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Posted: 5/9/2024 8:01:12 AM EDT
Looks like PSA is finally starting to sell their in house 7.62x39. A 122gr FMJ load is supposedly coming, but the first load out of the starting gates was a AAC "SABRE BLADE BLACK TIP" 7.62X39MM 123 GRAIN load. This is loaded in a boxer primed steel case with "Soviet Slick" coating.
Obviously not a huge fan of .55cpr steel cased x39, but there is a better than FMJ bullet in there, and the boxer priming means you should be able to reload the steel cases without having to find, or already posess, Berdan primers. So, how many cycles have folks gotten out of COMBLOC steel cased ammo? I know DF3 and others have loaded x39, .223, and .45, but the x39 and .223 seem more applicable, due to the bottleneck and higher pressures. Trying to decide if I should pick up some of this ammo with the idea of getting an initial factory loading and then handload the cases afterwards. Doesn't make much sense if I'm only going to get 1-2 cycles from it before case necks start splitting, but 3-4 or more could make it worth the time and money. Should be easier to police up cases as well. Just get a contractor magnet and start sweeping  Thanks |
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Posted: 5/9/2024 9:20:38 AM EDT
[#1]
I’ve loaded both boxer primed and berdan primed steel cases. At one point, almost all of the steel case .223 cases from a couple makers was boxer primed. And I didn’t even segregate them out, I just loaded them like everything else.
I typically lose them before they’d wear out-AKs flinging casings the way they do. I also tended to use those in situations where I might not be able to recover my casings. What I can tell you is that steel cases don’t stretch like brass cases do. And so they don’t need trimming anywhere near as much as brass cases do, which is nice. Also, don’t use your chamfer tool for your brass on steel cases. It’ll wear out pretty quickly. Get a regular HSS chamfer tool/countersink to chamfer your steel cases. |
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Posted: 5/9/2024 9:22:23 AM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By mace2364: I’ve loaded both boxer primed and berdan primed steel cases. At one point, almost all of the steel case .223 cases from a couple makers was boxer primed. And I didn’t even segregate them out, I just loaded them like everything else. I typically lose them before they’d wear out-AKs flinging casings the way they do. I also tended to use those in situations where I might not be able to recover my casings. What I can tell you is that steel cases don’t stretch like brass cases do. And so they don’t need trimming anywhere near as much as brass cases do, which is nice. Also, don’t use your chamfer tool for your brass on steel cases. It’ll wear out pretty quickly. Get a regular HSS chamfer tool/countersink to chamfer your steel cases. Thanks for the info. Did you have issues with shaving bullet jackets if you didn't chamfer the case mouth on steel cases? |
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Posted: 5/9/2024 9:55:22 AM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By towerofpower94: Thanks for the info. Did you have issues with shaving bullet jackets if you didn't chamfer the case mouth on steel cases? Sometimes. Enough that I usually hit them with a chamfer tool regardless before I load them anyway. |
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GEO
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Posted: 5/9/2024 10:03:05 AM EDT
[#4]
I played with steel once.
At 23 reloadings of a 223 I finally lost the casing I was keeping track of. If I had a stay supply of steel 223 I would reload them. |
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Posted: 5/9/2024 10:05:21 AM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By GeorgiaBII: I played with steel once. At 23 reloadings of a 223 I finally lost the casing I was keeping track of. If I had a stay supply of steel 223 I would reload them. Wow, 23 cycles through a resizing die and rifle is pretty impressive. Was it a full house load, or a powder puff? I wonder if running at/near max pressure would decrease case life, or is it irrelevant? |
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Posted: 5/9/2024 11:32:48 AM EDT
[Last Edit: dryflash3]
[#6]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By towerofpower94: Thanks for the info. Did you have issues with shaving bullet jackets if you didn't chamfer the case mouth on steel cases?  Left case expanded with M die, case on right not expanded. Bullet is my home cast powder coated 155 gr GC from a 6 gang Lee mold.  50 ready to seat.  Seated not crimped yet.  Finished. I use 2400 powder and this load cycles my AK's just fine. Feels like a 3/4 power load when compared to Wolf.  OP left out 9mm, these are Boxer primed Win econo loading a buddy was shooting. Have 3 reloading cycles on them. Only fired some 223 steel once, no case failures. In 7.62x39 (Berdan primed) I have seen failures after 3-4 loadings, I just toss them and keep on loading and shooting the rest. I always bring a magnet mounted to a stick to pick up steel cases at the range. Why not it's free? |
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Posted: 5/9/2024 11:45:35 AM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By dryflash3: Never an issue for me as I use a Lyman M die to expand the case mouths https://i.imgur.com/nn6aucUl.jpg Left case expanded with M die, case on right not expanded. Bullet is my home cast powder coated 155 gr GC from a 6 gang Lee mold. https://i.imgur.com/dEOQMYhl.jpg 50 ready to seat. https://i.imgur.com/2Qt7usgl.jpg Seated not crimped yet. https://i.imgur.com/Agi6Nzml.jpg Finished. I use 2400 powder and this load cycles my AK's just fine. Feels like a 3/4 power load when compared to Wolf. https://i.imgur.com/R4ZRg9Gl.jpg OP left out 9mm, these are Boxer primed Win econo loading a buddy was shooting. Have 3 reloading cycles on them. Only fired some 223 steel once, no case failures. In 7.62x39 (Berdan primed) I have seen failures after 3-4 loadings, I just toss them and keep on loading and shooting the rest. I always bring a magnet mounted to a stick to pick up steel cases at the range. Why not it's free? Thanks DF3, figured you'd have some info on this topic. If I get a case of it, I'll mark the PSA steel to make it easier to separate them from COMBLOC steel via exterior visual inspection, since I don't have any Berdan primers. |
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Posted: 5/9/2024 12:00:50 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By towerofpower94: Thanks DF3, figured you'd have some info on this topic. If I get a case of it, I'll mark the PSA steel to make it easier to separate them from COMBLOC steel via exterior visual inspection, since I don't have any Berdan primers. To clean rusty steel cases, (the only thing I use walnut for) I dry tumble in walnut/with Nu finish added. Not going for bling here, just rust removal. Most clean up nicely. Couple hours. Really rusted cases go in AK. AR in 7.62x39 get no rust cases. Just how I roll. |
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Posted: 5/9/2024 1:57:43 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By dryflash3: Ya it's been 15 or so years since Berdan primers were available. Glad I stocked deep back then. To clean rusty steel cases, (the only thing I use walnut for) I dry tumble in walnut/with Nu finish added. Not going for bling here, just rust removal. Most clean up nicely. Couple hours. Really rusted cases go in AK. AR in 7.62x39 get no rust cases. Just how I roll. Not to quibble with you, but I bought most of my Berdan primers around 2020. I think they’re labeled Fort Smith something or other, and I bought them directly from them. But they’re Tula. You had to buy a whole sleeve, so I ended up with quite a few. I typically just toss the casings if they have any rust on them. If you haven’t had any issues with them, I might not be quite as persnickety with them going forward. |
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Posted: 5/9/2024 4:14:55 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By mace2364: Not to quibble with you, but I bought most of my Berdan primers around 2020. I think they're labeled Fort Smith something or other, and I bought them directly from them. But they're Tula. You had to buy a whole sleeve, so I ended up with quite a few. I typically just toss the casings if they have any rust on them. If you haven't had any issues with them, I might not be quite as persnickety with them going forward. Mine are Tula primers. |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 5:32:35 AM EDT
[#11]
I don’t really understand PSA making Boxer primed steel cases- just use brass!
Great, they have some special coating on them! Now I can’t wet tumble them most likely. Probably can dry tumble them, which I am not a fan of except for final polishing. Just a weird choice. AK’s will shoot brass cased just fine… |
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NC, USA
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Posted: 5/10/2024 8:27:00 AM EDT
[#12]
I loaded 223 in steel cases.
The will usually split at the neck high 20’s low 30’s was the average I would get out of a case. Used 55 gr fmjbt so I never saw metal shavings |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 8:29:50 AM EDT
[#13]
I really miss boxer primed steel-cased .223, it loaded as easily as pistol ammo.
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Posted: 5/10/2024 6:37:13 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By tac556: I don’t really understand PSA making Boxer primed steel cases- just use brass! Great, they have some special coating on them! Now I can’t wet tumble them most likely. Probably can dry tumble them, which I am not a fan of except for final polishing. Just a weird choice. AK’s will shoot brass cased just fine… I suspect the answer there lies in material cost. Take a look at scrap brass vs scrap steel prices and I think you’ll see what I mean. |
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Posted: 5/11/2024 7:49:49 AM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By mace2364: I suspect the answer there lies in material cost. Take a look at scrap brass vs scrap steel prices and I think you’ll see what I mean. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By mace2364: Originally Posted By tac556: I don’t really understand PSA making Boxer primed steel cases- just use brass! Great, they have some special coating on them! Now I can’t wet tumble them most likely. Probably can dry tumble them, which I am not a fan of except for final polishing. Just a weird choice. AK’s will shoot brass cased just fine… I suspect the answer there lies in material cost. Take a look at scrap brass vs scrap steel prices and I think you’ll see what I mean. I assumed raw material cost, along with the idea of replacing the imported steel cased ammo people are used to buying for their AKs with a domestic source, played a role. |
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Posted: 5/11/2024 8:24:39 AM EDT
[#16]
Are y’all using carbide dies on the steel case or will a normal die work?
And any full length sizing ? |
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Posted: 5/11/2024 8:42:07 AM EDT
[#17]
With the steel 7.62x39 cases, I just use a regular Lee die. I bought an extra expander and ground the tip off for the berdan cases.
For the others, I just use whatever die I’m already using for that caliber. Or I guess put another way, I don’t really do anything special for steel cases. |
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Posted: 5/11/2024 12:03:23 PM EDT
[#18]
I use regular steel dies for 223, and 7.62x39.
Lube the same as brass cases. I use the home made lube |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 1:25:10 PM EDT
[#19]
Anything you can add to the coating on the outside of the steel cases to prevent rusting and aid in extraction like the original polymer coating?
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Posted: 5/12/2024 1:53:12 PM EDT
[#20]
It's never been an issue for me.
When I get home from the range I dry tumble them in walnut with a little Nu finish. Couple hours removes any rust and is all the coating needed. |
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Posted: 5/12/2024 11:44:51 PM EDT
[#21]
Honestly the rusted up factory Wolf ammo witht the polymer coating still worked fine. Looked terrible, but it works. Shellac is 100% better in my opinion though.
Will be interesting to find out what exactly PSA uses for their coating. |
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USA
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Posted: 5/13/2024 3:58:12 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By dryflash3: Never an issue for me as I use a Lyman M die to expand the case mouths https://i.imgur.com/nn6aucUl.jpg Left case expanded with M die, case on right not expanded. Bullet is my home cast powder coated 155 gr GC from a 6 gang Lee mold. https://i.imgur.com/dEOQMYhl.jpg 50 ready to seat. https://i.imgur.com/2Qt7usgl.jpg Seated not crimped yet. https://i.imgur.com/Agi6Nzml.jpg Finished. I use 2400 powder and this load cycles my AK's just fine. Feels like a 3/4 power load when compared to Wolf. https://i.imgur.com/R4ZRg9Gl.jpg OP left out 9mm, these are Boxer primed Win econo loading a buddy was shooting. Have 3 reloading cycles on them. Only fired some 223 steel once, no case failures. In 7.62x39 (Berdan primed) I have seen failures after 3-4 loadings, I just toss them and keep on loading and shooting the rest. I always bring a magnet mounted to a stick to pick up steel cases at the range. Why not it's free? Been year since I took a gander in this part of Arfcom. - and back years ago, DryFlash3 was loading steel cases even then! The man has long experience here. Never had a problem with the Ruskie 45ACP cases, but they did tend to crack after the 3rd reload. If you find a steel case that has been stepped on or is out-of-round, toss it. It is not worth it. With brass, my dies usually can iron-out the brass and I can save the case. But a stepped-on 45 case cost me a carbide .45 die; cracked the ring. It wasn’t an expensive die, but still. Love reloading steel generally though. Takes the sting outta losing cases in the weeds. |
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Posted: 5/13/2024 4:11:06 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Dominion21: Been year since I took a gander in this part of Arfcom. - and back years ago, DryFlash3 was loading steel cases even then! The man has long experience here. Never had a problem with the Ruskie 45ACP cases, but they did tend to crack after the 3rd reload. If you find a steel case that has been stepped on or is out-of-round, toss it. It is not worth it. With brass, my dies usually can iron-out the brass and I can save the case. But a stepped-on 45 case cost me a carbide .45 die; cracked the ring. It wasn't an expensive die, but still. Love reloading steel generally though. Takes the sting outta losing cases in the weeds. 
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