I just picked up an FN Tactical Police Shotgun with the CAR adjustable stock. Given the recoil of a 12-gauge, which of the following setups would you think works best:

-just get a recoil pad for my CAR buttstock
-M4/Vltor buttstock with recoil pad
-ACE SOCOM stock
-Magpul M93B (no recoil pad available yet)

I do want an adjustable buttstock, so I'm not looking for an A1 or an A2 stock. I also do not want an LMT SOPMOD stock.

Thanks.

www.knoxx.com/

Hmm... looks worth the time to investigate anyways...

Vmpglen

I got my FN Tactical Police Shotgun a couple of months ago. At first I was not going to stay with the 4 position CAR stock, because I felt the CAR stock, just had to small of an area making contact with the shoulder, for a weapon that may well be used with full power shotgun loads.

I looked at both the Ace SOCOM, M-4 6 Position and Basic Vltor stocks.

While I was figuring out which uberstock I wanted....I bought a 4 Position CAR Stock pad from these guys Blackjack Buffers

I bought mine for $15.00, but they'r on sale now for $11.00. Blackjack sent me an order confimation within minutes and had my recoil pad to me in 3 days....they'r sevice was top notch.

This is the recoil pad I bought.



It's Rubber, with U.S. molded onto the back of the pad with the Ordinace Lantern and the numbers  A123044 on the bottom face of the pad and fits snuggly, without any slop movement onto the FN's CAR stock.

The CAR pad, changes the whole feel of the FN Tactical's CAR stock and you may well reconsider the need for anouther stock once you try one. I know that I moved the new stock option way down my list of "thinks to put on this shotgun" once I installed it....I Shot it the other day with a mix of full power slugs, 00 buck and #1 buck and it handled the recoil very well and felt just fine. The pad add's just the right amount of additional shoulder contact area to better spread the recoil.

I usualy use the #3 position on the stock and belive the #2 position will be ideal if wearing body armor. The 4 position stock has all the adjustment, I really need and keeps things simple.

I also installed a Hogue rubber overmolded AR-15 grip and a Magpul trigger guard. The Hogue's greater palm surface area and rubber overmold seems to help soak up the recoil as well.

The Magpul trigger Guard goes on without much trouble, but getting the rear pin, out of the old one, is a red headed bitch. Be sure to have the correct sized punch and to support the trigger guard wing, on the other side, before you attempt  the removal. Remember that the trigger guard assembly is plastic and if you break off a trigger guard wing, YOU ARE SHIT OUTTA LUCK. So use the correct tools in this undertaking. Do not, try to use a nail, or some other impliment which is "Sorta the right size.". You may also, have to remove, a very small amount of plastic, to round the front wings, of the trigger guard, with a Dremel tool, to get the front, of the Magpul trigger guard, to fit up, where the spring loaded pin engages. Don't get crazy, with this, as  1 to 2mm, is all you will need to trim. After that, the Magpul trigger guard, fits solid as a rock and keeps those annoying trigger guard wings, from slapping down on the second supporting finger of your pistol grip hand every time you blast away.

Hope this Helps.

Thanks FN-TPS, I just ordered a pad for mine.

Brent

No problem Brent...get with me, in about a week and tell me how you like the pad.

Me...I think my next move, is to put a set of XS 24/7 tritium AR-15 sights on it and save up for a Surefire forend.

I'm not sure if I'll even mess with a side saddle, as the weapon handles, and points, so nicely right now, that I'd almost hate to hang a bunch of weight off the left side and mess that up. I had a side saddle on my Mossberg 590 and loved it. Had the same sidesaddle on an 870 and hated it. Side saddle shell carriers seem to catch on every piece of belt and web gear your carrying, if your using a single point or three point sling. On the positive side of the coin, with the higher AR type sights, those shells sticking up, on the left side of the gun would not be such a distraction in your sight picture field of veiw, as they are on any other combat shotgun.  So, I'm still thinking about the whole side saddle on the TPS issue and have not quite made up my mind.

Hey FN-TPS,

Thanks for the info on the recoil pad - I'll have to try that out.

Another quick question: does the step up between the buffer tube and the sliding portion of the stock "catch" you at all on the cheek during recoil, or make it hard for you to get a good sight picture through the irons (bad cheek weld)?

Thanks.

Quoted: -Magpul M93B (no recoil pad available yet)

I spoke with Richard about these earlier this week. He's just looking for someone to manufacture them. I could not get any idea for a delivery date though.

When I ordered my FN Shotgun (from CMMG) I had them install an M93A (later swapped out for an M93B). I'm a M93 junkie to begin with (all my ARs have them) so I wouldn't consider anything else for my shotgun. I like the larger surface area though I really do need the pad. I normally shoot it with my BH vest on because of the padding in the shoulder.

Mine has an M93B on it.  It doesn't have a recoil pad.  It doesn't need a recoil pad.  

If you wanted to add one, buy a gunsmith pad from Brownell's and trim to fit using a belt sander.  It would be easy to do.

VmpGlenn

Hey FN-TPS, Thanks for the info on the recoil pad - I'll have to try that out. Another quick question: does the step up between the buffer tube and the sliding portion of the stock "catch" you at all on the cheek during recoil, or make it hard for you to get a good sight picture through the irons (bad cheek weld)?

I was shooting full power loads and found the "step up" unnoticable.

I think the combination of the porting, pistol grip, and pad make the recoil very managable, if you lean into the weapon and use the proper stance. Maybe it's just me, but the recoil seemed lighter than my 20" Mossberg 590 or the unported Remigton's that I've handled.

I'm really looking forward to getting my hands on some "managed recoil" Buck and Slug to put though this thing.

I think if I was going to put anouther stock on it...I'd go with the the Vltor basic with the pad. Simply because it would offer battery storage for a Surefire Forearm and should fit on my current tube (I'm pretty sure the TPS uses a mil-spec diameter tube, because FN makes Mil-Spec M-16's. Somebody correct me if I'm wrong about this.)

I also wonder if the empty space inside the tube, could be used for storage, since I don't have an AR-15's buffer system in there. Kind of like the Storage tube with the screw off cap on the end, that Vltor offers for AK mods.

Matt_B....Do you have pictures up, of your TPS with the Magpul stock and if so, what page of the Shotgun Pic's thread are they on?...I'd like to see it, but am way to lazy to sit though all 25 pages or so of  image downloads, in order to find it.

In case Matt doesn't see this, his shotgun is on page 11.

Quoted: In case Matt doesn't see this, his shotgun is on page 11.

Thank you

Yep. Page 11 sure enough....I knew I'd seen one with the Magpul stock, somewhere up there in the shotgun pic thread.

Gotta ask Matt_B, how that whole Aimpoint on a TPS thing, is working out for him?

I usually ascribe to the "Irons are for shotguns and optics, are for rifles" school of thought, but that rail staring me in the face every day, is starting to look awfully tempting.  I have not had a chance to slap somebodies EOtech on my TPS yet, but I suspect that the TPS's rail is higher than an AR rail and I would not get the kind of Co-witness sight picture that I would want. So the Aimpoint would seem to be the only game in town.

Judging from the ARM's quick release mount, Matt_B seem's to be running, he's taken Clint Smith's "Optic's ought to be mounted on a rifle, with a pin like a hand grenade. So you can pull it, if they fail and the optic, just instantly falls off the weapon." philosophy to heart and that's what I'd do as well. I sure wouldn't want one on there, that would take more than two seconds to remove, if it was misting outside.

Like I said. I'm still not totaly convinced of whether or not you ought to mount an optic, on the TPS, but I'm looking forward, with an open mind, to Matt trying to convince me, that it ought to be.

Quoted: I have not had a chance to slap somebodies EOtech on my TPS yet, but I suspect that the TPS's rail is higher than an AR rail and I would not get the kind of Co-witness sight picture that I would want. So the Aimpoint would seem to be the only game in town.

You are correct. I've got an old 552 sitting around and it is too high for co-witnessing. The irons are blocked by the sight.

The Aimpoint works fine. As you might suspect, it's not that necessary for buckshot but since I have Aimpoint on my ARs, it's nice to have the same setup on the shotung. The red dot makes shooting slugs more precisely easier. At the very least, I have a spare Aimpoint in case I need one for my ARs. I wish Larue mount the correct height for the shotgun but the ARMS mount ain't so bad.

Quoted: I'm not sure if I'll even mess with a side saddle, as the weapon handles, and points, so nicely right now, that I'd almost hate to hang a bunch of weight off the left side and mess that up. I had a side saddle on my Mossberg 590 and loved it. Had the same sidesaddle on an 870 and hated it. Side saddle shell carriers seem to catch on every piece of belt and web gear your carrying, if your using a single point or three point sling. On the positive side of the coin, with the higher AR type sights, those shells sticking up, on the left side of the gun would not be such a distraction in your sight picture field of veiw, as they are on any other combat shotgun.  So, I'm still thinking about the whole side saddle on the TPS issue and have not quite made up my mind.

The local PD tested the FN-TPS and Wilson Combat Scatterguns using side saddles and didn't like them on the FN-TPS.  (They went with the Scatterguns in the end, they just felt the scatterguns were easier for most of the force to adjust to from the old Mossbergs they had.  The tests showed a 50/50 split with testers on which to go with.  They just needed one more tester with BRD)  

Brent

Quoted: Hey FN-TPS, Thanks for the info on the recoil pad - I'll have to try that out. Another quick question: does the step up between the buffer tube and the sliding portion of the stock "catch" you at all on the cheek during recoil, or make it hard for you to get a good sight picture through the irons (bad cheek weld)? Thanks.

I notice both of these issues.  It makes me feel like my cheek is being pinched.  I also feel like I need to get my face closer to the stock to get a good sight picture, and it only makes that cheek pinching effect feel worse.  I still love the shotgun, though.

Bigworm55

Quoted: Hey FN-TPS, Thanks for the info on the recoil pad - I'll have to try that out. Another quick question: does the step up between the buffer tube and the sliding portion of the stock "catch" you at all on the cheek during recoil, or make it hard for you to get a good sight picture through the irons (bad cheek weld)? Thanks. I notice both of these issues. It makes me feel like my cheek is being pinched. I also feel like I need to get my face closer to the stock to get a good sight picture, and it only makes that cheek pinching effect feel worse. I still love the shotgun, though.

Maybe I'm just used to it, YMMV.

The dedicated tactical shotgunner, is a diffent breed of cat. He's generaly pumped a ton, of full power 12ga down range, and settled into the philosophy, of " Yes, I'm carrying a shotgun...and it's going to kick me. In return, it's going to do spectacular and massive damage, to whatever or whomever, I shoot with it."  It's a mindset of the shotgunner thing.

I've often said, that the dedicated shotgunner in the 21st century, carries the gene, of the guy, who carried a battle axe during the 14th century. He's only worried about getting close to his adversary and then, taking him out...In the most violent and gruesome manner conceivable. He also knows, that the Gods extract a price, for giving him such a horrendous, close quarters, killing implement. That price being,  your shoulder, may be a little sore, after a day of swinging it.  he's willing to make that trade off, of a little discomfort, for the shear killing power, that his weapon of choice, brings to the fight.

I'm not up here, pounding my chest, suggesting that, I'm a tuff guy and thus I don't notice recoil or discomfort, but instead, trying to impart the mindset of the shotgunner, which has served me well. I don't pick up, a riot type shotgun up, without thinking "It's time to Cowboy up bud" (I'm an Okie and we say things like that.)

I realize, that the objective of this dedicated shotgun forum, is for us, to help each other figure out, ways to make, the fighting shotgun ,better, faster and as high speed, as we can possibly figure out, a way for it to be. But unless we drop the shell loads, to velocities pushing the pellet or slug, the speed of spitballs. The combat shotgun, is never going to be, the comfortable to shoot pussy cat, that your skeet gun is.

Minor discomfort comes with the territory.

(Me, after a day of firing a "18 Remington 870, with one of the old style Choate overfolders.) (Just in case, you've never had the pleasure, of shooting a riotgun equipped with that  painful abortion, of a folding stock...If you have, then you know, that we've come light years forward, in the stock design, of the FN Tactical Police Shotgun, the Mesa's and the Cav'y SST's

FN-TPS,

That's the best post I've read in a while, good explanation.  

You did leave out the Argonaut Arms/Magpul M93B/EOTech arrangement that I know and love so well, so I've just added it right now.

Quoted: Quoted: -Magpul M93B (no recoil pad available yet) I spoke with Richard about these earlier this week. He's just looking for someone to manufacture them. I could not get any idea for a delivery date though.

Richard is a great guy but he promised me a recoil pad way back in May 2003 when I puchased a M93 from the very first production run.....he
I use an ACE adapter for the M93.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v672/cervelop2k/MyM93.jpg
(Recoil pad wasn't yet fitted in the pic)

FN-TPS

I like the idea of the FN shotgun set up, (shocking coming from a die hard 870 nut!) but I think that CaCrusin was on the right idea of the Knoxx Stock as a replacement for the factory unit.

I'm a BIG guy and have shot pumpguns all my life.  I served in a Military Police Regiment as a Firearms Instructor and Range Safety Officer.  I fired every shotgun in the company with 5 rounds every quater to certify then.  That is a LOT of rounds.  I used to end up black and blue, (but heck what a tuff guy badge of honor to be known as the tought ass who can shoot a whole case of buck in a day. Yes, a shotgun can do spectacular damage, (on both ends!!!) and hey I do like to think that I am the true Viking Beserker kind of fighter anyway too!

HOWEVER, we do have the tecknology to shoot full power loads without getting our shoulders pounded to bits.  

I have nothing to do with Knoxx (I don't work for them, sell their products, get paid for promoting them ect...  - Nothing to do with them except as a VERY satisfied customer & end user!!) but I do strongly recommend their stocks for shotgunners.  I shoot a Rem 870 Super Mag year round, and any stock that allows you to burn through 3.5" magnum shot without any pain or discomfort is Strong MoJo in my book!  You don't have to suffer to pound your target with the shotgun!!

The Spec Ops stock should really be something that combines adjustable L.O.P. and great recoil reduction in a neat package.  It is not cheap, but then the better things in life cost a bit more for all the benefits you receive!

Just my two cents on that!

BIGGER_HAMMER

Since the Knoxx stock, has come up a couple of times, in this thread. I think possibly a little explanation might be needed, for those not 100% up to speed on FN shotguns. in order to avoid confusion on this issue.

This is not being a smart ass, but just a little primer, for those, who might be confused, by the diffence between the FN POLICE Shotgun and the FN TACTICAL POLICE Shotgun.

This is the FN Police Shotgun.





It will take the Knoxx stocks.


This is the FN Tactical Police Shotgun.





It will not easily or readily take the Knoxx stocks. At least, not without tearing off, all the stuff that makes it a $600.00 shotgun.

I just thought, this should be pointed out, because some posters, seem to be using the terms "Tactical Police Shotgun" and "Police Shotgun" as though, they were the same Shotgun. When in fact, they are very different models, sharing the same reciever and action.

I've seen one member, of this forum, who added the Knoxx overfolder, to his FN Police Shotgun with great results and I think Knoxx is a great company, who's representatives interact with the shotgun community here on AR15.com, in a most positive manner. That being said, if you want to go with the Knoxx Stock on an FN, you'd probably be better off, buy Buying the Base Model FN Police or Winchester 1300 Defender to mount it on. Because I can't imagine anyone tearing everything south of the reciever, CAR Stock assembly, Pistol grip, rear sight assembly and rail, off of a FN Tactical Police Shotgun, they just paid premium price for. In order to put a Knoxx Stock on it.

I'm sure, that the guys who support Knoxx, were suggesting, you put their product on the FN Police Shotgun not the FN Tactical Police Shotgun, but I just thought I'd post this, to avoid any confusion.

Besides it was a great  opportunity to post FN Porn...

Quoted: Besides it was a great  opportunity to post FN Porn...

+1

Brentwal

Quoted: Besides it was a great opportunity to post FN Porn... +1

I've got pictures of an FN SPS naked...But I'm not letting you bastard's near them...so don't even bother to ask.

I ended up ordering an ACE SOCOM stock for my FN-TPS. I have one on my Dissy and I love the consistent cheek weld, the strength of the setup, and the multiple built-in sling points. I'm willing to bet the rubber buttpad and the foam padding on the buffer tube will take some of the sting out of the recoil. I've seen the SOCOM on some 870/Cav Arms conversions.

I also have a Surefire 636FGA light fore-end coming - thanks to Matt_B, whose kick-a** TPS in the pic thread made me have to own one too...

I'll post pics as soon as I have everything put together, and hopefully a range report not too long after that.