Armory Sponsor
|
Quoted:
Quoted:
CMON! Lets get these things to market!!!! +1 I am scared Obama will pull something at any time. I will be glad to get my hands on one of these in 9mm. Please hurry MSAR! They have expanded the size of their factory and hired new folks. I believe they were just moving into their expanded new digs a few weeks ago so it could be awhile yet before the MCS is ready to go, but obviously they're working on it and spending money on it. I get the sense that the STG-556 E4 is priority right now. The MCS is a brand new innovative design. Keep in mind that they didn't reveal (to general folks) the MCS at SHOT Show 2009 this year though with it's new design that allows for bottom ejection (ala PS90). 
Obama is just an empty suit he will not push for an AWB until Pelosi and Reid want it and Reid voted against the AWB in 1994 and against it again in 2004. Pelosi pretty much has said we need to enforce the laws we already have, and although I'm sure she would love an AWB I think her lust for power right now outweights that. Of course, if some moron goes into a school and shoots kids or something we're toast, but outside of that I think we'll be fine. |
|
Quoted:
All high cap mags will work. If it fits in a standard Glock (17, 20, 21, 22, 31, 37) it will fit in our stock Yes I realize that so I guess I should have been clearer. I heard a rumor that MSAR was going to make propritory mags for the MCS. Did I hear wrong? Thx |
|
Quoted:
Quoted:
All high cap mags will work. If it fits in a standard Glock (17, 20, 21, 22, 31, 37) it will fit in our stock Yes I realize that so I guess I should have been clearer. I heard a rumor that MSAR was going to make propritory mags for the MCS. Did I hear wrong? Thx If it fits in a Glock pistol, it will fit in the MCS. |
|
Quoted:
Quoted:
This is the first Ive heard that. The plan has always been to use Glock mags for the obvious reasons (plentiful, Police Issue, etc). BUT THEY'D BE SOOOOOOOO COOL!!!! http://i484.photobucket.com/albums/rr205/firecop/stglock.jpg KABOOM! It would be like a nuclear blast. |
|
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Dang it, I have loads of 19 mags...  PLEASE, PLEASE TAKE G19 MAGS!!  +1 TONS AND TONS of G19 mags here as well as two G19 pistols. That's the whole reason I was interested in this carbine in the first place. I have two RRA 9mm AR's also. May want to pick up some of the Korean G17 mags asap. |
|
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Dang it, I have loads of 19 mags... PLEASE, PLEASE TAKE G19 MAGS!! +1 TONS AND TONS of G19 mags here as well as two G19 pistols. That's the whole reason I was interested in this carbine in the first place. I have two RRA 9mm AR's also. May want to pick up some of the Korean G17 mags asap. Nope. If the carbine doesn't take G19 mags I don't need it. I'm not going to buy another type of mag. |
|
Quoted:
Maybe they will make the first ones to take 17 mags and longer, then sell a stock later on that works with 19 mags? That was all in fun...I couldn't resist  wganz ~>  <~HK_DUDE
Probably be more like the Glock grip reduction services where G17's are frame shortened to use G19 mags. Given that the G19 is probably the most popular pistol on the planet, it would make marketing sense to go with a G19 format as the factory standard. I'll confess that I'm not a mechanical engineer and there may be valid structural integrity issues that require the use of a G17 length mag well. Given their track record of listening to their customer base, I'm sure that the G17 vs. G19 length is being debated now. |
|
Quoted:
Quoted:
Given their track record of listening to their customer base, I'm sure that the G17 vs. G19 length is being debated now. Heavily A stock or pistol that can take G19 mags can also take G17 mags, but the reverse is not true. Also, some states are limited to a 15 round mag capactiy. And a G19 mag can have a +2 base pad added to get to the same capacity as a G17 mag. That should answer your question right there. A 33 rounder is already going to protrude, if the concern is one of over-insertion, make a simple polymer sleeve that can be slipped over a G17 mag to prevent over-insertion, and the same to boot for the 33 round magazines. |
| I understand wanting it to take G19 mags but the more demands that y'all make, the longer the delay in releasing the gun might be. And with another AWB looming, that is NOT a good thing. My vote is for MSAR to just get the damn thing into production in its current state, which I believe is as close to perfect as one can reasonably hope for. Just my $0.02. |
|
Quoted:
I understand wanting it to take G19 mags but the more demands that y'all make, the longer the delay in releasing the gun might be. And with another AWB looming, that is NOT a good thing. My vote is for MSAR to just get the damn thing into production in its current state, which I believe is as close to perfect as one can reasonably hope for. Just my $0.02. Exactly. I don't know about you guys, but I carry G17 mags for my backups for my G19 In the event I actually need the 2nd and 3rd magazine (not likely), I think the capacity would be needed. Terry |
|
We have a thread going about this on another gunboard I follow (Something Awful's "The Firing Range") and a bunch of folks there said the same thing about G19 mags, so that's a separate pool from ARF that came to the same conclusion.
One fellow mentioned that he dremeled his Kel-Tec SUB2000 to take 19 mags, but wouldn't be willing to do that to a $1000+ MSAR. Again, since shortering the magwell seems like such a minor change, I'd hope it could be easily done with little hassle before the "final draft" of the mould for the MCS is made. Thinking on it more, I'd say I'm more excited about the MCS than the STG556. I'm still up in the air about MSAR vs. Sabre/Steyr vs. waiting for the .223 Kel-Tec RFB in 18mo or so and just getting an XCR now. However, if I can get a $1000ish AUG that suppresses easier than the 5.56 (directs the gas/noise downward vice towards me ear), I could really swing that direction. |
|
MSAR Consider:
1. What takes a G19 mag will take the G17 mag. (Lots of G19 owners and mags out there already) 2. Thread pitch at least on my 9mm cans is 1/2 - 28. (Don't know if that is standard, but it is what my SWR cans are) Thanks for the great work and customer support. You guys really are terrific!!!!!!!!! |
 Please help guys
I am not a stranger to pistols however I am to 'scary black' guns. That said I have the resources to commit to one high risk ban firearm I wish to use: 1. Home defense 2. Relatively cheap for ammo for practice (and some fun!) 3. To help & join a militia I realize no gun will be the 'ultimate' weapon, & I realize you must match the right firearm (like a tool) to the job at hand. However with this said I have decided on a STG-556. Whether short 14" barrel with a Class 3 OR the 6.8 conversion with a 20", it seems to have the bases covered. Just before purchasing however I read about all these variants like the E4, the Carbine version, and even the Heavy Barrel version over at Rat Worx. Now I am confused. And anxious.... with prices going up, the Obama Spectre, and drawn out waits for these other guns, I am getting the shakes worse than Red Bull! Any thoughts? BTW, since I don't own other rifles (like the AR-15) I assume the E4 would be pointless? Or are there other features to consider? |
|
Quoted:
Please help guys
I am not a stranger to pistols however I am to 'scary black' guns. That said I have the resources to commit to one high risk ban firearm I wish to use: 1. Home defense 2. Relatively cheap for ammo for practice (and some fun!) 3. To help & join a militia I realize no gun will be the 'ultimate' weapon, & I realize you must match the right firearm (like a tool) to the job at hand. However with this said I have decided on a STG-556. Whether short 14" barrel with a Class 3 OR the 6.8 conversion with a 20", it seems to have the bases covered. Just before purchasing however I read about all these variants like the E4, the Carbine version, and even the Heavy Barrel version over at Rat Worx. Now I am confused. And anxious.... with prices going up, the Obama Spectre, and drawn out waits for these other guns, I am getting the shakes worse than Red Bull! Any thoughts? BTW, since I don't own other rifles (like the AR-15) I assume the E4 would be pointless? Or are there other features to consider? If currently don't own any rifles at all, start out with a Ruger 10/22, or some other inexpensive 22LR. Everyone needs at least one 22 rifle. Great practice, cheap ammo, they last forever, etc. For a centerfire HD rifle, I would start with an AR-15. There are more mags, parts, accessories, etc. available for it, and they can be had for less $$$ than the STG. They are a common weapon and most rifle instructors specialize in the AR. For cheap practice, you can install a 22LR conversion kit and blaze away all day for a few bucks. There are also caliber conversions for just about anything else you can conceive. I love AUG's, but wouldn't be without an AR. |
|
Quoted:
Please help guys
I am not a stranger to pistols however I am to 'scary black' guns. That said I have the resources to commit to one high risk ban firearm I wish to use: 1. Home defense 2. Relatively cheap for ammo for practice (and some fun!) 3. To help & join a militia I realize no gun will be the 'ultimate' weapon, & I realize you must match the right firearm (like a tool) to the job at hand. However with this said I have decided on a STG-556. Whether short 14" barrel with a Class 3 OR the 6.8 conversion with a 20", it seems to have the bases covered. Just before purchasing however I read about all these variants like the E4, the Carbine version, and even the Heavy Barrel version over at Rat Worx. Now I am confused. And anxious.... with prices going up, the Obama Spectre, and drawn out waits for these other guns, I am getting the shakes worse than Red Bull! Any thoughts? BTW, since I don't own other rifles (like the AR-15) I assume the E4 would be pointless? Or are there other features to consider? The 6.8 SPC conversion kit for the MSAR has not been done yet or at least is not currently available for sale and there has been no date provided on when to expect it. The 14" barrels I have not seen, but the 20" and 16" barrels are available and with the bullpup STG layout you get 27" in overall length with a 16" barrel which is almost on par with the length of a 10.5 inch AR in terms of overall length. The heavy barrel versions are nice, but those barrels are not interchangeable from my understanding with other MSAR receivers and are matched to the specific receiver. The STG-556E4 that takes the AR magazines has additional improvements/add ons in that it has an improved ejection port cover, improved bolt release lever, raised standard optic, textured body and AR style pistol grip along with additional rail attachment points over standard STG-556 rifles. The STG-556E4 is not yet available, but will be available within months. You're going to pay slightly more for the STG-556E4 than the currently available STG-556 rifle. The Modular Carbine System (MCS) is a pistol caliber semi-automatic carbine that has a downward ejection like the PS90 and will use standard Glock Magazines. It is not yet available for purchase it will be probably summer time before we see it at best. The standard STG-556 as available now in GEN V configuration and of course all earlier configurations will be fully supported and the orginal STG-556 as MSAR largest selling rifle will be going nowhere so it will continue to be available for as long as MSAR can legally sell rifles in a free land. Regarding your goals the STG-556 is an excellent rifle for home defense and for civilians with limited mechanical experience with rifles. It's a meat and potatos rifle that is based on a design that was intended to provide conscripts with a very simple weapons platform that would fill a variety of needs. It's short stroke gas piston system provides dependable and clean operation that reduces heat transfer to the bolt and provides for less heat wear and stronger longer lasting parts over direct impingement systems. The ability to adjust the gas system without tools also provides for improved reliability under adverse conditions. The large trigger guard also provides for ease of use with winter gloves or CBN gloves. The biggest and most important advantage of the STG-556 is that of the "bullpup" length. The bullpup length provides to folks a way to have a short overall length without loss of barrel length. This means that the rifle acts well within tight confines of a home, but can go out doors and put rounds on targets at intermediary distances while still maintaining sufficient velocity for the .223 of 5.56NATO round to fragment properly thanks to the fact that it maintains a 16" barrel. This makes the STG-556 among only a handful of rifles available within the U.S. well suited for both close quarters defense and to do what the Second Amendment was written for and that's defend against tyranny of a government whether foreign or domestic. There is a draw back to the STG-556 though and that's simply put "cost." It is more expensive than Direct Impingment AR's or long stroke piston AK-47s. However, it is on par with most and even cheaper than some Gas Piston AR rifles. It has parts that while available for purchase are more expensive than AR or AK parts. It has magazines (now both MSAR or AUG) that are more expensive than AR or AK magazines (although the STG-556E4 will accept AR mags when it comes out). If you are looking to be a member of a militia unit than logistical reason may dictate that you carry a cheaper platform simply to keep parts commonality. However, I would like to point out that not all AR parts work well with each other so the fact that a militia group may use largely AR's does not mean that all parts will interchange well together. Keep in mind though that if SHTF and we ended up living Mad Max or the government came in and shut down all firearms production including production of their parts it would be more difficult to locate and purchase STG parts over that of older and more common rifles like the AR or the AK. The thing that doesn't make the STG-556E4's ability to accept AR magazines "worthless" even if you don't already own an AR is that if you are fighting the Russians that have just landed behind your local high school screaming "Wolverines" you will be able to use your buddies AR magazines whereas if you're using the standard STG-556 you're going to really have to be dependent on your own magazines or get lucky to know folks like those here who can build a fort from AUG and/or MSAR magazines. |
|
I appreciated greatly these responses. Helps much.
The E4 sounds promising. Thing is that despite your (MSARs) great customer service and track record, I nevertheless hear that MSAR is victim like many manufactures to the disease known as 'vaporware'. With the current climate I can't blame you tho. I heard from a MSAR rep by phone that you have already reduced (completely)?) manufacture of accessories to "get the guns out". Since the STG 556 certainly sells, how committed is MSAR to a firm release commitment for the E4 & Carbine? This seems uncertain that you would ramp up production for a whole new line of guns that still need first Gen 'Beta testing' when the entire market may shut down? My reason for being difficult is obvious: I do NOT want to wait, then told another 4 months, etc. then miss out on getting even a STG556 for at least a reasonable price as they are now. Sorry for putting you on the spot my friend SilentType
One last question for all rifle owners.... what is the excitement over the carbine version? Obviously I am the naive one here but it seems to fire 'simply' pistol caliber which will have a much shorter range thus utilizing less of the Bullpup rifle design. Better accuracy I gather. I assume the carbine would be more strictly for home defense or close quarter skirmish? |
|
Well, if the E4 and MCS are vaporware, I have been doing alot of work for nothing. Both are already in testing, they will come. All i can ask for is patience, I know that is exactly what you didnt want to hear, but they are coming. Both rifles will be out in less than 5 months
|
|
Quoted:
I appreciated greatly these responses. Helps much. The E4 sounds promising. Thing is that despite your (MSARs) great customer service and track record, I nevertheless hear that MSAR is victim like many manufactures to the disease known as 'vaporware'. With the current climate I can't blame you tho. I heard from a MSAR rep by phone that you have already reduced (completely)?) manufacture of accessories to "get the guns out". Since the STG 556 certainly sells, how committed is MSAR to a firm release commitment for the E4 & Carbine? This seems uncertain that you would ramp up production for a whole new line of guns that still need first Gen 'Beta testing' when the entire market may shut down? My reason for being difficult is obvious: I do NOT want to wait, then told another 4 months, etc. then miss out on getting even a STG556 for at least a reasonable price as they are now. Sorry for putting you on the spot my friend SilentType
One last question for all rifle owners.... what is the excitement over the carbine version? Obviously I am the naive one here but it seems to fire 'simply' pistol caliber which will have a much shorter range thus utilizing less of the Bullpup rifle design. Better accuracy I gather. I assume the carbine would be more strictly for home defense or close quarter skirmish? Bill, Thank you for the interest in our products. I would like to clear up a few things. First of all we currently produce all of our accessories and I have in stock and can ship anything you need today, I can have anything you need on your doorstep tomorrow. I would love for you to get me the name of the very poorly informed "MSAR" rep who told you different. We have not and will not slow down on production of accessories. We do not have a firm release date for the E4 or the carbine because we want to be sure we get it right. We are however very committed to the production of the MCS carbine and our other firearm that will be released at the same time. Construction is currently underway on our entire new 100,000 square foot factory that will produce these two weapons. The MCS carbine is something that I think is worthy of excitement. With its bottom ejection, ambi features, 4.5 lb weight, and the ability to use readily available glock mags as well as our own 30 round mags, it is a great weapon. With the distances that it was meant to be used, the 6 calibers that it will be available in our quite sufficient for any intended purpose. If you can't get it done with 30 rounds of 10mm out of a 16" barrel my friend, you have one hell of a problem that no "rifle cartridge" will fix! Dave Robertson MSAR |
|
Quoted:
Quoted:
I appreciated greatly these responses. Helps much. The E4 sounds promising. Thing is that despite your (MSARs) great customer service and track record, I nevertheless hear that MSAR is victim like many manufactures to the disease known as 'vaporware'. With the current climate I can't blame you tho. I heard from a MSAR rep by phone that you have already reduced (completely)?) manufacture of accessories to "get the guns out". Since the STG 556 certainly sells, how committed is MSAR to a firm release commitment for the E4 & Carbine? This seems uncertain that you would ramp up production for a whole new line of guns that still need first Gen 'Beta testing' when the entire market may shut down? My reason for being difficult is obvious: I do NOT want to wait, then told another 4 months, etc. then miss out on getting even a STG556 for at least a reasonable price as they are now. Sorry for putting you on the spot my friend SilentType
One last question for all rifle owners.... what is the excitement over the carbine version? Obviously I am the naive one here but it seems to fire 'simply' pistol caliber which will have a much shorter range thus utilizing less of the Bullpup rifle design. Better accuracy I gather. I assume the carbine would be more strictly for home defense or close quarter skirmish? Bill, Thank you for the interest in our products. I would like to clear up a few things. First of all we currently produce all of our accessories and I have in stock and can ship anything you need today, I can have anything you need on your doorstep tomorrow. I would love for you to get me the name of the very poorly informed "MSAR" rep who told you different. We have not and will not slow down on production of accessories. We do not have a firm release date for the E4 or the carbine because we want to be sure we get it right. We are however very committed to the production of the MCS carbine and our other firearm that will be released at the same time. Construction is currently underway on our entire new 100,000 square foot factory that will produce these two weapons. The MCS carbine is something that I think is worthy of excitement. With its bottom ejection, ambi features, 4.5 lb weight, and the ability to use readily available glock mags as well as our own 30 round mags, it is a great weapon. With the distances that it was meant to be used, the 6 calibers that it will be available in our quite sufficient for any intended purpose. If you can't get it done with 30 rounds of 10mm out of a 16" barrel my friend, you have one hell of a problem that no "rifle cartridge" will fix! Dave Robertson MSAR I was never a fan of the "Bullpup"design,then I purchased a MSAR.One range trip,I realized how great the bullpups are, so I bought a PS90. With that being said.....I CAN NOT WAIT FOR THE MCS!!!!!!! Make mine a 9mm for Glock mags. |
|
Quoted: < snip > Thank you very much for the news from the inside. I almost bought a STG yesterday, but I'm still crossing my fingers and holding my breath for the E4 –– I'm(way too invested/committed to AR mags to switch at this point and the E4 will make it more practical for me to buy 2 (maybe 3  ) STGs instead of just one and a load of proprietary mags. Really looking forward to its release. Ditto on the MCS (Glock junkie as well...).  |
|
I say make it take g17 mags and get it out already. I guess im one of the different people out there, i dont care what mags it takes, i just want one. Yes i have a g19 and about 30 mags for it, 20 of which are brand new in the wrap, but i could care less if they work with this gun or not. I dont buy more ar15s because i have a few mags for them, i buy them cause each is different and has a different feel and use. Saying you wont buy this gun because you will have to spend another 22 dollars on a glock mag is, to me, dumb. I buy great guns because they are great, not because of what mags they take. I mean if you gona make it take g19 mags, why not make it take sub compact mags? im sure there are lots of people out there who own sub compact glocks. . .
Ill buy it, i dont care if it takes 15 rounders, or 17 rounders. . . im putting 33 rounders in it anyways
{at |
|
Quoted:
I say make it take g17 mags and get it out already. I guess im one of the different people out there, i dont care what mags it takes, i just want one. Yes i have a g19 and about 30 mags for it, 20 of which are brand new in the wrap, but i could care less if they work with this gun or not. I dont buy more ar15s because i have a few mags for them, i buy them cause each is different and has a different feel and use. Saying you wont buy this gun because you will have to spend another 22 dollars on a glock mag is, to me, dumb. I buy great guns because they are great, not because of what mags they take. I mean if you gona make it take g19 mags, why not make it take sub compact mags? im sure there are lots of people out there who own sub compact glocks. . . Ill buy it, i dont care if it takes 15 rounders, or 17 rounders. . . im putting 33 rounders in it anyways
{at I have 2 brand new factory 33 round mags and I don't even own a 9mm Glock yet. I'm wondering if I should get some more or just wait things out. |
Armory Sponsor