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Posted: 4/10/2008 1:36:19 PM EDT
[#1]
Well, I have put almost 3000 rds thru my two 16 in barrel Bushmasters without any weapon related problem. And at times, around some of the isolated jungle areas here, I have pushed them hard. They have far exceeded my expectations in quality, toughness and accuracy. I just make sure I do a real good clean / lube after every fire time. They started at around a grand, but with good stuff added, they have both tricked out past $2400+ now. They have been worth every penny.
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Posted: 4/10/2008 1:56:09 PM EDT
[#2]
I have bought 6 Bushy barrels, all of them were purchased at different times over a 5 year period. 5 of the 6 had canted FSBs, and I mean real canted, as in 3-5 clicks left for adjustment to the left. (looked like the aperture was sitting in the corner) I sold off all the canted ones, after I reassembled them with about 1/2 the cant. 5 out of 6.......not a good average. |
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Posted: 4/10/2008 2:08:44 PM EDT
[#3]
BushMaster just made some bad batches. Seems they're quality control is in need of improvement. I haven't seen one fail personaly but I have seen many stories (w/ pics) showing various problems. I have a feeling most of their bad reputation has been hyped up but I will pass on the BM.
RRA, LMT, STAG, and DPMS are great Mfg's to buy from... OlyArms & BushMaster = DooDoo |
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Posted: 4/10/2008 2:10:56 PM EDT
[#4]
You have to remember that Bushmaster is the best selling AR-15 brand in America. Now without going into details why that is, all you have to know is that means there are a lot of them out there. Most people only talk about them when things go wrong and since there are lots of Bushies out there, you hear a lot of complaints. Percentage wise, I doubt they produce more lemons than any other major manufacturer.
Or maybe I'm full of crap. |
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Posted: 4/10/2008 2:20:15 PM EDT
[#5]
I have had two bad barrels. Both had canted FSB and one had a chamber issue that was causing brass to be literally cut when fired (dangerous if you ask me). They replaced the latter barrel, but not with a direct replacement because they said they are too backordered...so instead of getting my superlight 1/7, I am getting a 14.5 m4 1/7...
 Oh well I guess. ETA: Lacking a F FSB is ridiculous on a carbine too... I hate having to use the taller FSP as there are no night sight options available. |
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Posted: 4/10/2008 2:24:44 PM EDT
[#6]
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Posted: 4/10/2008 2:27:06 PM EDT
[#7]
Bushmaster? They are pieces of shit. They don't park under the FSB you know?
Oh yeah I own 3 of their barrels, and mine are all GTG. 
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Posted: 4/10/2008 2:30:08 PM EDT
[#8]
+1. Had a Bushmaster for about 4 years and it has never given me any problems. |
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Posted: 4/10/2008 2:56:54 PM EDT
[#9]
No. When I first joined this site, bushmaster was the cats ass. The advice you used to get when you asked " what AR should be my first? " you would be told to stick with the ABCs. Armalite, Bushmaster and Colt. Now Armalite and Bushmaster = blackthorne around here, and depending on by flavor of koolade you prefer you will hear about colt and whoever is the AR of the moment.
I dont care if Jesus H. Christ opens up a small AR shop he hand builds ever part himself, any firearm you may need to depend on needs to be shot, and shot some more with whatever ammo you plan to use. Every manufactorer will turn out the occasional lemon, what really counts is the customer support you recieve after the sale. |
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Posted: 4/10/2008 3:06:03 PM EDT
[#10]
I recently bought a Bushmaster as my first AR. I won't lie, I knew very little about ARs when I made my purchase. I bought my gun for the same reason that someone else pointed out earlier in this thread. To me, Bushmaster is and has always been a reputable American company. I think if you were to ask random people who makes AR-15s most would answer Bushmaster. I knew of BM when I was a kid growing up and that is what stuck with me.
I've put close to 1k rounds through it with zero failures. It has eaten everything I've given it no problems. I'd also like to say that my gun has M4 feed ramps, properly staked gas key and an m4 profile barrel properly marked. Since my gun is the ORC I can't comment on the FSB issue. The fit and finish is great. I think a lot of people on this forum are basing their judgement of BM on old information.(someone needs to update that stupid chart) From what I've read and experienced first hand (with my own gun) it seems that Bushmaster is now adding a majority of the milspec features to their guns that were previously missing. As with any large company that makes a whole bunch of anything there will be occasional QC issues and lemons. That said, I'm confident in my gun in any situation and that is what matters to me. I will add that Colt,LMT,Noveske among many others make great guns. I'm sure I'll own many in the future. I don't however, see the point in bashing BM or any other manufacturer just to reaffirm one's choice. I do see a bit of an elitist attitude in some of the stuff I read here and it is disappointing. I would rather see information and facts instead of stuff like "BM is shit end of story". The ONLY thing that I wish my gun had would be the 1/7 twist barrel. Other than that I have no problems and no regrets. I'm really no authority on anything but hope the experience and opinion of a BM owner helps. |
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Posted: 4/10/2008 3:37:48 PM EDT
[#11]
+1 to above. I have a 20" Bushmaster Heavy Barrel A3 and love it! No problems whatever. Beware of the Bushmaster MAGS, though... they can be pretty iffy. |
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Posted: 4/10/2008 3:50:40 PM EDT
[#12]
How do you tell if the front sight is canted
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Posted: 4/10/2008 4:00:53 PM EDT
[#13]
Extreme windage adjustments anything past 10 clicks left or right is out of the spec but that can also mean a mis indexed barrel as well..in any event extreme windage just to get the rifle on apaer is a sign either or both of those 2 things could be wrong.
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Posted: 4/10/2008 4:03:07 PM EDT
[#14]
With one barrel I had all you had to do was look at it, it was that bad. |
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Posted: 4/10/2008 4:10:13 PM EDT
[#15]
My bushmaster is great!!!! It's never failed!
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Posted: 4/10/2008 4:41:53 PM EDT
[#16]
Bushmaster catches a lot of flack from really knowledgeable people here and other M4 sites. People that can tell you they are junk because they know what they are talking about.
Thats why I'm keeping my A1/M4. Its an anomaly. According to some of the experts, its obvious to me that this is the only Bushmaster that has ever worked beyond a few thousand rounds. My Colt and LMTs have been 100%. But so has the Bushmaster. While it may not quite be up to the same standards as LMT, it was only $750 (almost half the cost of the Colt) and makes the perfect truck gun. I don't really want to throw a $1200-2000 rifle behind my truck seat. Its always with me so it gets shot 4 times as much as my other rifles. Its even been cleaned a couple of times too. I would put it in a case to keep it out of the floorboard dirt but I don't want to spoil her. I just have to wonder if my "good" guns would survive the same abuse I've dealt to the Bushmaster. Its proven itself as a dead reliable and very accurate working gun. Its earned my respect more than its pampered "prestige symbol" counterparts that are sitting in the air conditioning, rubbed down with oil. |
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Posted: 4/10/2008 5:06:34 PM EDT
[#17]
Every Bushmaster I have ever owned which has been 4 has gone bang when I pulled the trigger. I can't say the same for Colt because I had an SP-1 that was plagued with problems but I think most of it came from the previous owner not knowing anything about AR rifles. Bushmasters are good guns and the only time I ever had to dealt with customer service I was treated well.
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Posted: 4/10/2008 6:20:33 PM EDT
[#18]
no problems with mine.
I have no doubt that 1300+ colt is a "better" "spec" gun. My opinion is if your not LE or some other type of operator, just a guy out to have some fun like me, buy the "decent" well priced AR and you'll never know what your missing unless you actually own more than one or your just jealous of all the other guys that have half a dozen Colts. just my $.02 |
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Posted: 4/10/2008 11:39:36 PM EDT
[#19]
My first was a RRA and my second was a Bushmaster. I'm happy with it and in fact I just purchased a Leupold Mark 4 variable power scope for it so that I can do some precision target shooting. I've never had a problem with it and the finish is fine. My Bushmaster is the Modular Carbine model and it is unique with its fluted barrel compared to the other M4gery rifles I see at the range. I almost traded it off for a Sig Sauer pistol but I got my senses back and I am enjoying this carbine even more.
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Posted: 4/11/2008 7:21:40 AM EDT
[#20]
A friend of mine has one and aside for the shitty trigger, it's a fine weapon.
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Posted: 4/11/2008 8:38:42 AM EDT
[#21]
I purchased a Bushmaster Patrolmans Carbine (LEO marked) about 3 years ago. The fit and finish are top notch, the bolt is properly staked and the sights line up perfectly. All that was needed was 1 click left on the rear sight... not 1 notch, just 1 click. It has been through 2 courses and never skipped a beat.
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Posted: 4/11/2008 9:12:23 AM EDT
[#22]
So BM doesn't park under the FSB. Big deal! It is of no consequence whatsoever!
Since 1992, I have owned many BM ARs and have NEVER experienced any QC issues. Every one has run great, without modification to bolts, extractors, etc. BM is a top quality product at a competitive price. I also own Colts, which are no better than BM. The substantital effort being made to distinguish and "brand" AR products is nothing more than a marketing effort to establish a better branding of the product. |
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Posted: 4/11/2008 9:28:40 AM EDT
[#23]
My first Ar15 was a BM. It since has been given to my 9yr old son and he loves it!
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Posted: 4/11/2008 9:34:10 AM EDT
[#24]
Funny, I was helping one of my shooting buddies put a PWS 556FSC on her 16" Bushy CAR barrel...as we indexed the muzzle brake, I noticed that her FSB was canted...and I thought that it was just me or that I twisted the barrel as I tightened the FSC556. Good thing she shoots through an ACOG...the firearm functioned fine afterwards...so it has to be a canted FSB... |
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Posted: 4/11/2008 12:39:09 PM EDT
[#25]
I have 2 bushy's and I'm satisfied with both of them. The finish isn't as nice as the mega lower my .223 sits on but thats not the issue. They feed, shoot, and cycle just fine. FWIW my rra upper had the finish chipped on the charging handle, a canted gas block, uneven ground feed ramps(its a .458) and a defective dust cover spring. But it also shoots and cycles fine. So, no real issues here. Still, I would have to say it is probably best to build the rifle yourself using quality components.
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Posted: 4/11/2008 1:07:14 PM EDT
[#26]
excellent post. |
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Posted: 4/11/2008 1:59:37 PM EDT
[#27]
1 Colt
2 LMT`s 2 bushmasters My Bushmaster ran 100% and accurate I now run LMT M4`s |
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Posted: 4/11/2008 2:06:09 PM EDT
[#28]
Never heard all the BULL SHIT UNTIL THE BAN WAS LIFTED !!
NO ONE COULD BY COLTS 6920 NOW YA CAN so everyone now brags During the time I join NO ONE WAS BASHING BUSHMASTER DURING THE BAN LOTS OF GUYS LOVED BUSHMASTER I KNOW SOME THAT TRADED IN THERE COLTS FOR BUSHMASTER BTW Never ever had trouble with there CARRIER/BOLT |
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Posted: 4/11/2008 2:10:06 PM EDT
[#29]
I have a Carbon 15 M4 and love it. Never had a malfunction with it. That being said I did have to send the upper back in to have the barrel reindexed (extreme windage problem). They fixed it fast and sent it back fast. Customer Service is great. I would buy another in a heartbeat. Hell I wish they still made a 7.62x51.
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Posted: 4/11/2008 2:17:02 PM EDT
[#30]
http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn86/mechanicus1/choke.jpg
bushy's are toxic, bad for the digestion... |
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Posted: 4/11/2008 2:33:12 PM EDT
[#31]
I see we have some "Bushamster" fans. Coming from someone who's "seen the elephant", I wouldn't take one into battle. Not enough consistency in quality for me. Improperry staked gas keys, etc, etc, etc. I don't think any of my operators or anyone that really know the AR/M4 platform would chose a Bush over a Colt. We're using the H&K 416 now and still use Colts. I asked Larry Vickers the other day and his opinion mirrors mine. Now, i have seen Bushmasters that have been real tack drivers and very reliable.
But, if I had to use something other than Colt or H&K (without those shitty H&K overprized mags) I would go with LWRC, CMMG & LMTin that order. Oh yeah,and go with P Mags. Just my experience from being in harms way in many shit holes with the Colt M4. But, the sad reality is that the AR/M4 platform is still and will always be 1960's technology, nothing wrong with that, so is the FN FAL and is an awesome battle rifle. But, just goes to show you how the US military rationalizes sometimes. |
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Posted: 4/11/2008 2:34:50 PM EDT
[#32]
I see we have some "Bushamster" fans. Coming from someone who's "seen the elephant", I wouldn't take one into battle. Not enough consistency in quality for me. I'm an AR/M4 armorer and I see too many improperry staked gas keys, etc, etc, etc. I don't think any of my operators or anyone that really knows the AR/M4 platform would chose a Bush over a Colt. We're using the H&K 416 now and still use Colts.
But, if I had to use something other than Colt or H&K (without those shitty H&K overprized mags) I would go with LWRC, CMMG & LMTin that order. Oh yeah,and go with P Mags. Just my experience from being in harms way in many shit holes with the Colt M4. But, the sad reality is that the AR/M4 platform is still and will always be 1960's technology, nothing wrong with that, so is the FN FAL and is an awesome battle rifle. But, just goes to show you how the US military rationalizes sometimes. |
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Posted: 4/11/2008 2:57:28 PM EDT
[#33]
bushmaster can't bee all that bad since they recently got a military m16 contract.
one of the stories you hear about bushmaster is that they don't have an "h" buffer in the carbines. I bought mine in 2000 and it has and h buffer. so not all of the internet b.s. is true. |
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Posted: 4/11/2008 3:12:28 PM EDT
[#34]
No disrespect to you sir, but I would look for "official DOD procurement" documentation on that. Look, there's been rumors that Bushmaster supplied the 82nd ABN Div during Desert Storm and that some "D" boys assigned to the Gen. Schwarzkopf protective detail were using them. Well, news flash, I was one of those operators that got pulled for that security detail and all of us had Colt M4's.
I haven't come across any trooper in the 82nd that used a Bushy during that time. Is it possible, yes. But, just letting you know. I can guarantee you this though, if they are supplying the military, is not the same poor quality rifle they sell civilians. Again, I've seen Bushies that have raised the hairs on my back! As a matter of fact, I have a neighbor that serves on his PD SWAT team that has a Bushy M4 and I had to properly stake the gas keys in his rifle. Thank God I picked up on it before the poor kid got into a gun fight! His rifle did have an M4 feed ramp, something I had not seen on Bushmasters before. Its a shame too, because with some minor,low cost adjustments they would probably have a damn good rifle. They use excellent 4150 steel on their barrels, then they put on a front sight/gas block without parkerizing the FSB before mounting it. How much can it possibly cost to cover an extra 2 inches of steel with paint. Same thing with the staking of the gas keys. I used my MOAKS tool and did my neighbors rifle in under 5 minutes. |
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Posted: 4/11/2008 3:27:59 PM EDT
[#35]
I support our troops and want them to have the absolute best they can get their hands on, Colts, HK's, whatever is the cutting edge. Anything less is unacceptable. I salute your service, and hell, if they'd take me I'd be out there with you guys, and I'll damned sure buy the first round of brewski's if we ever meet, I'd consider it an honor. But I'm just an old grey beard civilian consigned now to working as a DoD contractor. I'd love to get my hands on a HK416. I'm stuck with COTS. I've got Colts & Bushy's, although I haven't bought off the rack in years. I see no sound mechanical reason to shun Bushmaster lowers when building, mixing and matching, etc. Good combo for me has been Bush lower, GI pins fire control & guts, Colt BCA, LMT M4 upper, LMT M4 butt. When I'm busting caps with this rig, how is that little snake on the side of the receiver an issue? I kinda' like that little snake.... |
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Posted: 4/11/2008 3:37:23 PM EDT
[#36]
My respect to you Sir! I've seen very good mix and matching with Bushmaster lowers. You shouldn't have any issues with those and still get to admire that little rattle snake, lol. Now, their uppers are a whole different story. Have they put out good rifles, sure they have. But, how can you play Russian roulette with your life hoping you ended up with one of the "good ones". Again, consistency is key! I'm also seeing an increasing number of law enforcement agencies dropping the Bush from their approved carry list, for obvious reasons such as the ones I stated earlier.
Competition is very tough right now in the M4 market. Everybody is making one of some type or another and to be honest, some are getting quite good! LWRC, LMT, CMMG, Noveske and I'm sure the list will get bigger. I'm really starting to believe that Bushmaster has survived due to an its attractive price and rumors that they have supplied the US military. |
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Posted: 4/11/2008 5:16:21 PM EDT
[#37]
It's amazing how much time some spend on lamenting the "Bush". "Been there, done that"...whatever. You drive your ford, i'll drive my chevy.
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Posted: 4/11/2008 5:57:47 PM EDT
[#38]
I find it amusing how many people jump on the BRANDwagon. I own a 100% Bushmaster. I have had zero issues with it. I am sure BM has made some bad ones. I would put money on it that Colt has too. No one is 100% consistent in manufacturing and QC. From reading countless posts on this site, I am going to have to agree that a lot of Colt owners tend to have an elitist attitude when it comes to brands.
Not directed at anyone. Just an observation. |
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Posted: 4/11/2008 8:33:01 PM EDT
[#39]
Bought my first Bushmaster 10 years ago and have had ZERO problems.
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Posted: 4/11/2008 9:31:32 PM EDT
[#40]
I have owned 2, both have run without a problem!!
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Posted: 4/12/2008 3:34:24 AM EDT
[#41]
I WOULDNT TAKE ANY RIFLE/CARBINE INTO BATTLE WITHOUT TESTING FIRST OUT OF THE BOX WITHOUT TESTING ( IF I HAD TO ) YES I WOULD TAKE A COLT OVER A BUSHMASTER ANY DAY BTW COLT can make a bad one now and then |
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Posted: 4/12/2008 4:37:07 AM EDT
[#42]
Nothing wrong with Bushmaster.
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Posted: 4/12/2008 6:02:44 AM EDT
[#43]
Blackwater, Triple Canopy, and nearly 70% of our nations nuclear facilities use Bushmasters...I am not claiming they are the best, but those mentioned above chose Bushy's for a reason...and I doubt it was price, since Bushy is comparable to several other manufacturers. There are many private contractors that carry their bushy's in harms way on a daily basis (primarily the blackwater boys), and they seem to be fine with them...perhaps they are seeing a different elephant... |
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Posted: 4/12/2008 8:32:38 AM EDT
[#44]
I have only had experience with 3 bushmasters.
ALL had a cant to the front sight. ALL had problems extracting Wolf. ALL worked fine with other ammo. I would purchase another one, but with CMMG being so close, I probably won't... My experience comes from 5(+1) different makers RRA DPMS Colt Bushmaster CMMG Some 'Generic' uppers |
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Posted: 4/12/2008 9:13:38 AM EDT
[#45]
I have an issued Bushmaster that I carry at work. I have put at least a few hundred rounds through it a month for the past 2 years, and it was well used when I got it. When it was issued to me it had a lot of external marks and was clogged with carbon internally. I spent several hours just getting it into what I would consider a basic level of cleanness. A typical training session involves lots of fast shooting and mag changes as well as plenty of exposure to dirt, rain, and mud.
All that, and the only problems I have ever had with it were related to bad ammo and even those were rare instances. A lot of the guys I work with have Colts and I've never seen any obvious difference in performance or reliability between the two guns. Honestly I think a lot of people buy cheap ammo, don't properly maintain their guns, and then blame their problems on the gun rather than their own poor decisions. |
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Posted: 4/12/2008 9:25:34 AM EDT
[#46]
No matter what ammos used it comes down to maintaiining the rifle,if you take care of your shit itll take care of you
It seems most problems are either mag or end user related.Its not a hard system to keep up with and if you have basic knowledge of the systems needs you shouldnt have a problem no matter the make.
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Posted: 4/12/2008 9:28:06 AM EDT
[#47]
We started issuing AR's to all of our patrolmen and the armory would only buy Colt to start with. I helped teach 5 classes where we issued at least 100 Colt 6721's with no problems that I saw on the range. After determining we could buy about 30% more rifles for the same money, the armory decided to buy Bushmasters. Also, we had to wait at least 6 months to get the Colts, but we could have the Bushmasters in a couple of weeks. At the very first class we taught with the Bushies, we found the FSB's were not canted. BUT after breaking 2 tools trying to adjust the front sight we had to use a hammer and punch to get them to turn. They were that tight. We had one rifle that would not run more than 3 rounds without failing to properly extract. Two other rifles could not go through a 20 round magazine without an extraction problem. All ammo was XM193. We were able to fix them by replacing the extractor springs with springs from some spare Colt rifles. There were other minor issues that were not a real big deal. Yes, you can send the rifles back to BM and they will take care of you, but when you are teaching a class and people have driven a long distance to get trained with all of the travel expenses, it is frustrating when the rifle doesn't work, not to mention the lack of confidence you have in the weapon you will take into battle.
I know several people that have Bushmasters and love them, but if we could do it over again, we'd stick with Colt. |
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Posted: 4/12/2008 10:35:23 AM EDT
[#48]
I find Bushmaster's small parts (springs, pins, etc.) to be of uniformly excellent quality; I have tried most of the other brands and have always gone back to Bushmaster. I also like their barrels. I have probably owned close to 30 over the years and have never had a canted FSB. But I installed the barrels myself.
I always use Bushmaster of Colt parts in the fire control group; they seem better made than the other brands I have tried (but seeming better made and actually being better made could be two entirely different things). Bushmaster recievers are of average quality. The receivers I have from Armalite and RRA generally have better fit and finish. For bolts groups I use LMT; some of the older Bushmaster carriers I have are really rough and none of them are staked well. I like that LMT tests their bolts. Bushmaster A2 stocks are better than some of the others I have. I have never used Bushmaster's carbine stocks, sticking with mil spec tubes from CMT or LMT. In my experience most AR makers seem to do a few things things really well, but none of them do everything pefectly. |
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Posted: 4/12/2008 10:36:55 AM EDT
[#49]
And there are thousands more stories like your my friend! TRUST ME! Many more.
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Posted: 4/12/2008 10:37:59 AM EDT
[#50]
Funny, I heard the same thing as well 
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