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Posted: 9/3/2022 3:02:22 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Everyone has their opinions on change and technology. I don't think anyone will say you HAVE to run electronic ignition, same as you won't HAVE to run unleaded avgas. But you're going to have a harder time buying it. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: You can now buy new Lycoming engines (though I don't know what the current wait time is, due to supply chain issues) with a new electronic ignition system on them. We've installed a few of them at the shop I work at. No STC needed, as (as I understand it) Lycoming added the electronic system to the engine Type Certificate as an alternate part for the left magneto. Looks like a weird magneto, that you have to run a power wire to, when you install the engine. There is also at least one aftermarket electronic ignition system that is STC'd for some of the Lycoming engines, but it's not self-contained in a housing similar to a magneto housing (like the Lycoming factory electronic ignition). It involves a distributor that bolts on in place of the left magneto, and a box that houses the electronics, that you have to find a place to mount it and wire it in. If you are considering either system, I would suggest going with the one Lycoming offers as an option on their engines. (Less paperwork, less to deal with on the installation, and less additional wiring to rub on stuff under the cowling.) I had dual electronic ignitions on the RV8. They worked great. Did it detect and prevent detonation? They made the sparky things spark. I feel that they helped the engine make more power. Maxed out I could see about 200mph. Fuel flow worked out to about 18 mpg Just curious, and I should have known. Car engines prevent detonation with the computer. If plane engines did that, the fuel would be much less of an issue. When they first started putting electronic ignition in cars (1970s), it didn't come with all the fancy sensors that they have been putting on them for the last couple decades or so. It was just an electronic distributor that did a better job of controlling the spark (easier starting and probably a small increase in power) with the same inputs that were available to the mechanical distributors. Until they put even more electronics on the engine (controlling the fuel, and more sensors), it's not going to be doing a lot to prevent detonation. The beginnings of electronic ignition simply eliminated points, and all of those shortcomings. I would wager a perfectly tuned set of points is as precise as a simple electronic ignition system, but not for very long. I’d also bet a nickel a dual electronic ignition system is more reliable than the old dual-mag  The problem is that it relies on an electrical system, so the electrical system has to come with redundancies. Batteries are heavy, and a charge doesn't last very long. I have an outboard with a full electronic ignition, zero battery required What happens when your alternator quits? If your engine quits, does your boat sink? What alternator? Oh you mean the same permanent magnet system that is in your magnetos?! I don't know what your boat has. Does it have an ignition coil? If so, then no, it's not the same system. If it uses magnitos, then it has electronic points, and there is no real advantage. and we're back full circle, aviation does not like/is afraid of change.  Change for the sake of change - no. If there is no demonstrable advantage, such as with electronic points, it's not worth the paperwork to get it approved. Aviation likes what is known and proven to work well. Everyone has their opinions on change and technology. I don't think anyone will say you HAVE to run electronic ignition, same as you won't HAVE to run unleaded avgas. But you're going to have a harder time buying it. Now you're talking about two different things. When you say "aviation doesn't like change", you aren't talking about pilots/owners. You're talking about the FAA. Pilots embrace change, and crave new technology. They flock from all over the country to Florida and Wisconsin, just to get a first glimpse of it. If you show them they will get an extra knot, or half an hour per gallon, they would jump on a set of electronic points. There would be a line to buy them. If you tell them that they're easier to adjust, and require it less often, you'll get a blank stare, because they still have to pay the same person the same money to adjust them once a year, whether they need it or not. Did you watch the video I posted earlier on why new engine designs fail? You would find enlightenment in it. There is a LOT more to it than accepting new technology. |
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Posted: 9/3/2022 3:08:03 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I’m the guy that washes his hands after shooting then showers and changes clothes when I can. I don’t like lead. I love asbestos though.  That's the "prophylactic measures" I was talking about. None the less, you are probably STILL ingesting SOME lead. Which brings me back to my original point. |
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Posted: 9/3/2022 3:14:59 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted: If you show them they will get an extra knot, or half an hour per gallon, they would jump on a set of electronic points. There would be a line to buy them. If you tell them that they're easier to adjust, and require it less often, you'll get a blank stare, because they still have to pay the same person the same money to adjust them once a year, whether they need it or not. Just convincing them they need something, when they "haven't needed it on any past annual", can be a major challenge. The mental gymnastics that can be displayed, when telling a C-150 owner he needs new rudder cables, are impressive. |
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Posted: 9/3/2022 3:22:23 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Just convincing them they need something, when they "haven't needed it on any past annual", can be a major challenge. The mental gymnastics that can be displayed, when telling a C-150 owner he needs new rudder cables, are impressive. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: If you show them they will get an extra knot, or half an hour per gallon, they would jump on a set of electronic points. There would be a line to buy them. If you tell them that they're easier to adjust, and require it less often, you'll get a blank stare, because they still have to pay the same person the same money to adjust them once a year, whether they need it or not. Just convincing them they need something, when they "haven't needed it on any past annual", can be a major challenge. The mental gymnastics that can be displayed, when telling a C-150 owner he needs new rudder cables, are impressive. Ah, but the beauty is that you don't have to convince them that they need new cables. You just have to convince them that you're not going to sign off on the ones they have.
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Posted: 9/3/2022 3:27:40 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Change for the sake of change - no. If there is no demonstrable advantage, such as with electronic points, it's not worth the paperwork to get it approved. Aviation likes what is known and proven to work well. Freedom is scary. The FAA is unconstitutional |
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Posted: 9/3/2022 3:30:18 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted: That's the "prophylactic measures" I was talking about. None the less, you are probably STILL ingesting SOME lead. Which brings me back to my original point. And I know that I’m ingesting lead when I do it. As do pilots and people in aviation. I’d rather not live downwind of an airport though. |
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Posted: 9/3/2022 3:31:23 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Ah, but the beauty is that you don't have to convince them that they need new cables. You just have to convince them that you're not going to sign off on the ones they have. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: If you show them they will get an extra knot, or half an hour per gallon, they would jump on a set of electronic points. There would be a line to buy them. If you tell them that they're easier to adjust, and require it less often, you'll get a blank stare, because they still have to pay the same person the same money to adjust them once a year, whether they need it or not. Just convincing them they need something, when they "haven't needed it on any past annual", can be a major challenge. The mental gymnastics that can be displayed, when telling a C-150 owner he needs new rudder cables, are impressive. Ah, but the beauty is that you don't have to convince them that they need new cables. You just have to convince them that you're not going to sign off on the ones they have. And then they go tell all their pilot friends that you rip people off. Doesn't matter that their nose wheel steering (that they had made some mention of when they brought the plane in) is now working perfectly, because you didn't replace anything on the nosewheel and insisted that they needed rudder (which is on the opposite end of the plane) cables. In fact, they'll probably add that tidbit to their tale, to show how incompetent you are. |
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