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Originally Posted By SigOwner_P229: My dad was recently considering trading a piece of equipment. Trade value was $580k (its 3 yrs old), new machine $740k. It brings in $9,000/hr that it's running. I reminded him that it took 6 months to work out the kinks and get it running like a well oiled machine. Why trade for a new one that is a roll of the dice and may take 6 months to work out all the issues? He still has the used one... Good plan. Makino is coming again to put the 4th spindle in it this year. The machine is less than 2 years old. We have other high speed CNC mills that are as old as 2003 that run all day everyday. |
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So after all the pissing and moaning, it wasn't the digital combo lock that was at fault. It was a internal "panic lock" that was defective. I opted for a digital combo on my Liberty Safe when I ordered it and got it delivered almost four years ago. Four years later, no issues and having the convenience of a digital lock is great. I would not having it any other way. |
carpe diem!!!
Love life and life will love you back
Life is short. Live it up!
Endowment NRA member
Love life and life will love you back
Life is short. Live it up!
Endowment NRA member
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Originally Posted By mauiblue: So after all the pissing and moaning, it wasn't the digital combo lock that was at fault. It was a internal "panic lock" that was defective. I opted for a digital combo on my Liberty Safe when I ordered it and got it delivered almost four years ago. Four years later, no issues and having the convenience of a digital lock is great. I would not having it any other way. I don't believe there is anything one can say about a $5K door that failed terminally while locked in less than a year, wasn't openable for over a month, and shitty communication on top of it, that rates as "pissing and moaning".   |
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Amsec is STILL screwing this up. Piss poor customer service. They scheduled the new door to be delivered Friday without talking to me about it. I called and asked it they could do it Monday. They said they would, “Make it happen.” I never got any confirmation from them about it. I figured it was happening since they said it would. I had a lot of prepping to do for them to put the door in . I have to clear out a room and take a large heavy door off the hinges. …They didn’t show up. I called Amsec, they weren’t sure when they were supposed to come. Didn’t know anything about today. At this point, weather they fix this or not. I will never recommend or use Amsec again for anything. They just can’t get their shit together. Edit: I just got off the phone with the delivery company. No one ever contacted them to ask about installing it today. FUCK AMSEC! |
| That is not good to hear. Sorry this has been such a horrible experience. I really hope they sort things out soon for you. I am looking to purchase a door very soon and the Amsec was high on the list due to my previous safe being a BF and the price. Your experience is giving me pause and knocking it down the list. |
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I’ve spoken to the same manager twice now. Both times he said, “They shouldn’t have told you that”. In the same breath he says, “ We’re doing everything we can to fix this”. To which I said, “Not in any way are you doing everything you can”. I told him I’m just going to deal with the installation company now because I don’t want to speak to anyone from there again. I went off on him for a few minutes. The lack of competence in that company is impressive. I truly don’t understand how they have made it this far and kept a good reputation. I was really looking forward to this all being fix and behind me. I would have looked passed all the other screw ups and I’d be posting positive comments about them now. They screwed that up. |
| My god, it just doesn’t end. Now the moving company “ Nick of Time” just completely stiffed me. They said they would be here to deliver and install today between 1030am and 2pm. No call, nothing. They just didn't show. I called them to find out where they were. They said they couldn't make it due to “wet roads”. Do they have some 80 year old women driving for them? It's been sprinkling all day but nothing severe. School buses are running but that was the best excuse they could come up with. If it’s not delivered by Monday I’m going to demand a full refund. I’ll take this to small claims court if I have to. I’m tired of dealing with shitty unprofessional and incompetent companies. |
Joined:
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Posts:
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WI, USA
| I’ve tried to communicate with them several times. They’re supposed to come tomorrow now. I’ve been very clear that it needs to be in the morning because I go to work. They said it will get done. Just got a call confirming they should arrive between 11am and 1pm. Clearly they heard nothing I’ve said. This company is worse than Amsec. |
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NY, USA
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No, I told them I wanted a refund. They started out by saying they will need the old door back then. I told them to bring a grinder because the frame is welded in. The more I thought about it the more pissed off I became. After all this, they would actually take the door back too. Cost and time wise, replacing the door with a door from another company just isn’t the best option. Another door might be cheaper but then I have to install it again and get it welded again. Weather they really would take the door back, I doubt it. I could weld this door and fix it. But really, I just want a good door. I picked up a heat gun because the first thing I’m going to do is remove there name and logo from the door so I don’t have to look at it. I gave in and told them I would still take the replacement door. It’s supposed to be delivered and installed this Monday. I’ll believe it when I see it. I’ve been trying not to talk to them about it because I have had a hard time being nice to the people I’ve been speaking to. I realize the individuals I’m talking to didn’t cause this but the amount of misinformation I keep getting from them when I do speak to someone just gets me too angry to be nice. |
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Nuts that this is still going on since August. Seems like a company I want no part of dealing with. Originally Posted By bruh44: On the plus side, I can finally get to hunting. Hope the season worked out for you. |
NRA: Not another dime until WLP is gone
GOA: Supported anti 2A legislation in NH-not a dime until they fix themselves
SAF: Sends the most junk mail of all and refuses to remove me. Worst donation I ever did.
GOA: Supported anti 2A legislation in NH-not a dime until they fix themselves
SAF: Sends the most junk mail of all and refuses to remove me. Worst donation I ever did.
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Just when you’d think this saga would end, it takes a new turn. They delivered the door today. Pulled the old one out, put the new one in. It doesn’t fit. The hinges are 1/2” different than the other door. I was very clear that this frame would not come out, that the new door needed to fit in this frame. It’s in a block wall and welded to the steel frame….. I wish I had just stuck with getting the refund. I’m waiting to hear back from Amsec. I’m sure this one will take a day or two to figure out. The only solution I see it to cut the upper hinge off and re-weld it a half inch lower. |
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Spoke to someone there last night. He really harped on the fact that I welded this frame in. Sounds like they’re about ready to wash their hands of this and say it’s my problem. If I hadn’t been very clear that the new door needed to fit the old frame from the beginning, I would be a little more understanding of it. This is yet the third major piece of miss information I got while communicating with them. I’m not really sure how to proceed if they say they’re done with it. I have the new door and the old door. I would much prefer they finish what they started. I’m inclined to tell them to come take it all and give me my money back. Not sure I would leave it at that though. |
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Here's the long and short of it. It doesn't sound like at any time you've been dealing with any professionals who know what they're doing. Every product I sell, I myself am behind it 100%. You don't need to rely on manufacturers or whomever they send for you to deal with. Locksmiths are not safe techs. One hole is enough to scope around to see what's going on. Swiss cheesing a safe is a sure sign that the locksmith had no business touching your door. Nick Of Time is a hot tub mover who got into moving safes. They are not security professionals. They are not safe experts. They know nothing about vault doors. Welding? Installing these doors should not include welding at all. Here's the good news. Old door should lift off hinges, new door should sit right back on. No need to mess with the frame. Person doing this should be an expert (not either of the two mentioned above), and should ensure the door is operating properly prior to locking it. Sorry you have had issues, but sometimes that happens when we save money by not paying those who know what they're doing to handle these things for us. |
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Originally Posted By a1abdj: Here's the long and short of it. It doesn't sound like at any time you've been dealing with any professionals who know what they're doing. Every product I sell, I myself am behind it 100%. You don't need to rely on manufacturers or whomever they send for you to deal with. Locksmiths are not safe techs. One hole is enough to scope around to see what's going on. Swiss cheesing a safe is a sure sign that the locksmith had no business touching your door. Nick Of Time is a hot tub mover who got into moving safes. They are not security professionals. They are not safe experts. They know nothing about vault doors. Welding? Installing these doors should not include welding at all. Here's the good news. Old door should lift off hinges, new door should sit right back on. No need to mess with the frame. Person doing this should be an expert (not either of the two mentioned above), and should ensure the door is operating properly prior to locking it. Sorry you have had issues, but sometimes that happens when we save money by not paying those who know what they're doing to handle these things for us. I didn’t hire anyone. I bought a door that turned out to be a POS. Nick of Time scratched up the old frame and the new door. As for lawyering up, I’m not sure just yet. I would much prefer they do the right thing here. I agree, it should have just dropped on. Paul Sarkis called me yesterday. Basically said I never should have welded it because there crappy two page instructions don’t say to do that. If he thought about his words before he spoke I would imagine he wouldn’t have said that. If they make this right, I have no plans to spread negative feedback past this thread. If not, yes, Facebook, X, local news…. I would bet my local news would like to hear about my guns being accessible to my children (six and eight). |
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Originally Posted By bruh44: I didn’t hire anyone. I bought a door that turned out to be a POS. Nick of Time scratched up the old frame and the new door. As for lawyering up, I’m not sure just yet. I would much prefer they do the right thing here. I agree, it should have just dropped on. Paul Sarkis called me yesterday. Basically said I never should have welded it because there crappy two page instructions don’t say to do that. If he thought about his words before he spoke I would imagine he wouldn’t have said that. If they make this right, I have no plans to spread negative feedback past this thread. If not, yes, Facebook, X, local news…. I would bet my local news would like to hear about my guns being accessible to my children (six and eight). All I gotta say is be careful of the news as they may spin it to why not get a regular residential security container, I mean "safe" |
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Originally Posted By jack_pine_savage: That's surprising about "Nick O' Time" movers. Up in the NE IL / SE WI area, they have a rep for being pretty dependable. I can understand your frustration, over three months and still no resolution. Hopefully this situation gets resolved. ...except for when they aren't. The crew they sent were unprofessional, incompetent, and generally inept, but it was around 10 years ago. Maybe they've gotten better since, but I won't use them. |
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My S&G is pushing 40 and has never been an issue, worth the extra for the upgrade! Electronic locks are faster and cheaper but the tradeoffs are not worth it, why do meth heads think that smashing an electronic lock will open the safe? |
Simple minds demand simple solutions
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So it was not Paul Sarkis I spoke to the other day. I spoke to him yesterday. Basically he said they don’t do welding. They will send paint to fix up the areas that need to be fixed but the rest is on me. I’m still frustrated with that mainly because I told them this was the situation from the beginning. But I also don’t see much of an alternative. They did leave the old door and the new frame. I plan to fix it all up and sell it. Since that door costs almost 6k, I’m sure I can get 2k out of it to cover my costs and then some. I don’t have anything good to say about Amsec now that this is pretty well over with, but I have no plans to take any further action either. Really the big issue I see with them is that the people who answer phones don’t seem to pass on information to those who need it. Most of the issues I had were because I was told something that either wasn’t true or information wasn’t passed on from the people who answered the phones. You get what you pay for. Maybe they need to hire better people to do that job. The guy who did all my welding is very good so I have no doubt he can move the hinge to the right spot. Hopefully with the paint they send it can look as good as new when finished. |
Joined:
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Posts:
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EE: 0% (0)
WI, USA
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Originally Posted By jack_pine_savage: I find it odd that Amsec's vault door/frame units aren't built to a standard configuration. This means that their vault door/frames are a "one of a kind" type of thing with no interchangeability? As far as I can tell, yes. The frame itself is identical. The bottom hinge is welded in the exact same location. The top hinge is about 1/2” higher on the new frame and door. I’m still not happy about this at all but I am happy to be done dealing with Amsec. |
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Originally Posted By bruh44: As far as I can tell, yes. The frame itself is identical. The bottom hinge is welded in the exact same location. The top hinge is about 1/2” higher on the new frame and door. I’m still not happy about this at all but I am happy to be done dealing with Amsec. you would think just out of convenience and quality control, they would use a jig when positioning the hinges on the door frame so they would be identical on each one. |
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Originally Posted By Libertas: Why have you not filed a Civil Suit yet? This blows my mind. I would have already been in court with my stack of evidence suing for my money back. Because I have the door and the old door. I’m sure I could bring them to small claims but I’m not sure how effective it would be. If you look at my time, yes they owe me a lot. If it’s just equipment and dollars, I’m not sure I would get anything. Small claims doesn’t allow you to sue for your time or stress. Just for damages and dollar amounts. Getting a lawyer and going to the next level of court isn’t that simple. There might be a lawyer out there that would take this on a percentage of a win. But the time and energy to search for that lawyer isn’t worth it to me. If someone here knows better, I’m all ears. |
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Finally had my welding guy out. The new door is installed. ….And the lock is loose. Yeah, they got the relock lever done right but didn’t tighten up the dial lock. It’s just two screws behind the dial, but I’m not willing to remove the dial to tighten it. It doesn’t affect the function, yet at least. I’m calling them again tomorrow. NEVER BUY AMERICAN SECURITY! |
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Originally Posted By bruh44: Finally had my welding guy out. The new door is installed. ….And the lock is loose. Yeah, they got the relock lever done right but didn’t tighten up the dial lock. It’s just two screws behind the dial, but I’m not willing to remove the dial to tighten it. It doesn’t affect the function, yet at least. I’m calling them again tomorrow. NEVER BUY AMERICAN SECURITY! There was a new thread yesterday someone asking what door to buy, I was looking for this to tell him what not to buy. |
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The lock smith came to tighten up the lock. It was loose because the bottom hole that the base screwed into was not tapped all the way through. So who ever put it together screwed it in as far as it would go and figured good enough. Yet another quality control issue. I figured after all this, they would have made sure my door was perfect. Nope. It is fixed now after using yet more of my time. As for the paint issue, they basically accused me of lying. I told them I started painting it on. I could see it was darker but thought maybe it’ll lighten up when it dries. Plus my eyes aren’t as good as they used to be. They had me send pictures to prove it. I sent a shitty email over that too. Now the right color is on the way. Hopefully after this I will never have to deal with these turds again. Have I said DON’T EVER BUY AMSEC lately? |
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Originally Posted By bruh44: The lock smith came to tighten up the lock. It was loose because the bottom hole that the base screwed into was not tapped all the way through. So who ever put it together screwed it in as far as it would go and figured good enough. Yet another quality control issue. I figured after all this, they would have made sure my door was perfect. Nope. It is fixed now after using yet more of my time. As for the paint issue, they basically accused me of lying. I told them I started painting it on. I could see it was darker but thought maybe it’ll lighten up when it dries. Plus my eyes aren’t as good as they used to be. They had me send pictures to prove it. I sent a shitty email over that too. Now the right color is on the way. Hopefully after this I will never have to deal with these turds again. Have I said DON’T EVER BUY AMSEC lately? Hey OP, I'm looking at my options--what do you think about AMSEC.  Anyhow, glad to see you're at the end of this debacle. |
NRA: Not another dime until WLP is gone
GOA: Supported anti 2A legislation in NH-not a dime until they fix themselves
SAF: Sends the most junk mail of all and refuses to remove me. Worst donation I ever did.
GOA: Supported anti 2A legislation in NH-not a dime until they fix themselves
SAF: Sends the most junk mail of all and refuses to remove me. Worst donation I ever did.
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Wow. OP, don't know if you are keeping up with this but, could this thing have failed while you were inside with the door locked and trapped you inside? Sorry for your ordeal and thanks for posting - am building a house with a safe room and Amsec was on my potential list. |
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This is a good reason to open and photograph the inside of the door and use that time to grease up all points that slide The relocker tripped. That is a pain in the ass to defeat without good inside info I have seen a new two door safe that had a lock installed upside down and the relocker was put together so when the door closed the first time it tripped and then they never tried to open it The other door was good and I used it for measurements to open the bad one I have seen cotter pins not bent and then fall out and door bolts fall and stay locked when trying to open the door There could be a manufacturing flaw that caused your problem |
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Originally Posted By kychas: This is a good reason to open and photograph the inside of the door and use that time to grease up all points that slide The relocker tripped. That is a pain in the ass to defeat without good inside info I have seen a new two door safe that had a lock installed upside down and the relocker was put together so when the door closed the first time it tripped and then they never tried to open it The other door was good and I used it for measurements to open the bad one I have seen cotter pins not bent and then fall out and door bolts fall and stay locked when trying to open the door There could be a manufacturing flaw that caused your problem If you look back in the thread, what happened is listed. They put the emergency lock together backwards. Once we got in, it was easy to figure out. They just have very poor quality control. I had an issues with the new door too. You’d think after all that, they would make sure the next product was perfect. They did not. |
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