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Posted: 8/24/2026 9:37:38 AM EDT
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I've been gearing up to load a couple calibers and the Lee Second Edition of Modern Reloading doesn't have a recipe for either of the calibers I've settled on. I don't think I've put the cart before the horse, but I could have. We found starting and maximum charging points for the 6.5 Grendel, but this Lee manual doesn't have what I'm looking for with the 30-06. Is it poor form to ask for someone here to find this information on the 30-06 for me? Specs.: Single shot Encore.24" barrel. Hornady 178gr. 3.22" OAL to the lands. H4350 powder. CCI 200 primers. |
"Some of the greatest dads I've ever seen weren't so much perfect as they were willing to work hard to overcome their failings. Does that make sense?"
Yes. Yes it does.
Yes. Yes it does.
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Good morning all, OP Data from Hornady 11th Ed.: H4350 powder and 176gr to 180gr varrious Hornady bullets; start charge 46.5gr yeilds 2300fps---max charge 55.3gr yeilds 2650fps. Hornady tested C.O.A.L. = 3.220 for all their 178gr bullets. Hornady test rifle: Winchester Mod 70, 23.75 inch barrel, 1-10 twist rate. Case: Hornady Primer: Winchester Large Rifle. Hodgedon has a free web-site with plenty of data for H4350 as well. Welcome to the forum and always: Have fun and stay safe. |
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Powder manufacturers usually list load data on their sites. There are loads listed for 30-06 with H4350 at the link. https://hodgdonreloading.com/rldc/ |
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Originally Posted By xCLAYBUSTERx: Powder manufacturers usually list load data on their sites. There are loads listed for 30-06 with H4350 at the link. https://hodgdonreloading.com/rldc/ Thank you both for the replies! That link doesn't give me 178gr. Should I work with the 175gr or 180gr data? |
"Some of the greatest dads I've ever seen weren't so much perfect as they were willing to work hard to overcome their failings. Does that make sense?"
Yes. Yes it does.
Yes. Yes it does.
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Originally Posted By paduce: High again OP The data you look at will be for safe places to start. You'll be making your own data using your own components and technique unique to your firearm. You'll be seeing what works best for your specific style and most of all the firearm. Cool. Thank you. |
"Some of the greatest dads I've ever seen weren't so much perfect as they were willing to work hard to overcome their failings. Does that make sense?"
Yes. Yes it does.
Yes. Yes it does.
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You're very welcome Great aspect of forums like this is that when data gets posted it becomes a part of a vast searchable data-set. Example: My December, 1941 date M1 Garand shoots lights-out with 46.5gr of Shooters World Match powder under a Hornady 155gr A-MAX bullet, lit by a Federal 210Match large rifle primer. The above data is now available to anyone searching around the world. So keep us updated on what works for your Encore, the data is very valuable. |
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To the OP #1 The Lee Manual is not original data they generated. It is a POS. For handgun you want the Lyman Manual. In general it is best to the have manual from brand of bullets you are loading. #2 With rifle brass you need to be aware that each brand of brass has a different internal case capacity. So a load worked up in Federal brass is not going to work in Winchester brass. #3 Invest in the Hornady Manual. Once can never have enough manuals. You can get an app on your smart phone. #4 You do not want to be engaging the lands this can spike the pressure. Follow the COAL of the OEM (Hornady) |
jme and I am a NRA Endowment Member
Don't be too timid and squeamish about your actions. All life is an experiment. The more experiments you make the better.
R W Emerson
Don't be too timid and squeamish about your actions. All life is an experiment. The more experiments you make the better.
R W Emerson
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Originally Posted By rn22723: To the OP #1 The Lee Manual is not original data they generated. It is a POS. For handgun you want the Lyman Manual. In general it is best to the have manual from brand of bullets you are loading. #2 With rifle brass you need to be aware that each brand of brass has a different internal case capacity. So a load worked up in Federal brass is not going to work in Winchester brass. #3 Invest in the Hornady Manual. Once can never have enough manuals. You can get an app on your smart phone. #4 You do not want to be engaging the lands this can spike the pressure. Follow the COAL of the OEM (Hornady) Another chunk of good info. Thank you! First, I was planning on backing the OAL off to 3.20". Second, I'm not going to load anything until I'm 100% sure of what I'm doing. And right now I'm not sure, so I'll keep learning... Thanks again. |
"Some of the greatest dads I've ever seen weren't so much perfect as they were willing to work hard to overcome their failings. Does that make sense?"
Yes. Yes it does.
Yes. Yes it does.
|
Being nervous is a good sign. It indicates that you know the physics at play here and respect the forces that are about to be unleashed right against your cheek. Your Encore is a well built firearm and should put a smile on your face putting bullets precisely where you want them to go. Just wondering out load what (if any) factory rounds you may have tried so far? |
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Originally Posted By paduce: You're very welcome Great aspect of forums like this is that when data gets posted it becomes a part of a vast searchable data-set. Example: My December, 1941 date M1 Garand shoots lights-out with 46.5gr of Shooters World Match powder under a Hornady 155gr A-MAX bullet, lit by a Federal 210Match large rifle primer. The above data is now available to anyone searching around the world. So keep us updated on what works for your Encore, the data is very valuable. Thank you for this post! Great perspective, and I'll give a little history on this gun. Single shot Encore. 24" barrel. 150gr. Sierra Game King 58.5gr. IMR4350 3.26" OAL ( 3.28" to the lands) 3005 fps. 3/4" at 100 yds My B-I-L and I worked up this load back in the mid-2000's. |
"Some of the greatest dads I've ever seen weren't so much perfect as they were willing to work hard to overcome their failings. Does that make sense?"
Yes. Yes it does.
Yes. Yes it does.
|
Originally Posted By paduce: Being nervous is a good sign. It indicates that you know the physics at play here and respect the forces that are about to be unleashed right against your cheek. Your Encore is a well built firearm and should put a smile on your face putting bullets precisely where you want them to go. Just wondering out load what (if any) factory rounds you may have tried so far? About a year ago, my son and I put a few rounds of these factory loads. Fiocchi 180gr. Hornady SST. They have an OAL of 3.21" We weren't really feeling steady at our shots, so I when I was seeing 1.5 - 2.5" groups at 100yds we stopped shooting. |
"Some of the greatest dads I've ever seen weren't so much perfect as they were willing to work hard to overcome their failings. Does that make sense?"
Yes. Yes it does.
Yes. Yes it does.
|
My Lyman 50th Ed. Tested a 150gr Hornady soft point bullet with IMR4350 powder, 49gr start load yeilded 2545fps--57gr max charge yeilded 2887fps. Lyman test barrel used 24" Universal pressure testing barrel. Winchester brass and primers with a recorded C.O.A.L 3.200 Your 58.5gr of IMR4350 is stout. How was extraction? |
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I have about 35-40 of those 150gr handholds left, so I don't shoot them unless it's in preparation for a hunt & the actual hunt. I've been bow hunting almost exclusively since around '06 or '07, so it's been a while since I've shot them. I don't recall them being difficult to remove and my B-I-L was right there watching and looking at the spent brass, so it passed his inspection. He's got close to 50 years of reloading experience under his belt by now. |
"Some of the greatest dads I've ever seen weren't so much perfect as they were willing to work hard to overcome their failings. Does that make sense?"
Yes. Yes it does.
Yes. Yes it does.
|
Good. Older IMR powder data dated May, 2003 used 59gr IMR4350 under a Remington 150gr SP Cor-Lokt bullet. Current Speer data max charges 59gr IMR4350 powder to push their bonded hunting bullets. My old load for an inherited Remington 740 Woodsmaster semi-auto was 58gr IMR4350 pushing a 165gr Remington Core-Lokt just remember taking a large white-tail buck at 1/4 mile with that. Remember extraction was terrible and had to full length resize for the semi-auto to cycle. Thought accuracy would fall-off with the full-length resizing but it didn't. |
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Originally Posted By tree-hugger: I've been gearing up to load a couple calibers and the Lee Second Edition of Modern Reloading doesn't have a recipe for either of the calibers I've settled on. I don't think I've put the cart before the horse, but I could have. We found starting and maximum charging points for the 6.5 Grendel, but this Lee manual doesn't have what I'm looking for with the 30-06. Is it poor form to ask for someone here to find this information on the 30-06 for me? Specs.: Single shot Encore.24" barrel. Hornady 178gr. 3.22" OAL to the lands. H4350 powder. CCI 200 primers.  It is good form to ask questions here. We will help. Lee #2 is a dated manual with incomplete/recycled data from many sources. Every major bullet maker puts out a manual with data for their bullets. If you want a general manual Lyman 51 (latest) is a fovorite of mine. When researching a load I like to cross reference at least 3 manuals. Just keep in mind that reloading data is a report of what happened when these components were used. Different rifles, test equipment, and testers will get different results. More variables are brass headstamp, bullet, primer, and powder lots. So keep in mind reloading data is a report and not scientific fact. |
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Shooting and Reloading, one hobby feeds the other.
Shooting and Reloading, one hobby feeds the other.
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I have the Hornady app for my iPhone/iPad. Cost is $19.99 annually and you get the latest editions when they are released. Easy to search for recipes. And no, it's not poor form to ask, just know that you're responsible for you're loads and what works in one guy's rifle may not work as well in yours. |
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Thanks again for all the help! I've decided to return the Lee Manual and have already downloaded the Hornady 12th Edition manual to my computer. Inexpensive compared to buying the book and I can print off the appropriate data and keep it with each caliber's dies, components, etc. |
"Some of the greatest dads I've ever seen weren't so much perfect as they were willing to work hard to overcome their failings. Does that make sense?"
Yes. Yes it does.
Yes. Yes it does.
|
You have mentioned IMR 4350 AND H 4350. You also mentioned 178 and 150 grain bullets. Both the different powders and bullet weights will need separate loads. Make sure to note that. General rule is to start low, 10% maybe and work up. I don't use either 4350 in my 30-06 but I sure am liking 125 to 150 grain bullets! |
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Originally Posted By RWEIII: You have mentioned IMR 4350 AND H 4350. You also mentioned 178 and 150 grain bullets. Both the different powders and bullet weights will need separate loads. Make sure to note that. General rule is to start low, 10% maybe and work up. I don't use either 4350 in my 30-06 but I sure am liking 125 to 150 grain bullets! 1st, figure out your goal for your load. Accuracy? Velocity? Both? Start at the start load, and work your way up. This hobby can be more interesting than the actual shooting. Soon you will have the ammo you want, not just what you can find on the shelf. |
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Welcome! This hobby is a combination of hard science and “trying it out”. There are too many variables to be able to say “this load will be safe and meet expectations in every firearm”. So we use published data as a starting point, see how it works out for us, then adjust as appropriate. Unlike a lot of online forums, this technical forum is a safe place to ask questions, even ones you might think are stupid. I have certainly asked (at least) my share of those here! The staff keeps posters that aren’t helpful pretty much at bay, so most of the time what you’ll get is responses like what you’ve gotten in this thread. I applaud your caution, and apparent willingness to learn new things. I’ve been handloading since 1980 and I learn something new with each session. Sometimes on my own, sometimes when I ask a question here. Again, welcome! |
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Awesome feedback! Thanks again for the info and welcome! I'll post updates and eventually, shooting results. |
"Some of the greatest dads I've ever seen weren't so much perfect as they were willing to work hard to overcome their failings. Does that make sense?"
Yes. Yes it does.
Yes. Yes it does.
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Originally Posted By tree-hugger: Awesome feedback! Thanks again for the info and welcome! I'll post updates and eventually, shooting results. Then we can welcome you into the reloading club.  |
Selling agent for Algores carbon credit scam.
Shooting and Reloading, one hobby feeds the other.
Shooting and Reloading, one hobby feeds the other.
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Originally Posted By dryflash3: It's a great feeling after you shoot your first loads. "I can do this". Then we can welcome you into the reloading club. Originally Posted By dryflash3: Originally Posted By tree-hugger: Awesome feedback! Thanks again for the info and welcome! I'll post updates and eventually, shooting results. Then we can welcome you into the reloading club. First - That was cool shooting those first loads and having the gun run them just fine. You nailed the "I can do this" feeling. Thank you.  Well... From scratch and for my first reloading attempt, I loaded up the recipe that my B-I-Law worked up for our 6.5 Grendel uppers and just shot them through my son's upper. No problems what-so-ever and his gun chewed through them without one hiccup - all while giving 1.25" group at 100yds. (wondering if I should play with COAL so that the load gets the best results when playing with when the bullet hits the lands??) I think I'm ready to work through this 30-06 project, coming up with a recipe. There is one thing holding me back and that is the fact I don't have a chronograph. All those years ago, I remember shooting the different recipes, finding the smallest groups. And once I found the smallest group, we checked the feet per second. But now I read on this forum that I should be monitoring the FPS while chasing groups. So that begs the question for me... Do I wait until I have access to a chronograph or just find the smallest group while staying within the 'starting and maximum' powder charge, and THEN find out how fast the recipe is traveling? |
"Some of the greatest dads I've ever seen weren't so much perfect as they were willing to work hard to overcome their failings. Does that make sense?"
Yes. Yes it does.
Yes. Yes it does.
Global Warming Hoax Skeptic before it was cool
Joined:
Jun 2007
Posts:
73071
EE: 100% (1)
WA, USA
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Originally Posted By tree-hugger: First - That was cool shooting those first loads and having the gun run them just fine. You nailed the "I can do this" feeling. Thank you. Well... From scratch and for my first reloading attempt, I loaded up the recipe that my B-I-Law worked up for our 6.5 Grendel uppers and just shot them through my son's upper. No problems what-so-ever and his gun chewed through them without one hiccup - all while giving 1.25" group at 100yds. (wondering if I should play with COAL so that the load gets the best results when playing with when the bullet hits the lands??) I think I'm ready to work through this 30-06 project, coming up with a recipe. There is one thing holding me back and that is the fact I don't have a chronograph. All those years ago, I remember shooting the different recipes, finding the smallest groups. And once I found the smallest group, we checked the feet per second. But now I read on this forum that I should be monitoring the FPS while chasing groups. So that begs the question for me... Do I wait until I have access to a chronograph or just find the smallest group while staying within the 'starting and maximum' powder charge, and THEN find out how fast the recipe is traveling? In an AR the OAL is determined by what we call "mag length". Longest OAL that feeds reliably. Reliably matters or else your shooting a single shot. Safety first, then reliably, then accuracy. That should be the goal. Not hard to have all three. Stay with your present OAL and experiment with bullets and powder if you want better accuracy. Myself I get good results with Hornady 123 gr SST, CFE-223, Starline brass, and Rem 7 1/2 primers. I use the loads straight out of the Hornady manual. No vodoo. Many other combos also work, that's what I find I enjoy with reloading, always trying new combos. Chronographs are nice but not required if you follow published load data. One thing about loads, if you see a load posted, confirm it with published data before trying. For now just be happy with getting your groups smaller. |
Selling agent for Algores carbon credit scam.
Shooting and Reloading, one hobby feeds the other.
Shooting and Reloading, one hobby feeds the other.
|
Originally Posted By tree-hugger: First - That was cool shooting those first loads and having the gun run them just fine. You nailed the "I can do this" feeling. Thank you. Well... From scratch and for my first reloading attempt, I loaded up the recipe that my B-I-Law worked up for our 6.5 Grendel uppers and just shot them through my son's upper. No problems what-so-ever and his gun chewed through them without one hiccup - all while giving 1.25" group at 100yds. (wondering if I should play with COAL so that the load gets the best results when playing with when the bullet hits the lands??) I think I'm ready to work through this 30-06 project, coming up with a recipe. There is one thing holding me back and that is the fact I don't have a chronograph. All those years ago, I remember shooting the different recipes, finding the smallest groups. And once I found the smallest group, we checked the feet per second. But now I read on this forum that I should be monitoring the FPS while chasing groups. So that begs the question for me... Do I wait until I have access to a chronograph or just find the smallest group while staying within the 'starting and maximum' powder charge, and THEN find out how fast the recipe is traveling? I have a Magnetospeed Sporter you can have if you’d like. PM me an address and I’ll send it to you. |
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Originally Posted By MSC182: I have a Magnetospeed Sporter you can have if you’d like. PM me an address and I’ll send it to you. Originally Posted By MSC182: Originally Posted By tree-hugger: First - That was cool shooting those first loads and having the gun run them just fine. You nailed the "I can do this" feeling. Thank you. Well... From scratch and for my first reloading attempt, I loaded up the recipe that my B-I-Law worked up for our 6.5 Grendel uppers and just shot them through my son's upper. No problems what-so-ever and his gun chewed through them without one hiccup - all while giving 1.25" group at 100yds. (wondering if I should play with COAL so that the load gets the best results when playing with when the bullet hits the lands??) I think I'm ready to work through this 30-06 project, coming up with a recipe. There is one thing holding me back and that is the fact I don't have a chronograph. All those years ago, I remember shooting the different recipes, finding the smallest groups. And once I found the smallest group, we checked the feet per second. But now I read on this forum that I should be monitoring the FPS while chasing groups. So that begs the question for me... Do I wait until I have access to a chronograph or just find the smallest group while staying within the 'starting and maximum' powder charge, and THEN find out how fast the recipe is traveling? I have a Magnetospeed Sporter you can have if you’d like. PM me an address and I’ll send it to you. That's very nice of you. Thank you. I'll gladly borrow it for this project and send it back after I get the '06 dialed in. The kids like to go in on something I'm jonesin' for - for birthdays, Christmas, and Father's Day. (They're grown and have cool engineering gigs) I had my eye on both the Garmin chronograph and one of the automatic powder scales that has the powder ready by the time I've seated the bullet on the previous round. But those are things I'll consider IF I take this further than hunting load development. Again. Thank you for the offer. Very kind. |
"Some of the greatest dads I've ever seen weren't so much perfect as they were willing to work hard to overcome their failings. Does that make sense?"
Yes. Yes it does.
Yes. Yes it does.
|
Originally Posted By dryflash3: Now I can welcome you to the successful handloader club. In an AR the OAL is determined by what we call "mag length". Longest OAL that feeds reliably. Reliably matters or else your shooting a single shot. Safety first, then reliably, then accuracy. That should be the goal. Not hard to have all three. Stay with your present OAL and experiment with bullets and powder if you want better accuracy. Myself I get good results with Hornady 123 gr SST, CFE-223, Starline brass, and Rem 7 1/2 primers. I use the loads straight out of the Hornady manual. No vodoo. Many other combos also work, that's what I find I enjoy with reloading, always trying new combos. Chronographs are nice but not required if you follow published load data. One thing about loads, if you see a load posted, confirm it with published data before trying. For now just be happy with getting your groups smaller. Originally Posted By dryflash3: Originally Posted By tree-hugger: First - That was cool shooting those first loads and having the gun run them just fine. You nailed the "I can do this" feeling. Thank you. Well... From scratch and for my first reloading attempt, I loaded up the recipe that my B-I-Law worked up for our 6.5 Grendel uppers and just shot them through my son's upper. No problems what-so-ever and his gun chewed through them without one hiccup - all while giving 1.25" group at 100yds. (wondering if I should play with COAL so that the load gets the best results when playing with when the bullet hits the lands??) I think I'm ready to work through this 30-06 project, coming up with a recipe. There is one thing holding me back and that is the fact I don't have a chronograph. All those years ago, I remember shooting the different recipes, finding the smallest groups. And once I found the smallest group, we checked the feet per second. But now I read on this forum that I should be monitoring the FPS while chasing groups. So that begs the question for me... Do I wait until I have access to a chronograph or just find the smallest group while staying within the 'starting and maximum' powder charge, and THEN find out how fast the recipe is traveling? In an AR the OAL is determined by what we call "mag length". Longest OAL that feeds reliably. Reliably matters or else your shooting a single shot. Safety first, then reliably, then accuracy. That should be the goal. Not hard to have all three. Stay with your present OAL and experiment with bullets and powder if you want better accuracy. Myself I get good results with Hornady 123 gr SST, CFE-223, Starline brass, and Rem 7 1/2 primers. I use the loads straight out of the Hornady manual. No vodoo. Many other combos also work, that's what I find I enjoy with reloading, always trying new combos. Chronographs are nice but not required if you follow published load data. One thing about loads, if you see a load posted, confirm it with published data before trying. For now just be happy with getting your groups smaller. I was told that already about the 'magazine length' with the AR. Don't know why that didn't stick in my head... Thank you. |
"Some of the greatest dads I've ever seen weren't so much perfect as they were willing to work hard to overcome their failings. Does that make sense?"
Yes. Yes it does.
Yes. Yes it does.
|
Go look at Hogden's website they have a free load data calculator. I use it a fair amount then compare it to my books. I would go with 180gr to be on the safe side then work up a load on your own. With chrono results at the range. |
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