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Posted: 12/9/2022 12:01:28 AM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I believe fl has some genes and black ones ? Documented like a dead cat? Can't find . Sure seems like I heard something before. Snip. Internet... Again, only four species are classified Panthera (leopard, jaguar, lions and tigers). When we hear folks talking about seeing panthers in the United States, we know they’re really talking about mountain lions. No, we haven’t found a black mountain lion in North America. But, according to zoologist and science writer Dr. Karl Shuker, the Yana Puma (Black Puma) exists in neighboring South and Central America historical records. There you have it! locally, we call them painters, which is a slur on panther. if you hear some real florida boys talking about a painter they saw, it's a big cat sighting, not some vatos from the home depot parking lot.  if the cats aren't moving, the tawny ones blend right in with the grass, and palmetto waste and you'll never see them. the movement is what makes them noticeable. a black one (probably not an actual, solid black one, just a hyper-melanistic version) is a lot easier to spot, just because a solid black mass draws your attention. i have a solid black doberman. if you get her in the sun, you can see she has the markings of a normal doberman, but the rust colors on her are melanistic. while she is a "black doberman" she isn't truly black. (if that makes sense) |
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Posted: 12/9/2022 12:02:29 AM EDT
[#2]
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Posted: 12/9/2022 12:08:39 AM EDT
[#3]
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Posted: 12/9/2022 12:11:56 AM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Negative. The gene that would allow that black fur coloration has never once been found in any DNA sampling Nor has a Puma ever been captured anywhere in North America dead or alive with that coloration. There is simply no valid basis by any stretch that someone claims to have encountered a "black (puma) panther". Quote HistoryQuoted: Negative. The gene that would allow that black fur coloration has never once been found in any DNA sampling Nor has a Puma ever been captured anywhere in North America dead or alive with that coloration. There is simply no valid basis by any stretch that someone claims to have encountered a "black (puma) panther". if you were walking through the glades and saw a large, black cat 100 feet away, could you positively identify it as a florida panther, or as a jaguar/panther? my answer to you, as the viewer, would be unequivocally no. i don't believe an asian/indian/south american black cat lives in south florida. i believe a melanistic/aberrant colored florida panther does. What Causes Melanism? Hein van Grouw, in the study called “The dark side of birds: melanism – fact and fiction,” stated that melanism is associated with the mutation of a gene that encodes the MC1R protein, the melanocortin one receptor, which is responsible for melanin pigmentation regulation. However, other studies show that other factors besides genetic mutation may cause melanism. Melanism is also related to the process of adaptation. This type of melanism is called adaptive, and it’s heritable, with a dominant allele responsible for the amount of melanin. There’s also industrial melanism – a phenomenon that “forces” animals, insects, and birds to change their color as a consequence of pollution. Melanism is very common in 11 felid species. Did you know that the black panther is, in fact, a melanistic leopard? The jaguarundi population has many melanistic individuals, too, but they aren’t completely black; they are either dark brown and gray or light reddish. text above bolded by me. |
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Posted: 12/9/2022 12:13:33 AM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted: if you were walking through the glades and saw a large, black cat 100 feet away, could you positively identify it as a florida panther, or as a jaguar/panther? my answer to you, as the viewer, would be unequivocally no. i don't believe an asian/indian/south american black cat lives in south florida. i believe a melanistic/aberrant colored florida panther does. text above bolded by me. How many game cameras are in Florida? |
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Posted: 12/9/2022 12:29:41 AM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryConsidering the witnesses reported it had spots it was probably another escaped or released pet Jaguar or leopard like the one killed over in Joplin in 08. https://www.joplinglobe.com/news/local_news/black-cat-killed-near-neosho-last-month-was-a-leopard/article_053a60a3-506d-5b3f-90f3-9943b4ace8f7.html |
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Posted: 12/9/2022 12:31:46 AM EDT
[#7]
I couldn't tell you which big cat it was, but I saw one while hunting coyotes, SE AZ.
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Posted: 12/9/2022 12:32:02 AM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: @countyworker You got a pic right ? Now that would be one for the books. The title should have read Jaguar instead of Mountain Lion. The two are shaped very differently. A black Cougar would be a beautiful animal. Cougars are the largest of the small cat family, so they have the long legs, long tails and long bodies, rather than the stocky blockheaded bodies of the big cat family, like a Jaguar. A 200 pound, 8 foot long black Oregon cougar would be an incredible sight. I have had two sightings of animals that the “experts” say that I shouldn’t have seen. First was a Canadian Lynx. ODFW claims that they do not exist in Oregon, but I sat in my kitchen looking out the windows at one for a half hour one morning. The second was a Pine Marten. The experts say that they do not exist on the Oregon coast, north of the Siuslaw River, yet I had one come right up to my front deck and stare at me while I was sitting in a chair. Quite possibly the most adorable face I’ve ever seen on any animal. I knew nothing about them and didn’t even know what I was looking at. I had know idea how vicious they are and that it was looking at me, because it was trying to figure out if it could kill me and eat me. That little sucker hung around for a few days killing everything in sight. Ferocious little guy.  Attached File |
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Posted: 12/9/2022 7:09:48 AM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted: TPW has said there are no mountain lions in Texas. I beg to differ. "Black Panthers" are just black pigmented cats that are already here. Jaguars are in central Mexico, so it wouldn't be far fetched for the occasional lost one to show up. A game warden was telling me how there were no alligators in the lake we live on, while we were watching one swim by at about 60 yards. A rather large one. Asked him what that was. He just walked off. https://tpwd.texas.gov/huntwild/wild/species/mlion/ The first pdf is titled "Mountain Lions of Texas" and the second is titled "Field Guide to the Mountain Lions of Texas" One of the pdfs has a map of Texas by county where Mountain Lions have been killed or found dead proving that they live there. |
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Posted: 12/9/2022 7:28:24 AM EDT
[#10]
JFC
What is it with legends of big black cats? When I spent time in rural Western Australia, there was a wild rumor of a black panther that lived in the woods outside of town. The town paper offered a reward for any proof, so every night when shooting kangaroos, we’d always be looking out for the big cat to kill for reward money. My friend said he seen it once but I didn’t believe him. |
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Posted: 12/9/2022 7:29:24 AM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted: TPW has said there are no mountain lions in Texas. I beg to differ. "Black Panthers" are just black pigmented cats that are already here. Jaguars are in central Mexico, so it wouldn't be far fetched for the occasional lost one to show up. A game warden was telling me how there were no alligators in the lake we live on, while we were watching one swim by at about 60 yards. A rather large one. Asked him what that was. He just walked off. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: There are no black mountain lions in the U.S. TPW has said there are no mountain lions in Texas. I beg to differ. "Black Panthers" are just black pigmented cats that are already here. Jaguars are in central Mexico, so it wouldn't be far fetched for the occasional lost one to show up. A game warden was telling me how there were no alligators in the lake we live on, while we were watching one swim by at about 60 yards. A rather large one. Asked him what that was. He just walked off. TPWD does not deny the existence of mountain lions in Texas. They do state there has NEVER been a black mountain lion reported in the US.  Attached File Attached File |
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Posted: 12/9/2022 7:31:34 AM EDT
[#12]
Free Huey!
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Posted: 12/9/2022 7:34:29 AM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Texas Parks and Wildlife has a very easy to use website. It has a page on the mountain lion. It talks about Mountain Lions in Texas and has two different links to pdfs about Mountain Lions in Texas. https://tpwd.texas.gov/huntwild/wild/species/mlion/ The first pdf is titled "Mountain Lions of Texas" and the second is titled "Field Guide to the Mountain Lions of Texas" One of the pdfs has a map of Texas by county where Mountain Lions have been killed or found dead proving that they live there. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: TPW has said there are no mountain lions in Texas. I beg to differ. "Black Panthers" are just black pigmented cats that are already here. Jaguars are in central Mexico, so it wouldn't be far fetched for the occasional lost one to show up. A game warden was telling me how there were no alligators in the lake we live on, while we were watching one swim by at about 60 yards. A rather large one. Asked him what that was. He just walked off. https://tpwd.texas.gov/huntwild/wild/species/mlion/ The first pdf is titled "Mountain Lions of Texas" and the second is titled "Field Guide to the Mountain Lions of Texas" One of the pdfs has a map of Texas by county where Mountain Lions have been killed or found dead proving that they live there. Yes, There are plenty of mountain lions in Texas. I’ve seen 6 personally in South Texas and killed 1. |
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Posted: 12/9/2022 7:56:55 AM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted: https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/387898/F3F5389B-53DF-455A-9C5E-396A93512A2C_jpe-2628737.JPG Back in his younger days he physically was like a pit bull version of a cat. I had a Sofa Pantheris as well. That is a 50lb heeler in the pic with him. Rudy Ray Moore was a badass cat.  Attached File |
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Posted: 12/9/2022 8:19:55 AM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted: There is a black mountain lion mounted in the lunchroom of a high school in Wyoming, right, @guns762?   Yes there is.
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Posted: 12/9/2022 8:23:00 AM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Okay, show me a reputable jaguar sighting, say generously, north of the Gila. Arizona jags are a long ways from Flagstaff.  WATCH: Video shows only known US jaguar roaming Arizona mountains |
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Posted: 12/9/2022 8:27:43 AM EDT
[#17]
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Posted: 12/9/2022 8:28:31 AM EDT
[#18]
There is at least one black lynx in Canada.
 Paint It Black: First Record of Melanism in Canada Lynx |
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Posted: 12/9/2022 8:56:54 AM EDT
[#19]
Maybe not lion size, but puma size, yes.
In the mid 90's, I personally saw a black cat 30-50lb range at driving after midnight in the sticks of west TN. Big head, thick body and the tail was crazy big and as long or longer than the body. I can still see it in my memories, clear as a bell. I started hunting with a 357mag on my hip for archery or gun season. I am not walking into the woods at AM dark thirty without a side arm. No drinking or drugs involved. I was driving for an auto-body parts overnight delivery service. Recently in my county, Fayette county TN, several lions have been spotted. I have my doubts on the size, but i believe they saw a big (bigger) cat. Maybe a tan puma type cat. I would not be surprised if there were lions here. |
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Posted: 12/9/2022 10:03:00 AM EDT
[#20]
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Posted: 12/9/2022 10:06:46 AM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I had a Sofa Pantheris as well. That is a 50lb heeler in the pic with him. Rudy Ray Moore was a badass cat.https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/141911/3F2025C7-E22B-4017-92B7-0080FFB792DC_jpe-2629018.JPG That is a damn impressive beast and no doubt has the potential to start some tall tales. |
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Posted: 12/9/2022 10:13:34 AM EDT
[#22]
Yes. I saw one.
I grew up in the country. When I was a kid we were on a section line driving into town and maybe 50 yards up the road one came out of the brush to walk across the road with a cub behind her. I remember my mom telling me to remember this because people say they don’t exist. It was definitely a bigass cat. |
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Posted: 12/9/2022 10:14:33 AM EDT
[#23]
Most border states have seen jaguars, so yes. This is actually normal for the areas.
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Posted: 12/9/2022 10:16:25 AM EDT
[#24]
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Posted: 12/9/2022 10:18:34 AM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Florida Panther. I feel like I remember someone seeing a black one when I was a kid. |
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Posted: 12/9/2022 10:19:51 AM EDT
[#26]
Yup we ha e them in OK.
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Posted: 12/9/2022 10:29:51 AM EDT
[#27]
Black panthers, extra points if they have green eyes, are as common as people hearing mountian lions screaming at night.
I have a neighbor lady down the road that swears hearing them screaming at night, of course followed by classic description it sounded like a woman screaming. I told her it propably was a woman screaming. Probably from the meth billies living further down the road. |
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Posted: 12/9/2022 10:31:10 AM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Melanistic phased jaguars down by the border states maybe but far and few in between. This. A big jaguar is the size of a small mountain lion. |
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Posted: 12/9/2022 10:31:59 AM EDT
[#29]
Guy I went to school with always talked about going to South American to track cats down there with his dad.
He has his own tracking biz now and always talked about them in Fl. Ill see if I can get in touch with him. Back in 2012 there was a kid that got attacked down here in Big Bend National Park by a mountain lion, I have been in Alpine for over 25 years now and have yet to see one but they are out here. 
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Posted: 12/9/2022 10:35:44 AM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Yes. And I know where to find one reliably. But let me guess, you dont have any pictures? |
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Posted: 12/9/2022 10:37:51 AM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This. A big jaguar is the size of a small mountain lion. Jaguars are the largest cats in the Americas. Obviously you can have outliers but generally speaking they are bigger than Mountain lions on a whole. Having seen both in zoos I have to say my impression is that a Jaguar is a big slab of muscle and the Mountain lion is a little more svelte. |
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Posted: 12/9/2022 10:38:26 AM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This. A big jaguar is the size of a small mountain lion. Wut? Jaguars are the third largest of the Big Cat species. |
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Posted: 12/9/2022 10:39:35 AM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted:  TxPW hasn't denied there are mountain lion s in Texas. They have a hot line set up to report sitings and/or kills. "MOUNTAINS LIONS Mountain lions are classified as nongame animals; they are not protected and can be harvested at any time. Please report mountain lion sightings, harvests or mortalities to (512) 389-4505." Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: TPW has said there are no mountain lions in Texas. I beg to differ. "Black Panthers" are just black pigmented cats that are already here. Jaguars are in central Mexico, so it wouldn't be far fetched for the occasional lost one to show up. A game warden was telling me how there were no alligators in the lake we live on, while we were watching one swim by at about 60 yards. A rather large one. Asked him what that was. He just walked off. TxPW hasn't denied there are mountain lion s in Texas. They have a hot line set up to report sitings and/or kills. "MOUNTAINS LIONS Mountain lions are classified as nongame animals; they are not protected and can be harvested at any time. Please report mountain lion sightings, harvests or mortalities to (512) 389-4505." Texas has a lot of mountain lions in Brewster, presidio, ft Davis counties |
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Posted: 12/9/2022 10:42:18 AM EDT
[#34]
 Black Panther Stalking Big Buck |
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Posted: 12/9/2022 10:43:15 AM EDT
[#35]
Meet Luna the black panther and her hot Russian chick owner.
https://www.youtube.com/@Lunathepantera/videos 
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Posted: 12/9/2022 10:52:00 AM EDT
[#36]
In Texas at least, they are not black panthers, but more than likely Jagarundis. Especially sightings in the middle of the day.
Link |
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Posted: 12/9/2022 11:00:02 AM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted: In Texas at least, they are not black panthers, but more than likely Jagarundis. Especially sightings in the middle of the day. Link Jaguarundis are small cats. They are also very, very rare and the piece of Texas they did inhabit recently is small. There is simply no way the number of black panther sightings could be explained as Jaguarundis. It's much more likely that mistaken identity with other animals, being completely full of shit, or a mixture of both are the culprits. |
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Posted: 12/9/2022 11:07:02 AM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I never saw one. However there are two Albino Squirrels that hang around my work place. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/50096/20221130_154434_jpg-2628736.JPG https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/50096/20221130_154442_jpg-2628739.JPG are they married? |
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Posted: 12/9/2022 11:09:22 AM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted: All the same and yes, sighted in AR |
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Posted: 12/9/2022 11:11:09 AM EDT
[#40]
Yes. They are all over Texas. Mom has a couple and nephew in Alabama breeds & trains them for hunting.
 Seriously, though, melanistic jaguars probably do exist outside of captivity in S AZ, NM, & Florida (they have all the non-native species people threw out like trash) |
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Posted: 12/9/2022 11:15:23 AM EDT
[#41]
The first time I saw the black jaguar at the Field Museum it blew my mind how they still had spots under the black. Their coats are gorgeous. You get an idea by the image on page 1.
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Posted: 12/9/2022 11:16:20 AM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted: THIS I've seen several black panthers in Florida, southern Georgia and Alabama going back to 1980. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Florida Panther. I feel like I remember someone seeing a black one when I was a kid. THIS I've seen several black panthers in Florida, southern Georgia and Alabama going back to 1980. Shoot, I can go down to southeast Raleigh and find some black panthers in a matter of minutes. Oh wait, wrong BP, sorry, carry on.
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Posted: 12/9/2022 11:21:33 AM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Cool. You should start telling newcomers the Legend of the Killer Ghost Squirrells seeking revenge or something. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I never saw one. However there are two Albino Squirrels that hang around my work place. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/50096/20221130_154434_jpg-2628736.JPG https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/50096/20221130_154442_jpg-2628739.JPG Cool. You should start telling newcomers the Legend of the Killer Ghost Squirrells seeking revenge or something. More like racist white power squirrels that have clearly appropriated the indigenous squirrels territory. |
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Posted: 12/9/2022 11:34:39 AM EDT
[#44]
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Posted: 12/9/2022 11:36:09 AM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryThat’s a Husky |
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Posted: 12/9/2022 11:55:40 AM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted: THIS I've seen several black panthers in Florida, southern Georgia and Alabama going back to 1980. I saw one in the SC lowcountry around 2000. |
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Posted: 12/9/2022 12:15:07 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Wait, Kansas isn’t supposed to have bears? I thought bears were in every continental state. Supposedly there aren't any in Ohio. But I have seen some suspiciously large raccoon scat. |
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Posted: 12/9/2022 12:21:29 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Im sure they are spotted much less often. Jaguars are usually spotted. Panthers not so much. |
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Posted: 12/9/2022 12:23:00 PM EDT
[#49]
Look up the Florida Panther
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Posted: 12/9/2022 12:25:45 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Jaguars are usually spotted. Panthers not so much. And I have it on good authority that a leopard can't change it's spots. |
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