User Panel
User Panel
User Panel
|
Posted: 12/2/2023 12:36:29 AM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Understood, but would it have any value on the back side of a happening like that? Nobody knows. Some think it would, others don't. Its a bet as much as picking teams against the spread is... Can you point at a single time in history post-agricultural revolution where gold had no value? I don't give a shit about indians living in the stone age, I mean actual civilizations, or weird bullshit scenarios like some dude alone in the forest. I have looked for it and can't find an instance where gold has had no value. Even during disasters, nobody was throwing gold away because it took up too much space in the cupboard, they were trading it for things they needed. Anyone who thinks a brick of gold is going to be valueless doesn't have an opinion worth hearing. |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/2/2023 12:51:07 AM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I dunno man, this looks pretty good to me… https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/136311/DF937CF5-8103-4CEE-A1EA-A01224881C73_png-3046676.JPG Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: This is because the cost to produce gold is way up as well! You know fuel, acid, cyanide, blasting supplies, equipment parts etc...not to mention the shortage of personal to get the job done. I dunno man, this looks pretty good to me… https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/136311/DF937CF5-8103-4CEE-A1EA-A01224881C73_png-3046676.JPG Every mines cost to produce differs bases on a lot of factors from surface mine op to UG op to Mill, leach, rock type chemicals needed etc.. You might take a look at where these mines are ( another foreign mining company ) They have a small exploration project in nevada and a open pit in nevada and they are averaging about $1200 and oz to produce ( in NV ) not great but not horrible either. Calibres mines in Nicaragua are more than likly carring the company right now. The mine I work for is coasting us about $1400 an oz pre covid it coast $800 an oz. the mine my kid works at is at $1800 an oz and they are talking about closing down until the economy get stronger. |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/2/2023 12:51:54 AM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You didn’t answer my question. You moved the subject. So I’ll ask again: What’s your plan if fiat currencies crash? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: People are starting to understand the lie of fiat currency. POG is on its way to the moon. As opposed to a metal that serves no tangible purpose other than to make jewelry & high conductivity electrical contacts?... As opposed to a fiat currency that may eventually serve no tangible purpose other than to stoke a fire or use as toilet paper?... So, assuming that happens and the fiat currency crashes. What’s your plan for gold? Irresponsible money printing is driving inflation. We all can see the dollar devaluing right before our eyes. Stay hedged. You didn’t answer my question. You moved the subject. So I’ll ask again: What’s your plan if fiat currencies crash? People here, and prepper types in general, and very careless and reckless with that word. First, what do you mean by “crash”? A traditional Crash, is deflationary, it makes Cash More valuable, relative to assets. But, I think you mean Hyperinflation?. Because the Fed will not allow a Crash. (Not for long, anyway) Picture this: In 2000-2001, Argentina was at 1-1 parity with the Dollar. If you had 300,000 pesos, you could have bought 1000 ounces of gold. Today, that 300,000 pesos can only buy you a nice dinner for 8 people. (It’s worth about $320). But, if you had that 1000 ounces of gold, it would be worth 1000 x $2000 today. Or, $2,000,000. The gold didn’t get more valuable. It just held its value. Relative to Arg pesos, and relative to USD. Do the conversion math in Oil. Or Real Estate. It’ll be pretty close. This isn’t hypothetical at all. 22 years ago wasn’t ancient history. You get the idea. Gold is just a store of value. That’s all. Like a more compact form of storing Oil. |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/2/2023 12:54:57 AM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Why would it be accepted globally post fiat currency fall? Who would govern the price? What would global trade be? What’s your plan to trade it? Do you posses it currently? How do you travel with it? Real questions here. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Still a very weak investment compared to a S&P index fund. It's not an investment. It is protection against the guaranteed failure of fiat (non Tony kind) How? By being accepted as money globally. Fiat has a finite lifespan because every single government has destroyed their currency. It's a lot harder to destroy gold by inflating it. Sure, it gets mined albeit at a slow pace...probably keeps up with population growth, not sure on the exact numbers. It's kinda like Bitcoi , except government can more easily ban bitcoin if it threatens their central banks too much. Why would it be accepted globally post fiat currency fall? Who would govern the price? What would global trade be? What’s your plan to trade it? Do you posses it currently? How do you travel with it? Real questions here. You know everything about oil, but not so much of international travel. Nobody has to govern the price. It floats based on the laws of supply and demand. There are truly wealthy people, all over the world. They will always trade, Money will always move. Gold isn’t the only form of wealth of course. It just happens to be compact, transportable, durable and impossible to counterfeit. |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/2/2023 1:02:56 AM EDT
[#5]
Gold spikes every year just before Christmas.
Add in inflation and devaluation of the dollar and it's not really a big jp in "value" for gold. It'll drop back to 1950/Oz mid January. H |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/2/2023 1:06:52 AM EDT
[#6]
All time high?
It was at $2300 back in 2011, and $2600 in 1980. |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/2/2023 1:11:39 AM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Why is it a weird world? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: SP500 is also at ATH. Weird world we live in. Why is it a weird world? You think the world is not weird right now? |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/2/2023 1:21:17 AM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: All time high? It was at $2300 back in 2011, and $2600 in 1980. No it wasn't, fact check yourself before throwing out numbers. |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/2/2023 1:28:22 AM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted: All time high? It was at $2300 back in 2011, and $2600 in 1980. Kitco's chart shows high in 2011 in September of $1884.20 and the high for gold in 1980 was $677.97. Numbers vary slightly depending on the source. |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/2/2023 1:30:11 AM EDT
[#10]
Gold is also inflationary.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 12/2/2023 1:49:40 AM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted: One step closer to the world making sense again. Next is for the crypto tards to go broke. There's a bunch of them From those to less than 100 bucks and quite a few with millions invested. They should probably listen to a smart guys and not be in.  Attached File |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/2/2023 2:16:58 AM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Does that mean the U.S. dollar is at an all time low? Yes |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/2/2023 2:48:07 AM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Understood, but would it have any value on the back side of a happening like that? Nobody knows. Some think it would, others don't. Its a bet as much as picking teams against the spread is... Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: In that^ sort of environment, gold serves me no purpose, unless folks can be fooled into exchanging shavings for goods and services... ...which would serve them no purpose Gold’s purpose isn’t to shave off a slice to buy a loaf of bread during a crisis. Rather its value is in maintaining some of your wealth to come out on the other side after a crisis like you describe. Understood, but would it have any value on the back side of a happening like that? Nobody knows. Some think it would, others don't. Its a bet as much as picking teams against the spread is... It always has, before, during, and after. |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/2/2023 2:54:38 AM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The failure of fiat currency is literally an end of the world situation. Plan accordingly. 90%+ of fiat throughout history is worthless and the end of the world didn't happen. Yet gold has increased in value all through history. Fiat fails all the time. Every year gold gains 1-5% value through productivity gains relative to the quantity of gold. |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/2/2023 4:03:48 AM EDT
[#15]
Nowhere close to an all-time high
You need to look at inflation adjusted price |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/2/2023 4:19:25 AM EDT
[#16]
Gold can be a hedge against inflation, if you already own it before inflation started to rise.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 12/2/2023 4:22:29 AM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted: thanks Nixon, you ignorant fuck. imagine if a 14 ton gold nugget had been found beneath Australia. It would've screwed up our economy overnight if our currency was tied to the value of a shiny metal. |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/2/2023 4:28:54 AM EDT
[#18]
Quote History^This. And, gold is not an investment. It does not appreciate, and it does not pay dividends. It is insurance. it more or less tracks with inflation over the long term thus far. It is money that sits outside of the banking system. Allocate accordingly. |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/2/2023 4:33:28 AM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted: It's about time. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/340401/1422MOM-C_colors_480x480_jpg-3046385.JPG Lol! |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/2/2023 7:10:29 AM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You know everything about oil, but not so much of international travel. Nobody has to govern the price. It floats based on the laws of supply and demand. There are truly wealthy people, all over the world. They will always trade, Money will always move. Gold isn’t the only form of wealth of course. It just happens to be compact, transportable, durable and impossible to counterfeit. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Still a very weak investment compared to a S&P index fund. It's not an investment. It is protection against the guaranteed failure of fiat (non Tony kind) How? By being accepted as money globally. Fiat has a finite lifespan because every single government has destroyed their currency. It's a lot harder to destroy gold by inflating it. Sure, it gets mined albeit at a slow pace...probably keeps up with population growth, not sure on the exact numbers. It's kinda like Bitcoi , except government can more easily ban bitcoin if it threatens their central banks too much. Why would it be accepted globally post fiat currency fall? Who would govern the price? What would global trade be? What’s your plan to trade it? Do you posses it currently? How do you travel with it? Real questions here. You know everything about oil, but not so much of international travel. Nobody has to govern the price. It floats based on the laws of supply and demand. There are truly wealthy people, all over the world. They will always trade, Money will always move. Gold isn’t the only form of wealth of course. It just happens to be compact, transportable, durable and impossible to counterfeit. What does international travel have to do with this? And, you would also be extremely wrong. (Sorta have a degree in international studies… another in economics…) While durable, I’ll agree with. Impossible to counterfeit, compact, eh. That’s extremely debatable. |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/2/2023 7:22:29 AM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted: As opposed to a metal that serves no tangible purpose other than to make jewelry & high conductivity electrical contacts?... Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: People are starting to understand the lie of fiat currency. POG is on its way to the moon. As opposed to a metal that serves no tangible purpose other than to make jewelry & high conductivity electrical contacts?... Those are both pretty valued purposes. |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/2/2023 7:33:11 AM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted: 90%+ of fiat throughout history is worthless and the end of the world didn't happen. Yet gold has increased in value all through history. Fiat fails all the time. Every year gold gains 1-5% value through productivity gains relative to the quantity of gold. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: The failure of fiat currency is literally an end of the world situation. Plan accordingly. 90%+ of fiat throughout history is worthless and the end of the world didn't happen. Yet gold has increased in value all through history. Fiat fails all the time. Every year gold gains 1-5% value through productivity gains relative to the quantity of gold. So, which percentage had nuclear weapons when they collapsed? When did the world share, mostly, a common fiat currency like today? Do you not think countries would lash out in anger if the reserve banking currency fails? |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/2/2023 7:34:04 AM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You think the world is not weird right now? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: SP500 is also at ATH. Weird world we live in. Why is it a weird world? You think the world is not weird right now? I think the world is what it is. Life is wild. Enjoy the ride. |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/2/2023 7:40:58 AM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryMaybe smart in the short term, but if war ever happens with China and Taiwan, Chinese citizens better accept that their overseas assets will be frozen or seized just like we did with Russia |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/2/2023 7:48:16 AM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted: SP500 is also at ATH. Weird world we live in. Still got about 7% more to go for ATH |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/2/2023 7:51:21 AM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted: And who knows, silver might even hit $30 in the next twenty years.  Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: People are starting to understand the lie of fiat currency. POG is on its way to the moon. I’ll take my chances on the S&P.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 12/2/2023 8:12:24 AM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted: No, the Saudis accept gold for oil now without conversion to dollars. One other OPEC nation does but I can't remember which. Gold has held value for 5000 years and will continue to do so. One could argue that whether a new "dollar" is created or the world converts to quatloos, there will always be a conversion to gold and back once the collapse has completed and recovery is underway. Either way, gold will always have value in the future. So, yeah, I actually *do* know that gold will have value in the future because it both has had in the past and has industrial uses in the present and future as well. Further, getting a sizable quantity to store is a prudent precaution given our current trajectory (where "sizable" is a matter of opinion and unique to individual circumstances). Some of the smarter financial advisors recommend between 5 and 10% of your wealth portfolio be in PMs. (I'm not there yet but am slowly working towards that.) I, too, mentioned having property and other tangible assets to come out the other side of a currency collapse as a valuable idea if you look at my post you quoted. For the foreseeable future, physical gold isn't a terrible investment. It shouldn't be considered an investment *at all*. It should be a risk mitigation that has intrinsic value in and of itself, much like the land we talk about. Some people "invest" in paper gold ETFs and such and if that's your bag, go for it. It's just not something I'm interested in doing. As Gerald Celente says, "If you can't hold it, you don't own it.". He says that because he got screwed out of his gold being held when MF Global went bust. He's been pretty bitter ever since. As for not seeing other currencies collapsing, both the Zimbabwe "dollar", the Venezuelan bolivar, the Turkish lira, and some others have either already collapsed or are in the process of doing same. So, the fact that most other currencies in the world would collapse before ours is irrelevant. The fact is, ours can collapse and its current trajectory is in that direction. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Still a very weak investment compared to a S&P index fund. It's not an investment. It is protection against the guaranteed failure of fiat (non Tony kind) How? By being accepted as money globally. Fiat has a finite lifespan because every single government has destroyed their currency. It's a lot harder to destroy gold by inflating it. Sure, it gets mined albeit at a slow pace...probably keeps up with population growth, not sure on the exact numbers. It's kinda like Bitcoi , except government can more easily ban bitcoin if it threatens their central banks too much. Why would it be accepted globally post fiat currency fall? Who would govern the price? What would global trade be? What’s your plan to trade it? Do you posses it currently? How do you travel with it? Real questions here. Because it's already accepted *now*. Price would be based on the free market value (probably more of a free market than fiat is now since the printing press goes brrrrrrr). Global trade would also be based on free markets. Gold would just be one of the things that would be part of that trading worldwide. I do possess it currently. If I wanted to travel with it, I could since it is a compact storage of value. If our fiat currency dies, all the other fiat currencies will as well. Since gold is a compact storage of value, having a portion of your "wealth" in gold means that you will have a portion of your "wealth" once recovery on the other side of a currency collapse happens. Having property, tools and equipment, guns and ammo, food, water, and other real, tangible items will also be valuable both during and after any currency collapse. One could certainly argue as to when the dollar will ultimately collapse but given the trajectory we are on, it is a certainty. If the trajectory changes dramatically, there is always a chance to stave off disaster. I see no evidence that there is any movement towards changing the trajectory even slightly much less dramatically. It’s accepted now because it’s trade able to a fiat currency. So what you just described is a collapse of the world economic system. Which means there’s no reason to think gold would still be the standard. Let alone what its value is worth going forward. We also have zero clue what, you said “the other side” is - and whether or not gold would be valued at anything. As you would, in the meanwhile, have mass starvation, and a huge population decline in general. My entire point of my questions isn’t to get an answer. It’s to make you think through the process. There is no right answer. You could be correct, gold could be the only thing after some sort of currency collapse. Or, it could be utterly worthless. You don’t know. I don’t know. What I do know, is in the foreseeable future, gold is a terrible investment. And getting any sizable quantity to “store” is fairly foolish. You would be much better off buying land under the current market situations, as they ain’t making more of it. The reality of the global economy right now, other currencies would collapse far before the USD. And we have yet to see that. Velocity of money and all will keep the USD afloat for a while. No, the Saudis accept gold for oil now without conversion to dollars. One other OPEC nation does but I can't remember which. Gold has held value for 5000 years and will continue to do so. One could argue that whether a new "dollar" is created or the world converts to quatloos, there will always be a conversion to gold and back once the collapse has completed and recovery is underway. Either way, gold will always have value in the future. So, yeah, I actually *do* know that gold will have value in the future because it both has had in the past and has industrial uses in the present and future as well. Further, getting a sizable quantity to store is a prudent precaution given our current trajectory (where "sizable" is a matter of opinion and unique to individual circumstances). Some of the smarter financial advisors recommend between 5 and 10% of your wealth portfolio be in PMs. (I'm not there yet but am slowly working towards that.) I, too, mentioned having property and other tangible assets to come out the other side of a currency collapse as a valuable idea if you look at my post you quoted. For the foreseeable future, physical gold isn't a terrible investment. It shouldn't be considered an investment *at all*. It should be a risk mitigation that has intrinsic value in and of itself, much like the land we talk about. Some people "invest" in paper gold ETFs and such and if that's your bag, go for it. It's just not something I'm interested in doing. As Gerald Celente says, "If you can't hold it, you don't own it.". He says that because he got screwed out of his gold being held when MF Global went bust. He's been pretty bitter ever since. As for not seeing other currencies collapsing, both the Zimbabwe "dollar", the Venezuelan bolivar, the Turkish lira, and some others have either already collapsed or are in the process of doing same. So, the fact that most other currencies in the world would collapse before ours is irrelevant. The fact is, ours can collapse and its current trajectory is in that direction. I’m not even going to start reading the rest of your post because you started off with a lie. No one has done gold for oil transactions, as of 2023. The only hint of that, is SA was talking about having the frame work to accept gold. Russia has talked about accepting gold. But, at current markets it would be foolish on both sides to do so. |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/2/2023 8:12:28 AM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You didn’t answer my question. You moved the subject. So I’ll ask again: What’s your plan if fiat currencies crash? Gold is a fiat currency. You can buy paper gold and that same ounce of gold on paper has been sold 100s of times. |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/2/2023 8:13:56 AM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted: $2k today is the 2020 $1k |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/2/2023 8:35:04 AM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Nameless_Hobo Anyone who thinks a brick of gold is going to be valueless doesn't have an opinion worth hearing. The only people I've heard saying metals would be worthless are young gay screen writers and people jealous of others who stocked deep when the price was low |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/2/2023 8:41:07 AM EDT
[#31]
So ARF.com will be buying gold.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 12/2/2023 8:45:21 AM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Every mines cost to produce differs bases on a lot of factors from surface mine op to UG op to Mill, leach, rock type chemicals needed etc.. You might take a look at where these mines are ( another foreign mining company ) They have a small exploration project in nevada and a open pit in nevada and they are averaging about $1200 and oz to produce ( in NV ) not great but not horrible either. Calibres mines in Nicaragua are more than likly carring the company right now. The mine I work for is coasting us about $1400 an oz pre covid it coast $800 an oz. the mine my kid works at is at $1800 an oz and they are talking about closing down until the economy get stronger. Interesting. Thank you! |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/2/2023 9:05:50 AM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Kitco's chart shows high in 2011 in September of $1884.20 and the high for gold in 1980 was $677.97. Numbers vary slightly depending on the source. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: All time high? It was at $2300 back in 2011, and $2600 in 1980. Kitco's chart shows high in 2011 in September of $1884.20 and the high for gold in 1980 was $677.97. Numbers vary slightly depending on the source. In constant dollars $677.97 in 1980 is ~$2,500 in 2023 dollars. $1884.20 in 2011 is ~$2,600 in 2023 dollars. |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/2/2023 9:06:30 AM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted: In the last 10 Years, the Bitcoin (^BTC) Commodity obtained a 67.91% compound annual return, There's lot going in with btc Do a little research. Buy a little now might be good idea. 76% is already being held ...and in the last two years it has a -21% compounded annual return... |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/2/2023 9:09:37 AM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted: BTC is now about 60% of its ATH. I avoid that level of volatility. My post above was about cherry picking data ranges. Pretty much every stock has 40% drawdowns. Pretty much every stock had even worse drawdowns in 2000, 2007-9 or Mar 2020. Volatility is inescapable. |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/2/2023 9:18:55 AM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted: My post above was about cherry picking data ranges. Pretty much every stock has 40% drawdowns. Pretty much every stock had even worse drawdowns in 2000, 2007-9 or Mar 2020. Volatility is inescapable. Volatility can be desirable. Options speculators love volatility. |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/2/2023 9:19:08 AM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted: That's $573,772,360,000 Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: People are starting to understand the lie of fiat currency. POG is on its way to the moon. As opposed to a metal that serves no tangible purpose other than to make jewelry & high conductivity electrical contacts?... As opposed to a fiat currency that may eventually serve no tangible purpose other than to stoke a fire or use as toilet paper?... In that^ sort of environment, gold serves me no purpose, unless folks can be fooled into exchanging shavings for goods and services... ...which would serve them no purpose I know. This is an age old argument that can go on forever. However, it is ironic the USG gold reserves total 8,134 metric tons which is way more than anyone else in the world. Why? 10% skim rule for when the currency collapses? That's $573,772,360,000 Yep. A cool $0.6T. And the gov is printing $2T a year and has $34T in debts and $50T+ in unfunded liabilities. Seems like enough to cover any unforeseen circumstances... |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/2/2023 9:26:19 AM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted: 90%+ of fiat throughout history is worthless and the end of the world didn't happen. Yet gold has increased in value all through history. Fiat fails all the time. Every year gold gains 1-5% value through productivity gains relative to the quantity of gold. No, gold holds its value throughout history. If you own gold while a currency is devaluing, it appears that gold is growing. If gold gained just 2% per year over 2,000 years, an ounce of gold would be about a quadrillion dollars. Compounding gets very interesting in very long timeframes. |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/2/2023 9:30:45 AM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Maybe smart in the short term, but if war ever happens with China and Taiwan, Chinese citizens better accept that their overseas assets will be frozen or seized just like we did with Russia That's why they have houses in Vancouver with safes in the basements. Outside of the seize-able financial system. The trick is to know when to get out of China, too early is suspicious, too late and you are screwed. |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/2/2023 9:32:04 AM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted: In constant dollars $677.97 in 1980 is ~$2,500 in 2023 dollars. $1884.20 in 2011 is ~$2,600 in 2023 dollars. Now do the SP500. Or Nasdaq since April 2000. |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/2/2023 9:44:01 AM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted: thanks Nixon, you ignorant fuck. Pretty much this... |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/2/2023 9:46:24 AM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Gold is a fiat currency. You can buy paper gold and that same ounce of gold on paper has been sold 100s of times. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: You didn’t answer my question. You moved the subject. So I’ll ask again: What’s your plan if fiat currencies crash? Gold is a fiat currency. You can buy paper gold and that same ounce of gold on paper has been sold 100s of times. No, gold is gold. GLD is a fiat gold proxy, as are gold future contracts. PHYS is semi-fiat, if things get bad, it is theoretically backed 100% by physical gold and you are theoretically and legally allowed to ask for a redemption in actual gold, but with a 40% haircut. This of course, has not been tested and the current Canadian commie administration and legal system has been ... less than trustworthy. And yes, many gold derivatives have been re-hypothicated. Which means that they have been (usually illegally) promised as collateral many times over so that their value has been diluted to being almost worthless. If the SEC or CFTC actually paid the least bit of attention, they might do something about it. Most currency crises last a year or two. The goal is to come out the other side with at least some of your wealth intact. Gold (and silver for day to day transactions) does this. I am not a fan of Ray Dalio, but he summed it up as "Gold is insurance against government central banks". As a billionaire, he has 10% allocated to physical gold (not derivatives). |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/2/2023 9:50:47 AM EDT
[#43]
Watch what happens to gold prices when Elon tows an asteroid full of it back to earth.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 12/2/2023 9:55:50 AM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Now do the SP500. Or Nasdaq since April 2000. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: In constant dollars $677.97 in 1980 is ~$2,500 in 2023 dollars. $1884.20 in 2011 is ~$2,600 in 2023 dollars. Now do the SP500. Or Nasdaq since April 2000. S&P500 chart (inflation adjusted)  NASDAQ 100 chart (inflation adjusted)  Gold chart (inflation adjusted) 
|
|
|
|
Posted: 12/2/2023 9:56:42 AM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Pretty much this... Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: thanks Nixon, you ignorant fuck. Pretty much this... Nixon was caught between a rock and a hard place. The Great Society spending meant deficits as far as the eye can see and countries were asking for debt settlement in gold. We would have no gold reserves if he didn't, there wold have been riots if he cut "entitlements" (which he couldn't anyway without Congress, which wouldn't support it). |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/2/2023 9:56:57 AM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I know. This is an age old argument that can go on forever. However, it is ironic the USG gold reserves total 8,134 metric tons which is way more than anyone else in the world. Why? 10% skim rule for when the currency collapses? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: People are starting to understand the lie of fiat currency. POG is on its way to the moon. As opposed to a metal that serves no tangible purpose other than to make jewelry & high conductivity electrical contacts?... As opposed to a fiat currency that may eventually serve no tangible purpose other than to stoke a fire or use as toilet paper?... In that^ sort of environment, gold serves me no purpose, unless folks can be fooled into exchanging shavings for goods and services... ...which would serve them no purpose I know. This is an age old argument that can go on forever. However, it is ironic the USG gold reserves total 8,134 metric tons which is way more than anyone else in the world. Why? 10% skim rule for when the currency collapses? Don't tell Joe and his democrat buddies this. They will sell it off to our adversaries at pennies on the dollar....and buy the replacements back at today's high. 
|
|
|
|
Posted: 12/2/2023 10:01:46 AM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Watch what happens to gold prices when Elon tows an asteroid full of it back to earth. Thats a real threat. Ditto for Nickel prices if he brought in a iron-nickel rock. Speaking of Nickel, the mines sitting over the world's 4th largest reserve of the stuff, New Caledonia (a French territory), are imploding and expected to cease production in January if they don't get a 1.5 billion euro bailout from France or the EU. From what I've read, that's probably going to have the same affect as the Russian sanctions we saw last year in anything that uses Nickel. Buckle up. |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/2/2023 10:05:53 AM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted: BTC is now about 60% of its ATH. I avoid that level of volatility. Wish it was 6% of its ATH so I could buy even more on the cheap. |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/2/2023 10:07:43 AM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted: S&P500 chart (inflation adjusted) https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/128807/IMG_0294-3046874.jpg NASDAQ 100 chart (inflation adjusted) https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/128807/IMG_0295-3046875.jpg Gold chart (inflation adjusted) https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/128807/IMG_0296-3046878.jpg Yep. So about 10 years from the 2000 peak to break even for the SP500 and 18 years for the Nasdaq. And the real return from the 2000 peak is of about 2.5% per year. So, the question is, are we at a valuation peak now? We are certainly in the top 5% of valuations over time, down from top 98% a few months ago, so probably yes (hint: NVDA was trading a few weeks ago at a PE of 100 and P/S of 30...). |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/2/2023 10:08:44 AM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Come on, $50/oz for silver. This is what I’m waiting for. Silver is actually affordable to the middle class. Gold is for boomers and doomers. |
|
|
Win a FREE Membership!
Sign up for the ARFCOM weekly newsletter and be entered to win a free ARFCOM membership. One new winner* is announced every week!
You will receive an email every Friday morning featuring the latest chatter from the hottest topics, breaking news surrounding legislation, as well as exclusive deals only available to ARFCOM email subscribers.
AR15.COM is the world's largest firearm community and is a gathering place for firearm enthusiasts of all types.
From hunters and military members, to competition shooters and general firearm enthusiasts, we welcome anyone who values and respects the way of the firearm.
Subscribe to our monthly Newsletter to receive firearm news, product discounts from your favorite Industry Partners, and more.
Copyright © 1996-2024 AR15.COM LLC. All Rights Reserved.
Any use of this content without express written consent is prohibited.
AR15.Com reserves the right to overwrite or replace any affiliate, commercial, or monetizable links, posted by users, with our own.
