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Posted: 12/28/2020 9:15:18 AM EDT
[#1]
Possible scenario,
Showed up there to take care of business against one individual. Old guys witnessed incident, where CCW and decided to engage SF guy. He instinctively shot guys trying to shoot him. Teens got caught in exchange of fire. Seems plausible from only gathering data in this thread and know shit else about the incident. |
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Posted: 12/28/2020 9:16:37 AM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I dont think I'm trying to get into a gunfight with a Green Beret Didn't think that response through very well, did ya? |
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Posted: 12/28/2020 9:18:19 AM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Wanna bet he is a flu bro and some doomer fuck started in on him about a mask and he just fucking snapped? He’s probably more disciplined than that. |
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Posted: 12/28/2020 9:19:00 AM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Mine would be if they were BLM. We all know BLM is a terrorist org. You defending them bro? They deserve to get put down like dogs. In case you have a case of ADHD, they beat old people, burn business, shoot cops. They are proud to be know as Marxists. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I am sure the tone of the comments would be much different if shooter was BLM or a COP. Im sure they get stressed and sleepy as well... Mine would be if they were BLM. We all know BLM is a terrorist org. You defending them bro? They deserve to get put down like dogs. In case you have a case of ADHD, they beat old people, burn business, shoot cops. They are proud to be know as Marxists. It looks like your defending this terrorist. |
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Posted: 12/28/2020 9:58:55 AM EDT
[#5]
Interesting. I'm curious if this guy was going downhill mentally prior to this.
What a freaking shame. RIP to the victims who died and hope that kid is able to survive. |
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Posted: 12/28/2020 10:12:34 AM EDT
[#6]
I imagine an SF guy who isn't right in the head. Home on leave for the holidays, doesn't have anything to do except get wasted at a random local bar. Drunk, angry, aggressive, confrontational. As much as you'd assume he's drilled CQB, the whole thing might have been a 15 second loss of control. I don't think it's super spooky stuff, and I don't absolve him of blame for his actions and choices that led to that moment. But you have to figure if he really wanted to intentionally kill soft targets, he'd have done a lot more killing.
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Posted: 12/28/2020 10:15:25 AM EDT
[#7]
CNN facebook post about this is chock full of comments about him being alive because he’s white.
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Posted: 12/28/2020 10:18:17 AM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: It looks like your defending this terrorist. Looks like you have convicted the guy and are calling him a terrorist based solely off some shoddy media report. If he truly did walk in and start blasting, then yes he is a dirk bag. But we don't know anything at this point, and like others have suggested, there must be something more to the story... |
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Posted: 12/28/2020 10:23:02 AM EDT
[#9]
The blood and urine will be interesting.
Kharn |
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Posted: 12/28/2020 10:24:02 AM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Looks like you have convicted the guy and are calling him a terrorist based solely off some shoddy media report. If he truly did walk in and start blasting, then yes he is a dirk bag. But we don't know anything at this point, and like others have suggested, there must be something more to the story... I wonder what scenario justifies shooting a 14 year old boy a 16 year old girl and killing 3 elderly men aged 74, 65 and 69? |
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Posted: 12/28/2020 10:25:11 AM EDT
[#11]
Drugs. Not the first, won’t be the last.
We had an 18D on leave, pull his Glock on a security guard, while running around the city in his boxers a while ago. Thankfully, in his zonked out on coke mind, he dropped his mag a few blocks back and apparently didn’t keep one in the pipe. Feds went after his ass with a vengeance. |
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Posted: 12/28/2020 10:31:40 AM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Usually an obituary is a couple days after the death. If the obit calls a person a murderer or a suicide. And the poet is wrong that would be libel and potentially sue worthy, but so in my understanding they leave it out until cops formally say “yep this was a murder suicide”. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: I know an active duty sf warrent officer that interestingly was also an 18F get prison time for making CP with his own kid. It took me a while to process that one... weird sbit happens. A few years ago, a former SF guy murdered the commander of the Air Force Pararescue selection course after failing out. Found his obituary. They left out the murder / suicide part. Usually an obituary is a couple days after the death. If the obit calls a person a murderer or a suicide. And the poet is wrong that would be libel and potentially sue worthy, but so in my understanding they leave it out until cops formally say “yep this was a murder suicide”. Generally, your family writes your obit and sends it to the paper. So unless the family wanted to include the murder/suicide part, it would be left out. |
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Posted: 12/28/2020 10:34:41 AM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted: He’s probably more disciplined than that. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Wanna bet he is a flu bro and some doomer fuck started in on him about a mask and he just fucking snapped? He’s probably more disciplined than that. There was a green beret CIA contractor a few years back who shot someone over a parking spot dispute. Hell there have actually been quite a few similar ones. |
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Posted: 12/28/2020 10:34:43 AM EDT
[#14]
Quoted: An active member of the US Army has been charged with murder after three men were shot dead and three more people were injured in a 'random attack' at bowling alley in Illinois. Green Beret Duke Webb, 37, from Florida, was on Sunday charged with three counts of murder and three counts of attempted murder. The shooting happened just before 7pm on Saturday at Don Carter Lanes in the city of Rockford about 90 minutes northwest of Chicago. Three men, aged 73, 65 and 69, were killed. They have not been named. A 14-year-old boy was shot in the face; his condition is described as stable. A 16-year-old girl was shot in the shoulder and released from hospital. The sixth victim, a 62-year-old man, remains in a critical condition after he was shot multiple times, The Chicago Tribune reports. It is not known why Webb was in Rockford and Police Chief Dan O'Shea said Sunday: 'We believe this was a completely random act, and there is no prior meeting or any kind of relationship between the suspect and any of the victims in this case.' According to a statement from the Army Webb is assigned to 3rd Battalion, 7th Special Forces Group (Airborne), based at Eglin Air Force Base, Florida. He was on leave at the time of the shooting. Police say around 6.55pm on Saturday, they received a call that someone had opened fire in an outdoor bar area of the bowling alley according to a police press conference given in the hours after the shooting. When police arrived, they found multiple victims and the person of interest. Two handguns were also found at the scene. The bowling alley was closed due to COVID-19 restrictions. The bar, Shooters Bar & Grill, has remained open for outside drinking and takeout. Around 20 to 25 people had been at the establishment when the shooting broke out Saturday. O'Shea said: 'The two teenage victims were picking up food. It's a carryout establishment as well. They were not in the bar area.' Mayor Tom McNamara said in a statement he was 'angered and saddened'. He added: 'My thoughts are with the families of those who lost loved ones. I'm also thinking of those who were injured and my hopes are with them for a quick and full recovery.' Webb is being held without bond. He will make his first appearance in court Monday. https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9090805/Active-Army-soldier-charged-murder-Illinois-bowling-alley-shooting.html No motive listed, pretty weird situation but it s still 2020. Since they’re saying no prior association between the individuals, my guess is that the dude was drunk or high, old dudes said something he didn’t like so he shot them. Considering there were two pistols, one could have been one of the old dudes’ or just a backup from an ankle holster. The kids probably just caught stray rounds. |
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Posted: 12/28/2020 10:43:10 AM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted: There was a green beret CIA contractor a few years back who shot someone over a parking spot dispute. Hell there have actually been quite a few similar ones. I stand corrected, and thinking about it more now. I’ve had two soldiers just snap back in the 90’s over minor things. One who got tired of humping the sincgars and another because a rental moped wouldn’t start. |
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Posted: 12/28/2020 10:45:13 AM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I'm going with not random. ^ Makes you wonder what happened at the bowling alley. I have a hard time beliveing, he randomly showed up, walked in, and started shooting. |
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Posted: 12/28/2020 10:47:53 AM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted: ^ Makes you wonder what happened at the bowling alley. I have a hard time beliveing, he randomly showed up, walked in, and started shooting. It may be as simple as he stopped by to pick up his to go order of food, and some teens tried to jack the wrong dude. |
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Posted: 12/28/2020 10:47:56 AM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I stand corrected, and thinking about it more now. I’ve had toe soldiers just snap back in the 90’s over minor things. One who got tired of humping the sincgars and another because a rental moped wouldn’t start. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: There was a green beret CIA contractor a few years back who shot someone over a parking spot dispute. Hell there have actually been quite a few similar ones. I stand corrected, and thinking about it more now. I’ve had toe soldiers just snap back in the 90’s over minor things. One who got tired of humping the sincgars and another because a rental moped wouldn’t start. There was a green beret in pakistan who shot a kid or two on a moped while driving down some third world street, back some years. They were probably chasing him with an AK or something though. I can see it being difficult to go in between those realities. A lot of those guys did/do contracting work. I got into the truck with one one time and he had two ARs ready to go within his reach. I looked at them and looked at him, and he said something about me being a soft target. Fuck, I guess so. |
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Posted: 12/28/2020 10:48:00 AM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted: shoulda marked it zero calmer than you dude |
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Posted: 12/28/2020 10:50:13 AM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The victims where mostly elderly, really strange There's a lot of hate out there for boomers...heck right here for that matter... |
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Posted: 12/28/2020 10:50:16 AM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted: If someone starts shooting random people around me I'm shooting back regardless of what color their hat is. Nobody is bulletproof. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I dont think I'm trying to get into a gunfight with a Green Beret If someone starts shooting random people around me I'm shooting back regardless of what color their hat is. Nobody is bulletproof. Bingo |
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Posted: 12/28/2020 10:50:27 AM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I dont think I'm trying to get into a gunfight with a Green Beret Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I've told friends of mine a hundred times. Things like this can happen anywhere you go. Always carry. I dont think I'm trying to get into a gunfight with a Green Beret I’m not going to try to get in a gunfight with anyone, but I’d rather die in a gunfight than be executed unarmed. |
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Posted: 12/28/2020 10:55:25 AM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The kid that was shot in the face is black and at least one of the dead is black. I read an article on Heavy that mentioned two guns. Careful now, your bias is unintentionally showing. |
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Posted: 12/28/2020 11:00:42 AM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted: And to piss away a career like he had to shoot a few people in a bowling alley bar makes no sense. If he wanted to do some damage he had the means to do so on a large scale. I originally thought it was gang related before seeing the shooter. Rockford is super dangerous. Then I thought “ok, active green beret just trying to defend against a mugging or something “. But the age of victims throws that out the window along with some witness statements against him. It is a strange event. I despise active shooter or gun related attacks because politicians and media use it to fuel their fire against all of us law abiding gun owners any chance they get. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Just for the sake of educating folks about the 18 series profession, here is how you get to be a 18F. You start out getting another 18 series MOS like 18B, 18C, and so on. It's only after you have been around a while and generally get to E-7 that you are sent off to the 18F course at Fort Bragg which is all intel stuff there isn't any weapons or demo shit involved, just secret squirrel stuff. In order to make it to E-8 you have to become 18F qualified. Then eventually you move up to 18Z50 which is your team OP SGT or company SGM MOS. If he is an 18F that means he has been around a while on teams and likely deployed where ever the 7th is working these days. I started out as an 18B and several years later went to the O&I course. Of course the way they deal with it now may be different than when I was in. And to piss away a career like he had to shoot a few people in a bowling alley bar makes no sense. If he wanted to do some damage he had the means to do so on a large scale. I originally thought it was gang related before seeing the shooter. Rockford is super dangerous. Then I thought “ok, active green beret just trying to defend against a mugging or something “. But the age of victims throws that out the window along with some witness statements against him. It is a strange event. I despise active shooter or gun related attacks because politicians and media use it to fuel their fire against all of us law abiding gun owners any chance they get. Yea I know nothing but when I heard shot 14 y/o I was thinking drugs, drug dealing, meet gone wrong. Of course it waas wild conjecture. |
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Posted: 12/28/2020 11:08:14 AM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Not being coy, y'all got the internet too. Do you want me to read you a story? Here, for the moderately lazy (most of the modern population). Special Forces Assistant Ops & Intelligence Sgt. MOS 18F MOS 18F—Special Forces Assistant Operations and Intelligence Sergeant Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Look up what an 18F is. Why so coy about it? Not being coy, y'all got the internet too. Do you want me to read you a story? Here, for the moderately lazy (most of the modern population). Special Forces Assistant Ops & Intelligence Sgt. MOS 18F MOS 18F—Special Forces Assistant Operations and Intelligence Sergeant Lazy? What does that say about you for not just posting a simple link in the first place? |
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Posted: 12/28/2020 11:09:54 AM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted: There was a green beret in pakistan who shot a kid or two on a moped while driving down some third world street, back some years. They were probably chasing him with an AK or something though. I can see it being difficult to go in between those realities. A lot of those guys did/do contracting work. I got into the truck with one one time and he had two ARs ready to go within his reach. I looked at them and looked at him, and he said something about me being a soft target. Fuck, I guess so. Side note, in this incident one of the two kids shot at the CIA security contractor (former green beret) with a torkarov pistol, missed and and he shot back killing both the armed teenage assassin and the moped/scooter driver. Motorcycle and motor scooter assassination teams are actually quite common in Pakistan and and India. It might take awhile to mentally switch gears from hyper vigilance to armed awareness, but I'm going with drugs and, need more info on this one. |
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Posted: 12/28/2020 11:20:52 AM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This is very unusual. 7th Groups forte is living like a rock star with hot ladies in south and Central America based on the US dollar, And having various incidents like this swept under the rug OCONUS. Some field grade is not going to be dropping op fund bribes and handing GPS and other cool shit to some Departamento Policia jefe to make this shit go away. Right. You are fucking clueless. |
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Posted: 12/28/2020 11:21:24 AM EDT
[#28]
Green Berets are human too. 2020 has mentally fucked up a lot of people and this guy might have had the means to act out his rage. Ft Hood soldiers do all kinds of heinous shit around here so I don't immediately assume service members are always upstanding citizens.
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Posted: 12/28/2020 11:30:21 AM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I don't give a fuck what he is in Army terms. He's a piece of shit and deserves the needle. guilty till proven innocent....nice to see our men in uniform think so lowly of the constitution. |
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Posted: 12/28/2020 11:33:34 AM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Green Berets are human too. 2020 has mentally fucked up a lot of people and this guy might have had the means to act out his rage. Ft Hood soldiers do all kinds of heinous shit around here so I don't immediately assume service members are always upstanding citizens. Every part of the military has its shitbags. Plenty of guys had tabs revoked. Fortunatly it is less in the SOF community. I would love to hear the complete facts. |
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Posted: 12/28/2020 11:34:35 AM EDT
[#31]
He was in the process of having his mind indoctrinated for a government hit and he went off to soon.
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Posted: 12/28/2020 11:34:40 AM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted: CNN facebook post about this is chock full of comments about him being alive because he’s white. Insane people with keyboards individual insanity is bad enough but group insanity...whoa...like Planet of the Apes when they spot a rogue human. |
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Posted: 12/28/2020 11:36:29 AM EDT
[#33]
He was the only one to give a shit about the rules.
Now I need to read the thread to see how many times I got beat. |
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Posted: 12/28/2020 11:51:05 AM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted: He’s probably more disciplined than that. So disciplined he shot six people (including two kids) at a bar/restaurant. |
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Posted: 12/28/2020 11:55:39 AM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Yup, best to interrogate active shooters that are killing random people before engaging them. |
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Posted: 12/28/2020 11:57:29 AM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted: WTF. I saw info about this shooting last night and was like that's weird the shooter is my age. I just assumed it was some local who was drunk and got into a bar type fight. Really fucking weird. |
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Posted: 12/28/2020 12:00:49 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I dont think I'm trying to get into a gunfight with a Green Beret When the alternative is just getting shot by said Green Beret... Besides: They bleed just like any other human being. |
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Posted: 12/28/2020 12:01:48 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Let us not forget and lose sight of the real monsters- the tiktard nurses and their dancing. That goes without saying |
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Posted: 12/28/2020 12:03:09 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted: So disciplined he shot six people (including two kids) at a bar/restaurant. Is that a fact? I'm not defending him, but two handguns suggest a two-way fight. How do you know it was the .mil guy who shot the kids and if it was him, they could have simply been in the crossfire? Too early to make definitive statements, but I doubt we'll ever hear the real truth about this incident. ROCK6 |
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Posted: 12/28/2020 12:03:15 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted: If someone starts shooting random people around me I'm shooting back regardless of what color their hat is. Nobody is bulletproof. This would get a thumbs up from me if it had it. |
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Posted: 12/28/2020 12:04:52 PM EDT
[#41]
Shot 6 people, all of which were elderly or children.
Wow. Not much coc friendly to say. |
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Posted: 12/28/2020 12:06:10 PM EDT
[#42]
... what an asshole!
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Posted: 12/28/2020 12:06:30 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted: my WAG: he swiped some new age Pervatin/Benzedrine that is made available for secret squirrel types, thought he would have some fun and took too much or was his first high and flipped out. also explains how some one that should know how to shoot somewhat proficiently only managed to kill half of what he shot. Proficiency in marksmanship is not nearly as common, even among "elite" forces, as people might think. Especially with handguns. |
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Posted: 12/28/2020 12:07:00 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Right. You are fucking clueless. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: This is very unusual. 7th Groups forte is living like a rock star with hot ladies in south and Central America based on the US dollar, And having various incidents like this swept under the rug OCONUS. Some field grade is not going to be dropping op fund bribes and handing GPS and other cool shit to some Departamento Policia jefe to make this shit go away. Right. You are fucking clueless. I’ll grant the joke seems less funny and less appropriate re-reading it, But the wide range and variety of amusing, bemusing, confusing, comical, surprising, and shocking situations racked up and reminisced about is legendary. |
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Posted: 12/28/2020 12:08:46 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted: There was a green beret in pakistan who shot a kid or two on a moped while driving down some third world street, back some years. They were probably chasing him with an AK or something though. I can see it being difficult to go in between those realities. A lot of those guys did/do contracting work. I got into the truck with one one time and he had two ARs ready to go within his reach. I looked at them and looked at him, and he said something about me being a soft target. Fuck, I guess so. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: There was a green beret CIA contractor a few years back who shot someone over a parking spot dispute. Hell there have actually been quite a few similar ones. I stand corrected, and thinking about it more now. I’ve had toe soldiers just snap back in the 90’s over minor things. One who got tired of humping the sincgars and another because a rental moped wouldn’t start. There was a green beret in pakistan who shot a kid or two on a moped while driving down some third world street, back some years. They were probably chasing him with an AK or something though. I can see it being difficult to go in between those realities. A lot of those guys did/do contracting work. I got into the truck with one one time and he had two ARs ready to go within his reach. I looked at them and looked at him, and he said something about me being a soft target. Fuck, I guess so. That's the same guy. Raymond Davis. The Pakistanis were attempting to rob him, and then one them pulled a piece. Davis blasted both of them through his vehicle's windshield with an unmodified Glock 19. Whether or not those EKIA beardies were actual criminals acting on their own volition or if they were paid by another party to assassinate him was thoroughly debated. Whatever the case, the Pakistani interrogators likely fucked with him even with "diplomatic" credentials. Hussein Obama ended up paying Pakistan's extortion request to themselves and to the mother of the "victims" in order to free Davis. |
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Posted: 12/28/2020 12:08:47 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted: shoulda marked it zero This isnt Nam. There are rules. |
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Posted: 12/28/2020 12:12:40 PM EDT
[#47]
It was mentioned up thread. Cups run over and once broken an individual is never right again or takes a very long time to get there. There are few plausible explanations here, guy had a mental breakdown and lost his shit. Guy was a total shit bag and decided this needed to be done for some reason in his head. Generally shitbags don't wait until 37 to out themselves as such, my opinion but the guy probably has 15 years in or more.
It smacks of mental failure to me. That said what a tragedy for the victims, sad he didn't get help or just shoot himself in the head. His service branch and MOS is not reflected in his actions. Plenty of people serve in the SF community, serve in combat, or hands on and don't do shit like this. There have been a run of these around the holiday and it's sadly predictable. |
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Posted: 12/28/2020 12:13:00 PM EDT
[#48]
While we would all like to find a "rational" reason for this act, the pursuit is going to be fruitless.
When a person commits an act of violence, it doesn't have to make sense to anyone but them. Some acts we might be able to do enough perspective-taking to sort of understand. Many...if not most...however, we won't. |
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Posted: 12/28/2020 12:15:33 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I dont think I'm trying to get into a gunfight with a Green Beret Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I've told friends of mine a hundred times. Things like this can happen anywhere you go. Always carry. I dont think I'm trying to get into a gunfight with a Green Beret Yeah, you should just sit there and let him shoot you 
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Posted: 12/28/2020 12:15:34 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I dont think I'm trying to get into a gunfight with a Green Beret Save that last bullet, then "put your pistol to your head and go to Fiddler's Green." |
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