked an email over to ACE directly asking for some input too.
I'm sure it's something stupid on my end, though what I can't imagine... shy of having dropped a pretzel down the buffer tube. This install issue aside, the stock is sweet.... rock solid and at a good price. |
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Posted: 5/23/2005 9:22:58 AM EDT
[#5]
Just hung up with Bob at ACE...
Good guy, fast response. Unfortunately, no clue as to the cause of problem that I'm seeing. Sending it back to ACE for them to eyeball. Frustrating, but it is some solid gear and good manufacture (and dealer) responsiveness... Will update when I hear back from ACE. |
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Posted: 5/23/2005 10:13:56 AM EDT
[#6]
From my experiences in the past ACE is a top notch company with great customer support... Good luck! |
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Posted: 6/3/2005 8:12:33 AM EDT
[#7]
Any resolution to this kallnojoy? Has Bob rec'd. your stock? Let us know if we can help you... |
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Posted: 6/4/2005 12:59:26 PM EDT
[#8]
hey kal, first thing is to check an make sure the pin in the end of the buffer isn't sticking out and catching the spring......if that's not it, i would start by removing the recoil spring and seeing if the recoil spring tube is long enough...just pull the spring, drop the buffer down the tube, close the recievers, and see if the bolt will come back far enough to be caught by the latch.........
if not, look where the tube comes through the lower and holds the buffer retainer detent in....can you back it out 1 full turn???.....if so, this may give you enough length....... if you can't get enough length that way, you've prob got the wrong buffer/tube combo..... good luck w/ it, and keep us posted skintback |
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Posted: 6/4/2005 4:16:40 PM EDT
[#9]
Edit:
Could be that someone left something in the receiver extension, and the reason that the buffer is bottoming out too soon (read a packing peanut would do it). |
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Posted: 6/4/2005 10:44:20 PM EDT
[#10]
IIRC, that model of stock uses the rifle buffer and spring, perhaps the spring is long for a rifle spring.
is there a mark on the anti rebound buffer on the rear of the buffer? |
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Posted: 6/6/2005 7:54:08 AM EDT
[#11]
Been away on vacation and haven't put the stock out in the mail yet. Thanks for checking back. Based on the prompt voice and email responses from Ace/Bob, I'm sure they will get it right.
I did confirm the normal rifle buffer and spring are what I should be using. Dropping the buffer in the tube (sans spring), shows 3 1/4" from top off buffer to top of tube... same measurement as with the spring in place, so spring length or binding aren't at issue. Looks like I would need about 4" to give the bolt carrier enough room in the tube to clear the bolt catch. Damn nice stock though... I haven't seen any more solid, makes the standard m4 look like a flimsy toy. |
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Posted: 6/6/2005 11:47:41 AM EDT
[#12]
how long is your buffer?
is there anything sticking in the bottom of the tube? |
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Posted: 6/6/2005 12:09:47 PM EDT
[#13]
Buffer is a hair under 6" Tube depth empty is 9.25" No obstruction in the tube, the buffer definately bottoms out. Leaving roughly 3.25"+ depth for the bolt carrier to retract into, which unless I've got a case of the stupids, leaves the bolt face about 1" in front of the bolt catch. The only two options I can see are a 1" shorter buffer or a 1" longer tube. |
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Posted: 6/6/2005 12:18:05 PM EDT
[#14]
IIRC the rifle buffer should be 6" long. the length of the buffer plus the distance from the rear of the carrier key to the rear of the carrier is the ~ internal depth of the buffer tube.
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Posted: 6/6/2005 12:37:16 PM EDT
[#15]
Here is the deal in pictures:
Stock components and BCG  Buffer Tube depth (empty)  Buffer Tube remaining capacity after 6" rifle buffer inserted (no spring)  Buffer and BCG fully inserted into buffer tube (no spring)  |
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Posted: 6/6/2005 6:49:46 PM EDT
[#16]
I don't have my SOCOM in front of me, but are you CERTAIN that they sent you the "L" model, and not the standard M4 SOCOM?
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Posted: 6/6/2005 11:03:26 PM EDT
[#17]
The receiver extension was not bored deep enough or you have the wrong buffer.
Just check a couple of tubes. Depth of a standard A-1 or 2 receiver extension is 9-5/8" to the lip, with a standard buffer being 5-7/8". Your tube shows 5-1/4, and the buffer would need to be shortened by 1/2" to make the receiver extension work (would need to be 5-3/8" long). Unlesss there is a special buffer for the butt stock set, it is time to send the unit back for replacement. |
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Posted: 6/7/2005 10:39:46 AM EDT
[#18]
I believe that is the case also... as did the guy from ACE I spoke with. Now I just need to make it out to the post office.... |
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Posted: 6/7/2005 11:50:05 AM EDT
[#19]
Kallnojoy, I have to give you credit for your patience,
Over half the guys her, including myself, would have shortened the buffer right out of the gate (WECSOG special), instead of calling up the supplier and having them correct the problem. We get so used to having to tweak/fit the parts that often we forget where to draw the line. I applaud you on keeping them honest and making the suppliers solve their own problems (at the cost of making you wait to enjoy the rifle), instead of leaving it up to the end-user. Post back when the problem has been corrected, and get to take the rifle for a spin. |
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Posted: 6/14/2005 4:13:45 PM EDT
[#20]
[If I leave the rifle spring in, but use a carbine buffer, the catch functions.
/b]Be very cautious about dropping in a short buffer/spring. A situation may arise where every thing seems to be functioning fine but your buffer may not be stopping the carriers rearward movement. The carrier key will then be slamming into your upper receiver/charging handle. Bad news to follow. |
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Posted: 6/14/2005 5:15:16 PM EDT
[#21]
No worries here, that was bench testing, not live firing. I'm the curious type, but I like keeping my apendages attached. |
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Posted: 6/20/2005 6:15:30 PM EDT
[#22]
Bump w/resolution
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Posted: 6/20/2005 10:13:09 PM EDT
[#23]
Interesting. I'm having the same problem with an ace stocked rifle I took in trade. Same symptoms. I need to whip out the measuring stick.
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Posted: 6/21/2005 1:41:22 AM EDT
[#24]
I have to ask, What buffer goes with the old receiver extension that first received, of was this a extension designed to fit a AK type swing block?
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Posted: 6/21/2005 3:37:20 AM EDT
[#25]
Standard rifle buffer, as this stock was the long version. ACE's standard M4 SOCOM model uses a car buffer. |
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Posted: 6/21/2005 5:55:20 AM EDT
[#26]
Sorry you had a hassle with it kallnojoy, but glad its taken care of.
ACE makes a good product and on the occasion there is a problem they always take care of it. |
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Posted: 10/18/2005 11:17:20 PM EDT
[#27]
good info here
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