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Posted: 5/19/2022 7:56:32 PM EST
[#1]
DUPE
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Posted: 5/19/2022 7:59:40 PM EST
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted: It's a muzzle brake threaded on to the barrel with a straightness running through the barrel and the muzzle brake. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/28568/muzzle_brake_straightness_gauge_001-2389751.jpg .... Ohhhhhh, now THAT makes way more sense. Someone, in a couple of posts above, stated that it was a straightness gauge in the barrel, but it still looked off to me as it sure didn't look like the end of any barrel I have ever seen. I wanted to ask for further clarification but didn't decided not to ask, as I felt retarded enough not knowing what I was looking at.  . This picture explains a whole helluva lot. |
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Posted: 5/19/2022 9:53:20 PM EST
[#3]
I’d keep it and have the port opened to .073”.
I bet money G fixes the issue by having the next batch ported at .076” + for rEliAbILiTy. |
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Posted: 5/19/2022 10:27:34 PM EST
[#4]
Really curious what Molon experiences with regard to reliability.
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Posted: 5/20/2022 4:29:04 AM EST
[#5]
Comparison between gas ports between the Geissele and a Ballistic Advantage. Both 16" and both midlength gas.
  As you can see, I did slightly misalign the gas block, but I'm not sure if it's fully on the builder. The dimple marks were basically right on... And they appear to slightly to the left. Perhaps the dimpling is just a hair off? Not sure. Should that small of an error have caused the rifle not to pick up another round? Maybe. Will have to try again this weekend. The BA barrel was hand-dimpled and, as you can see, is dead-on aligned. As for port sizes, the G is smaller to the naked eye. Rough micrometer measuring (nothing 100% scientific) reads about. 0.066" for Geissele and the BA reads about 0.076", which basically aligns with the chart earlier the thread, so I'd guess my micrometer readings are pretty accurate. |
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Posted: 5/20/2022 9:32:54 AM EST
[#6]
There's a reason the hole in the gas block is bigger than the port in the barrel, and the soot ring shows the barrel gas port was within the gas block's hole.
But, that misalignment could have torqued your gas tube and resulted in a misalignment inside the upper, which would interfere with free travel of the bolt carrier. ETA: Just an aside, I think it's interesting the Geissele barrels have the recess cut for the front hand guard cap when the gas block journal is made so short as to only accept a low profile gas block. I assume it's so folks know not to push the gas block all the way back into the thicker boss behind the journal. |
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Posted: 5/20/2022 9:40:41 AM EST
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Comparison between gas ports between the Geissele and a Ballistic Advantage. Both 16" and both midlength gas. https://i.ibb.co/zmcNcHp/20220520-035046.jpg https://i.ibb.co/BV00Byk/20220520-035029.jpg As you can see, I did slightly misalign the gas block, but I'm not sure if it's fully on the builder. The dimple marks were basically right on... And they appear to slightly to the left. Perhaps the dimpling is just a hair off? Not sure. Should that small of an error have caused the rifle not to pick up another round? Maybe. Will have to try again this weekend. The BA barrel was hand-dimpled and, as you can see, is dead-on aligned. As for port sizes, the G is smaller to the naked eye. Rough micrometer measuring (nothing 100% scientific) reads about. 0.066" for Geissele and the BA reads about 0.076", which basically aligns with the chart earlier the thread, so I'd guess my micrometer readings are pretty accurate. GP/GB alignment is not the issue. You're getting the full flow of available gas. |
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Posted: 5/20/2022 10:31:05 AM EST
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: There's a reason the hole in the gas block is bigger than the port in the barrel, and the soot ring shows the barrel gas port was within the gas block's hole. But, that misalignment could have torqued your gas tube and resulted in a misalignment inside the upper, which would interfere with free travel of the bolt carrier. ETA: Just an aside, I think it's interesting the Geissele barrels have the recess cut for the front hand guard cap when the gas block journal is made so short as to only accept a low profile gas block. I assume it's so folks know not to push the gas block all the way back into the thicker boss behind the journal. And this is a non-scientific line drawn on my phone, but rotating the photo to vertical and adding the line makes it appear thst the port is pretty closely aligned with the notch. To my googly eye anyway   Attached File |
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Posted: 5/20/2022 11:54:02 AM EST
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Yes, at least something to check out. And this is a non-scientific line drawn on my phone, but rotating the photo to vertical and adding the line makes it appear thst the port is pretty closely aligned with the notch. To my googly eye anyway https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/384595/20220520-035046_jpg-2390509.JPGHe mentioned the dimples on the barrels underside looked to be a hair off |
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Posted: 5/20/2022 12:30:28 PM EST
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Comparison between gas ports between the Geissele and a Ballistic Advantage. Both 16" and both midlength gas. https://i.ibb.co/zmcNcHp/20220520-035046.jpg https://i.ibb.co/BV00Byk/20220520-035029.jpg As you can see, I did slightly misalign the gas block, but I'm not sure if it's fully on the builder. The dimple marks were basically right on... And they appear to slightly to the left. Perhaps the dimpling is just a hair off? Not sure. Should that small of an error have caused the rifle not to pick up another round? Maybe. Will have to try again this weekend. The BA barrel was hand-dimpled and, as you can see, is dead-on aligned. As for port sizes, the G is smaller to the naked eye. Rough micrometer measuring (nothing 100% scientific) reads about. 0.066" for Geissele and the BA reads about 0.076", which basically aligns with the chart earlier the thread, so I'd guess my micrometer readings are pretty accurate. Gas block misalignments slant the gas tube and can cause drag on extraction and resistance on chambering. Take the bolt out of the carrier and insert the carrier into the barreled upper while parallel to the ground. Tilt the barrel down. What angle does the carrier slide into place? If it's above 45* you misaligned the tube. |
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Posted: 5/23/2022 9:06:52 PM EST
[#11]
So, another update. After re-aligning the gas block, took the new barrel out for a shoot.
I did not tinker with the buffer settings, because I wanted to see how it shot first with the new gas alignment. I started with the M855, and it shot great. Ejection pattern was 3:30-4 o'clock. Then moved on to some M193. Shot fine as well. Ejection pattern about 3-3:30 o'clock. Then some Hornady 75g Match was the about the same. The rifle shot pretty smoothly, but when I got to the end of the M193 or Hornady 223 mag, the bolt would not hold open... Which means it was basically semi-short stroking. That's not good. So then I tried something I already knew the answer to. I tried some Tula steel case 223. The first shot was a true short stroke on the ejection and malfunctioned the action. The next couple of shots didn't even eject. So. Then I decide to try a carbine weight buffer instead of an H1. Well....that was an absolute disaster that locked up the entire action. The shell fired, but then the case was locked in the chamber. I had to take the rfle apart and get a dowel rod and rubber mallet to hammer the BCG out backwards from the chamber in the upper. I couldnt have done it any other way. So, now this leaves me wondering just exactly what to do. Yes, I could take it to a machine shop or gunsmith and get the gas port drilled out to about .070+ and I'm sure it would run like a champ, but how much would that be? Another $50-$100 on an already $300 barrel? I shouldn't have to do that to run standard M193 or high quality 223 match ammo. And let's just say I do bore out the gas port, is the chamber still going to lock up if accidently get a steel round in there? I don't know. I have no problem avoiding steel in the rifle, but I just figured a so-called "duty-grade" barrel from a company like Geissele would pretty much eat anything your throw at it...but I guess not. |
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Posted: 5/23/2022 9:16:43 PM EST
[#12]
No need to take it to a a machine shop. Buy yourself a pin vise (made by general) and a .068-.070 reamer. Open it up yourself. By hand.
ETA: I'd run it with a std carbine buffer and m193 & m855. Tula is crap. |
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Posted: 5/23/2022 9:39:48 PM EST
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted: So, another update. After re-aligning the gas block, took the new barrel out for a shoot. I did not tinker with the buffer settings, because I wanted to see how it shot first with the new gas alignment. I started with the M855, and it shot great. Ejection pattern was 3:30-4 o'clock. Then moved on to some M193. Shot fine as well. Ejection pattern about 3-3:30 o'clock. Then some Hornady 75g Match was the about the same. The rifle shot pretty smoothly, but when I got to the end of the M193 or Hornady 223 mag, the bolt would not hold open... Which means it was basically semi-short stroking. That's not good. So then I tried something I already knew the answer to. I tried some Tula steel case 223. The first shot was a true short stroke on the ejection and malfunctioned the action. The next couple of shots didn't even eject. So. Then I decide to try a carbine weight buffer instead of an H1. Well....that was an absolute disaster that locked up the entire action. The shell fired, but then the case was locked in the chamber. I had to take the rfle apart and get a dowel rod and rubber mallet to hammer the BCG out backwards from the chamber in the upper. I couldnt have done it any other way. So, now this leaves me wondering just exactly what to do. Yes, I could take it to a machine shop or gunsmith and get the gas port drilled out to about .070+ and I'm sure it would run like a champ, but how much would that be? Another $50-$100 on an already $300 barrel? I shouldn't have to do that to run standard M193 or high quality 223 match ammo. And let's just say I do bore out the gas port, is the chamber still going to lock up if accidently get a steel round in there? I don't know. I have no problem avoiding steel in the rifle, but I just figured a so-called "duty-grade" barrel from a company like Geissele would pretty much eat anything your throw at it...but I guess not. Insert a brass rod into the bore, open the port with a #49 drill bit. Bypass the machine shop. |
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Posted: 5/23/2022 9:46:44 PM EST
[#14]
Yep. Brass welding rod for protection from drilling through the other side.
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Posted: 5/24/2022 8:35:08 AM EST
[#15]
Literally call Geissele and ask for a replacement.
They probably messed up. It's not the first time. But they do have a customer service to hopefully rectify the issue. |
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Posted: 5/24/2022 8:45:31 AM EST
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Literally call Geissele and ask for a replacement. They fucked up. It's not the first time they put out products that are bad. But they do have a customer service to hopefully rectify the issue. This is exactly what I would do. I don't care who he gives free shit too, the company especially does not deserve to get a free pass and needs to make it right or at least be aware that they released a turd and to make things good to the customer. |
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Posted: 5/24/2022 9:25:16 AM EST
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Literally call Geissele and ask for a replacement. They probably messed up. It's not the first time. But they do have a customer service to hopefully rectify the issue. Except Bill Geissele has confirmed that is the correct size gas port. @BasementShark Did you run the 193 and Hornady 75gr with the carbine buffer. I read that as you had all sorts of issues with Tula and the carbine buffer. The 855 ran fine and locked mags back. I'd be curious how it ran with the carbine buffer, along with the 193 and Hornady. Either way, sounds like the barrel is meant to run hot ammo unsuppressed, and weak ammo would require a suppressor. However, if I misread and what you wrote with the carbine buffer wasn't just Tula, Geissele definitely needs to do something. |
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Posted: 5/24/2022 11:12:22 AM EST
[#18]
What, so don't pursue customer support because geissele said they intended for the gas ports to be too small in one post?
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Posted: 5/24/2022 11:48:12 AM EST
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted: What, so don't pursue customer support because geissele said they intended for the gas ports to be too small in one post? Where did I say that? You said they probably messed up. I was simply saying the gas port size was correct. There are simple trouble shooting tasks we should all be willing to do prior to contacting a manufacturer, especially when assembling our own guns vs buying an upper or complete rifle. He is working through those and I asked for a clarification. If he did those things he should 100% contact Geissele like I said. I would be curious if Geissele has a recommended buffer setup for these barrels. @sagmill @GACS |
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Posted: 5/24/2022 1:19:11 PM EST
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted: So, another update. After re-aligning the gas block, took the new barrel out for a shoot. I did not tinker with the buffer settings, because I wanted to see how it shot first with the new gas alignment. I started with the M855, and it shot great. Ejection pattern was 3:30-4 o'clock. Then moved on to some M193. Shot fine as well. Ejection pattern about 3-3:30 o'clock. Then some Hornady 75g Match was the about the same. The rifle shot pretty smoothly, but when I got to the end of the M193 or Hornady 223 mag, the bolt would not hold open... Which means it was basically semi-short stroking. That's not good. So then I tried something I already knew the answer to. I tried some Tula steel case 223. The first shot was a true short stroke on the ejection and malfunctioned the action. The next couple of shots didn't even eject. So. Then I decide to try a carbine weight buffer instead of an H1. Well....that was an absolute disaster that locked up the entire action. The shell fired, but then the case was locked in the chamber. I had to take the rfle apart and get a dowel rod and rubber mallet to hammer the BCG out backwards from the chamber in the upper. I couldnt have done it any other way. So, now this leaves me wondering just exactly what to do. Yes, I could take it to a machine shop or gunsmith and get the gas port drilled out to about .070+ and I'm sure it would run like a champ, but how much would that be? Another $50-$100 on an already $300 barrel? I shouldn't have to do that to run standard M193 or high quality 223 match ammo. And let's just say I do bore out the gas port, is the chamber still going to lock up if accidently get a steel round in there? I don't know. I have no problem avoiding steel in the rifle, but I just figured a so-called "duty-grade" barrel from a company like Geissele would pretty much eat anything your throw at it...but I guess not. Are you sending in your barrel to G customer service? We would be glad to take a look at it The G barrels are designed for normal M193, 855 etc. to get them to run with low powered cheap steel case plinking ammo with some of the poor quality AR parts out there the buffer needs to be an H0 and a coil removed from a mil spec spring We deliberately set this up this way so the gun runs smoother, without major gas blow back. It will not eat anything you want to throw at it, if we did for most shooters there is harsher recoil, decreased reliability, gas in your face and eyes. Not to mention an unshootable gun if you put a suppressor on it. Just to put a perspective on this since we launched our commercial barrels there have been very few complaints about gassing. The one I took care of personally was a gas block that was covering up half the hole. Again, mix and matching cheap parts. We set the fellow up with a G gas block for free and he was good to go. |
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Posted: 5/24/2022 2:47:41 PM EST
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Are you sending in your barrel to G customer service? We would be glad to take a look at it The G barrels are designed for normal M193, 855 etc. to get them to run with low powered cheap steel case plinking ammo with some of the poor quality AR parts out there the buffer needs to be an H0 and a coil removed from a mil spec spring We deliberately set this up this way so the gun runs smoother, without major gas blow back. It will not eat anything you want to throw at it, if we did for most shooters there is harsher recoil, decreased reliability, gas in your face and eyes. Not to mention an unshootable gun if you put a suppressor on it. Just to put a perspective on this since we launched our commercial barrels there have been very few complaints about gassing. The one I took care of personally was a gas block that was covering up half the hole. Again, mix and matching cheap parts. We set the fellow up with a G gas block for free and he was good to go. Thanks for jumping in and responding! |
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Posted: 5/24/2022 2:51:15 PM EST
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Looks delicious. |
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Posted: 5/24/2022 3:00:16 PM EST
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Are you sending in your barrel to G customer service? We would be glad to take a look at it The G barrels are designed for normal M193, 855 etc. to get them to run with low powered cheap steel case plinking ammo with some of the poor quality AR parts out there the buffer needs to be an H0 and a coil removed from a mil spec spring We deliberately set this up this way so the gun runs smoother, without major gas blow back. It will not eat anything you want to throw at it, if we did for most shooters there is harsher recoil, decreased reliability, gas in your face and eyes. Not to mention an unshootable gun if you put a suppressor on it. Just to put a perspective on this since we launched our commercial barrels there have been very few complaints about gassing. The one I took care of personally was a gas block that was covering up half the hole. Again, mix and matching cheap parts. We set the fellow up with a G gas block for free and he was good to go. @sagmill Are these the same barrels/gas porting as in your SD URGs and guns (Other than the 16" that have the Geissele length gas system)? |
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Posted: 5/24/2022 3:49:17 PM EST
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted: @sagmill Are these the same barrels/gas porting as in your SD URGs and guns (Other than the 16" that have the Geissele length gas system)? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Are you sending in your barrel to G customer service? We would be glad to take a look at it The G barrels are designed for normal M193, 855 etc. to get them to run with low powered cheap steel case plinking ammo with some of the poor quality AR parts out there the buffer needs to be an H0 and a coil removed from a mil spec spring We deliberately set this up this way so the gun runs smoother, without major gas blow back. It will not eat anything you want to throw at it, if we did for most shooters there is harsher recoil, decreased reliability, gas in your face and eyes. Not to mention an unshootable gun if you put a suppressor on it. Just to put a perspective on this since we launched our commercial barrels there have been very few complaints about gassing. The one I took care of personally was a gas block that was covering up half the hole. Again, mix and matching cheap parts. We set the fellow up with a G gas block for free and he was good to go. @sagmill Are these the same barrels/gas porting as in your SD URGs and guns (Other than the 16" that have the Geissele length gas system)? All our 16" guns have our Geissele midlength+ gas system. These barrels with the midlength we made for commercial sale, we dont make guns with them. 14.5" barrels are .076" with a midlength gas system If we find that the .062" on a 16" barrel has excessive issues with gas we will either open the gas port up or do two barrels, one suppressor optimized and another with a large gas port to run everything, but with detractions. |
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Posted: 5/24/2022 4:02:53 PM EST
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted: All our 16" guns have our Geissele midlength+ gas system. These barrels with the midlength we made for commercial sale, we dont make guns with them. 14.5" barrels are .076" with a midlength gas system If we find that the .062" on a 16" barrel has excessive issues with gas we will either open the gas port up or do two barrels, one suppressor optimized and another with a large gas port to run everything, but with detractions. Thanks for responding, really appreciate your reply and openness. It's interesting you went so small with the 16" commercial mid-length, but kept the 14.5" mid-length larger. May I ask what the reasoning was for that? |
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Posted: 5/24/2022 4:06:43 PM EST
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Thanks for responding, really appreciate your reply and openness. It's interesting you went so small with the 16" commercial mid-length, but kept the 14.5" mid-length larger. May I ask what the reasoning was for that? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: All our 16" guns have our Geissele midlength+ gas system. These barrels with the midlength we made for commercial sale, we dont make guns with them. 14.5" barrels are .076" with a midlength gas system If we find that the .062" on a 16" barrel has excessive issues with gas we will either open the gas port up or do two barrels, one suppressor optimized and another with a large gas port to run everything, but with detractions. Thanks for responding, really appreciate your reply and openness. It's interesting you went so small with the 16" commercial mid-length, but kept the 14.5" mid-length larger. May I ask what the reasoning was for that? Its the same gas system length. 16" has more dwell, less gas is needed. But this one example does not tell all the story on how gas ports are sized....its not linear ......for instance an 18" barrel with a midlength.......that maybe even smaller or it might be the same as the 16" |
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Posted: 5/24/2022 4:13:34 PM EST
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Its the same gas system length. 16" has more dwell, less gas is needed. But this one example does not tell all the story on how gas ports are sized....its not linear ......for instance an 18" barrel with a midlength.......that maybe even smaller or it might be the same as the 16" Got it, was just surprised by how significant the difference is. Again, appreciate you taking the time. |
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Posted: 5/24/2022 8:28:05 PM EST
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted: My Criterion CORE is also near the larger end of the spectrum. I might eventually put a BRT gas tube on it. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/28568/criterion_core_barrel_gas_port_gauge_001-2140823.jpg ... My pin gauges finally arrived...I should have bought them long ago! You have inspired me 
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Posted: 5/25/2022 4:47:27 AM EST
[#29]
Quote HistoryAre you sending in your barrel to G customer service? We would be glad to take a look at it The G barrels are designed for normal M193, 855 etc. to get them to run with low powered cheap steel case plinking ammo with some of the poor quality AR parts out there the buffer needs to be an H0 and a coil removed from a mil spec spring We deliberately set this up this way so the gun runs smoother, without major gas blow back. It will not eat anything you want to throw at it, if we did for most shooters there is harsher recoil, decreased reliability, gas in your face and eyes. Not to mention an unshootable gun if you put a suppressor on it. Just to put a perspective on this since we launched our commercial barrels there have been very few complaints about gassing. The one I took care of personally was a gas block that was covering up half the hole. Again, mix and matching cheap parts. We set the fellow up with a G gas block for free and he was good to go. Thanks for reaching out and clarifying on some of the matters that many have been wondering about. I guess I was just a bit taken aback that an H1 buffer would be too heavy to fully cycle Match grade 223 and M193. I knew was thinking that Geissele Super Duty rifles came with H2 buffers, which lead me to believe the H1 would fine. But I also do not shoot suppressed. I can also say that the Gas alignment was not an issue on the last test, as the photo below illustrates.  Perhaps maybe I'm still doing something wrong, and I'm definetly not using cheap parts on the rifle, but I guess those are things that can all be discussed further. I will definetly be contacting the service department for more information. Thank you again for reaching out. |
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Posted: 5/25/2022 6:09:21 AM EST
[#30]
Curious if you’re going to run into similar findings that “the barrel sir” did or if he just happened to get a lemon.
 Failed To Load Title |
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Posted: 5/25/2022 6:38:58 AM EST
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Are you sending in your barrel to G customer service? We would be glad to take a look at it The G barrels are designed for normal M193, 855 etc. to get them to run with low powered cheap steel case plinking ammo with some of the poor quality AR parts out there the buffer needs to be an H0 and a coil removed from a mil spec spring We deliberately set this up this way so the gun runs smoother, without major gas blow back. It will not eat anything you want to throw at it, if we did for most shooters there is harsher recoil, decreased reliability, gas in your face and eyes. Not to mention an unshootable gun if you put a suppressor on it. Are these barrels advertised as "optimized" or such, as a caveat? Seems to be a niche market item with a narrow target audience. |
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Posted: 5/25/2022 7:45:48 AM EST
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Are these barrels advertised as "optimized" or such, as a caveat? Seems to be a niche market item with a narrow target audience. Geissele CHF, Chrome Lined Barrel, 5.56 - 16" Geissele barrels are precision machined and cold hammer forged utilizing the highest quality materials at our state of the art facility in North Wales, PA to ensure the highest quality and consistency of each barrel. Our barrels are High Pressure Tested (HPT) and Magnetic Particle Inspected (MPI). The accuracy and reliability of Geissele CHF barrels makes them an ideal choice for a hard use duty weapon, precision tuned competition gun, and everything in between. |
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Posted: 5/25/2022 8:09:58 AM EST
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Curious if you’re going to run into similar findings that “the barrel sir” did or if he just happened to get a lemon.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u7nacoI_Zoohttps://www.ar15.com/forums/general/i-found-this-interesting-Geissele-Super-Duty-/5-2553167/ https://www.ar15.com/forums/general/The-returned-G-super-duty-place-your-bets-/5-2553594/ |
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Posted: 5/25/2022 8:14:29 AM EST
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Geissele CHF, Chrome Lined Barrel, 5.56 - 16" Geissele barrels are precision machined and cold hammer forged utilizing the highest quality materials at our state of the art facility in North Wales, PA to ensure the highest quality and consistency of each barrel. Our barrels are High Pressure Tested (HPT) and Magnetic Particle Inspected (MPI). The accuracy and reliability of Geissele CHF barrels makes them an ideal choice for a hard use duty weapon, precision tuned competition gun, and everything in between. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Are these barrels advertised as "optimized" or such, as a caveat? Seems to be a niche market item with a narrow target audience. Geissele CHF, Chrome Lined Barrel, 5.56 - 16" Geissele barrels are precision machined and cold hammer forged utilizing the highest quality materials at our state of the art facility in North Wales, PA to ensure the highest quality and consistency of each barrel. Our barrels are High Pressure Tested (HPT) and Magnetic Particle Inspected (MPI). The accuracy and reliability of Geissele CHF barrels makes them an ideal choice for a hard use duty weapon, precision tuned competition gun, and everything in between. "Everything in between" seems a stretch. |
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Posted: 5/25/2022 8:43:28 AM EST
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Curious if you’re going to run into similar findings that “the barrel sir” did or if he just happened to get a lemon. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u7nacoI_ZooPretty damning review done well. |
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Posted: 5/25/2022 8:45:09 AM EST
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Are these barrels advertised as "optimized" or such, as a caveat? There is no such "caveat" in any of Geissele's information on these barrels posted on their website. Geissele also quickly deleted any information about the size of the gas ports on these barrels that was posted in their Industry Partner forum on this website ... |
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Posted: 5/25/2022 9:16:38 AM EST
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Pretty damning review done well. Eh. That's guys groups with every barrel he shows in his chart aren't that great. I'd say similar to mine. I can shoot a 1.5"-2" group with match ammo pretty easily, less than an 1.5" or even an inch takes work for me and isn't as common even with a barrel and ammo capable. I rarely shoot for groups. If Molon get similar results, I will agree. |
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Posted: 5/25/2022 9:31:48 AM EST
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted: There is no such "caveat" in any of Geissele's information on these barrels posted on their website. Geissele also quickly deleted any information about the size of the gas ports on these barrels that was posted in their Industry Partner forum on this website ... Seems counterproductive in the long run. |
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Posted: 5/25/2022 9:56:07 AM EST
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Eh. That's guys groups with every barrel he shows in his chart aren't that great. I'd say similar to mine. I can shoot a 1.5"-2" group with match ammo pretty easily, less than an 1.5" or even an inch takes work for me and isn't as common even with a barrel and ammo capable. I rarely shoot for groups. If Molon get similar results, I will agree. They're 9-shot groups. The group sizes from the Colt and WOA are rather similar to what I've had myself with the same barrels (Colt and woa) and ammo, and what Molon has nicely shown as well from his own testing (often with even better barrels).  Just seems that the Geissele barrel had something wrong with it tbh. |
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Posted: 5/25/2022 10:06:51 AM EST
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted: They're 9-shot groups. The group sizes from the Colt and WOA are rather similar to what I've had myself with the same barrels (Colt and woa) and ammo, and what Molon has nicely shown as well from his own testing (often with even better barrels). https://i.imgur.com/sGjm0D7.jpg Just seems that the Geissele barrel had something wrong with it tbh. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Eh. That's guys groups with every barrel he shows in his chart aren't that great. I'd say similar to mine. I can shoot a 1.5"-2" group with match ammo pretty easily, less than an 1.5" or even an inch takes work for me and isn't as common even with a barrel and ammo capable. I rarely shoot for groups. If Molon get similar results, I will agree. They're 9-shot groups. The group sizes from the Colt and WOA are rather similar to what I've had myself with the same barrels (Colt and woa) and ammo, and what Molon has nicely shown as well from his own testing (often with even better barrels). https://i.imgur.com/sGjm0D7.jpg Just seems that the Geissele barrel had something wrong with it tbh. |
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Posted: 5/26/2022 4:37:29 PM EST
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted: They're 9-shot groups. The group sizes from the Colt and WOA are rather similar to what I've had myself with the same barrels (Colt and woa) and ammo, and what Molon has nicely shown as well from his own testing (often with even better barrels). https://i.imgur.com/sGjm0D7.jpg Just seems that the Geissele barrel had something wrong with it tbh. The only problem group I see is the 77 grain. The other groups look good. If you watch his video, he’s using an optic mount that doesn’t have the best reputation. |
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Posted: 5/26/2022 5:10:09 PM EST
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The only problem group I see is the 77 grain. The other groups look good. If you watch his video, he’s using an optic mount that doesn’t have the best reputation. You mean a Bobro mount? They're absolutely excellent optic mounts. Surely you must be confused. Still not getting why Geissele is basically selling a super reduced gas port 16" mid-length as a regular 16" mid-length. It would make more sense that they're just drilled for the wrong size (that's a standard carbine gas port size). If it's meant to be such a niche barrel, what is so damned hard about adding a product description to say "btw these are abnormally small gas ports for the gas length, so they will not function like a normal spec 16" mid-length". A company that actually cares about their customer base wouldn't be so stingy with information like that. |
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Posted: 5/26/2022 5:17:10 PM EST
[#43]
I wonder how these barrels would run with an LMT Enhanced Bolt Carrier.
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Posted: 5/26/2022 5:20:02 PM EST
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I wonder how these barrels would run with an LMT Enhanced Bolt Carrier. LMT EBCGs are meant to deal with the greater gas found in LMT barrels (which have generous gas ports) to make a more reliable combined gas system operation in particularly a 14.5" carbine gas system rifle. They are not supposed to be "throw in every AR to make more better" BCGs. They are genuinely meant to be part of an LMT system like a military M4. They're an enhancement in a super specific application, but not necessarily so in deviations from that. If anything pairing them with an already undergassed rifle would exacerbate things. Most LMT rifles are designed for the normal mil-spec BCG, as the EBCG isn't necessary. |
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Posted: 5/26/2022 5:36:06 PM EST
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted: LMT EBCGs are meant to deal with the greater gas found in LMT barrels (which have generous gas ports) to make a more reliable combined gas system operation. They are not supposed to be "throw in every AR to make more better" BCGs. If anything pairing them with an already undergassed rifle would exacerbate things. You need to do a little more research. |
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Posted: 5/26/2022 5:58:21 PM EST
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You need to do a little more research. What a great response with so much information disputing what I posted! It was designed for SOCOM to increase reliability with specifically 14.5" M4 rifles. Other than some material differences the functional differences are the cam path to allow a greater dwell time, and increased gas porting to bleed off more gas effectively (and increase dwell time). If you don't follow that, it's basically to negate the effect of too much gas from short carbine-length M4s hammering away with full pressure NATO loadings. It'll potentially have too much dwell time on longer gas systems. You can corroborate this information if you did a little research at all. |
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Posted: 5/29/2022 1:06:34 AM EST
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You mean a Bobro mount? They're absolutely excellent optic mounts. Surely you must be confused. Not quite. Have had 3 and all 3 had to be sent back for repair. There are plenty of other stories of them having issues as well. |
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Posted: 6/4/2022 7:56:22 PM EST
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted: In my experience, all my LaRue PredaTAR barrels are really, really strongly gassed in practical shooting as well. You can see it when playing with different spring weights, buffer weights, and ejection patterns. Never had it cause a problem though. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Yep, that is pretty small by about .010 on average from other barrel brands in that size/gas length For comparison, a Larue 16" mid-length barrel has a gas port diameter of 0.082". https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/28568/pin_gauge_in_gas_port_of_larue_barrel_00-2362875.jpg .. In my experience, all my LaRue PredaTAR barrels are really, really strongly gassed in practical shooting as well. You can see it when playing with different spring weights, buffer weights, and ejection patterns. Never had it cause a problem though. I put a BRT EZTUNE Gas Tube, with the equivalent of a .073 gas port, on a larue 16" mid-length. I'll be testing it in the near future. ... |
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Posted: 6/7/2022 5:39:24 PM EST
[#49]
Just got my 11.5 from midway, pin guaged the port at .061. Going to try and see how it groups with different ammo in few days.
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Posted: 6/8/2022 5:51:09 AM EST
[#50]
Run a JP polished carbine spring, not an enhanced or extra power spring. Run a carbine buffer. Run a JP LMOS carrier. That should be about perfect. More rounds seal the gas system up with carbine, the port will erode bigger and the recoil spring will weaken with time and use, all allowing greater reliability. This is like a tuned gas block for the above combo of parts in several of my rifles. It will run ammo and cycle but NEVER lock the bolt back on the last round if you swap in a full mass carrier. It sometimes stumbes unsuppressed with a full mass carrier and H buffer when new with .223 pressure ammo only, then runs that ammo fine after a few hundred rounds but will never lock the bolt with a full mass carrier.
You should be rewarded with a very soft shooting rifle that also weighs less. That won't solve your issue if it is something wrong with the barrel extension alignment, your bolt headspace or dimensions, or reciever extention. Also I have seen the issues you had with gas block screws that were too loose and vibrating loose. Very common. And could exain why putting in a lighter buffer had the opposite reaction. |
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