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Posted: 6/27/2024 1:00:01 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted: An unbiased person will conclude the shoot was justified. 
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Posted: 6/27/2024 1:40:42 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted: An unbiased person will conclude the shoot was justified. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: And what does that have to do with the bad shoot we are talking about? We call good and bad shoots as we see them. You're changing the subject entirely. An unbiased person will conclude the shoot was justified. You have biased, active LE on this board saying it was a bad shoot. Pretty sure you're just stirring the pot. |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 1:58:38 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I would've complied in this situation and made complaints/brought civil suit later. However, I also wouldn't have had an illegal pipe and I very rarely (like mistakenly once in 25 years) run a stop sign. Still, this is a bad shoot, IMHO. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted:  He was already running away with his empty hands in the air when he shot him. Part of the video is off-screen, and the subject is turned toward officer as subject comes up. I give the officer the benefit of the doubt and call it a justified shoot. And for those that suggest not complying unless the order is”lawful,” you really should make that case in a court of law, not at zero dark thirty on the side of the road. There are steps you can take to avoid getting shot… I would've complied in this situation and made complaints/brought civil suit later. However, I also wouldn't have had an illegal pipe and I very rarely (like mistakenly once in 25 years) run a stop sign. Still, this is a bad shoot, IMHO. Yep, agreed. Like it or not......you are going to end up doing what the cop tells you...or end up tazed or shot. Might as well comply, makes it easier on yourself. Take it up with the courts if you have a problem with the officer. If you think struggling with an office is going to ever help out your situation....you are insane (or as this instance shows, smoked up on crack). I don't know why this is such a foreign idea to some people.  I guess when you are drunk, or all drugged up....you aren't thinking that straight. |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 2:19:05 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You have biased, active LE on this board saying it was a bad shoot. Pretty sure you're just stirring the pot. We can disagree on this. It’s obviously a tragic event, but it could have been avoided… |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 2:21:04 PM EDT
[#5]
[Deleted]
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Posted: 6/27/2024 2:35:28 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted: How about you answer the question you conveniently ignored. Are you active law enforcement? Are are you as I suspect, a simping badge bunny?  Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: We can disagree on this. It’s obviously a tragic event, but it could have been avoided… How about you answer the question you conveniently ignored. Are you active law enforcement? Are are you as I suspect, a simping badge bunny? They had the guy's car. He was not a danger to anybody from how I saw it. Just report somebody on foot abandoned their vehicle. Why make a huge deal out of it? |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 2:46:34 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted: They had the guy's car. He was not a danger to anybody from how I saw it. Just report somebody on foot abandoned their vehicle. Why make a huge deal out of it? Que? I'm gonna guess you're talking to the Badge Bunny. I'm in the "That was a roadside execution for contempt of cop" camp. |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 2:50:44 PM EDT
[#8]
Everything up to the draw could be justified.
- Legit traffic stop - Cop sees something suspicious - driver shoving something down his pants. Perhaps by his training and experience in the past he reasons its a person hiding a gun. - Cop appears to be suspicious, has his hand by his holster. - orders driver out of the car. Driver reaches for his waistband. - Does a check for officer safety and and feels something he suspect to be a gun. - cop attempts to handcuff, driver is resisting. - cop does a takedown - cop draws gun Up to this point everything is justified. Since we can't see what happened off camera, we can only speculate. Maybe he saw the driver reach for the waistband or thought he saw a gun being pointed at him in the dark. He shot then saw the guys hands were empty and stopped shooting. Watching the video I can say the shot was wrong and the cop should've waited till clearly seeing a threat. However I can understand the circumstances and mindset the cop was in the heat of the moment, in the dark, and alone. |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 2:56:07 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Everything up to the draw could be justified. - Legit traffic stop - Cop sees something suspicious - driver shoving something down his pants. Perhaps by his training and experience in the past he reasons its a person hiding a gun. - Cop appears to be suspicious, has his hand by his holster. - orders driver out of the car. Driver reaches for his waistband. - Does a check for officer safety and and feels something he suspect to be a gun. - cop attempts to handcuff, driver is resisting. - cop does a takedown - cop draws gun Up to this point everything is justified. Since we can't see what happened off camera, we can only speculate. Maybe he saw the driver reach for the waistband or thought he saw a gun being pointed at him in the dark. He shot then saw the guys hands were empty and stopped shooting. Watching the video I can say the shot was wrong and the cop should've waited till clearly seeing a threat. However I can understand the circumstances and mindset the cop was in the heat of the moment, in the dark, and alone. Doesn't matter what we can or can't see. Dark-hearted cop commits MUUUURDER!!  |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 3:16:18 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Doesn't matter what we can or can't see. Dark-hearted cop commits MUUUURDER!! All LEOs have dark hearts, and wake up every morning, naked with their duty belts on, and rise out of bed, drop to their knees, praying to the Almighty that somehow, somewhere, they will GET IT ON! 
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Posted: 6/27/2024 3:31:52 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Que? I'm gonna guess you're talking to the Badge Bunny. I'm in the "That was a roadside execution for contempt of cop" camp. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: They had the guy's car. He was not a danger to anybody from how I saw it. Just report somebody on foot abandoned their vehicle. Why make a huge deal out of it? Que? I'm gonna guess you're talking to the Badge Bunny. I'm in the "That was a roadside execution for contempt of cop" camp. Sorry, I thought I was responding to the question of how it could have been avoided. Not shooting would be at the top of the list, and have the car towed and let other police know a man is on foot in the area if there's problems or if car comes up stolen, etc. Being out of shape and unable to chase somebody is not a reason to shoot them instead. |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 4:22:37 PM EDT
[#12]
out of shape
overreaction unable to follow protocol hand in pants sexual abuser trigger happy BUT THAT KNEELING, SINGLE SHOT THROUGH THE HEART OF A RUNNING PERP 
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Posted: 6/27/2024 4:35:04 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted: out of shape overreaction unable to follow protocol hand in pants sexual abuser trigger happy BUT THAT KNEELING, SINGLE SHOT THROUGH THE HEART OF A RUNNING PERP My guess is the cop didn't mean to shoot him, but he's practiced that draw and shoot with a timer a thousand times before. Adrenaline got pumpin and muscle memory kicked in. |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 6:02:05 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted: My guess is the cop didn't mean to shoot him, but he's practiced that draw and shoot with a timer a thousand times before. Adrenaline got pumpin and muscle memory kicked in. If I were to hazard a guess he drew the handgun to bluff the guy into not running away but after being on the losing end of the tussle he put a bit too much pressure on the trigger and scored a 1 in a million hit aka no skill all (bad) luck |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 7:06:34 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted: My guess is the cop didn't mean to shoot him, but he's practiced that draw and shoot with a timer a thousand times before. Adrenaline got pumpin and muscle memory kicked in. It looked purposeful. Cop assumed driver had a gun in the waistband. Driver was spun to the ground and reaching down to get up and initialing moving towards the cop may have looked like an aggressive move reaching for the waistband and pointing a gun. The driver was shot as his hands were shown to be empty, but cops didn't see that due to reaction time. |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 8:43:46 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I personally don't care if he was drinking. He didn't harm anyone. What's interesting is the cop gave zero indication he noticed the man was intoxicated. Seems odd he wouldn't make a single comment or ask any related question if he thought it was a DUI situation doesn't it? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: I would've complied in this situation and made complaints/brought civil suit later. However, I also wouldn't have had an illegal pipe and I very rarely (like mistakenly once in 25 years) run a stop sign. Still, this is a bad shoot, IMHO. So, you're on the side the road, by yourself, at zero dark thirty, having just removed from a vehicle a resistive subject whom you just witnessed furtively place an object in his waistband. You proceed to do a lawful Terry pat-down based on RAS, and you feel what you believe to be a concealable handgun (ie, specifically a derringer). You command subject to place his hands behind his back for lawful, investigative detention. The subject resists and you do a take-down. The subject gets up concurrently with you, but you're only on your knees. The subject turns towards you, with his hands moving close to his waistband. What is the reasonable course of action for a peace officer given the totality of the circumstances? If I even stopped him in the first place, why would I pull him out of the car for a traffic infraction? Concealed weapons are lawful, and everyone should be armed. I also don't care if you have a pipe. Smoke whatever you want man. I'm also not a sorry fat piece of shit who can't get off his knees. And what I wouldn't have done is shoot him when his hands are in the air empty and he's running away. He probably smelled like a distillery. I personally don't care if he was drinking. He didn't harm anyone. What's interesting is the cop gave zero indication he noticed the man was intoxicated. Seems odd he wouldn't make a single comment or ask any related question if he thought it was a DUI situation doesn't it? You would only care if he plowed into someone? DUI is only an issue after someone is hurt? |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 8:48:13 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Your chance of being killed by LE in any given year is about 0.00018%, less if you're white. And hardly measurable if you're a reasonable adult not engaged in criminal activity and not under the influence of etoh or drugs. This is really a non-issue. But those that harbor anti-LE sentiment will go to great lengths to further affirm their confirmation-bias. |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 8:50:50 PM EDT
[#18]
[Deleted]
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Posted: 6/27/2024 9:06:54 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You would only care if he plowed into someone? DUI is only an issue after someone is hurt? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: I would've complied in this situation and made complaints/brought civil suit later. However, I also wouldn't have had an illegal pipe and I very rarely (like mistakenly once in 25 years) run a stop sign. Still, this is a bad shoot, IMHO. So, you're on the side the road, by yourself, at zero dark thirty, having just removed from a vehicle a resistive subject whom you just witnessed furtively place an object in his waistband. You proceed to do a lawful Terry pat-down based on RAS, and you feel what you believe to be a concealable handgun (ie, specifically a derringer). You command subject to place his hands behind his back for lawful, investigative detention. The subject resists and you do a take-down. The subject gets up concurrently with you, but you're only on your knees. The subject turns towards you, with his hands moving close to his waistband. What is the reasonable course of action for a peace officer given the totality of the circumstances? If I even stopped him in the first place, why would I pull him out of the car for a traffic infraction? Concealed weapons are lawful, and everyone should be armed. I also don't care if you have a pipe. Smoke whatever you want man. I'm also not a sorry fat piece of shit who can't get off his knees. And what I wouldn't have done is shoot him when his hands are in the air empty and he's running away. He probably smelled like a distillery. I personally don't care if he was drinking. He didn't harm anyone. What's interesting is the cop gave zero indication he noticed the man was intoxicated. Seems odd he wouldn't make a single comment or ask any related question if he thought it was a DUI situation doesn't it? You would only care if he plowed into someone? DUI is only an issue after someone is hurt? I walk around with a loaded gun. I could kill any random person I walk by at any time. Am I guilty of murder? I don't disagree that it's a bad idea to drive drunk, but I am very leery of "pre-crime" type situations. |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 9:13:24 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted: What's your other screen name? You know your regular account?  Attached File Attached File |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 9:51:33 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted: If I even stopped him in the first place, why would I pull him out of the car for a traffic infraction? Because some departments apparently teach that PA v Mimms says you can pull anybody out of a car whenever you want to search the car. Click To View Spoiler Other possibilities previously mentioned: 1. "Furtive movement" 2. "I smell alcohol" |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 10:34:34 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I walk around with a loaded gun. I could kill any random person I walk by at any time. Am I guilty of murder? I don't disagree that it's a bad idea to drive drunk, but I am very leery of "pre-crime" type situations. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: I would've complied in this situation and made complaints/brought civil suit later. However, I also wouldn't have had an illegal pipe and I very rarely (like mistakenly once in 25 years) run a stop sign. Still, this is a bad shoot, IMHO. So, you're on the side the road, by yourself, at zero dark thirty, having just removed from a vehicle a resistive subject whom you just witnessed furtively place an object in his waistband. You proceed to do a lawful Terry pat-down based on RAS, and you feel what you believe to be a concealable handgun (ie, specifically a derringer). You command subject to place his hands behind his back for lawful, investigative detention. The subject resists and you do a take-down. The subject gets up concurrently with you, but you're only on your knees. The subject turns towards you, with his hands moving close to his waistband. What is the reasonable course of action for a peace officer given the totality of the circumstances? If I even stopped him in the first place, why would I pull him out of the car for a traffic infraction? Concealed weapons are lawful, and everyone should be armed. I also don't care if you have a pipe. Smoke whatever you want man. I'm also not a sorry fat piece of shit who can't get off his knees. And what I wouldn't have done is shoot him when his hands are in the air empty and he's running away. He probably smelled like a distillery. I personally don't care if he was drinking. He didn't harm anyone. What's interesting is the cop gave zero indication he noticed the man was intoxicated. Seems odd he wouldn't make a single comment or ask any related question if he thought it was a DUI situation doesn't it? You would only care if he plowed into someone? DUI is only an issue after someone is hurt? I walk around with a loaded gun. I could kill any random person I walk by at any time. Am I guilty of murder? I don't disagree that it's a bad idea to drive drunk, but I am very leery of "pre-crime" type situations. The fact that the guy was 2x the legal limit lends credence to the cops statement that the guy ran the stop sign. That makes him a danger. I'm ok with what the cop did right up until he shot the guy. |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 10:35:18 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: What's your other screen name? You know your regular account? /media/mediaFiles/sharedAlbum/raw-355-1044.gif/media/mediaFiles/sharedAlbum/Triggered-143.gif |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 10:42:47 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Oh no, you say things I don't like!!! How dare you!!! My feelings are hurt!!! Only a troll can do that!!! Once again......... Attached File |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 10:48:16 PM EDT
[#25]
What's weird is that the dude ran 40 yards with his heart blowed the fuck up.
In through the left armpit. Transected his heart and both lungs. Exited at the third rib. ... The human animal is impressively tough. |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 10:55:15 PM EDT
[#26]
Really time to start disbanding police departments.
' If I'm going to get shot, roughed-up, beaten, held against my will; I may as well fight a street horde (illegal gang) rather than the police (legal gang). |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 11:08:36 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Really time to start disbanding police departments. 'Much muh thin blue line is stopping anarchy". If I'm going to get shot, roughed-up, beaten, held against my will; I may as well fight a street horde (illegal gang) rather than the police (legal gang).  Attached File |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 11:31:42 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I walk around with a loaded gun. I could kill any random person I walk by at any time. Am I guilty of murder? I don't disagree that it's a bad idea to drive drunk, but I am very leery of "pre-crime" type situations. Driving while drunk is not pre-crime - it is criminal. |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 11:42:29 PM EDT
[#29]
How come I only see threads showing the worst side of cops? Where are all the videos of the good deeds? Only bad cop vids get clicks?
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Posted: 6/27/2024 11:43:14 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Because some departments apparently teach that PA v Mimms says you can pull anybody out of a car whenever you want to search the car. Click To View Spoiler Other possibilities previously mentioned: 1. "Furtive movement" 2. "I smell alcohol" The officer correctly applied PA v Mimms in this case. Officer observed open etoh container in vehicle, a crime in TX. |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 11:46:06 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted: How come I only see threads showing the worst side of cops? Where are all the videos of the good deeds? Only bad cop vids get clicks? ARFCOM seems to lean anti-LE, or maybe the anti-LE posters are more active.
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Posted: 6/27/2024 11:48:51 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted: How come I only see threads showing the worst side of cops? Where are all the videos of the good deeds? Only bad cop vids get clicks? That's how all of American society functions and has for ages - people are fascinated by the bad stuff, and that's what grabs headlines and attention. It's like people rubber necking a bad car accident on the highway. It's just morbid fascination. From what I watched in that video, this particular officer had no business wearing a badge, period. But unlike him (and the cop in the other thread who tried to steal $900), I still believe that most cops are decent and honorable people. If that makes me "naive," so be it. |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 11:49:36 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: ARFCOM seems to lean anti-LE, or maybe the anti-LE posters are more active. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: How come I only see threads showing the worst side of cops? Where are all the videos of the good deeds? Only bad cop vids get clicks? ARFCOM seems to lean anti-LE, or maybe the anti-LE posters are more active. To the contrary I think most of the membership here is pro LE, but the ones who aren't are very vocal. |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 11:58:20 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Driving while drunk is not pre-crime - it is criminal. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I walk around with a loaded gun. I could kill any random person I walk by at any time. Am I guilty of murder? I don't disagree that it's a bad idea to drive drunk, but I am very leery of "pre-crime" type situations. Driving while drunk is not pre-crime - it is criminal. Who does it harm? |
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Posted: 6/28/2024 12:06:35 AM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Everything up to the draw could be justified. - Legit traffic stop - Cop sees something suspicious - driver shoving something down his pants. Perhaps by his training and experience in the past he reasons its a person hiding a gun. - Cop appears to be suspicious, has his hand by his holster. - orders driver out of the car. Driver reaches for his waistband. - Does a check for officer safety and and feels something he suspect to be a gun. - cop attempts to handcuff, driver is resisting. - cop does a takedown - cop draws gun Up to this point everything is justified. Since we can't see what happened off camera, we can only speculate. Maybe he saw the driver reach for the waistband or thought he saw a gun being pointed at him in the dark. He shot then saw the guys hands were empty and stopped shooting. Watching the video I can say the shot was wrong and the cop should've waited till clearly seeing a threat. However I can understand the circumstances and mindset the cop was in the heat of the moment, in the dark, and alone. Cop had already checked his waist band and reached inside his pants. |
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Posted: 6/28/2024 12:07:15 AM EDT
[#36]
[Deleted]
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Posted: 6/28/2024 12:20:14 AM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Who does it harm? It costs our nation every year about $65 billion in medical bills, lost productivity, property damage, and legal costs due to premature death and injuries. Each year, about 13,500 Americans are killed, and millions injured, because of drunk driving. Is that harm enough? |
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Posted: 6/28/2024 12:20:46 AM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted: To the contrary I think most of the membership here is pro LE, but the ones who aren't are very vocal. Could be true. |
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Posted: 6/28/2024 12:25:40 AM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Actually a white guy is more likely to get shot than a black dude per a Harvard U. professor. He did a study on it....the prof is black. Lol I don’t believe that. Read this. |
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Posted: 6/28/2024 12:29:38 AM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted: It costs our nation every year about $65 billion in medical bills, lost productivity, property damage, and legal costs due to premature death and injuries. Each year, about 13,500 Americans are killed, and millions injured, because of drunk driving. Is that harm enough? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Who does it harm? It costs our nation every year about $65 billion in medical bills, lost productivity, property damage, and legal costs due to premature death and injuries. Each year, about 13,500 Americans are killed, and millions injured, because of drunk driving. Is that harm enough? And it's already illegal to drive drunk. Did that stop them? They actually have to harm someone first. You MIGHT harm someone isn't good enough to me. |
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Posted: 6/28/2024 12:33:04 AM EDT
[#41]
Tennessee v. Garner, 471 U.S. 1 (1985)
PRIMARY HOLDING Under the Fourth Amendment of the U.S. Constitution, a police officer may use deadly force to prevent the escape of a fleeing suspect only if the officer has a good-faith belief that the suspect poses a significant threat of death or serious physical injury to the officer or others. FACTS A state police officer shot and killed Garner as he was fleeing the scene of the crime. Despite knowing that Garner was unarmed, the police officer believed that he was justified in shooting him to prevent his escape. Garner's father brought a constitutional challenge to the Tennessee statute that authorized the use of deadly force in this situation. The state prevailed in the trial court, but the state appellate court ruled that the statute was unconstitutional. When a non-violent felon is ordered to stop and submit to police, ignoring that order does not give rise to a reasonable good-faith belief that the use of deadly force is necessary, unless it has been threatened. CASE COMMENTARY This decision responded to the evolution of the common law, which formerly imposed a death sentence for most felonies. Shooting a non-violent fleeing felon historically would have been permitted because it would have been the same result as if he had been caught and convicted. This is no longer the situation, and the Supreme Court adjusted the rule regarding the use of deadly force to account for it. Pretty sure this guy was not a fleeing felon, this was not a "felony hot stop", and the subject never threatened Boss Hogg. |
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Posted: 6/28/2024 12:33:41 AM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted: What's weird is that the dude ran 40 yards with his heart blowed the fuck up. In through the left armpit. Transected his heart and both lungs. Exited at the third rib. ... The human animal is impressively tough. But not tough enough to survive the stupidity of a fat government employee with poor judgment. The cop deserves to hang from a bridge. |
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Posted: 6/28/2024 12:34:34 AM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Unbiased person here: That shoot was bad. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: And what does that have to do with the bad shoot we are talking about? We call good and bad shoots as we see them. You're changing the subject entirely. An unbiased person will conclude the shoot was justified. Unbiased person here: That shoot was bad. |
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Posted: 6/28/2024 12:39:34 AM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted: To the contrary I think most of the membership here is pro LE, but the ones who aren't are very vocal. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: How come I only see threads showing the worst side of cops? Where are all the videos of the good deeds? Only bad cop vids get clicks? ARFCOM seems to lean anti-LE, or maybe the anti-LE posters are more active. To the contrary I think most of the membership here is pro LE, but the ones who aren't are very vocal. A lot of people are “pro LEO” until cops habitually do stupid shit that cost people their lives. When we fuck up at work it’s dollars and man hours; when cops fuck up it’s peoples lives. Remember that Chappell show skit about Rick James, American LEOs are often “habitual line steppers”. That takes away from the cops that do good work thanklessly. Basically, we’re tired of seeing lazy, fat, pathetic excuses for cops get a pass for simply being cops. |
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Posted: 6/28/2024 1:37:47 AM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted: To the contrary I think most of the membership here is pro LE, but the ones who aren't are very vocal. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: How come I only see threads showing the worst side of cops? Where are all the videos of the good deeds? Only bad cop vids get clicks? ARFCOM seems to lean anti-LE, or maybe the anti-LE posters are more active. To the contrary I think most of the membership here is pro LE, but the ones who aren't are very vocal. I have been generally pro-LEO, until calling a bad shoot a bad shoot somehow got me labeled "Anti-LEO". I won't give a blank check to police because they're police. I expect them to follow the laws. I believe the reason some here think the site is "anti-LEO" despite a huge population of LEO posters is that there are a proportionally large number of bad shoot videos posted, as the good shoots are usually not commented on, the bad shoot ones generally pit the people who give LEO a blank check to do anything they want vs the members who think police should at least follow the law and general procedures with common sense. I will say that the negative turn in my opinion of general law enforcement officers is due to things posted on this forum by LEO defending what are clearly situations that shouldn't have happened, yet are justified with some twisted logic and obscure case law, while common sense says that shouldn't have happened. |
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Posted: 6/28/2024 6:06:14 AM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Everything up to the draw could be justified. - Legit traffic stop - Cop sees something suspicious - driver shoving something down his pants. Perhaps by his training and experience in the past he reasons its a person hiding a gun. - Cop appears to be suspicious, has his hand by his holster. - orders driver out of the car. Driver reaches for his waistband. - Does a check for officer safety and and feels something he suspect to be a gun. - cop attempts to handcuff, driver is resisting. - cop does a takedown - cop draws gun Up to this point everything is justified. Since we can't see what happened off camera, we can only speculate. Maybe he saw the driver reach for the waistband or thought he saw a gun being pointed at him in the dark. He shot then saw the guys hands were empty and stopped shooting. Watching the video I can say the shot was wrong and the cop should've waited till clearly seeing a threat. However I can understand the circumstances and mindset the cop was in the heat of the moment, in the dark, and alone. Presuming the traffic stop was legitimate, this is pretty much my take on it. On the other hand, the officer seemed to be perturbed by the driver replying that he did not run the stop sign; kept interrupting the driver. Or, the officer could've smelled the alcohol (but the officer doesn't seem to give that as a reason from what I've read). Ordering the guy out of the car might have been contempt of cop punishment. 
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Posted: 6/28/2024 6:08:28 AM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted: If I were to hazard a guess he drew the handgun to bluff the guy into not running away but after being on the losing end of the tussle he put a bit too much pressure on the trigger and scored a 1 in a million hit aka no skill all (bad) luck Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: My guess is the cop didn't mean to shoot him, but he's practiced that draw and shoot with a timer a thousand times before. Adrenaline got pumpin and muscle memory kicked in. If I were to hazard a guess he drew the handgun to bluff the guy into not running away but after being on the losing end of the tussle he put a bit too much pressure on the trigger and scored a 1 in a million hit aka no skill all (bad) luck That seems like a good possibility. One shot... ND. |
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Posted: 6/28/2024 6:12:24 AM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Really time to start disbanding police departments. ' If I'm going to get shot, roughed-up, beaten, held against my will; I may as well fight a street horde (illegal gang) rather than the police (legal gang).  Attached File |
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Posted: 6/28/2024 6:32:32 AM EDT
[#49]
100% ''respect my authority'' shoot. Hang him. I'd question being hauled out and manhandled for a simple rolling stop violation myself.
I watched the incident multiple times and that cop would never want me on a jury. Totally out of line and even his assault on the victim was unwarranted. Cop didn't even ask for DL, or vehicle info before he decided to cuff and stuff him to massage his blue ego. Don't point guns at things you don't want to destroy, that goes for guys in badges, he owned that discharge 100%. Is there video of the driver rolling the stop? |
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Posted: 6/28/2024 7:12:08 AM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Who does it harm? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: I walk around with a loaded gun. I could kill any random person I walk by at any time. Am I guilty of murder? I don't disagree that it's a bad idea to drive drunk, but I am very leery of "pre-crime" type situations. Driving while drunk is not pre-crime - it is criminal. Who does it harm? May you never have to find the answer this question while lowering an innocent loved one into the ground due to someone driving intoxicated. Some of us have. And if you (or anyone reading this) drive buzzed or intoxicated, knock that shit off. |
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