I live 5 minutes from NYC in NJ and want to have a BO plan if I have to leave. If a SHTF situation happens in NYC again, I want to BO but dont know where to go. I guess west towards PA would be a good idea but the roads will be packed. I have 2 SUVs and plenty of ammo/gun, food and water. Any ideas or plans?

Heard a rumor of plans to blow up all bridges leading in/out of NYC localizing (trapping) most of the inhabitants 6-8 million, and allowing a defendable exterior perimeter. Don't know if it's true or not you might be better off going toward PA.

Quoted: Heard a rumor of plans to blow up all bridges leading in/out of NYC localizing (trapping) most of the inhabitants 6-8 million, and allowing a defendable exterior perimeter. Don't know if it's true or not you might be better off going toward PA.

Yeah I'm putting a lot of stock in that

Quoted: Heard a rumor of plans to blow up all bridges leading in/out of NYC localizing (trapping) most of the inhabitants 6-8 million, and allowing a defendable exterior perimeter. Don't know if it's true or not you might be better off going toward PA.

Sounds like the scenerio to "ESCAPE FROM NEW YORK"  Where they've turned NY into a maximum security prison. Seriously, I have no really good good plan because I don't know the region, best bet is to start looking/listening/talking to others while formulating plans to cover several diffrent scenerios.
Believe me, it's never like what you read in books be they fact, fiction, or a mixture.  

Im not in NYC so I dont need to get out of the city. I'm on the mainland wher the millions of people will be headed. I can stand my ground in NJ but if it came to it I want to have a BO Plan

Quoted: Im not in NYC so I dont need to get out of the city. I'm on the mainland wher the millions of people will be headed. I can stand my ground in NJ but if it came to it I want to have a BO Plan

Very strange coincidence that you bring this up...I was having similar thoughts yesterday as I drove I-80-W to PA.  

I'd assume all Westbound routes would be useless unless I somehow get early information, which is unlikely.  BO'ing directly from work is a no-go, a stop at home is unavoidable.

And even if I did have the mother-of-all-BO plans, I'd be uncomfy posting it here.

I wonder if it makes sense for a get together of interested Northern NJ'ers to get together somewhere there's beer do a mapboard drill?

Quoted: Heard a rumor of plans to blow up all bridges leading in/out of NYC localizing (trapping) most of the inhabitants 6-8 million, and allowing a defendable exterior perimeter. Don't know if it's true or not you might be better off going toward PA.

If there is a major release of radioactive material and widespread contamination of people, pets and motor vehicles etc. you aren't going anywhere. In a true SHTF scenario your only escape will likely be by boat if at all.

Quoted: I live 5 minutes from NYC in NJ and want to have a BO plan if I have to leave.

joe "sorta" had a bug out plan:
ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=1&f=123&t=420606

also see this thread of interest:
ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=1&f=123&t=422621

ar-jedi

Quoted: Heard a rumor of plans to blow up all bridges leading in/out of NYC localizing (trapping) most of the inhabitants 6-8 million, and allowing a defendable exterior perimeter. Don't know if it's true or not you might be better off going toward PA.

WTF color is the sky you live in?  

"heard a rumor"  ...  at what, the school lunch table?

ar-jedi

Well, if SHTF I think the best option for me would be to stay put.  By the time that I would honestly have gotten info and gotten the wife and Bug Out Accessories in the car it'd be too late and everything would be swamped.  I have a few Bug In plans, and would follow those until things calmed down a bit outside.

What I think would happen is that a dirty bomb would be set off in NYC and millions would have to evacuate to NJ over the GWB and other bridges. The other case would be a tsunami or other natural disaster. Fortunately, I have NYC and the Palisades to prevent the wave from getting to me. I also live on the higher part of  the town, so dont have to worry about flooding.

In these cases the threat would be domestic. Our own people would be the problem not a foreign military. And yes I would help my fellow man with food and water ..., but would also protect my family. If it got too bad I would BO with my family in our SUVs - Blazer, Escalade and other cars. We have 5 adults in the family which I can arm with "assault rifles" and ammo. We also know most of the police department.

We will have several hours if not days before we have to BO. Relocation and work wouldnt be hard to find because of my training (in the medical field). Only thing I wouold need now is a BO plan. Maybe it would be a good idea to meet and figure out a plan.

What do you guys consider a SHTF event anyway? As bad as 9/11 was here within eyesight of NYC, it was not a SHTF event for those anywhere but the battery. Let's face it, there is so much congestion locally, you aren't going to get ANYWHERE in the tri-state area. Hell, here in Bergen County, most towns gridlock after the fourth of July fireworks are over.

Quoted: What do you guys consider a SHTF event anyway?

a biological or radioactive contamination of the NYC area during weekday hours.
OR
a perceived biological or radioactive contamination of the NYC area during weekday hours.

imagine one scenario wherein the water supply in NYC is contaminated with some sort of bio contagion.  by the time (hours) the problem is fully understood, hundreds are dead and thousands are dying.  you can't drink any city water.  everyone in NYC wants out.  

imagine another scenario wherein a subway station is blanketed with chlorine gas.  hundreds dead in minutes.  rumors abound about "similar looking canisters" at Penn Station and at Port Authority.  then another subway station is doused.  everyone in NYC wants out.  

imagine another scenario wherein a dirty bomb is set off in times sqaure.  the NYPD OEM geiger counters are pinned at the right side of the scale and this info hits CNN and all of the NYC news networks.  everyone in NYC wants out.  

in all of these cases above, either you are already in NJ or you are never going to get to NJ.  

----

preps:

1) get a radio that receives the 4 NJ SPEN frequencies.  keep it on at all times.  any uptick on SPEN traffic is a surefire indication that something is going on.  otherwise, there is little to no SPEN traffic except for the daily tests -- SPEN channels are not "working" frequencies in the sense that you hear constant chatter.  
www.maxpages.com/frequencies/SP_Emergency_Network

2) get hooked into a pager/IM/text/email/blackberry net such that one person in the group can distribute an emergency message to many others.  this can provide an early heads up.

3) get your plans and comms with your family sorted out BEFOREHAND.  get a 3 day kit together and tested BEFOREHAND.  keep your vehicle with enough fuel to get someplace, and store enough fuel to get yourself someplace farther.  see "joe" link above for how not to do it.  see also
ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=1&f=123&t=422257

4) be prepared to walk and/or bike a good distance.  how does 10/20/50/100 miles grab you?  own a motorcycle or quad.

5) read the SF threads.  ignore the "i'm an internet idiot" tinfoil hat shit -- no one anywhere knows if there is "a plan to blow up all bridges" as posted above.

6) don't walk towards something that you don't understand the scale of.  my brother works at the NYMEX, and lives in NJ.  he was on the ferry from Jersey City going into Manhattan when the 1st plane hit WTC1.  he never got off the ferry, and took the return trip back to NJ on a nearly empty boat.  that's right, most people got off the ferry and started towards their daily jobs after watching a plane slam into WTC1.  

7) there is NOTHING more important than your life.  my brother-in-law (sister's husband) was on the 34th floor of WTC2 getting coffee and a bagel with colleagues when the first plane hit WTC1.  the building shook and debris was seen falling past the windows.  my brother-in-law and his trading partner decided to leave the building.  their other colleague went back upstairs to get his cell phone.  no remains of the third guy were ever found.  

ar-jedi

My plan is head to Freeport and steal a big ass boat.....Head out on the water ways

Or steal the boat of the guy who lives a couple houses away...Maybe I will invite him and his wife.

If it happens that fast we are all F*%#ed. It would take most people with BO plans hours to regroup and mobilize.

I do like the idae about a scanner with SPEN channels
I think I'll get a nice scanner

Quoted: I do like the idae about a scanner with SPEN channels I think I'll get a nice scanner

skip the scanner.
the SPEN channels are std FM 5KHz deviation at ~154MHz.  
which means you can receive them on all modern 2M ham radios.
get your tech class license (20 mins for test, no code learning needed).
now you can scan SPEN, the RACES/OEM repeaters, your local police,
AND when you need to communicate with others you can do that to.

there are a million "how-to-get-licensed" ham threads over in the SF and on the 'net.

ar-jedi

Quoted: It would take most people with BO plans hours to regroup and mobilize.

don't be "most people".  they were last seen on CNN at the Superdome.

so...

set up your gear at home so you can be gone in 5 minutes.  use a couple of rubbermaid totes.  keep your entire recorded life on a CDROM and a USB flash memory stick in one of the totes.   enough food for a week.  change of clothes.  meds and medical supplies.  arms and ammo.  source of fire. multiple sources of fire.  

set up your gear in the truck so you can make it through three days.  there is actually very little you need for three days.  you definitely need water.  you definitely need a little food (the USCG bars last forever!).  you definitely need some warmth and a few essentials (like meds).  so far i have described a small backpack and a water jug.  simple, right?

start small.  do you have a paper map with wide enough coverage for you to seek multiple routes to your cousin's friend's sister's farm in eastern PA?  do you have enough gas stored between your vehicle and your cans to get you there -- even if you have to drive twice as far as the map says?  do you have containers to carry water with you in?  

the warning signs of a bug-out plan include dependency on getting gas (what if electricity is out?) and dependency on buying food and water JIT (just in time).   JIT doesn't work when SHTF.  those are the folks you see at home depot in a mile long line waiting to buy the 7 (seven) gensets they have in stock.  

ar-jedi

ps:
before someone jumps on me about the dangers of having all of your life docs scanned and on a CDROM/USB flash, please google "truecrypt".  

Remember, nobody in NY has guns so everyone should be safe.

lots of good ideas here
As far as the HAM radios go, does anyone recomend one?

I guess I should post on the survival page, but I initially wanted a bug out route from Northeastern NJ.

Quoted: As far as the HAM radios go, does anyone recomend one?

which is sort of like asking, "can anyone recommend a good gun to me?"

at one end is a pawn shop saturday night special in .22LR.
at the other end is an Accuracy International AICS AW in .338 Lapua.

so ...
how far do you want to talk?
who do you want to talk to?
what do you want to listen to?
how portable do you want it to be?
how big is your wallet?

Quoted: I guess I should post on the survival page, but I initially wanted a bug out route from Northeastern NJ.

i would head WEST!!!  

ar-jedi

Part of my strategy is to NOT live in a big city.

You've seen the evacuating hurricane traffic last year. DAYS of warning. Not restricted to bridges. Something like a dirty bomb in NYC would be almost incomprehensible.

Quoted: Quoted: As far as the HAM radios go, does anyone recomend one? which is sort of like asking, "can anyone recommend a good gun to me?" at one end is a pawn shop saturday night special in .22LR. at the other end is an Accuracy International AICS AW in .338 Lapua. so ... how far do you want to talk? who do you want to talk to? what do you want to listen to? how portable do you want it to be? how big is your wallet? Quoted: I guess I should post on the survival page, but I initially wanted a bug out route from Northeastern NJ. i would head WEST!!!   ar-jedi

this is regarding NJ SHTF BO plans so what do you think would be needed? Thats why I posted it here - for NJ discussion and specs

how far do you want to talk?  dont know - 20 miles or so I guess
who do you want to talk to?
what do you want to listen to? police/fire or just to listen in
how portable do you want it to be? portable enough to put in you car
how big is your wallet? It will be much bigger in 2 years but for now a few hundred dollars ($500 range) but dont know how much these things go for. Is 500 the cheap end? Is it like NV where 1000 is cheap end and 3+ grand for high end?

Quoted: Part of my strategy is to NOT live in a big city. You've seen the evacuating hurricane traffic last year. DAYS of warning. Not restricted to bridges. Something like a dirty bomb in NYC would be almost incomprehensible.

Dont live in a big city I live next to one. If I were to go by your reasoning I would live at the North Pole with Santa.

PS please only constructive input here

Not living in a known target/problem area is somewhat constructive advice if you have the option. I'd tell the folks in NOLA to move as well. Probably get the same response from most. Please feel free to ignore any advice you don't like.

Quoted: Only thing I wouold need now is a BO plan. Maybe it would be a good idea to meet and figure out a plan.

I'm up for this.  Especially during Winter while the weather's crappy, my evening/weekend activity list is shorter than usual.  

Quoted: Not living in a known target/problem area is somewhat constructive advice if you have the option. I'd tell the folks in NOLA to move as well. Probably get the same response from most. Please feel free to ignore any advice you don't like.

Some dont have the choice of where they live and moving sometimes isn't an option. Some live near the city because of work or family and other reasons. And again, I dont live in a "target/problem area." I dont think terrorists want to bomb my little town. Its just that people may migrate here.

From what I understand, there are 3 "target/problem areas."
New Orleans area - natural disaster which already happened and will happen again
California area  - earthquake "the big one" or LA riot type
NYC - terrorist attack like dirty bomb

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Only thing I wouold need now is a BO plan. Maybe it would be a good idea to meet and figure out a plan. I'm up for this.  Especially during Winter while the weather's crappy, my evening/weekend activity list is shorter than usual.   Im game for a live "survival chat" dinner too. How about the Iron Bound section of Newark. Maybe some Rodezio at Seabra's Mediterranean Manor.

I'm in too. Just have to fit it in to my work schedule.
We could have a few meeting for each topic and bring items we like to see for our selves.
Food/water topic
Cars/Gas topic
Night Vision topic
Gear topic
Radio topic - ar-jedi knows about this stuff
Guns/ammo topic - at the range of course
Medical supplies topic - I could bring lots of stuff and teach too
I'm ATLS (Advanced Trauma Life Support) and ACLS (Cardiac) certified

Hell lets just start a militia!

Quoted: I'm in too. Just have to fit it in to my work schedule. We could have a few meeting for each topic and bring items we like to see for our selves. Food/water topic Cars/Gas topic Night Vision topic Gear topic Radio topic - ar-jedi knows about this stuff Guns/ammo topic - at the range of course Medical supplies topic - I could bring lots of stuff and teach too I'm ATLS (Advanced Trauma Life Support) and ACLS (Cardiac) certified

5thCavGuy knows a bit about managing movement of wheeled (and tracked) vehicles.  

Quoted: Hell lets just start a militia!

sssshhhhh...  the politicians are listening.  
militia's are so 1980's anyway.

so let's just call it an "investment group".
no, that's so 1990's.

hmmm.

ar-jedi

ps...
things i know a little about:
radios.  hobby of mine for some years.
networks.  i can hook anything up to anything else.
electrical things.  undergrad was a double, ME/EE.
camping.  i go solo camping/hiking.
off road motorcycles.  i've done 6 day enduro events multiple times.
fitness.  i could pass the FBI entrance exam tomorrow.
certain species of evil black 5.56mm rifles.
certain species of polymer pistols made by a certain Austrian company.

stuff i would like to learn about:
non-ar15 pattern rifles.  never held an CETME or AK or FAL much less operated and cleaned one.
medical procedures for field-expedient treatment of bone breaks, bleeding, etc

sounds good to me
a 4 man militia
I mean investment group
I mean home land security group - thats more 2006



stuff i would like to learn about:
non-ar15 pattern rifles. never held an CETME or AK or FAL much less operated and cleaned one.
medical procedures for field-expedient treatment of bone breaks, bleeding, etc

I could help with that. I've had 5 or 6 AK, FALs, HKs ...
I could also teach you all you need to know about trauma too

I also know how to ride motorcycles/enduros

WOW sure stirred the pot with that comment. I love this place. Also there will be aliens involved

Quoted: WOW sure stirred the pot with that comment. I love this place. Also there will be aliens involved

maybe the illegal ones

Not that this would be all that much help in a SHTF situation, but I have expertise in computers.

Oh yeah, I also have emergency services/management knowledge, mostly firefighting (useful, at least).  While I'm not an EMT, I did have to have first responder and BLS training, so at least I have a leg up there.

cool
where and when do we meet?
And how much beer do I bring?

Living on long island in the event of a NYC nuke, our only evacuation plan would be private boat or small private plane.  In both cases I would think one would have to act fast as the government Might want to contain radioactive contaminated people on long island. Would the Gov make small boats crossing long island sound turn back? Who knows  But I bet the marinas and boat ramps will be jammed with abandoned cars with boat trailers. I would also expect violance if people panicked at boat ramp exit points .  

How many days food supply is on long island if NYC is too contaminated to send trucks through?
Surely supermarkets will be looted first .So head to the pet store plenty of nutients there just joe public wont think of it before you do.

What do you stuck on Long Island guys have as a plan IF nyc exit routes are cut off?  The cabin upstate is not so great if you cant cross the rivers/drive to it.    Maybe our best plan is duck tape and plastic sheeting and sit in the basement untill the radiation dissipates.?

Was that a roll-up 2m jpole I saw? I used to have plans on how to make one from a scetion of  300ohm TV twinlead.  Suker worked great too...

Quoted: My plan is head to Freeport and steal a big ass boat.....Head out on the water ways Or steal the boat of the guy who lives a couple houses away...Maybe I will invite him and his wife.

You're an ass.

Most boat owners I know are rather attached to their boats, and many more than you may think consider their boat their own BO plan, and many will defend their boat (which they had the foresight to own for their own use, not yours) to the death.

Buy your own boat, don't base your survival plan on being a thief of someone else's belongings, or you're no better than a looter.

And remember the ever popular slogan in Florida, "You loot, I shoot".

As a person who owns a boat in a marina, I know that my dock beighbors will be well armed and preventing you and yours from entering the marina. They did on 9/11 and they'll do it again.

Quoted: Was that a roll-up 2m jpole I saw? I used to have plans on how to make one from a scetion of  300ohm TV twinlead.  Suker worked great too...

you got it.




ps
google j-pole and plans abound.

ar-jedi

I see a critical lapse in thinking regarding the different phases of escape planning here:

How - planning on stealing/commandeering an alternate source of transportation is not a viable strategy, and my be more risky that facing the threat from which you seek to escape.

I live on the east side of the Hudson, with reason to expect a need to get to the west side (Indian Point and prevailing winds). Knowing the chances of getting accross the TZ or Bear Mt. bridges in a hurry, I bought a kayak and practiced crossing the Hudson a few times each summer. I was looking into a small storage unit on the west side of the river in which to house a bicycle or old Honda 350 to get me to my end destination upstate.

Where - I'm not hearing much in terms of where you plan to go once clear of the immediate danger area. 'PA' sounds good, but if you don't have a place to go with supplies you are just another refugee. Access to PA is easily restricted as you need to cross a bridge to get into the state. If they don't want you, you'll get turned around to wander in NY or NJ.
I have been told by a reliable law enforcement souce with firsthand knowledge that on 9/11 the NH State Police and State Guard were prepared for a mass exodus of Boston area refugees headed north in the event of an attack in that city. They were to be turned away at the border to prevent NH resources from being swamped. While this never came to pass, we saw firsthand what happens to refugees in America - they get sent to the sports arenas and may not come out.
Have a place to go, the name of a relative, and proof of an address that might get you through the checkpoint.

We have real world examples of what will happen in the event of a disaster here in the NY metro area - 9/11 and the '03 blackout. Manhattan was temporarily quarrantined during the former, and I had friends who had to walk over the bridges and 20 miles to home during the blackout. The New Orleans debacle is still being analyzed, and is ripe with information and examples of what to do/not to do. This is no longer academic.

Quoted: I see a critical lapse in thinking regarding the different phases of escape planning here: How - planning on stealing/commandeering an alternate source of transportation is not a viable strategy, and my be more risky that facing the threat from which you seek to escape. I live on the east side of the Hudson, with reason to expect a need to get to the west side (Indian Point and prevailing winds). Knowing the chances of getting accross the TZ or Bear Mt. bridges in a hurry, I bought a kayak and practiced crossing the Hudson a few times each summer. I was looking into a small storage unit on the west side of the river in which to house a bicycle or old Honda 350 to get me to my end destination upstate. Where - I'm not hearing much in terms of where you plan to go once clear of the immediate danger area. 'PA' sounds good, but if you don't have a place to go with supplies you are just another refugee. Access to PA is easily restricted as you need to cross a bridge to get into the state. If they don't want you, you'll get turned around to wander in NY or NJ. I have been told by a reliable law enforcement souce with firsthand knowledge that on 9/11 the NH State Police and State Guard were prepared for a mass exodus of Boston area refugees headed north in the event of an attack in that city. They were to be turned away at the border to prevent NH resources from being swamped. While this never came to pass, we saw firsthand what happens to refugees in America - they get sent to the sports arenas and may not come out. Have a place to go, the name of a relative, and proof of an address that might get you through the checkpoint. We have real world examples of what will happen in the event of a disaster here in the NY metro area - 9/11 and the '03 blackout. Manhattan was temporarily quarrantined during the former, and I had friends who had to walk over the bridges and 20 miles to home during the blackout. The New Orleans debacle is still being analyzed, and is ripe with information and examples of what to do/not to do. This is no longer academic.

Good points here. It seems like we have to open this to the rest of the NY/NJ ARFCOM members in order to pool our resources, skills & knowledge. I think its time for a new post to set up a meeting among members in our area interested in BO plans for their families and themselves.

O.K
People seem interested...

Meet when and where?

I would prefer a Saturday due to work constraints.

RW3

I started a new post for those who may want to meet

see here
ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=8&f=9&t=219502&page=1

ar-jedi

Nice set up Almost the same has mine but where is your gas mask and chem suit.

I got one of those Motorola Saber radio's and a 800  some where in the house.

I'm on Long Island, if its something where I have to get off the island my plan is to head to my uncles boat meet up with the rest of the family and head off.