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NC, USA
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Posted: 3/17/2022 7:35:58 AM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By stainlineho: This should help you do the math: https://www.dwilsonmfg.com/Allegheny-Arms-Tapered-Gas-blocks_p_133.html https://i.imgur.com/sZUcYvA.png Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By stainlineho: Originally Posted By TheBrokePilot: Has anybody used the Allegheny Arms gas block on a rifle gas length barrel with a KAC URX 4 13"? I'm wondering how far the gas block would protrude. This should help you do the math: https://www.dwilsonmfg.com/Allegheny-Arms-Tapered-Gas-blocks_p_133.html https://i.imgur.com/sZUcYvA.png Trying to remember, AEM2-4 are a half inch shorter on the reflex chamber, right? |
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Posted: 3/17/2022 10:47:54 AM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By SpyHawk: Trying to remember, AEM2-4 are a half inch shorter on the reflex chamber, right? 0.45" shorter |
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NC, USA
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Posted: 3/17/2022 8:12:26 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By unclemoak: 0.45" shorter Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By unclemoak: Originally Posted By SpyHawk: Trying to remember, AEM2-4 are a half inch shorter on the reflex chamber, right? 0.45" shorter Thank you. So then, according to the dwilson numbers. AEM5 Rifle length - 16.56" Mid length - 13.56" Carbine Length - 11.56" AEM1-4 Rifle length - 16.11" Mid length - 13.11" Carbine Length - 11.11" Is their gas block longer than the Spikes? The spikes numbers are over a half inch off from those. They claimed 10.5" for carbine gas. |
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Posted: 3/17/2022 8:28:48 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By SpyHawk: Thank you. So then, according to the dwilson numbers. AEM5 Rifle length - 16.56" Mid length - 13.56" Carbine Length - 11.56" AEM1-4 Rifle length - 16.11" Mid length - 13.11" Carbine Length - 11.11" Is their gas block longer than the Spikes? The spikes numbers are over a half inch off from those. They claimed 10.5" for carbine gas. Hard to tell from the picture but the Allegheny gb is slightly longer OAL.  Attached File |
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GA, USA
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Posted: 3/18/2022 9:48:44 PM EDT
[#5]
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TX, USA
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Posted: 3/19/2022 8:51:55 AM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By stainlineho: https://i.imgur.com/usLSXDB.jpg That came out looking great. I love the fact that it's a poverty pony  that is far from being a poverty pony build lol.
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Posted: 3/22/2022 2:07:39 AM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Rothperson87: Hard to tell from the picture but the Allegheny gb is slightly longer OAL. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/462226/926DE9F7-FF42-4017-A878-BB145275AC5C_jpe-2317079.JPG If you don’t mind what is the total length of the gas block and length of the gas block without the taper. Trying to see if it will work with a spare Kmr rail I’ve had floating around. |
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Posted: 3/22/2022 8:04:20 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Gremyashchy1911: If you don’t mind what is the total length of the gas block and length of the gas block without the taper. Trying to see if it will work with a spare Kmr rail I’ve had floating around. I only have the spikes on hand.  Attached File Attached File |
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Posted: 3/22/2022 8:46:22 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Rothperson87: I only have the spikes on hand. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/462226/2788E5A4-E2EA-4089-BC8E-BC307BAB666F_jpe-2322896.JPG https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/462226/0B2311C6-9F84-4721-8FA9-1DF0FCA10F9F_jpe-2322897.JPG That will work looks like I’ll be about .100-150 too long on the hand guard. I’ll order one and find out tho. Thank you for the pictures tho! |
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Posted: 3/22/2022 9:44:30 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Gremyashchy1911: That will work looks like I’ll be about .100-150 too long on the hand guard. I’ll order one and find out tho. Thank you for the pictures tho! Shave the rail back a bit. I had to shave my ff ras for the can to fit but it’s nice and tight. |
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Posted: 3/22/2022 9:53:27 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Rothperson87: Shave the rail back a bit. I had to shave my ff ras for the can to fit but it’s nice and tight. Depending on how far back it sits on the taper it may fit I measured 1.165” from the mid length shoulder to the nub of the rail I’m sure I could fudge forward a hair on the gb if needed. Kinda wish they had just left the front of the KMR squared off. I got it cheap cheap so it very well meet the grinder. |
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Posted: 3/26/2022 5:00:27 PM EDT
[#12]
Ah yeah. Got my Form 4 to e-sign.
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Posted: 3/28/2022 2:13:20 AM EDT
[#13]
Anyone know the barrel length for a flush fit AEM5 with a 10.75 URX4? I’m thinking 13.5 or a little less.
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Posted: 3/28/2022 10:31:50 AM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By cdholmes: Anyone know the barrel length for a flush fit AEM5 with a 10.75 URX4? I'm thinking 13.5 or a little less. It varies depending on how the rail is clocked. Generally the barrel is 2.65" longer then the front edge of the rail. |
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Posted: 3/28/2022 10:19:29 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By lsujim: Ah yeah. Got my Form 4 to e-sign. Ron is the man. Got mine signed for my cans over the weekend |
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Posted: 3/29/2022 8:39:56 PM EDT
[#16]
Just picked mine up from the dealer! Very excited. Just over 8.5 turns, need to get to the range!
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CA, USA
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Posted: 3/29/2022 10:46:02 PM EDT
[#17]
Got a nice batch of AEM5's back from plating and sent out over the last couple of days.
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Posted: 3/30/2022 12:20:31 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By k31user: Got a nice batch of AEM5's back from plating and sent out over the last couple of days.  Thank you for all your hard work Ron! |
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Posted: 3/30/2022 1:16:20 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Green0]
[#19]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By UnknownPatriot: Thank you for all your hard work Ron! They are pretty cool cans, I also appreciate Allen Arms keeping the Ops cans in production- it is unique to be able to buy a historic 1:1 identical historical silencer. It's also unique in that Ops was one of the most advanced models the military ever issued, so pretty nice suppressors. It would be cool if that were possible for more models, like Sionics, or HEL, or even Knights Armament which really isn't available or in production most of the time. |
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TX, USA
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Posted: 3/30/2022 3:19:46 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Green0: They are pretty cool cans, I also appreciate Allen Arms keeping the Ops cans in production- it is unique to be able to buy a historic 1:1 identical historical silencer. It's also unique in that Ops was one of the most advanced models the military ever issued, so pretty nice suppressors. It would be cool if that were possible for more models, like Sionics, or HEL, or even Knights Armament which really isn't available or in production most of the time. Agreed. I'm proud to rock my Allen can. I'd love a 2nd one. Sounds like it might be a good time to see about chasing another one down from somewhere. |
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Posted: 3/31/2022 6:57:15 AM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Rothperson87: Hard to tell from the picture but the Allegheny gb is slightly longer OAL. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/462226/926DE9F7-FF42-4017-A878-BB145275AC5C_jpe-2317079.JPG You need to be careful using those gasblock collars. Make sure you are checking the run out of the barrels. It's not uncommon for the bargain barrels that everyone loves to be running out .015-.025 from the threads. There's a reason one size fits all collars don't work, that applies to these gas blocks as well. |
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Posted: 3/31/2022 6:44:58 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By bigbore: You need to be careful using those gasblock collars. Make sure you are checking the run out of the barrels. It's not uncommon for the bargain barrels that everyone loves to be running out .015-.025 from the threads. There's a reason one size fits all collars don't work, that applies to these gas blocks as well. What do you mean by run out of the barrel? |
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Posted: 3/31/2022 6:59:36 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Rothperson87: What do you mean by run out of the barrel? Concentricity of bore with regards to barrel OD. |
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Posted: 3/31/2022 8:22:56 PM EDT
[Last Edit: bigbore]
[#24]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Rothperson87: What do you mean by run out of the barrel? To properly mount an AE suppressor, the bore, threads and OD all need to be concentric. 90% of the cheap barrels people buy lately are NOT concentric in any two of those requirements. If you're starting with a cheap standard production barrel and you want to mount an AE suppressor you need the barrel to be threaded and contoured centered off the bore. Below is a video my guy sent me this week (sorry for the apple to galaxy compression). The first step is to cut threads centered off the bore, then find out how much you must take off the OD to be concentric to know what size custom collar is needed. Imagine if the barrel below was sent to be cut/threaded to size for use with a gas block style collar, and all we did was thread concentric to the bore. [youtube]shorts/EPsf_6nyyAQ[/youtube] https://www.youtube.com/shorts/EPsf_6nyyAQ |
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Posted: 3/31/2022 8:34:18 PM EDT
[#25]
So now the question is which manufacturers make barrels that are good to go?
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Posted: 3/31/2022 8:35:52 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Outrider: So now the question is which manufacturers make barrels that are good to go? CLE, WOA, Noveske, DD, BCM. |
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Posted: 3/31/2022 9:10:24 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By bigbore: CLE, WOA, Noveske, DD, BCM. Bison spr barrels don’t make the cut? |
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Posted: 3/31/2022 9:42:46 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By bigbore: To properly mount an AE suppressor, the bore, threads and OD all need to be concentric. 90% of the cheap barrels people buy lately are NOT concentric in any two of those requirements. If you're starting with a cheap standard production barrel and you want to mount an AE suppressor you need the barrel to be threaded and contoured centered off the bore. Below is a video my guy sent me this week (sorry for the apple to galaxy compression). The first step is to cut threads centered off the bore, then find out how much you must take off the OD to be concentric to know what size custom collar is needed. Imagine if the barrel below was sent to be cut/threaded to size for use with a gas block style collar, and all we did was thread concentric to the bore.  https://www.youtube.com/shorts/EPsf_6nyyAQhttps://www.youtube.com/shorts/EPsf_6nyyAQ I assume after the entire system is installed correctly a suppressor alignment rod would be a good idea? |
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Posted: 3/31/2022 9:55:22 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Steamedliver: I assume after the entire system is installed correctly a suppressor alignment rod would be a good idea? Considering there's about a .003-.004" variation of bore diameters for every caliber made, I don't put any value in alignment rods. |
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PA, USA
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Posted: 3/31/2022 10:14:27 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By bigbore: Considering there's about a .003-.004" variation of bore diameters for every caliber made, I don't put any value in alignment rods. I would disagree. The check point is concetricity of the muzzle of the barrel i to the suppressor, not the right -out if the barrel itself. Any button-cut barrel is going to weave around, but what is important is the exit trajectory i it the can. If you think this is not meaningful, what is? |
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Posted: 4/1/2022 8:35:45 AM EDT
[Last Edit: bigbore]
[#31]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By can-man: I would disagree. The check point is concetricity of the muzzle of the barrel i to the suppressor, not the right -out if the barrel itself. Any button-cut barrel is going to weave around, but what is important is the exit trajectory i it the can. If you think this is not meaningful, what is? People put too much stock in dropping an undersized rod down an oversized bore(that as you said isn't usually straight), then freak out because it's not dead center of their can mounted to their favorite QD spring loaded mount. At that point you may as well eyeball it. I have a disk with a hole in the center I drop down down the receiver that stops on the barrel extension. Look through that aperture and out the muzzle end. If you don't see the suppressor, it's good enough. |
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Posted: 4/2/2022 7:30:30 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By bigbore: CLE, WOA, Noveske, DD, BCM. I have used ballistic advantage barrels for a few builds using AE cans, a Mk12 and a couple mini NSW recces using an aem3 and aem5. The minis both used the spikes gas block. Both have aligned perfectly with an alignment rod. All have shot great! |
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Posted: 4/2/2022 9:54:46 PM EDT
[#33]
I’m also using a ballistic advantage barrel but it was cut so I suppose that’s not a valid data point
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TN, USA
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Posted: 4/2/2022 10:35:36 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By UnknownPatriot: Thank you for all your hard work Ron! Are the AE cans still going out of production or is that all a wash now? I haven’t read anything about it in some time. |
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Posted: 4/3/2022 12:34:26 AM EDT
[Last Edit: Green0]
[#35]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By bigbore: Considering there's about a .003-.004" variation of bore diameters for every caliber made, I don't put any value in alignment rods. The rods are like 17” oal. Most cans are ~8” so there is 9”of rod in the bore meaning 8” will run truer than that bore clearance value. The rods are straight to like .005” over 17, so alignment should be about .008 at the end of the can so inside .016 of bore clearance. Typically cans have .050 of clearance or more, so .016 is at or less than 1/3 of of total clearance and indicates perfect alignment. They can and do work, but then you can also bend the rod. I don’t need reading glasses (have normal vision) and I can eyeball alignment easily with white paper on the bolt face reflecting light from overhead to illuminate the bore so I understand what you mean and that works well too. A lot of laypeople can’t say thats .005” like a machinist with a calibrated eye, and they are the people who really appreciate alignment rods. |
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Posted: 4/3/2022 11:32:54 AM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By bradpierson26: I’m also using a ballistic advantage barrel but it was cut so I suppose that’s not a valid data point Mine were cut also. I would guess most barrels using the tapered gas blocks would have to be cut to proper length |
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Posted: 4/3/2022 11:42:55 AM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Rothperson87: Mine were cut also. I would guess most barrels using the tapered gas blocks would have to be cut to proper length Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Rothperson87: Originally Posted By bradpierson26: I’m also using a ballistic advantage barrel but it was cut so I suppose that’s not a valid data point Mine were cut also. I would guess most barrels using the tapered gas blocks would have to be cut to proper length I couldn’t comment on that. I had a 18” cut to 16” with an Allegheny arms gas block |
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USA
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Posted: 4/3/2022 10:48:20 PM EDT
[#38]
So my AEM5-30 came in. I want to use it on my scar. If I bought the OCL OTB Flash hider, who can open it up to .30 cal and re-thread it to 5/8x24? Thanks
I need a 7.62 version of this: 
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Posted: 4/4/2022 7:00:23 AM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By kaotic504: So my AEM5-30 came in. I want to use it on my scar. If I bought the OCL OTB Flash hider, who can open it up to .30 cal and re-thread it to 5/8x24? Thanks I need a 7.62 version of this: https://www.thoroughbredarmco.com/stores/2018/08/15/1/catalog/products/img/IMG_7176.jpg Ron needs to put out a statement that his suppressor warranties are null and void if anyone uses those mounts with his suppressors. They are a bad idea all around. Do it right and have your barrel contoured properly for a collar. |
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Posted: 4/4/2022 7:04:58 AM EDT
[Last Edit: bigbore]
[#40]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By bradpierson26: I couldn’t comment on that. I had a 18” cut to 16” with an Allegheny arms gas block Once you chop the undersized and off center threads off those cheap barrels they are good to go with good threads cut. If you are going to cut the barrel down, there is really no reason to spend $300+ on a good barrel. |
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Posted: 4/4/2022 8:09:03 AM EDT
[#41]
Originally Posted By bigbore: Considering there's about a .003-.004" variation of bore diameters for every caliber made, I don't put any value in alignment rods. Originally Posted By bigbore: People put too much stock in dropping an undersized rod down an oversized bore(that as you said isn't usually straight), then freak out because it's not dead center of their can mounted to their favorite QD spring loaded mount. At that point you may as well eyeball it. I have a disk with a hole in the center I drop down down the receiver that stops on the barrel extension. Look through that aperture and out the muzzle end. If you don't see the suppressor, it's good enough. What I read into that is if the rod is center, I’m good to go. If the rod isn’t center, then I may still be good to go. So the NPV is 100%, but the PPV is questionable. |
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USA
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Posted: 4/4/2022 8:14:04 AM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By bigbore: Ron needs to put out a statement that his suppressor warranties are null and void if anyone uses those mounts with his suppressors. They are a bad idea all around. Do it right and have your barrel contoured properly for a collar. I’ve seen a one piece mount he’s made and asked if he would make me one for 7.62 but he doesn’t have the resources to dedicate towards that. Unless he can make just a custom collar and brake, I would go that route too. But I don’t see anything wrong with going with 1 piece mounts. |
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Posted: 4/4/2022 9:14:20 AM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By bigbore: Once you chop the undersized and off center threads off those cheap barrels they are good to go with good threads cut. If you are going to cut the barrel down, there is really no reason to spend $300+ on a good barrel. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By bigbore: Originally Posted By bradpierson26: I couldn’t comment on that. I had a 18” cut to 16” with an Allegheny arms gas block Once you chop the undersized and off center threads off those cheap barrels they are good to go with good threads cut. If you are going to cut the barrel down, there is really no reason to spend $300+ on a good barrel. That’s what I wanted to hear -Cheap Bastard |
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TN, USA
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Posted: 4/4/2022 9:59:14 AM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By bigbore: They are a bad idea all around. Why? |
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Posted: 4/4/2022 10:18:57 AM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By cheekibreeki: Why? Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By cheekibreeki: Originally Posted By bigbore: They are a bad idea all around. Why? Because that mount nullifies the two points of contact and concentricity that the suppressor is known for. You're relying on the barrel threads and muzzle alone to be cut right. |
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TX, USA
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Posted: 4/4/2022 10:26:04 AM EDT
[#46]
This doesn't make sense to me. It indexes everything off of the muzzle shoulder so of course that has to be cut properly. But the original separate collar uses a set screw and is a second part in the mix in any case. Not clear to me why a slip fit collar plus set screw lends more concentricity than a square muzzle face alone would.
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Posted: 4/4/2022 10:28:38 AM EDT
[#47]
If it's concentric it's concentric.
Mine is. Lucky I guess. 
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Posted: 4/4/2022 11:21:06 AM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By kaotic504: I’ve seen a one piece mount he’s made and asked if he would make me one for 7.62 but he doesn’t have the resources to dedicate towards that. Unless he can make just a custom collar and brake, I would go that route too. But I don’t see anything wrong with going with 1 piece mounts. Go for it, use whatever once piece mount you want. Ron is the one who you will go crying to when you get a baffle strike, and as long as he keeps fixing stuff for free you have nothing to worry about. I'd rather see him making new suppressors than repairing old cans people used improper mounts on. |
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USA
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Posted: 4/4/2022 11:55:26 AM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By bigbore: Go for it, use whatever once piece mount you want. Ron is the one who you will go crying to when you get a baffle strike, and as long as he keeps fixing stuff for free you have nothing to worry about. I'd rather see him making new suppressors than repairing old cans people used improper mounts on. Ron at one point made the one piece mount, just not for 7.62. I have a SCAR20 I’m dedicating this can to. I just need a mounting system for it. And I’m not the brightest guy out there, but I don’t see how a one piece mount is less desirable or worse off than a two piece mount. I’m not an OCM fan, actually I made sure to buy this AEM5-30 from you at Adco. And have an AEM5 coming in. My problem is, I don’t have a 5/8x24 mount for it. |
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Posted: 4/4/2022 12:05:01 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By kaotic504: Ron at one point made the one piece mount, just not for 7.62. I have a SCAR20 I’m dedicating this can to. I just need a mounting system for it. And I’m not the brightest guy out there, but I don’t see how a one piece mount is less desirable or worse off than a two piece mount. I’m not an OCM fan, actually I made sure to buy this AEM5-30 from you at Adco. And have an AEM5 coming in. My problem is, I don’t have a 5/8x24 mount for it. Because the 7.62 scar barrel has no shoulder, you are better off having it threaded 1/2x28, open up the hole in a 1/2x28 AE brake, and have a proper collar turned to your 7.62 barrel. At that point EVERYTHING is concentric. I've never seen a one piece mount made by Ron, but that doesn't mean it doesn't exist... |
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