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Posted: 4/8/2013 6:16:04 AM EDT
[Last Edit: jukeboxx13]
[#1]
Thanks for the write up, and i'll be using the IBZ method once my BCM 6/3 carry handle gets here.
Tag for pics.
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FL, USA
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Posted: 4/13/2013 7:16:31 AM EDT
[#2]
Hi. I am new here and to AR15's. I just got my Colt LE6940 a few days ago. Have been doing a lot of reading here and this thread really got my attention. I have read this thread a couple of times now and I think I would like to do this. I first plan to zero as the manual describes but If this RIBZ is possible with this rear sight I would like to move on to it soon. The 6940 has a MaTech rear sight that doesn't seem to be mentioned in this thread. I did read quickly and could have missed something. Is it possible with this yet unmodified LE6940?
Thanks |
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Posted: 4/13/2013 11:07:18 AM EDT
[#3]
Originally Posted By dmarkh: Hi. I am new here and to AR15's. I just got my Colt LE6940 a few days ago. Have been doing a lot of reading here and this thread really got my attention. I have read this thread a couple of times now and I think I would like to do this. I first plan to zero as the manual describes but If this RIBZ is possible with this rear sight I would like to move on to it soon. The 6940 has a MaTech rear sight that doesn't seem to be mentioned in this thread. I did read quickly and could have missed something. Is it possible with this yet unmodified LE6940? Thanks Sorry, but I think this method is for fixed/detachable carry handle rear sights only. The matech should zero at what ever distance you want without using this method.
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Posted: 4/13/2013 11:08:41 AM EDT
[Last Edit: jukeboxx13]
[#4]
Modified my 6/3 carry handle today for a 50 zero, and going to check confirm at the range later.
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Posted: 4/16/2013 9:14:17 PM EDT
[#5]
Originally Posted By dmarkh:
Hi. I am new here and to AR15's. I just got my Colt LE6940 a few days ago. Have been doing a lot of reading here and this thread really got my attention. I have read this thread a couple of times now and I think I would like to do this. I first plan to zero as the manual describes but If this RIBZ is possible with this rear sight I would like to move on to it soon. The 6940 has a MaTech rear sight that doesn't seem to be mentioned in this thread. I did read quickly and could have missed something. Is it possible with this yet unmodified LE6940? Thanks Zero the MaTech using the IBZ. IOW, zero at 50yds using the 200M notch. Doing this with either M193, or M855 will mean you are 1/4" low to 1/2" high at 200M, or within the adjustment of the sights. As always with these shorter zeroing techniques, you will need to confirm them at the longer ranges, when you get a chance to do so. |
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FL, USA
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Posted: 4/17/2013 5:27:27 AM EDT
[#6]
[/quote]
Zero the MaTech using the IBZ. IOW, zero at 50yds using the 200M notch. Doing this with either M193, or M855 will mean you are 1/4" low to 1/2" high at 200M, or within the adjustment of the sights. As always with these shorter zeroing techniques, you will need to confirm them at the longer ranges, when you get a chance to do so.[/quote] I went to the range this past week end and zero'd by the book (BUIS set on line between 300 and 400) at 25M. It went well. 3 Very tight 3 shot groups groups that would fit in a nickle. Then went to the 100Y range and was all over the place. I was hitting the target but... not happy with my self. I will go back soon and do this as you recommend at 50Y. I suspect I will need more practice to get at 50 what I got at 25 though. I was just hoping there was a short range 100Y zero method. My range does have two 200Y lanes somewhere but 100Y will be what I use mostly. |
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Posted: 4/17/2013 9:48:30 AM EDT
[#7]
A 25M zero will be ~5" high at 100y.
M193 and M855 will give you 10 shot groups of ~3" at 100y, this assumes a good bench technique and a good trigger. Factory trigger and sloppy technique will yield larger groups. The LTC Santose IBZ (IOW the 50y/200M zero) is a rather useful one. Molon's revised IBZ was to take advantage of the elevation the A2/A4, and a few others, give in order to get a 25y/M and 100y/M zero. Given the course adjustment of factory set ups, it is good to confirm your far zero at the range intended. |
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Posted: 5/3/2013 11:26:54 PM EDT
[#8]
ttt
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FL, USA
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Posted: 5/19/2013 4:25:46 PM EDT
[#9]
Nice, How much of a shot group difference is it between an 20" HBAR and the 16" Carbine profiles? i will print off some of those targets and try them out...
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FL, USA
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Posted: 5/19/2013 4:42:59 PM EDT
[#10]
Originally Posted By Molon:
Here is a down-loadable target in .pdf format that can be used for zeroing 20" uppers with A2 sights at 50 yards using the Improved Battlesight Zero. The dashed vertical grey lines represent one click of the windage knob. The dashed horizontal lines represent one click of the FRONT SIGHT POST. 50 yard zeroing target When printing, you need to have the "page scaling" option in Adobe Reader set to "none" in order for the target to print with the correct dimensions. http://www.box.net/shared/static/x2lq0svwco.jpg Hummm I can't download this.... 
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TX, USA
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Posted: 6/2/2013 8:03:05 AM EDT
[Last Edit: masterskop]
[#11]
Hi,
I'm in the process of zeroing an RRA elite car 16" mid (1/9) with the A3 detachable tactical carry handle. I went to the range the other day and forgot how to zero my weapon appropriately. It has been a while since I was in the military with the M16 that I was issued. It did not have an elevation wheel in the rear sighting system as does my RRA rifle. This rifle has an 'F' front sight post. I do not know the appr. height of this post. The FSP was reset to mechanical zero where the base of the post is now flush with the front sight. So, now I can start changing out the elevation. I have the rear sight windage set to mechanical zero. I counted 82 clicks and set the windage to 41. I was able to set the elevation knob to 6/3 -8(double clicks). Ammo that will be used is the 62 gr steel core. I found out during the failed zeroing process the other day that my rifle hates federal 55 gr. ammo. 62 gr. works. I need some help with the following questions: 1. With the above info. I want to zero on 50 yards. I have the following distances at one of the ranges that I can use: 25yds, 50yds, 75yds, and 100yds. Do I set rear sight to 6/3 -4 for the 50 yd zero? 2. After taking appr. 3 shots at 50 yards, make adjustments to elevation and windage? 3. After a few more elev/wind adjustments and shot groups at 50 yards, and if everything goes right with groupings at center of target, then rifle is zeroed? 4. After zeroing at 50 yards, then the following would apply?: With the RIBZ modification an M4 should be on target if the elevation knob is set to the following: Distance/Setting (y =yards/m=meters; up to 100 meters the difference doesn't greatly affect POI) 25y: 6/3 50y: 6/3 -4 (for the 20" A4 rifle; the M4 carbine will zero at 41 meters/45 yards), poa=poi?? 75y: 6/3 -5, -6 100y: 6/3 -6 150y: 6/3 -5,-6 200m: 6/3 -4 300m: 6/3 400m: 4 500m: 5 600m: 6/3 (after one full rotation upward) 5. Would 75yds and 150yds be -5? Any help is appreciated! Thanks! |
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Posted: 6/2/2013 11:28:24 AM EDT
[Last Edit: RedFalconBill]
[#12]
Yes, 6/3, -4 is a 50 yd Zero. Given the velocity of M855 out of a 16" barrel using a 6/3, -4 50yd Zero will be ~3/8" low at 200M. That is within the adjustment of the elevation drum.
No, 6/3 is not a 25M/300M Zero. Again, given the velocity of M855 out of a 16" barrel, if you want to zero with the elevation drum at 6/3, then zero at 30yds. A 50 yd zero would be ~1" high at 75yds and ~1.7" high at 150yds, so you could rotate the drum down one more click, maybe two clicks. You would have to go and try it at 75/150 yds to see if your carbine is 6/3, -5 or -6. |
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TX, USA
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Posted: 6/2/2013 2:33:58 PM EDT
[Last Edit: masterskop]
[#13]
RedFalconbill,
Thank you for the reply. I was looking at Aaron556's reply on page 10 of this topic. http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_3_18/328143_RIBZ_____Revised_Improved_Battlesight_Zero__now_with_down_loadable_50_yard_zeroing_target_.html&page=10 I was wondering on a 25 yard target (not 25m target) with 62 gr ammo, would the poi=poa if the rear sight elevation was set to 6/3 +5? Thanks |
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Posted: 6/3/2013 12:56:25 AM EDT
[#14]
Still can't believe why this is not a sticky yet?
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Posted: 6/3/2013 1:27:06 AM EDT
[#15]
Originally Posted By recon: Still can't believe why this is not a sticky yet? +1 |
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TX, USA
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Posted: 6/3/2013 6:23:17 PM EDT
[#16]
Hi,
I have a few more questions about the RIBZ method by Melon. Should I: 1. Mechanical zero my AR 15 (16" barrel, 1/9 twist, F front sight post, detachable A3 carry handle 6/3 double clicks)??... <--- this had already been done. 2. Adjusted the A3 detachable rear sight to the RIBZ. <-- this had been done. Lowest setting is 6/3 -8 3. Here's the part that I haven't done and need some advise. Either use a 50 yard zero or a 100 yard zero?? A 50 yard zero (poa=poi) (is this also with the rear adjustment of 6/3 -4 and front sight post adjusted as well as with windage)?? seems to cross a target range fairly nicely from 25 yards to 250 yards. 4. If a 50 yard zero is advised, will the following then apply?? 25 yards = 6/3 +5 50 yards = 6/3 -4 75 yards = 6/3 -5 100 yards = 6/3 -6 |
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MI, USA
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Posted: 6/3/2013 8:10:01 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Strikefirst]
[#17]
Originally Posted By masterskop:
Hi, I have a few more questions about the RIBZ method by Melon. Should I: 1. Mechanical zero my AR 15 (16" barrel, 1/9 twist, F front sight post, detachable A3 carry handle 6/3 double clicks)??... <--- this had already been done. 2. Adjusted the A3 detachable rear sight to the RIBZ. <-- this had been done. Lowest setting is 6/3 -8 3. Here's the part that I haven't done and need some advise. Either use a 50 yard zero or a 100 yard zero?? A 50 yard zero (poa=poi) (is this also with the rear adjustment of 6/3 -4 and front sight post adjusted as well as with windage)?? seems to cross a target range fairly nicely from 25 yards to 250 yards. 4. If a 50 yard zero is advised, will the following then apply?? 25 yards = 6/3 +5 400 yards = 6/3 +4 50/225 yards = 6/3 -4 ( I call it 200) 75 yards = 6/3 -5 100 yards = 6/3 -6 See red. I used a 50 yard zero for the fact it is also dead on at 200 (225 actually) when I'm at 6/3 -4. Plus if you look at ballistic trajecotry of a 50 yard zero with 55 gr and 62 gr I thought it gave me the most benefit. But everyone's scenario and rifle use is different. 2" high or Low out to 250 yards http://www.box.net/shared/static/8xved8kfrm.jpg |
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TX, USA
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Posted: 6/3/2013 8:33:00 PM EDT
[Last Edit: masterskop]
[#18]
Strikefirst,
On the 50 yrd zero, was your setup on the rear sight drum 6/3 -4 with adjustments to fsp and windage? If so, keeping the fsp as is, then changing the rear sight elevation would then be ok for the following then? 25yrds - 6/3 +5 100 yrds - 6/3 -6 yes? |
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Posted: 6/3/2013 11:20:28 PM EDT
[#19]
Originally Posted By masterskop:
A 50 yard zero (poa=poi) (is this also with the rear adjustment of 6/3 -4 and front sight post adjusted as well as with windage)?? seems to cross a target range fairly nicely from 25 yards to 250 yards. Yes, a 50yd Zero is rather useful. This is why LTC Santose published the IBZ 14 years ago (8/3, -2, or 6/3, -4). With a 16" barrel, it doesn't matter if you use M193, or M855, a 50 yd Zero will insure that the bullets path doesn't go higher than 2" above POA or 2" below POA from 10yds to 250yds (roughly). Your 25yd (6/3, +5) an 100yd (6/3, -6) look ok, but you would have to actually shoot at those distances to see for you to see if you need to tweak those setting up or down one click, for your carbine. As for the 75yd Zero, if you use the 50yd Zero @ 75yds, you will be within 1" of POA=POI at 75yds, and if you use the 100yd Zero, you will be within 1/4" of POA=POI. Being able to hold 1/4" at 75yds when the front sight post would substend 10" at that same 75yd distance is a bit much. IOW, why bother? |
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TX, USA
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Posted: 6/4/2013 5:12:41 AM EDT
[#20]
RedFalconBill,
Thanks for your replies. When I get a little more time, I'll go back out to the range and use the ribz 50 yrd zero and report back. |
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NC, USA
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Posted: 6/12/2013 8:10:50 PM EDT
[#21]
This helped me out allot. Thanks
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MO, USA
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Posted: 7/7/2013 8:48:08 AM EDT
[#22]
Great article. Was wondering if you could post a trajectory graph of the large and small apertures of XM193/16 inch barrel with 50 yrd zero - zeroed with the 0 -2 aperture. Thanks,
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Posted: 7/7/2013 9:03:31 AM EDT
[#23]
ost
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Posted: 7/7/2013 10:43:01 AM EDT
[Last Edit: RedFalconBill]
[#24]
Originally Posted By kini:
Great article. Was wondering if you could post a trajectory graph of the large and small apertures of XM193/16 inch barrel with 50 yrd zero - zeroed with the 0 -2 aperture. Thanks, If you used LTC Santose IBZ (8/3, -2, or 6/3, -4), all you would have to do is rotate the 0-2 aperture up and click the elevation wheel back to 8/3 (or 6/3 for carry handle sights) and you have the same zero. |
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Posted: 7/7/2013 2:56:32 PM EDT
[#25]
Originally Posted By jukeboxx13: Originally Posted By recon: Still can't believe why this is not a sticky yet? +1 It was a sticky. We don't do stickies anymore. It is in the links thread at the top, and it is set to stay alive so it will never drop into the archives. |
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Posted: 7/29/2013 12:19:14 AM EDT
[#26]
What the front sight post elevation change per click with 16" midlenght with a F-Marked sight base?
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Posted: 7/29/2013 9:32:07 AM EDT
[Last Edit: RedFalconBill]
[#27]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AR15fan:
What the front sight post elevation change per click with 16" midlenght with a F-Marked sight base? Taking the average between the M4 and the M16A4, you get 1.45 MOA per click. |
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Posted: 8/19/2013 5:13:47 PM EDT
[#28]
Used This with a 20" 1:7 upper today. Used a KNS fsp which is taller. Started at 25, then 50 and 100. Confirmed the sight settings worked at each of those ranges.
With a 14.5" results at 25 and 50 were great but at 100 (6/3-6) I had a windage shift due to the rear sight not tracking true. Just gonna leave that one at 6/3-4 for everything. |
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Posted: 8/24/2013 11:25:22 AM EDT
[#29]
With 6/3 - 6 shooting poa at 100 and 6/3-4 poa at 50 is it reasonable to assume 6/3-5 for 75?
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Posted: 8/24/2013 6:11:26 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AR15fan:
With 6/3 - 6 shooting poa at 100 and 6/3-4 poa at 50 is it reasonable to assume 6/3-5 for 75? I would just use the 6/3, -6, as you will be off by 1/4" to 3/8" at 75yds. |
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Posted: 11/5/2013 10:39:00 PM EDT
[#31]
Okay. Off in the AM to try this on a new GI carry handle. Can't wait!
6/3 Settings 25 yards - 6/3 +5 50 yards - 6/3 -4 75 yards - 6/3 -5 100 yards - 6/3 -6 200 yards - 6/3 -4 300 yards - 6/3 400 yards - 4 8/3 Settings 25 yards 8/3 +3 50 yards - 8/3 -2 100 yards - 8/3 -3 200 yards - 8/3 -2 300 yards - 8/3 400 yards - 4 |
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Posted: 11/6/2013 10:08:42 AM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Lancelot: Okay. Off in the AM to try this on a new GI carry handle. Can't wait! 6/3 Settings 25 yards - 6/3 +5 50 yards - 6/3 -4 75 yards - 6/3 -5 100 yards - 6/3 -6 200 yards - 6/3 -4 300 yards - 6/3 400 yards - 4 8/3 Settings 25 yards 8/3 +3 50 yards - 8/3 -2 100 yards - 8/3 -3 200 yards - 8/3 -2 300 yards - 8/3 400 yards - 4 I've used similar settings on my Colt carry handle out to 500 yards on steel. At 500 with the elevation knob on the 5, I as hitting a tad high (shoulder height) on an echo silhouette target with IMI M855. Shooting at a 2.5MOA reduced silhouette at the same range, I had to come down a few clicks from 5 to hit center (when I missed, it was just over the right shoulder until I made the adjustments).
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Posted: 11/6/2013 3:51:41 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Muad:
I've used similar settings on my Colt carry handle out to 500 yards on steel. At 500 with the elevation knob on the 5, I as hitting a tad high (shoulder height) on an echo silhouette target with IMI M855. Shooting at a 2.5MOA reduced silhouette at the same range, I had to come down a few clicks from 5 to hit center (when I missed, it was just over the right shoulder until I made the adjustments). Yeah, once you go past 350 yards or so, the difference between meters and yards is enough that you have to come down in your elevation to. |
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Posted: 11/6/2013 8:13:36 PM EDT
[#34]
Well, it worked again. GI carry handle on a 14.5" middy.
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Posted: 11/6/2013 8:39:03 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Lancelot:
Well, it worked again. GI carry handle on a 14.5" middy. It's comforting to hear it still works. |
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MO, USA
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Posted: 2/1/2014 12:10:40 AM EDT
[Last Edit: StowaNewb]
[#36]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By masterskop:
Hi, I have a few more questions about the RIBZ method by Melon. Should I: 1. Mechanical zero my AR 15 (16" barrel, 1/9 twist, F front sight post, detachable A3 carry handle 6/3 double clicks)??... <--- this had already been done. 2. Adjusted the A3 detachable rear sight to the RIBZ. <-- this had been done. Lowest setting is 6/3 -8 3. Here's the part that I haven't done and need some advise. Either use a 50 yard zero or a 100 yard zero?? A 50 yard zero (poa=poi) (is this also with the rear adjustment of 6/3 -4 and front sight post adjusted as well as with windage)?? seems to cross a target range fairly nicely from 25 yards to 250 yards. 4. If a 50 yard zero is advised, will the following then apply?? 25 yards = 6/3 +5 50 yards = 6/3 -4 75 yards = 6/3 -5 100 yards = 6/3 -6 I came across this post, and I was wondering why 25 yards isn't 6/3 +6 and not +5? ETA: Also, on the first page it says, "when using this sighting method, you may find that once you have set your 100 yard zero, the top of the base of the front sight post is now slightly above the top of the well in the front sight base. If this happens, the “0.040” taller” front sight post from Bushmaster provides a quick and inexpensive fix." Can someone explain why it's a problem if the base of the front sight post is slightly above the top of the well in the front sight base? |
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Posted: 2/17/2014 9:16:34 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Bangz]
[#37]
I only have a 25 yard range (not 50, not 100)
Can I Zero to the RIBZ at 25 yards using 6/3 +5 POA=POI ? And have all the other RIBZ click settings work? OR Can I dial it 6/3-4 (for 50 yds) and then adjust the front sight to shoot 1.4 inches low (at 25 yds) giving me POA=POI at 50? And then keep it on 6/3-4 for the correct 50yd 200meter zero? Small aperature: 25: 6/3 50: -4 100: -6 200: -4 300: 6/3 400: 4 setting (+6 if you aren't looking) 500: 5 setting (+8 if you aren't looking) 600: 6 setting (+ 11 if you aren't looking) Large aperature: 25: +3 50: -1 100: -3 200: -1 300: +3 400: 4 setting +3 (+9 if you aren't looking) 500: 5 setting +3 (+11 if you aren't looking) 600: 6 setting +3 (+14 if you aren't looking) 25 yards - 6/3 +5 50 yards - 6/3 -4 75 yards - 6/3 -5 100 yards - 6/3 -6 200 yards - 6/3 -4 300 yards - 6/3 400 yards - 4 Regarding the question immediately above, my understanding regarding why 25 yards is 6/3 + 5 is that the fixed handle 8/3 has "full clicks" adjustment, while the 6/3 Carrry Handle has "half-clicks" adjustment. (If it takes 6 clicks on your carry handle to get from "6/3" marker to the "4" marker, your carry handle has a half-click adjustemnt wheel. At 25 yards, the 8/3 +3 Full click adjustment is not as precise as the 6/5 + 5 half click adjustment (6/3+6 would be the equivalent of the 8/3 +3.) |
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NC, USA
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Posted: 3/9/2014 1:43:27 AM EDT
[#38]
Hey are they a video of this anywhere to watch this being done ? I have the WW MPC AR15 and Love it
Thanks Jeff ><> |
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Posted: 3/22/2014 4:47:48 PM EDT
[#39]
Just employed the RIBZ on all my irons and an EoTech equipped rifle. I was surprised how well it worked on a rifle using the Dueck rapid transition sights. I must have lucked out as the front sight elevation only needed a few clicks and the rifle is shooting very well with this set up. No taller post needed. Many thanks for all the patiently explained instructions and supporting images. Say...this works!
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Posted: 4/13/2014 10:25:15 PM EDT
[#40]
Gents,
I'm doing some testing to determine what click values on the elevation index correspond with the distances at a KD range denoted in yards. I'm using an FN A2 (8/3) 20" upper with Federal M855 ammunition. Some questions: 1. The adjustments "per click" on the 8/3 elevation index wheel equal 1 MOA, correct? 2. If each click on the elevation index wheel equals 1 MOA, then the following should be true? -Three "clicks" between the 300 and 400 meter setting, thus: 3 MOA between them -Four "clicks" between the 400 and 500 meter setting, thus: 4 MOA between them ....and so on, correct? 3. If #2 is not correct, or not "totally" correct, would it be safe to say the following: -Three clicks between 300 and 400 meter settings, thus: 8/3 = 300 meters, 8/3 +1 = 333 meters, 8/3 +2 = 366 meters, 8/3 +3 = 400 meters (400 meter setting) 4. But if the solution described in #3 is correct, then how can the following be true (as it pertains to each click setting equal 1 MOA)? -Four clicks between 400 and 500 meter settings, thus: 400 = 400 meters, 400 +1 = 425 meters, 400 +2 = 450 meters, 400 +3 = 475 meters, 400 +4 = 500 meters (500 meter setting) Basically I need to figure out which is more accurate a way to determine the true value of each click between hundred meter settings on the elevation wheel. At that point, I can translate to yards to get accurate settings for a KD range denoted in yards. I did a simple test trying different estimated settings at various yardage distances at steel gongs. I shot several strings and recorded "hit" or "miss." I have come up with the following "rough" settings so far, again using a standard M16A2 profile rifle and Federal M855 ammunition. Please be advised I'm not the best shooter and am always working on my fundamentals as I need to be, so this is more of a test of me, not really the physics  :
***Denoted in YARDS 350 yards (equal to 320 meters): 8/3 +1 100% hit ratio 400 yards (equal to 366 meters): 8/3 +2 80% hit ratio 450 yards (equal to 411 meters): 400 +1 50% hit ratio 400 +2 0% hit ratio 500 yards (equal to 457 meters): 400 +2 70% hit ratio 400 +3 55% hit ratio Now I understand much of this is dependent on rifle used, ammo used, conditions, and shooter, etc. But I'm wondering if anyone else can look at my brief results (fired about 60 rounds to come up with these numbers) and see if they have experienced similar patterns. I will be returning to range soon to work on these more and get better results as I can. It should be noted I'm using a center hold on every gong. Gong size being (I believe) 20x20 inches. 
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USA
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Posted: 5/28/2014 5:04:00 PM EDT
[#42]
Okay, I've read and reread this thread many times and there's a lot to take in.
I just want to clarify: If I have a 16" barrel, detachable carry handle marked 6/3 (set to 6/3 -4), and I zero at 50 yards, I should have an acceptable POI no more than 2" low or 2" high from 10 yards or so out to 250 yards or so, correct? In other words, this setting would be the "set it and forget it setting"? |
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Posted: 5/28/2014 6:21:40 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By DocGlockster:
Okay, I've read and reread this thread many times and there's a lot to take in. I just want to clarify: If I have a 16" barrel, detachable carry handle marked 6/3 (set to 6/3 -4), and I zero at 50 yards, I should have an acceptable POI no more than 2" low or 2" high from 10 yards or so out to 250 yards or so, correct? In other words, this setting would be the "set it and forget it setting"? If you are using M193 or M855 ammunition, then yes a 50yd/200M zero is how you describe. You should still go out and shoot at distance, in order to fine tune your carbine. |
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NM, USA
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Posted: 5/29/2014 11:11:15 AM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Hallorann:
For a 14.5” sight radius with removable handle, the elevation clicks are worth 0.65 MOA each, and the POI shift between apertures is 3.48 MOA. Adjust the elevation wheel UP 5 clicks to maintain the same zero when changing from small to large aperture. [/span] So, extrapolating this out....on a carbine with 16" barrel, removable carry handle, zeroed at 50 yards with a rear dial setting of 6/3 -4, to maintain zero with the large aperture the rear dial setting would be 6/3 +1, correct? |
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Posted: 5/29/2014 3:47:18 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By DocGlockster:
So, extrapolating this out....on a carbine with 16" barrel, removable carry handle, zeroed at 50 yards with a rear dial setting of 6/3 -4, to maintain zero with the large aperture the rear dial setting would be 6/3 +1, correct? Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By DocGlockster:
[span style='font-weight: bold;']Originally Posted By Hallorann:
For a 14.5” sight radius with removable handle, the elevation clicks are worth 0.65 MOA each, and the POI shift between apertures is 3.48 MOA. Adjust the elevation wheel UP 5 clicks to maintain the same zero when changing from small to large aperture. So, extrapolating this out....on a carbine with 16" barrel, removable carry handle, zeroed at 50 yards with a rear dial setting of 6/3 -4, to maintain zero with the large aperture the rear dial setting would be 6/3 +1, correct? That would depend upon which one of the three 0-2 apertures you have (0.014", 0.017", or 0.024" offset). These equate to a 3.48", 4.25", or 5.96" offset. You have to shoot your carbine to find out. |
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NM, USA
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Posted: 5/29/2014 4:18:44 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RedFalconBill:
That would depend upon which one of the three 0-2 apertures you have (0.014", 0.017", or 0.024" offset). These equate to a 3.48", 4.25", or 5.96" offset. You have to shoot your carbine to find out. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RedFalconBill:
Originally Posted By DocGlockster:
[span style='font-weight: bold;']Originally Posted By Hallorann:
For a 14.5” sight radius with removable handle, the elevation clicks are worth 0.65 MOA each, and the POI shift between apertures is 3.48 MOA. Adjust the elevation wheel UP 5 clicks to maintain the same zero when changing from small to large aperture. So, extrapolating this out....on a carbine with 16" barrel, removable carry handle, zeroed at 50 yards with a rear dial setting of 6/3 -4, to maintain zero with the large aperture the rear dial setting would be 6/3 +1, correct? That would depend upon which one of the three 0-2 apertures you have (0.014", 0.017", or 0.024" offset). These equate to a 3.48", 4.25", or 5.96" offset. You have to shoot your carbine to find out. If the carry handle sight was purchased just within the last 4 years and came from a reputable, mil-spec supplier, does that suggest a starting point that it is "likely" a certain one? |
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Posted: 5/29/2014 6:09:02 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By DocGlockster:
If the carry handle sight was purchased just within the last 4 years and came from a reputable, mil-spec supplier, does that suggest a starting point that it is "likely" a certain one? If I had to bet, I would say you have one the latter two (0.017" or 0.024"). First, zero using the IBZ method, then flip to the 0-2 and shoot again. Ensure your shot group is large enough sample size (iow 7-10 shots) before taking your tape measure out. |
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NM, USA
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Posted: 5/29/2014 6:36:45 PM EDT
[Last Edit: DocApocalypse]
[#48]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RedFalconBill:
If I had to bet, I would say you have one the latter two (0.017" or 0.024"). First, zero using the IBZ method, then flip to the 0-2 and shoot again. Ensure your shot group is large enough sample size (iow 7-10 shots) before taking your tape measure out. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RedFalconBill:
Originally Posted By DocGlockster:
If the carry handle sight was purchased just within the last 4 years and came from a reputable, mil-spec supplier, does that suggest a starting point that it is "likely" a certain one? If I had to bet, I would say you have one the latter two (0.017" or 0.024"). First, zero using the IBZ method, then flip to the 0-2 and shoot again. Ensure your shot group is large enough sample size (iow 7-10 shots) before taking your tape measure out. I've had the rifle zeroed for a couple of years now using the IBZ and the small aperture. It was only after re-reading this thread did I have some doubts about my zeroing, especially with the larger aperture. So far, at 50 yards it seems to hit 3D targets like aluminum cans to point of aim, but I've been wanting to "put it on paper" and didn't want to just waste ammo flailing away without a good starting point. I think I'm GTG until I can really take my time and see how it does on paper at various ranges. I just wanted to know my parameters before starting. So, to repeat: if all else is GTG and I've got the appropriate offset for the 0-2 aperture, then 6/3 +1 should be the click setting for the 0-2 aperture at 50 yards, correct? |
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Posted: 5/30/2014 4:12:47 PM EDT
[#49]
That 6/3, +1 is if you have the 0.014" offset.
You need to actually go and shoot at 50 yds using both apertures and "put in on paper". Of course, given the coarseness of the adjustments, your carbine, and your bench technique, you might need to stretch the distance in order to find out which rear sight you have. It's really not as hard as you are making out to be. Just go shoot the carbine with M855 or M193 ammo and find out. |
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Posted: 8/2/2014 12:49:09 PM EDT
[#50]
ttt
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