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Link Posted: 8/4/2023 8:56:00 PM EDT
[#1]
Supreme Court Emergency Decision To Immediately Block ATF's Frames/Receivers Rule Delayed.
Supreme Court Emergency Decision To Immediately Block ATF's Frames/Receivers Rule Delayed!!!
Link Posted: 8/4/2023 8:58:51 PM EDT
[#2]
BREAKING NEWS: U.S. Supreme Court Issues ORDER in Biden Ghost Gun Case (extended to Tuesday 5pm)
BREAKING NEWS: U.S. Supreme Court Issues ORDER in Biden Ghost Gun Case...
Link Posted: 8/4/2023 9:03:59 PM EDT
[#3]
Thanks for the updates.
Link Posted: 8/4/2023 9:07:26 PM EDT
[#4]
Synoposis for those who read?
Link Posted: 8/4/2023 9:17:41 PM EDT
[#5]
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Quoted:
Synoposis for those who read?
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Link Posted: 8/4/2023 10:35:13 PM EDT
[#6]
Bearing arms: Alito kicks ruling on ATF frame and receiver rule to next week
The Supreme Court is going to keep gun owners and the DOJ in suspense for a few more days in regard to the ATF’s rule on unfinished frames and receivers. Late Friday afternoon Justice Samuel Alito issued a brief order extending his administrative stay of the Fifth Circuit’s partial vacatur of the rule until 5 p.m. Eastern next Tuesday, August 8th.





If Geidner’s correct then that would mean that Alito has referred the case to the full Court for review rather than deciding the emergency appeal himself. Then the question becomes who, exactly, would be writing a possible dissent or “statement” to be released along with the Court’s order on whether or not to allow the Fifth Circuit’s vacatur to stand while the underlying challenge to the agency’s rule proceeds to trial.

Trying to guess that is an exercise in pure speculation, and I won’t even hazard a guess. I think it is worth pointing out, however, that while Vanderstok v. Garland certainly implicates our right to keep and bear arms, the legal arguments presented by the plaintiffs are not based on the Heller or Bruen decisions. Instead, the plaintiffs argue that the ATF overstepped its executive branch authority in promulgating what amounts to legislation, not a tweak to existing regulation, by upending decades of previous guidance that stated unfinished frames and receivers were not considered “firearms” as defined by the Gun Control Act of 1968.

The Firearms Policy Coalition offered a secondary argument in its brief to Alito as well; that the district court’s interpretation of the ATF rule is supported by the doctrine of constitutional avoidance and the rule of lenity. In that argument, the Second Amendment does come into play.

To the extent there could be any uncertainty, the doctrine of constitutional avoidance and the rule of lenity further bolster the district court’s interpretation. The district court’s interpretation avoids at least two significant constitutional problems raised by the Rule. And “[w]hen the validity of an act of the Congress is drawn in question, and even if a serious doubt of constitutionality is raised, it is a cardinal principle that this Court will first ascertain whether a construction of the statute is fairly possible by which the question may be avoided.” Crowell v. Benson, 285 U.S. 22, 62 (1932). The district court’s interpretation also properly resolves ambiguity, to the extent it exists, against the Government.

First, the Gun Control Act, as applied through the Rule, creates a substantial question under the Second Amendment to the United States Constitution. The Second Amendment, which protects “the right of the people to keep and bear Arms,” also protects, by necessary implication, the right to acquire arms , see Luis v. United States, 578 U.S. 5, 26–27 (2016) (Thomas, J., concurring); see also Rigby v. Jennings, 630 F. Supp. 3d 602, 615 (D. Del. 2022). One way of acquiring arms is by making them; indeed, self-manufacture of firearms is an historically common way to acquire them. Supra Greenlee, 54 ST. MARY’S L.J. at 45–70.

And although certain restrictions on Second Amendment protected activity are acceptable if they can be shown to be “consistent with this Nation’s historical tradition of firearm regulation,” New York State Rifle & Pistol Ass’n, Inc. v. Bruen, 142 S. Ct. 2111, 2126 (2022), there is no historical tradition of regulating privately made firearms, supra Greenlee, 54 ST. MARY’S L.J. at 78 (“All such restrictions [on the manufacture of arms for personal use] have been enacted within the last decade.”). Instead, Congress has focused (as in the Gun Control Act) on regulating the commercial sale of firearms. The Rule breaks with this history and raises serious Second Amendment concerns that the district court’s interpretation of the Act avoids.

Second, the district court’s interpretation mitigates vagueness concerns with the Gun Control Act. The Act is a criminal statute, and “[t]he prohibition on vagueness in criminal statutes . . . is an essential of due process, required by both ordinary notions of fair play and the settled rules of law.” Sessions v. Dimaya, 138 S. Ct. 1204, 1212 (2018) (quotations omitted). The Rule threatens to render the Act unconstitutionally vague by making it unclear when an item that with some work could become a frame or receiver crosses the line to become a “frame or receiver” or when a “weapons parts kit” is sufficiently complete to be a “firearm.” For example, under the Rule an item may be regulated as a frame or receiver when it is in a state such that it “may readily be completed” to function as a frame or receiver. 27 C.F.R. § 478.12(c). “Readily” is, in turn, determined by reference to eight factors, which are not weighted, and include things like an evaluation of “parts availability” and “feasibility” of completing the manufacturing process. 27 C.F.R. § 479.11. The face of the regulation fails to provide clear guidance to law-abiding citizens about which items are or are not firearms under the Act.

The inclusion of “weapon parts kit[s]” within the definition of “firearm” creates similar problems. Such items are regulated when they are “designed to or may readily be completed” to become a firearm, 27 C.F.R. § 478.11, and in determining whether an item fits this definition, ATF may consider “any associated templates, jigs, molds, equipment, or tools that are made available by the seller” as well as “any instructions, guides, or marketing materials.” 27 C.F.R. § 479.102. In other words, whether an item or parts kit is a “firearm” and therefore regulated under the Gun Control Act depends in part on the “marketing materials” and “tools” with which it is packaged and the same parts, sold in different contexts, may be regulated in some but not regulated in others. Such a regulation, with criminal consequences, essentially creates a trap for the unwary.

Third, while the district court’s interpretation of the statute is straightforwardly the best interpretation, even if that were not the case the statute would be at best ambiguous. Because the Gun Control Act is a criminal statute, the rule of lenity counsels that any such ambiguity must be resolved against the Government. See United States v. Thompson/Ctr. Arms Co., 504 U.S. 505, 518 (1992).


We’ve seen the Supreme Court recently take issue with regulatory overreach in cases like West Virginia v. EPA and Sackett v. EPA, but this is the first real test of how SCOTUS will view the ATF overreach that’s gone into overdrive since Joe Biden was sworn in. The ATF’s ban on bump stocks was a byproduct of the Trump White House, but Biden’s abused his authority even more with the ATF’s attempt to re-define firearms to include something that could, with work, become one and its decision to essentially classify brace-equipped pistols as short-barreled rifles. All three of those ATF rules have been rejected by various lower courts around the country, but SCOTUS has been able to side step the issue until now… or rather, until next Tuesday afternoon.
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Link Posted: 8/4/2023 10:44:11 PM EDT
[#7]
Braking.  Delaid.
Link Posted: 8/7/2023 7:35:00 PM EDT
[#8]
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Quoted:


probably refering to the autokey card where they obstentively had laser engraved the outline of an autosear on a piece of sheet metal.
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…that the fucktards at ATF couldn’t even get to work when they cut one out and installed it.
Link Posted: 8/8/2023 5:13:00 PM EDT
[#9]
Need a title update!  Just read the rule has been completely reinstated in a 5 to 4 emergency hearing by Supreme Court.

https://justthenews.com/government/courts-law/supreme-court-reinstates-ghost-gun-regulations

https://www.reuters.com/legal/us-supreme-court-reinstates-bidens-ghost-gun-restrictions-now-2023-08-08/

The decision was 5-4, with Chief Justice John Roberts and fellow conservative Justice Amy Coney Barrett joining the court's three liberal justices to grant the administration's request. Conservative Justices Clarence Thomas, Samuel Alito, Neil Gorsuch and Brett Kavanaugh dissented from the decision.
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Link Posted: 8/8/2023 5:24:55 PM EDT
[#10]
It's only temporary. Rule is to remain in effect only until the 5th Circuit rules on the appeal (or until the Supreme Court rules on the matter if FATF appeals a 5th circuit win to the high court).  Rule is still likely to be struck down on appeal at the end of the day, and the matter seems to be moving quickly with oral arguments before the 5th Circuit on September 7th.

This was NOT a ruling on the merits by the Supreme Court.  It was just on whether to allow the rule to go into effect while a final determination is being made.  No need to find any elevated bridges to jump off.
Link Posted: 8/8/2023 5:25:00 PM EDT
[#11]
"Appoint conservative justices" they said.

"It'll be good for us" they said.
Link Posted: 8/8/2023 5:28:08 PM EDT
[#12]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
"Appoint conservative justices" they said.

"It'll be good for us" they said.
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Less bad is better than the alternative.

If we could clone the Founders or have a court of Thomas clones that'd be swell.
Link Posted: 8/8/2023 5:35:44 PM EDT
[#13]
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Quoted:
.......  No need to find any elevated bridges to jump off.
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Good luck stopping people here.

A majority of conservatives have Stockholm Syndrome beaten into them by Leftists.

They look for the downside to everything.
Link Posted: 8/8/2023 5:48:23 PM EDT
[#15]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
It's only temporary. Rule is to remain in effect only until the 5th Circuit rules on the appeal (or until the Supreme Court rules on the matter if FATF appeals a 5th circuit win to the high court).  Rule is still likely to be struck down on appeal at the end of the day, and the matter seems to be moving quickly with oral arguments before the 5th Circuit on September 7th.

This was NOT a ruling on the merits by the Supreme Court.  It was just on whether to allow the rule to go into effect while a final determination is being made.  No need to find any elevated bridges to jump off.
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Thank you.
Link Posted: 8/8/2023 5:52:10 PM EDT
[#16]
BREAKING NEWS! Supreme Court Allows ATF Frame/Receiver Rule To Remain In Effect
BREAKING NEWS! Supreme Court Allows ATF Frame/Receiver Rule To Remain In Effect
Link Posted: 8/8/2023 8:33:27 PM EDT
[#17]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
It's only temporary. Rule is to remain in effect only until the 5th Circuit rules on the appeal (or until the Supreme Court rules on the matter if FATF appeals a 5th circuit win to the high court).  Rule is still likely to be struck down on appeal at the end of the day, and the matter seems to be moving quickly with oral arguments before the 5th Circuit on September 7th.

This was NOT a ruling on the merits by the Supreme Court.  It was just on whether to allow the rule to go into effect while a final determination is being made.  No need to find any elevated bridges to jump off.
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Not jumping off bridges just giving everyone a heads up that they are being allowed to implement a rule that restricts a foundational right of the people of the Republic.

And what I said was legally accurate in regards to it being “completely reinstated”.  The Supreme Court does not have to hear it on the merits if they chose not to.
Link Posted: 8/8/2023 9:40:22 PM EDT
[#18]
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Quoted:



What has the NRA been doing?  Sending me emails about my free hat and shitty tote bag that I'm missing out on lol
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Don't forget that commemorative plaque engraved with a musket!
Link Posted: 8/8/2023 9:48:39 PM EDT
[#19]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:



What has the NRA been doing?  Sending me emails about my free hat and shitty tote bag that I'm missing out on lol
View Quote



Don't forget that commemorative plaque engraved with a musket!
Link Posted: 8/9/2023 5:33:25 AM EDT
[#20]
Do I still need to move to a free state?


Link Posted: 8/9/2023 5:44:57 AM EDT
[#21]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
District, so only applies to what geographical area?
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The 'District' refers to where the court case was filed.  The ruling applies federally.

The District courts are the general trial courts of the federal court system.
Once the federal District court has decided a case, the case can be appealed to a United States Circuit court of appeal.
The Supreme Court of the United States is the highest court in the American judicial system, and has the power to decide appeals on all cases brought in federal court or those brought in state court but dealing with federal law.
Communist State governments ignore those rulings they disagree with.
Link Posted: 8/9/2023 5:52:46 AM EDT
[#22]
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Quoted:
You know Bruen was NRA right?
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View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
You know Bruen was NRA right?

Quoted:
Wrong.   It was NRA-ILA.  NOT the same thing...

The hate is strong in this one.

The NRA is a lobbying organization.
The NRA-ILA is the branch of the NRA that files legal challenges.
Link Posted: 8/9/2023 11:54:55 AM EDT
[#23]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
The hate is strong in this one.

The NRA is a lobbying organization.
The NRA-ILA is the branch of the NRA that files legal challenges.
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NRA-ILA is the 501(c)4 lobbying group.  NRA-PVF is the PAC to give $ to candidates for election.  NRA-LDF (Legal Defense Fund) is a 501(c)3 that pays for lawsuits.  All are completely separate organizations.  ILA can transfer money to LDF, but not vice versa.

There's also the "Friends of the NRA" which is another 501(c)3 used to support education programs.
Link Posted: 8/13/2023 5:12:50 PM EDT
[#24]
ATF EXPERT: 2A ATTORNEY STEPHEN HALBROOK Talks SCOTUS re Biden "Ghost Gun and “Weapons Parts Kits”
ATF EXPERT: 2A ATTORNEY STEPHEN HALBROOK Talks SCOTUS re Biden "Ghost Gun" and "Weapons Part Kits"
Link Posted: 9/7/2023 7:55:37 PM EDT
[#25]
JUST NOW: TERRIBLE DAY FOR THE ATF IN FEDERAL GHOST GUN CASE...
JUST NOW: TERRIBLE DAY FOR THE ATF IN FEDERAL GHOST GUN CASE...
Link Posted: 9/7/2023 8:08:15 PM EDT
[#26]
Can someone break this long index jiberish down.
Link Posted: 9/7/2023 9:09:29 PM EDT
[#27]
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Quoted:
Can someone break this long index jiberish down.
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Nothing you'd notice has happened.
No measurable effect yet.

There's groundwork for continued challenges if this fails, but if it fails here they're even less likely in the future (on these particular grounds).
Link Posted: 9/7/2023 9:14:21 PM EDT
[#28]
has hawaii judge weighed in yet?
Link Posted: 9/7/2023 9:15:45 PM EDT
[#29]
The Feds need t be vacated…
Link Posted: 9/7/2023 9:27:33 PM EDT
[#30]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Can someone break this long index jiberish down.
View Quote


We will probably win because the ATF wants to keep the rules as vague as possible because they are asshats.

It will probably be 2 years until the ruling because the law of the land for everyone.
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