No shit, can we stop wasting our money and resources now!


"Rep. Andy Harris (R-MD), the Congressional Ukraine Caucus cochair, said during a town hall on Tuesday he is not sure the Ukrainian war against Russia is "winnable."

Harris spoke at a town hall in Abingdon, Maryland, in front of a PowerPoint presentation on the national debt, saying that it is time to wind down America's aid to Ukraine.


"Is this more a stalemate? Should we be realistic about it? I think we probably should," Harris remarked."

Article link

Wait, people actually believed the "Ukraine gonna win it!" propaganda?

Hahahahahabababababababahbahahahaha

It never really was. The best case scenario was the Russians got tired of the losses and fucked off back to Russia.

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Not matter who wins, the American taxpayer loses.

It seemed to me the best Ukraine can do was cause a stalemate.
They have the will but not the population to throw at the invaders, regardless of what weapons systems they are given.
The other side is the Russians can’t move very far from their entrenched positions without getting torn to pieces, and what little land they managed to hold will never be profitable or even habitable.
All they can do is keep throwing bodies at the Ukrainians just to hold what they have.
It’s going to go on for years, maybe even decades unless something drastic happens.

It was never winnable. Simps are some delusional motherfuckers. Persistence, but naive as fuck and fairy tell believing motherfuckers.

If we wanted them to win it we'd be giving them millions of arty rounds and thousands of tanks rather than just looking through our old shit to see what we could part with.

So basically just hand them the keys to the US Military? Lol

Does Ukraine have fertile soil for money trees and fleshlight bushes or something?

If Ukraine ever started making real gains. And taking Russian cities. Putting is going to make them glow in the dark. He still might hit the easy button depending on circumstances.

Best case scenario at this point is to force everyone to the peace table.

Just like how we won it in Iraq and Afghanistan....

No peace until the Russian surrenders!

We are back baby!!! Wooooohoooooo!!!!

No, do lend lease like we did in WW2. Out-manufacture Russia by producing 10x the amount of weapons they can.

Just finished this shit show of a book:



All we (or they) need is an ass fuck like this in Congress.  In the book, Charlie Wilson is a squandering motherfucker that barely connected the fact that he gave rise to the modern radical muslim.

In before the trolls

Ukraine is gonna win (take back their territory). If the US still had balls and realized that Putin's Russia is still the enemy of the world and opened the taps, they's win this year!! It's the best investment for US tax payers since the Louisiana Purchase.

Ukraine is winning right now.

The ruble is collapsing, the offensive is gaining steam, and sketti is posting pro-Russian doom porn. I’m sorry, “just asking questions”.

Don't we always?

not my war

No one seriously believes this to be true.

If we keep supplying Ukraine with heroic amounts of gear (and money)....the best case is a Korea 2.0, with the Great Minefield of Ukraine forming the new DMZ, and Russia keeping what they've held.

If we stop supplying Ukraine....well, their economy is on life support (and maybe dead already), and their domestic military industry isn't capable of supplying their troops what they need....so worst case is likely a "soft capitulation", where the Russians get a laundry list of "wants", in exchange for not bombing their way to collapsing the Ukraine and then advancing to the Dnipr.



The only victory condition even remotely likely for Ukraine is if the Russians collapse internally (as a nation-state), and the Russian Army just leaves.  No sign of that, so far.



Russia's fucked, too.  Just in different ways.

Yes I can actually feel how great of a investment it is everytime I buy groceries or get gas. Every war, proxy war or intervention America just gets better.

This will require Uke bros to change their stance on no negotiations and that Ukraine will take it all back at any cost. Then try to act like they were right all along.

Europe should step up more with equipment. It is very clear that western Europe has been massively under funding their military for a long time.

This should be a wake up call, and only Poland is serious about it.

Well, they aren't losing either.  They've held back a much stronger military.  As incompetent as the Russian military is, they still have more resources, manpower, and hardware.  Of course, Ukraine couldn't do it without help.  The world is also better off without Russia controlling Ukraine.  Apart from the security challenges of NATO with Russia that much closer, the economic resources Russia would seize would be problematic.  All that oil, gas, minerals, metals, and excellent farmland would revitalize Russia's economy and power in the world.  Since we all know Putin is evil, it is best he doesn't get these things.  Instead, Russia's economy is hurting.  Their military will take decades to rebuild, even if they find the money to do it.  It will be even harder with all the young people who have fled the country to which Russia will need to keep its economy going.  

It seems that we're getting something for our money.  Whether it's too expensive is debatable.  

I don't predict anything major happening.  Ukraine probably wants to eke out a few more gains before the lines solidify even further.  A stalemate seems likely and what you gain now will likely be the status quo for a long time.  Just like the Korean war, it will probably end in a ceasefire with no treaty.  When Putin finally dies, maybe a treaty is possible.

While I have seen a lot of these headlines, I’d recommend patience till at least September 4th if not October 4th before making final conclusions for either the Russians up north or Ukraine down south and east at Bakhmut. That being said Congress will have to decide sometime in late September and October whether to continue, end, reduce or whatever aid the GOP House under McCarthy and Senate under Democrats vote on this fall before mud season arrives Attached File

Ukraine:
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Ukraine isn't going to win.  And Russia isn't going to just give up.  This will drag out for years.  And yes, as far as the US is concerned, that's the point.  The last time the US dragged out a Russian war for close to a decade, it collapsed the Soviet Union, and they didn't invade anyone else again for a long time.  Since Putin is rebuilding the Soviet Union, that's been the mission statement for continued US assistance for quite a while now.  

And it'll probably work again too.

Again:  Even with the backing of the "most powerful country on earth", aka America, with billions of dollars, advisors, and the most modern military technology, they haven't made significant gains on WWI style trench systems.

Just throwing that out there, along with "why can't the US military meet recruiting goals".   We're a dead nation and Biden and his gang of cronies are just throwing the rest to the wolves of the world to ensure they're sitting comfy.

I don’t think Ukraine is able to retake all of the conquered territories barring another coup or collapse.

Can they liberate the majority of territory conquered from 2/24? Yes.

But I think Crimea will be unobtainable

lol, Breitbart. Obvious Russian propaganda...



...rating troll

They don't have access to all of the most modern military technology.  They've gotten some of it.  If the US went full bore with aircraft, the Ukes would have a good shot at winning.  That's a big ask, considering modern fighters, CAS, bombers, missiles, jamming aircraft, and support/training for all of the above.  Even a big shipment of ATACMS would change things.  Being able to destroy their rear areas and supply system would screw the Russian military pretty good.  Modern US aircraft could down Russian planes and destroy their AA missile sites.  I'm not saying they should get these things, but if they did, it could have above mentioned result.  

I agree with you about Biden.  He's screwed up a competent military with wartime experience.  Most vets are wary of a peacetime military.  A peacetime military with a liberal president is a nightmare for soldiers.

Another stunning loss for the Biden administration.
Who coulda seen that coming.
Do tell…

So, any day now?

Whether you believe it or not it's true.

Putin invaded Ukraine with the intent to subjugate and conquer the entire country in a few days and humiliate the west. Not just the eastern parts and no, Kyiv was not a feint. He wanted the entire country and to drive Zelenskyy out of the capital. Nobody expected Ukraine to offer more than a few days or weeks of resistance and Russian propagandists publicly declared Ukraine would be annihilated. In Putin's Essay "On the historical unity of Ukraine and Russia" he claimed Ukraine belonged to Russia. That's Putin himself talking, not me. Russia also publicly declared on February 26th, 2022 that they had defeated Ukraine and "Ukraine had returned to Russia". It was soon withdrawn when Russia began to flee Kyiv after losing the battle. Nato is stronger and now has 2 more nations, including one former Russian imperial colony, and Ukraine is stronger.

Ukraine is the underdog and not on the level of Russia. They're a much smaller nation with a much weaker military. For people to say "Oh, they got billions yet they can't push Russia out, they're losing" is ignorant because it's the lightweight boxer going against the heavyweight boxer and winning. The puppet government Russia intended to setup with it's JBT FSB goons isn't happening.

Odesa? Still Ukrainian.

Kherson? Liberated.

Kharkiv? Still Ukrainian.

Kyiv? Still Ukrainian.

Bucha? Even more Ukrainian after the horrors VDV soldiers did to the people there.

Izium? Free.

Kupyansk? Free.

Balakliya? Free.

Urozhaine? Recently free.

Robytne? Freedom, 50% loaded.

The victory pathways for Ukraine are much larger whereas the pathways to victory for Russia are much narrower. Russia is seen as the more powerful country yet when faced with unified Ukrainian resistance fled the capital.

Ukrainian victory is retaining most of their country and surviving as a nation. A Russian victory is taking Kyiv and accomplishing the goals they set out to on 2-24-22. Russia was closest to those goals in the weeks around 2-24.

If Ukraine succeeds in breaking the land bridge from Crimea to the mainland-and I believe they will-Russia will have traded 250k men, another countless hundreds of thousands wounded, trillions in lost assets and military hardware, and political and economic isolation for a few clumps of land.

That is a victory for Ukraine and a defeat for Russia.

Putin has a personal desire to own Kyiv because of the history of the Rus and Kyivan rus and a need to re-write it. He also can't claim to be a Tsar without owning Ukraine.

As the saying goes:

Russia with Ukraine is an empire
Russia without Ukraine is just a country

Probably not any day now. Another year probably.

Russia has already been defeated, just like the Japanese were at the battle of Midway in 1942

They just don't know it yet and refuse to acknowledge it.

It took a lot of hard slogging through the pacific in island hopping campaigns and 2 nuclear bombs before Japan surrendered.

Already lost.

Election is coming up. US money and supplies will dry up. Congress won’t pass a big bill to fund the war.  It’s bad optics for each party especially if Ukraine doesn’t take substantial ground by October.  Without large amounts of US support the Ukrainians are fucked.  So I guess we’ll all see in a couple months how it will go.

“I think the time has come to realistically call for peace talks."
-- Congressman Andy Harris (R - MD)

https://www.politico.com/newsletters/huddle/2023/08/17/ukraines-top-freedom-caucus-ally-gets-cold-feet-00111608

Like Deja Vu all over again.

Funneled money into Affghanistan and eventually the Soviets got tired of it and pulled out. The US economy then was in much better shape. How did that turn out for the US in Afghanistan? Rest of the world plays the long game and the US never looks past the end of its nose. Just like in the middle east the crusades to them are like a recent event. The US can't even begin to comprehend where other countries are going or have come from. We play the incredibly short game. Everykthing in the world doesn't fit into the timespan of a 4 year election or 8 at most.

Pour trillions of printed money into the economy and as long as it doesn't fall totally apart before I leave office mission accomplished.

Translation, we could win but then nukes will fly. Bye bye NYC, & DC to start.

Unfortunately by walking away a new world order emerges that severely threatens the power of the dollar in several ways, but if we can be disciplined we can win economically, a tough row to hoe given our soft underbelly of leftist proletariat.

It wasn't our fight to begin with.

This. It's a test of will between Russia and the West. Looks like maybe the West is losing resolve before Russia.

Win, lose who cares?  

--General Dynamics, Lockheed Martin, Boeing.

They sure love their endless wars

100% this and it is obvious to anyone paying the least bit attention.

Quick, let’s send another 87 billion to be laundered for the big guy!

That guy is about as credible as "The Duran". Both are just cheerleaders for their side.

@FlyNavy75

This right here is the only undisputed fact in the entire thread...

I agree.

Russia should withdraw all of their troops and follow the Memorandum they signed.