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Posted: 11/15/2014 5:36:13 PM EDT
Ok ok. I know "this vs that brand" threads are a dime a dozen. And I've been reading tons of them tying to research. But I can't seem to get these two particular AR's out of my mind.
I've narrowed it down to these two choices mainly because my LGS has both in stock and I've been able to fondle them recently. Here's the dilemma: Daniel Defense MK12 vs Knights Armament SR-15 "mod 2". The price difference is negligible between the two. Basically $2k each (a little under for one, a little over for the other). I want a high end AR that's going to be accurate, durable, a joy to shoot, and will hold its value over time. So what's the right call between these two? They're both awesome. A little background: I used to have a Rock River Predator Pursuit. LOVED the accuracy and reliability, didn't really dig the weight. I now have an M&P-15 Sport that I've dressed up with a quad rail, eotech, match trigger, and new furniture. It's a wonderful weapon but it's not exactly "high-end". The fact is, I recently came to a place where I have the cash to spend on a really nice, high quality AR and I simply want one. It's really as simple as that! So between the two I've narrowed it down to, does anyone have any opinions?? |
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Prepare for responses overwhelming in favor of the KAC. View Quote Hahah.... Sweet. I'm kind "leaning" that way. The DD was a slow-burn for me. I kept going back to it mentally because at $1900 it's a good deal. But the KAC...I had an immediate "emotional" response when I handled that one! I mean that in such a way that the gun just FELT soooo right in my hands. I had to set it down so as not to make an impulse purchase! :) |
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KAC has been around and has been in the pocket of uncle sugar for a long time. I think very highly of th Knight family and would love to learn 1/100th of what they know about how to make a Stoner ar-15.
But. Daniel Defense seems to know what that are doing, and have been quietly building a great reputation for making quality ARs for many years. KAC has a history, some proprietary parts, and a loyal following that, just a few years ago, were willing to pay stupid prices for what KAC makes readily available to John Q Public today. Compare that to DD, who is one of several vanilla manufacturers selling products at reasonable prices. If you have a Gucci budget, get a CRANE (if you can find one (ADCO) ) or MSTN custom. If you don't want to do that, get both. If you can't/ don't want to do that, read up on Kac's proprietary parts and decide if that helps or hurts their position, and decide accordingly. To play devil's advocate: have you heard of Noveske's 3 groove 1 in 8 twist barrels?? |
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I have owned a DD M4V7 and a Knights SR-15 mod1. They both shot well but the KAC had a lot of benifit's for only and felt like a better value it also held its value muck better when I sold them. I am sure you have seen the comparison list's before, but here are some benefits of the kac
Kac micro flip sight's (very nice sights) make up for the price difference alone Nice KAC 2 stage trigger complete ambi lower, some people do not care but nice to have LMT sopmod stock Is much nicer then the moe or new DD stock in IMHO E3 Bolt, nice design never read on any issues shearing lugs custom gas system, Not really needed but Some say it shoots smoother. The Features outweigh the extra cost and KAC rifles are not as common as DD and seem to retain their value better. I like dd and still have 2 of their barrels but with the cost being that close I would go KAC |
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It sounds like you really want the KAC and you're trying to make yourself want the DD. You can't go wrong with either brand, but I have a feeling you'll regret not getting the SR15.
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Get the KAC and dont look back! Its a plug and play optics ready carbine. The DD MK12ish rifle is nice but that seems more.like.SPR platform gun. My SR15 is the smoothest shooting AR I own and have yet to find anything else that rivals it in quality, durability, balance and resale value. Good luck with your decision
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Get the KAC and dont look back! Its a plug and play optics ready carbine. The DD MK12ish rifle is nice but that seems more.like.SPR platform gun. My SR15 is the smoothest shooting AR I own and have yet to find anything else that rivals it in quality, durability, balance and resale value. Good luck with your decision View Quote I'm glad you brought up optics. OP, you can essentially put any optic you want on the KAC. IE. magnified, RDS etc, but the DD MK12 is really only going to shine with a magnified optic. So while the rifles may be relatively close in cost it's going to take more to outfit one properly vs. the other. |
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KAC, for a ton of reasons, but not least of which you'll get your money back, even during Salad Days.
DD makes a good product, but if you don't own a KAC, that should be your first high end buy, before anything else. |
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It sounds like you really want the KAC and you're trying to make yourself want the DD. You can't go wrong with either brand, but I have a feeling you'll regret not getting the SR15. View Quote I think you hit the nail on the head. Like I said the KAC evoked an "emotional" response and I wanted to just take it home that minute! But the DD sorta kept talking to me throughout the day. "On paper" the DD looks great, perhaps even better, because it's got the cold hammer-forged stainless steel barrel and Geissele trigger. Plus the new DD furniture is pretty cool, love the grip angle. But dang, that KAC just wanted to go home with me! Hahahaha |
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I have owned a DD M4V7 and a Knights SR-15 mod1. They both shot well but the KAC had a lot of benifit's for only and felt like a better value it also held its value muck better when I sold them. I am sure you have seen the comparison list's before, but here are some benefits of the kac Kac micro flip sight's (very nice sights) make up for the price difference alone Nice KAC 2 stage trigger complete ambi lower, some people do not care but nice to have LMT sopmod stock Is much nicer then the moe or new DD stock in IMHO E3 Bolt, nice design never read on any issues shearing lugs custom gas system, Not really needed but Some say it shoots smoother. The Features outweigh the extra cost and KAC rifles are not as common as DD and seem to retain their value better. I like dd and still have 2 of their barrels but with the cost being that close I would go KAC View Quote DDMK12 comes with a Geissele SSA. Everything else you said is spot on. And I am a DD lover. |
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Not a true Mk12. Like, not even close. So don't let the "Mk12" designation lead you to believe you're getting something special. It's simply an 18" AR15 with a good trigger. No hate, just say'n.
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KAC.
The thought of the DD SPR being called a MK12 rustles my jimmies. |
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DD simply because it's not prop
I'd ditch both and get lwrc though |
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KAC
<3 my SR15. All other ARs I own or have shot have came up lacking in the shadow of my KAC. Yes its that damn good, IMO. ETA: Not to say DD isnt squared away. They are. Great outfit Marty runs over there and much like KAC, I do favor them over others due to the number of parts being made in-house. Barrels being at the top of that list. If KAC was out of the equation Id take DD over all other 'mil-spec' manufacturers for that reason. Even over the almighty BCM. JMO. |
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I think the KAC LPR is a closer comparison than the Mod 2 to the DD. Have you seen those?
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I think the KAC LPR is a closer comparison than the Mod 2 to the DD. View Quote This. These two rifles serve different purposes. KAC and DD are two of the top black rifle companies around. In this case, if you're looking for a more precision/bench/distance rifle, the DD would be my choice. If you're looking for a more multi purpose battle rifle, I'd opt for the Mod 2. My personal choice would be to get both though. |
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I think the KAC LPR is a closer comparison than the Mod 2 to the DD. Have you seen those? View Quote I agree. My LGS doesn't have the LPR though. Honestly I'm thinking part of the reason I liked the KAC so much is that it really fits what I'm looking for. Like I said it was only after I thought about it (and researched more online) that the added "accuracy features" of the DD started to look attractive. |
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My LGS has the complete rifle (SBR). Can't recall the price but I fondled it as well. Too short for my needs but boy is it nice! View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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I hope a good deal on a 11.5 KAC upper doesn't pop up... My LGS has the complete rifle (SBR). Can't recall the price but I fondled it as well. Too short for my needs but boy is it nice! I am just glad to see you guys are able to finally possess them! (WA native here) |
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I am just glad to see you guys are able to finally possess them! (WA native here) View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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I hope a good deal on a 11.5 KAC upper doesn't pop up... My LGS has the complete rifle (SBR). Can't recall the price but I fondled it as well. Too short for my needs but boy is it nice! I am just glad to see you guys are able to finally possess them! (WA native here) Ha! We'll see for how much longer. The Libs over in Seattle are starting to chip away at our gun rights here in WA. Huge victory for them recently with that ridiculous I-594 BS they voted for! Also meant to add it was a "CQB SBR" so yeah, 11.5 inches. Sweet little "handgun". :) |
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Quoted: Not a true Mk12. Like, not even close. So don't let the "Mk12" designation lead you to believe you're getting something special. It's simply an 18" AR15 with a good trigger. No hate, just say'n. View Quote Nope. It's not a Mk12 at all. They're just took the name and slapped it on a gun to get more sales and appeal.
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Nope. It's not a Mk12 at all. They're just took the name and slapped it on a gun to get more sales and appeal. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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Not a true Mk12. Like, not even close. So don't let the "Mk12" designation lead you to believe you're getting something special. It's simply an 18" AR15 with a good trigger. No hate, just say'n. Nope. It's not a Mk12 at all. They're just took the name and slapped it on a gun to get more sales and appeal. Hmmm. Good to know. I'm not sure what makes a MK12 a "true" version vs others. That being said DD does have a great reputation. It sounds from the replies so far though that KAC is a much more respected name in AR's. Pretty sure I'll be picking that bad boy to ASAP! |
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Hmmm. Good to know. I'm not sure what makes a MK12 a "true" version vs others. That being said DD does have a great reputation. It sounds from the replies so far though that KAC is a much more respected name in AR's. Pretty sure I'll be picking that bad boy to ASAP! View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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Not a true Mk12. Like, not even close. So don't let the "Mk12" designation lead you to believe you're getting something special. It's simply an 18" AR15 with a good trigger. No hate, just say'n. Nope. It's not a Mk12 at all. They're just took the name and slapped it on a gun to get more sales and appeal. Hmmm. Good to know. I'm not sure what makes a MK12 a "true" version vs others. That being said DD does have a great reputation. It sounds from the replies so far though that KAC is a much more respected name in AR's. Pretty sure I'll be picking that bad boy to ASAP! Look at the mk12 thread for the specs. DD MK12 is their version, using DD equivalent parts. It's really apples and oranges. The DD mk12 is more of a precision rig, the SR15 more of an all around "battle" rifle. A better comparison would be against one of the CMV barrel DDs. |
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Hmmm. Good to know. I'm not sure what makes a MK12 a "true" version vs others. That being said DD does have a great reputation. It sounds from the replies so far though that KAC is a much more respected name in AR's. Pretty sure I'll be picking that bad boy to ASAP! View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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Not a true Mk12. Like, not even close. So don't let the "Mk12" designation lead you to believe you're getting something special. It's simply an 18" AR15 with a good trigger. No hate, just say'n. Nope. It's not a Mk12 at all. They're just took the name and slapped it on a gun to get more sales and appeal. Hmmm. Good to know. I'm not sure what makes a MK12 a "true" version vs others. That being said DD does have a great reputation. It sounds from the replies so far though that KAC is a much more respected name in AR's. Pretty sure I'll be picking that bad boy to ASAP! There is a 650+ page thread if you want to acquaint yourself with the Mk12. I wouldn't say KAC is much more respected but like I said in an earlier post, they are leader and innovators in the AR world. I can't see any scenario where you'll be disappointed in the KAC. What optic do you plan on using (sorry if i missed it somewhere)? |
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Not a true Mk12. Like, not even close. So don't let the "Mk12" designation lead you to believe you're getting something special. It's simply an 18" AR15 with a good trigger. No hate, just say'n. View Quote This. I wouldn't buy the DD "Mk 12" for the sole purpose of making a failtrain attempt to cash in on the Mk 12 hysteria and deliver a product that doesn't resemble it at all. I like DD and KAC, but that was a Busch League move from DD that was all about duping the uninformed. |
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There is a 650+ page thread if you want to acquaint yourself with the Mk12. I wouldn't say KAC is much more respected but like I said in an earlier post, they are leader and innovators in the AR world. I can't see any scenario where you'll be disappointed in the KAC. What optic do you plan on using (sorry if i missed it somewhere)? View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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Not a true Mk12. Like, not even close. So don't let the "Mk12" designation lead you to believe you're getting something special. It's simply an 18" AR15 with a good trigger. No hate, just say'n. Nope. It's not a Mk12 at all. They're just took the name and slapped it on a gun to get more sales and appeal. Hmmm. Good to know. I'm not sure what makes a MK12 a "true" version vs others. That being said DD does have a great reputation. It sounds from the replies so far though that KAC is a much more respected name in AR's. Pretty sure I'll be picking that bad boy to ASAP! There is a 650+ page thread if you want to acquaint yourself with the Mk12. I wouldn't say KAC is much more respected but like I said in an earlier post, they are leader and innovators in the AR world. I can't see any scenario where you'll be disappointed in the KAC. What optic do you plan on using (sorry if i missed it somewhere)? I've got an eotech 517 that's currently on my M&P. I'm planning on throwing that on the KAC with a 3x eotech magnifier. I'm open to suggestions though! |
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Was it a KAC 11.5 SBR rifle at our local LGS?
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My LGS has the complete rifle (SBR). Can't recall the price but I fondled it as well. Too short for my needs but boy is it nice! View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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I hope a good deal on a 11.5 KAC upper doesn't pop up... My LGS has the complete rifle (SBR). Can't recall the price but I fondled it as well. Too short for my needs but boy is it nice! |
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I IM'd you...
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Was it a KAC 11.5 SBR rifle at our local LGS? View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
Was it a KAC 11.5 SBR rifle at our local LGS? Quoted:
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I hope a good deal on a 11.5 KAC upper doesn't pop up... My LGS has the complete rifle (SBR). Can't recall the price but I fondled it as well. Too short for my needs but boy is it nice! |
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If you are looking for a TRUE MK12ish rifle, then neither of these actually come very close.
If you're looking for a very good general purpose rifle, then the KAC is better suited for that. If you looking for more of a precision setup, then the Daniel Defense might be the better way to go. Both are very good rifles aimed at slightly different target audiences. |
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Two great rifles you're looking at.
I prefer KAC due to what the rifle comes, and I prefer their proprietary parts. Some people prefer mil-spec pattern parts, and like to add stuff over time. If so, KAC isn't the right rifle for you! You're picking from two of the best AR15 builders out there today, so either way you will get a great rifle. |
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You guys are killin me with all the KAC pics!
I've made up my mind for sure. As soon as I possibly can I'm walking in there with a wad of cash in my hand....and walking out with a KAC SR-15 mod2! |
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