User Panel
Posted: 1/30/2024 8:30:29 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Fooboy]
We did this once before, time to try again. It's only 7 yards so you irons guys should be fine
The official FBI-QIT-99 "bottle" targets are not very common so I made some modifications to make it simpler to shoot for the AR15.com edition (use of IPSC target, using 2 vs 3 targets on stage 6, etc); however, the spirit of the drill is very much the same - a blend of speed and accuracy. This is just for fun, but if you want to participate you'll need: - CCW setup with 1 spare mag, timer, and 30 rounds - 2 ISPC targets at 7 yards - To post a pic of your score sheet along with primary target (I'll trust your target 2 is all alphas unless you tell us otherwise) - "Official" rules are found below. Who's in? Drop Box Link to PDF: ARF FAMQ Attached File |
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Isaiah 1:18 - "Come now, let us reason together," says the LORD: "though your sins are like scarlet, they shall be as white as snow"
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Passing Score = 135+ points, all hits on paper (30 rounds / no misses), and did not fail any stage par times
Arf qualified Air Marshals (CCW setup, preferably IWB): - 2alpha-down0 - 03RN - evnash - Fooboy Junior Marshals (non CCW setup): - - - |
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Isaiah 1:18 - "Come now, let us reason together," says the LORD: "though your sins are like scarlet, they shall be as white as snow"
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Tag, this looks fun.
What's the approved sequence? String 1 stages 1-7 then string 2 stages 1-7? Or Stage 1; string 1-string 2 Stage 2; string 1-string 2 etc |
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Isaiah 1:18 - "Come now, let us reason together," says the LORD: "though your sins are like scarlet, they shall be as white as snow"
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Why the separation for IWB and OWB? The qual was shot with an open top leather paddle holster and a cover garment at the academy.
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Let's see how I do with my mountain gun this year.
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"If you cant do something smart, do something right"
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Originally Posted By ToyCop: Why the separation for IWB and OWB? The qual was shot with an open top leather paddle holster and a cover garment at the academy. View Quote |
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Isaiah 1:18 - "Come now, let us reason together," says the LORD: "though your sins are like scarlet, they shall be as white as snow"
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This looks fun. I might have an opportunity to go out to the pit this weekend.
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I know I'll never go home.
So set fire to your ships, and past regrets, and be free. |
Can we modify this a bit for indoor ranges where we can’t shoot multiple targets side by side? Perhaps a couple of b8s on the same large target can count as 2 separate targets?
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Originally Posted By thatguybryan: Can we modify this a bit for indoor ranges where we can't shoot multiple targets side by side? Perhaps a couple of b8s on the same large target can count as 2 separate targets? View Quote I'm just gonna use a couple sheets of printer paper. Pretty sure it's close size to A zone. Certainly won't miss any |
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Isaiah 1:18 - "Come now, let us reason together," says the LORD: "though your sins are like scarlet, they shall be as white as snow"
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Thanks fellas. Have been wanting to give this a try for a while, this may help me actually do it.
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Tried it today with the 1911 and didn’t quite make the par times. Thick winter jackets make quite a bit of difference in draw times lol.
Attached File Got a bit of pinch/bite on one of the reloads. Attached File |
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"Some get spiritual because they see the light, others because they feel the heat."-Ray Wylie Hubbard
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Originally Posted By Detn8r-Red2: Tried it today with the 1911 and didn't quite make the par times. Thick winter jackets make quite a bit of difference in draw times lol. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/389898/IMG_3120_jpeg-3114630.JPG Got a bit of pinch/bite on one of the reloads. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/389898/IMG_3119_jpeg-3114632.JPG View Quote |
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Isaiah 1:18 - "Come now, let us reason together," says the LORD: "though your sins are like scarlet, they shall be as white as snow"
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Originally Posted By Fooboy: New Hampshire? Probably freezing out there View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By Fooboy: Originally Posted By Detn8r-Red2: Tried it today with the 1911 and didn't quite make the par times. Thick winter jackets make quite a bit of difference in draw times lol. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/389898/IMG_3120_jpeg-3114630.JPG Got a bit of pinch/bite on one of the reloads. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/389898/IMG_3119_jpeg-3114632.JPG Meh, 32 is like flannel weather at this point. |
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"If you cant do something smart, do something right"
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Originally Posted By 03RN: Meh, 32 is like flannel weather at this point. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By 03RN: Originally Posted By Fooboy: Originally Posted By Detn8r-Red2: Tried it today with the 1911 and didn't quite make the par times. Thick winter jackets make quite a bit of difference in draw times lol. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/389898/IMG_3120_jpeg-3114630.JPG Got a bit of pinch/bite on one of the reloads. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/389898/IMG_3119_jpeg-3114632.JPG Meh, 32 is like flannel weather at this point. 34 up here today, so a little above freezing But 03RN is right, that's pretty warm for us this time of year. I don't think I put my gloves on for most of the day. |
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"Some get spiritual because they see the light, others because they feel the heat."-Ray Wylie Hubbard
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Just to make this more fun, Ken Hackathorn said in a recent Wilson YouTube video he has not met a single person who passed this qual with a red dot.
I am not a red dot shooter primarily, but I feel like this is very doable with a dot, so I may give it a go. Love Ken, but I think he’s off on this one. |
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Originally Posted By thatguybryan: Just to make this more fun, Ken Hackathorn said in a recent Wilson YouTube video he has not met a single person who passed this qual with a red dot. I am not a red dot shooter primarily, but I feel like this is very doable with a dot, so I may give it a go. Love Ken, but I think he's off on this one. View Quote |
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Isaiah 1:18 - "Come now, let us reason together," says the LORD: "though your sins are like scarlet, they shall be as white as snow"
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Tag. Cool challenge. I'm ready to get out and shoot it. Life has been crazy lately and I haven't been able to do much real shooting in a couple of months more than firing a mag here and there in my back yard. I'm ready to do some real shooting, challenges, timers, multiple targets etc. My buddy texted me 2 days ago and said I better get my shit together because he is ready to do the same. We usually shoot together every week or 2, and it's been since Thanksgiving
Hell, I still have to shoot the Candle challenge! That's a great one too! Shoot it folks! Post it up. I look forward to seeing how everyone does. Shooting is fun Thanks for posting it up Fooboy! |
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"When I pass away, I hope my wife sells my stuff for what it's worth, and not what I told her I paid for it !!"
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Why is the sky blue?
What makes the green grass grow? |
Originally Posted By 11boomboom: Subbed Let's see if I can best last year's https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/523928/20240128_195628_jpg-3115879.JPG View Quote |
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Isaiah 1:18 - "Come now, let us reason together," says the LORD: "though your sins are like scarlet, they shall be as white as snow"
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I’m in. Supposed to rain tomorrow, but maybe I can shoot it on Sunday.
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Here I am, Here I remain
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Originally Posted By 11boomboom: Subbed Let's see if I can best last year's https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/523928/20240128_195628_jpg-3115879.JPG View Quote Oh shit, I'm not sure I'll beat my run from last year. Except I'll probably get the par time with a moon clipped gun Last years Attached File |
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"If you cant do something smart, do something right"
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It appears by the times that a reasonably competent A class shooter should be able to qualify.
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Originally Posted By 11boomboom: Subbed Let's see if I can best last year's https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/523928/20240128_195628_jpg-3115879.JPG View Quote Your math seems off, a C zone hit is minus 3, not 1, there is no minus 1 hit. By my math assuming all you -1's are actually minus 3 C zone hits and your minus 4 is 4 C zone hits. Thats 7 C zone hits at minus 3 each or your down 21 and a score of 129, which would be a fail. total max poinys is 30 rounds 5 points max each round 150 total. Minus 7 C zone hits is -21 points. But still respectable to make par @11boomboom |
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2021 just said to 2020, hold my beer and watch this. Poster formally known as Iam4
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Originally Posted By StaccatoC2: Your math seems off, a C zone hit is minus 3, not 1, there is no minus 1 hit. By my math assuming all you -1's are actually minus 3 C zone hits and your minus 4 is 4 C zone hits. Thats 7 C zone hits at minus 3 each or your down 21 and a score of 129, which would be a fail. @11boomboom View Quote I've done it several times so I just picked one of my sheets from last year. I was using IDPA targets on some of the runs, so that might have been it. Now I'm reading it, it might be the dropped shots in the c-zone. So minus one means I dropped one shot in the c-zone. It was a while ago, so I don't remember exactly. ETA: here's my SUCCESSFUL 1911 run Attached File |
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Why is the sky blue?
What makes the green grass grow? |
Originally Posted By 11boomboom: I've done it several times so I just picked one of my sheets from last year. I was using IDPA targets on some of the runs, so that might have been it. Now I'm reading it, it might be the dropped shots in the c-zone. So minus one means I dropped one shot in the c-zone. ETA: here's my 1911 run https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/523928/20240202_204542_jpg-3116312.JPG View Quote As i edited in, still respectable to make par |
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2021 just said to 2020, hold my beer and watch this. Poster formally known as Iam4
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Originally Posted By StaccatoC2: As i edited in, still respectable to make par View Quote Yeah, I went back through the math and it came out to 129, I think. Attached File I struggled with the scoring last year, too. |
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Why is the sky blue?
What makes the green grass grow? |
In. Gonna do it with a buddy on Sunday. Will see how it goes.
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I'm in
might try it with a few guns interesting qual, never heard of this before |
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That didn't look too hard until I realized the times were both strings combined.
You'd need a lot of practice to get that good. |
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Still though. Not horrible Joe.
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Esstac’s Retarded Social Media Influencer
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Originally Posted By JoeDevola: FAIL. G19 gen4, Swampfox Liberty optic. (No, Hack is STILL wrong, I just sucked!) Concealed, AIWB. Made all the par times except for string 4. https://i.postimg.cc/ZRZb2f9j/20240203-163046.jpg https://i.postimg.cc/qRgjMgrh/20240203-163102.jpg View Quote Very close. You'll get it next time. |
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Why is the sky blue?
What makes the green grass grow? |
Originally Posted By thatguybryan: Just to make this more fun, Ken Hackathorn said in a recent Wilson YouTube video he has not met a single person who passed this qual with a red dot. I am not a red dot shooter primarily, but I feel like this is very doable with a dot, so I may give it a go. Love Ken, but I think he's off on this one. View Quote He is full of baloney since most FAMS are carrying dots now. He's just a fud who hates dotes and WMLs. Yes it can be done. Yes it takes practice. But with practice it becomes routine. Put enough rounds down range and you'll be okay. IMO dots are faster then irons with practice. And most guys are using AIWB holsters. They work better with the design of airline seats and seatbelts. Easier to get the gun out while seated and not telegraph it to anyone in the aisle. |
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Shot this today with my Sig P365XL. Missed most par times but scores were all there. I could only imagine a red dot helping. My spare mag holster and 12rd mag sit so low that I had a hard time with the reloads. Plan to get a spare Macro mag for additional capacity but also more grip. I felt good shooting as well as a did and not using a full size gun.
Stage 1: 2:06, 2:06 F Stage 2: 1:22, 1:33 P Stage 3: 2:32 P Stage 4: 3:73, 3:78 F Stage 5: 1:59, 1:55 F Stage 6: 3:59, 3:48 F Stage 7: 3:60, 3:36 P Total score: 142 |
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I went out to the range today for another purpose, but it was raining cats and dogs. There is a covered area about 12 yards long, so it was the perfect opportunity to try out this qual, since I couldn't do anything else. I had already printed up some score sheets and a bunch of scoring-zones and had them in my truck, so it all worked out perfectly.
First time 'cold' was with my EDC G19 with RMR, OWB at about 4 O-Clock. I missed par time on stage 1 by about 2 tenths, so technically it was game-over. But I continued and only dropped two shots outside of the 4x5 scoring area for the entire course, making par time on everything else (just barely). I know you're not supposed to shoot it after warming up, but since I had nothing else to do, I burned through a couple hundred rounds with different guns, just to see. I consider myself an above average shooter, and I only passed about 65-70% of the time. If I failed, it was almost always stage 1. I think having a 'shoot-me-first' vest or a nice sorta-stiff windbreaker would be ideal for the gun-reveal. I was using a T-shirt first, and later a light cotton button-up shirt, and found that there just wasn't enough 'weight' in the material to clear the garment away cleanly. I did notice that, on stage 1, once I accepted that a hit within the 4x5 box wasn't essential to pass the course, and time was more important, my pass-rate went up to nearly 100%. If you fumble the reveal or draw on stage 1, it's hard to make par-time. Take aways: -I recognize that folks are using an IPSC target out of convenience, but you are cheating yourself a good bit--the actual 'full-point-value' scoring area of the Q-target is 4x6" (or 4x5.25", I've seen both measurements) while the A-zone of an IPSC target is roughly 6x11". That's a big difference. I just drew a 4x5.25" box on a piece of paper and made a bunch of copies to take to the range. -I did the qual course with 6 different guns: G19/RMR, VP9/RMR, P320/SRO, CZ75/RMR and a G17/RMR. All of my times were nearly identical. I don't know what that means--I probably just suck equally as bad with all of them. -The basis of this thread--MRDS or not for the qual course--to me it's not even a question. I re-shot each gun with the dot turned off for iron sight score and the dot is a CLEAR winner (for me). I really haven't shot irons much after transitioning to a dot for both work and play, and I immediately saw the dot as superior in just this simple drill. I just track the dot so much better than iron sights. Anyway, fun qual course, and not super-easy. I'll keep the targets and score card in my truck and shoot it the way it's meant to be shot each time I go to the range. ETA: I can't find it stated anywhere--what's the start position for the concealed stages--surrender? Hands at side? |
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I just went hands at side.
One area where AIWB shines, for me, is having no problem with a fast first shot from concealment. And yes, accept that those first 2 don't have to be perfect, just fast. My times on those first two were 1.24 & 1.36. I think I hit an A on one, but not the other. Totally agree on the target. The A zone we're using here is wider and more forgiving than the FBI-QIT-97 For that matter, the C zone on these is more forgiving up top too. And hell yes, the dot rules. ALL my scores on all pistol drills have gone up since transitioning a couple years ago. Better precision too, at distance. |
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Did it today. I busted times on some. I'll post up my sheet later on. Haven't totaled the points.
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Originally Posted By Razzman1: I went out to the range today for another purpose, but it was raining cats and dogs. There is a covered area about 12 yards long, so it was the perfect opportunity to try out this qual, since I couldn't do anything else. I had already printed up some score sheets and a bunch of scoring-zones and had them in my truck, so it all worked out perfectly. First time 'cold' was with my EDC G19 with RMR, OWB at about 4 O-Clock. I missed par time on stage 1 by about 2 tenths, so technically it was game-over. But I continued and only dropped two shots outside of the 4x5 scoring area for the entire course, making par time on everything else (just barely). I know you're not supposed to shoot it after warming up, but since I had nothing else to do, I burned through a couple hundred rounds with different guns, just to see. I consider myself an above average shooter, and I only passed about 65-70% of the time. If I failed, it was almost always stage 1. I think having a 'shoot-me-first' vest or a nice sorta-stiff windbreaker would be ideal for the gun-reveal. I was using a T-shirt first, and later a light cotton button-up shirt, and found that there just wasn't enough 'weight' in the material to clear the garment away cleanly. I did notice that, on stage 1, once I accepted that a hit within the 4x5 box wasn't essential to pass the course, and time was more important, my pass-rate went up to nearly 100%. If you fumble the reveal or draw on stage 1, it's hard to make par-time. Take aways: -I recognize that folks are using an IPSC target out of convenience, but you are cheating yourself a good bit--the actual 'full-point-value' scoring area of the Q-target is 4x6" (or 4x5.25", I've seen both measurements) while the A-zone of an IPSC target is roughly 6x11". That's a big difference. I just drew a 4x5.25" box on a piece of paper and made a bunch of copies to take to the range. -I did the qual course with 6 different guns: G19/RMR, VP9/RMR, P320/SRO, CZ75/RMR and a G17/RMR. All of my times were nearly identical. I don't know what that means--I probably just suck equally as bad with all of them. -The basis of this thread--MRDS or not for the qual course--to me it's not even a question. I re-shot each gun with the dot turned off for iron sight score and the dot is a CLEAR winner (for me). I really haven't shot irons much after transitioning to a dot for both work and play, and I immediately saw the dot as superior in just this simple drill. I just track the dot so much better than iron sights. Anyway, fun qual course, and not super-easy. I'll keep the targets and score card in my truck and shoot it the way it's meant to be shot each time I go to the range. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By Razzman1: I went out to the range today for another purpose, but it was raining cats and dogs. There is a covered area about 12 yards long, so it was the perfect opportunity to try out this qual, since I couldn't do anything else. I had already printed up some score sheets and a bunch of scoring-zones and had them in my truck, so it all worked out perfectly. First time 'cold' was with my EDC G19 with RMR, OWB at about 4 O-Clock. I missed par time on stage 1 by about 2 tenths, so technically it was game-over. But I continued and only dropped two shots outside of the 4x5 scoring area for the entire course, making par time on everything else (just barely). I know you're not supposed to shoot it after warming up, but since I had nothing else to do, I burned through a couple hundred rounds with different guns, just to see. I consider myself an above average shooter, and I only passed about 65-70% of the time. If I failed, it was almost always stage 1. I think having a 'shoot-me-first' vest or a nice sorta-stiff windbreaker would be ideal for the gun-reveal. I was using a T-shirt first, and later a light cotton button-up shirt, and found that there just wasn't enough 'weight' in the material to clear the garment away cleanly. I did notice that, on stage 1, once I accepted that a hit within the 4x5 box wasn't essential to pass the course, and time was more important, my pass-rate went up to nearly 100%. If you fumble the reveal or draw on stage 1, it's hard to make par-time. Take aways: -I recognize that folks are using an IPSC target out of convenience, but you are cheating yourself a good bit--the actual 'full-point-value' scoring area of the Q-target is 4x6" (or 4x5.25", I've seen both measurements) while the A-zone of an IPSC target is roughly 6x11". That's a big difference. I just drew a 4x5.25" box on a piece of paper and made a bunch of copies to take to the range. -I did the qual course with 6 different guns: G19/RMR, VP9/RMR, P320/SRO, CZ75/RMR and a G17/RMR. All of my times were nearly identical. I don't know what that means--I probably just suck equally as bad with all of them. -The basis of this thread--MRDS or not for the qual course--to me it's not even a question. I re-shot each gun with the dot turned off for iron sight score and the dot is a CLEAR winner (for me). I really haven't shot irons much after transitioning to a dot for both work and play, and I immediately saw the dot as superior in just this simple drill. I just track the dot so much better than iron sights. Anyway, fun qual course, and not super-easy. I'll keep the targets and score card in my truck and shoot it the way it's meant to be shot each time I go to the range. Good insights. I’m going to give it a shoot this Saturday. (Can’t do it on Super Bowl Sunday. ). ETA: I can't find it stated anywhere--what's the start position for the concealed stages--surrender? Hands at side? That’s what I was wondering …. Here’s your ‘benchmark’ from surrender position: https://tenor.com/view/jim-zubiena-miami-vice-hitman-quick-draw-gif-13076348 |
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. I ran this several times last year in my GD pistol challenge thread. Since then I’ve had my archon cut for a 507k shot owb concealed.
150 points, under all par times Attached File Attached File |
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"Government is like a baby. An alimentary canal with a big appetite at one end and no sense of responsibility at the other."
Ronald Reagan |
Originally Posted By : Just to make this more fun, Ken Hackathorn said in a recent Wilson YouTube video he has not met a single person who passed this qual with a red dot. I am not a red dot shooter primarily, but I feel like this is very doable with a dot, so I may give it a go. Love Ken, but I think he’s off on this one. View Quote yeah I just easily aced it this afternoon. See above post |
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"Government is like a baby. An alimentary canal with a big appetite at one end and no sense of responsibility at the other."
Ronald Reagan |
Damn dude, nice run! Great times and solid hits. What holster you using?
Yeah I've been reading Hackathorn for years (never had the opportunity to train with him), and was always one of the good sources for solid TTPs and learning, but lately he's demonstrated his lack of evolving, so to speak. Or maybe he's trying to remain relevant by playing the contrarian. But he's dead wrong about pistol MRDS. Why the shit don't we have more shooters getting in on this? It's like ARFCOM is 10,000 dudes talking about guns and taking pics of them, and 10 people actually shooting. |
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Originally Posted By JoeDevola: Damn dude, nice run! Great times and solid hits. What holster you using? Yeah I've been reading Hackathorn for years (never had the opportunity to train with him), and was always one of the good sources for solid TTPs and learning, but lately he's demonstrated his lack of evolving, so to speak. Or maybe he's trying to remain relevant by playing the contrarian. But he's dead wrong about pistol MRDS. Why the shit don't we have more shooters getting in on this? It's like ARFCOM is 10,000 dudes talking about guns and taking pics of them, and 10 people actually shooting. View Quote My own build Attached File |
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"Government is like a baby. An alimentary canal with a big appetite at one end and no sense of responsibility at the other."
Ronald Reagan |
Originally Posted By JoeDevola: Damn dude, nice run! Great times and solid hits. What holster you using? Yeah I've been reading Hackathorn for years (never had the opportunity to train with him), and was always one of the good sources for solid TTPs and learning, but lately he's demonstrated his lack of evolving, so to speak. Or maybe he's trying to remain relevant by playing the contrarian. But he's dead wrong about pistol MRDS. Why the shit don't we have more shooters getting in on this? It's like ARFCOM is 10,000 dudes talking about guns and taking pics of them, and 10 people actually shooting. View Quote So over a year ago I started a pistol drill thread in GD. Right after Eli Dickens shooting. Every month I posted a new drill with videos, descriptions, etc. every kept up with a scoreboard. First month I had 20+ shooters post their results. By the 5th month there were around 7-8 and for the next year we averaged around 5 people a month until I let it die I even made a post here on handgun discussions and not a single person replied. I’m convinced that 90% of members don’t even shoot their guns and of those 10% that do, they will never post any drill results |
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"Government is like a baby. An alimentary canal with a big appetite at one end and no sense of responsibility at the other."
Ronald Reagan |
Florida Class G Qualification Course of Fire (New Jan 2017 Standard) This is the new course of fire for our qualifications as security officers. Seems we're doing stuff that's much harder than our federal counterparts. During my last quals, I can remember being at the 3, 7, and 15 yard with targets that size. I passed with both a 9mm and a .38 snub. 2024 HR218 Qualification Walkthrough This is HR 218. Basic Police qualification and LEOSA. For those who aren't actively serving in a federal capacity, the requirements seem to be somewhat steeper. For what it's worth, I am certain that the Air Marshal training goes well beyond their basic qualification course of fire. They do have to qualify using a course of fire at least annually, but some agencies do it quarterly. And believe it or not, there are some people out there who ended up having to do it more than once. Their schedules don't always permit them being able to train in between mandatory courses. Anyways, I will attempt to do this course of fire if I am able to. I'd like to see for myself if I can pass it with a Shield plus. |
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Has anyone passed in 2024 from concealment IWB?
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Isaiah 1:18 - "Come now, let us reason together," says the LORD: "though your sins are like scarlet, they shall be as white as snow"
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Originally Posted By evnash: So over a year ago I started a pistol drill thread in GD. Right after Eli Dickens shooting. Every month I posted a new drill with videos, descriptions, etc. every kept up with a scoreboard. First month I had 20+ shooters post their results. By the 5th month there were around 7-8 and for the next year we averaged around 5 people a month until I let it die I even made a post here on handgun discussions and not a single person replied. I’m convinced that 90% of members don’t even shoot their guns and of those 10% that do, they will never post any drill results View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By evnash: Originally Posted By JoeDevola: Damn dude, nice run! Great times and solid hits. What holster you using? Yeah I've been reading Hackathorn for years (never had the opportunity to train with him), and was always one of the good sources for solid TTPs and learning, but lately he's demonstrated his lack of evolving, so to speak. Or maybe he's trying to remain relevant by playing the contrarian. But he's dead wrong about pistol MRDS. Why the shit don't we have more shooters getting in on this? It's like ARFCOM is 10,000 dudes talking about guns and taking pics of them, and 10 people actually shooting. So over a year ago I started a pistol drill thread in GD. Right after Eli Dickens shooting. Every month I posted a new drill with videos, descriptions, etc. every kept up with a scoreboard. First month I had 20+ shooters post their results. By the 5th month there were around 7-8 and for the next year we averaged around 5 people a month until I let it die I even made a post here on handgun discussions and not a single person replied. I’m convinced that 90% of members don’t even shoot their guns and of those 10% that do, they will never post any drill results I hate to say I told you so... but I told you so |
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"If you cant do something smart, do something right"
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